Ireland World Cup Bid for 2023 or 2027 - GAA coming on board...

[Jackass] · 18-08-2012 6:04pm #1

Confirmed today that Ireland, as has been speculated for some time, will be looking to make a sole world cup bid and also, the GAA will be going to congress with the view to allowing SIX stadiums to be used in the bid...

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2012/0818/334098-central-council-keen-on-rwc-bid/

According to the article, 12 stadiums were used in New Zealand and 11 will be used in 2019...

Presumably, the GAA will look to use the opportunity to get some outside funding into developing the stadiums and a big cut from rent and ticket sales...

So, what stadiums may be used?

Croke Park

Croke%20Park.jpg

Capacity: 82,500
Status: Completed

Aviva Stadium

Capacity: 51,700
Status: Completed

Thomond Park

tickets_page.jpg&h=326&w=786&zc=1&q=100

Capacity: 26,500
Status: Completed

RDS Arena

Capacity: 18,500
Status: Plans to extend to 23,000 - will be bosted by this bid prospect

Ravenhill

Capacity: 12,300
Status: Plans confirmed and funding secured for 18,000 stadium

Possible Other Stadiums

Semple Stadium, Tipperary

Capacity: 55,000

Gaelic Grounds, Limerick

Capacity: 49,500

Páirc Uí Chaoimh, Cork

Capacity: 43,500

Fitzgerald Stadium, Killarney, Co. Kerry

Capacity: 43,000

Pearse Stadium, Galway

Capacity: 36,000

Nowlan Park, Kilkenny

Capacity: 30,000

This bid, if passed by GAA congress, could also open the permanent opportunity for the likes of perhaps Munster being allowed host major games in Gaelic grounds in Limerick, similar to how Leinster use the Aviva.

I think this would be a fantastic development for the country and I think we would have a very strong chance.

In all honesty, I think we all knew a bid was coming, but I thought it would be a joint bid with Wales, but surprised and delighted at the GAA's progressive attitude and hopefully if they agree to share the stadia, it could be a massive leap forward in sporting infrastructure in this country for all sports.

thomond2006 · 18-08-2012 6:11pm

The GAA got some serious cash for the use of Croke Park in 2007-2010, from a financial POV it makes sense. For an RWC, Croke Park's availability might be limited given the RWC would clash with the All Ireland semis and finals.

Pearse Stadium in particular is important, so that the games can be hosted in Connacht.

You just hope the GAA traditionalists that were against Croke Park opening it doors before won't derail this.

[Jackass] · 18-08-2012 6:16pm

True, but for the payday that could be in it, they make make arrangements to ensure that timing could be switched around on a once off basis to allow all the stadia to be used.

CatFromHue · 18-08-2012 6:44pm

GAA pitches are very big, too big really for a rugby game. I was never a fan of going to Croker to watch a game as I couldn't see an awful lot of it.

So while it would be great to get the RWC here the actual match day experience in the GAA stadiums could be lacking for the match goer.

4PP · 18-08-2012 6:46pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

The GAA got some serious cash for the use of Croke Park in 2007-2010, from a financial POV it makes sense. For an RWC, Croke Park's availability might be limited given the RWC would clash with the All Ireland semis and finals.

Pearse Stadium in particular is important, so that the games can be hosted in Connacht.

You just hope the GAA traditionalists that were against Croke Park opening it doors before won't derail this.

Are they(the finals) not held on the 1st & 3rd WE of September? Surely things could be arranged to avoid any clash??

4PP · 18-08-2012 6:47pm

CatFromHue wrote: »

GAA pitches are very big, too big really for a rugby game. I was never a fan of going to Croker to watch a game as I couldn't see an awful lot of it.

So while it would be great to get the RWC here the actual match day experience in the GAA stadiums could be lacking for the match goer.

True but nothing stops them putting in extra seats...................or advertising hoardings!!!...........Wonder which it'll be :rolleyes:

thomond2006 · 18-08-2012 6:49pm

4PP wrote: »

Are they(the finals) not held on the 1st & 3rd WE of September? Surely things could be arranged to avoid any clash??

I can see some traditionalists not wanting to change for that. All sorts of bull**** was brought up when the decision to open Croke Park was debated.

4PP · 18-08-2012 6:55pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

I can see some traditionalists not wanting to change for that. All sorts of bull**** was brought up when the decision to open Croke Park was debated.

No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
The World is round, not Oval.

thomond2006 · 18-08-2012 6:58pm

4PP wrote: »

No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
The World is round, not Oval.

true enough, bs was too strong a word.

CatFromHue · 18-08-2012 7:00pm

4PP wrote: »

True but nothing stops them putting in extra seats...................or advertising hoardings!!!...........Wonder which it'll be :rolleyes:

No the rugby pitch is too small for the grass area available. It just makes it tough to watch the game I found.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 18-08-2012 7:01pm

4PP wrote: »

No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
The World is round, not Oval.

I'd actually prefer to see the final in Croke Park. Its the biggest stadium we have and it would be a great way to advertise our sporting culture and history to the rest of the world.

wp_rathead · 18-08-2012 7:03pm

4PP wrote: »

Are they(the finals) not held on the 1st & 3rd WE of September? Surely things could be arranged to avoid any clash??

the camogie and ladies football are on the other weekends i think though

tolosenc · 18-08-2012 7:06pm

I presume Wales and Scotland are in on it too? That would have us at 7 already.

One caveat about the non-Croker GAA grounds is that those capacity figures are at least twice would be allowed at a RWC match when seats are put in.

4PP wrote: »

No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
The World is round, not Oval.

Croke Park was overwhelming funded by the taxpayer. Whatever about other stadia in GAA hands, it's a disgrace that fundamentally racist policies like Rule 42 are allowed to be applied to what should be a public ammenity.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 18-08-2012 7:07pm

As I've said in previous threads,our biggest problem will be ensuring quality training facilities for the 20 teams involved. IF that can be sorted, we should be in a great place to launch a bid. The RWC, Euros, and boxing in the Olympics, has allowed us to earn a reputation as "the best fans in the world". We have been the force in european club rugby since the advent of the professional game, and our hold on the HEC doesn't look like slipping any time soon.

If the GAA can recognise how hosting the RWC would benefit all parties involved, we should be able to win the bid.

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:07pm

thomond2006 wrote: »

I can see some traditionalists not wanting to change for that. All sorts of bull**** was brought up when the decision to open Croke Park was debated.

It was unanimously agreed to put it to Congress and I heard the GAA president speaking very positively about it so lets not go down the usual route of slagging off the gaa, considering it would mean about 2 games per stadium for the GAA, so they are not going to make a huge amount of money from it but their members (country) would gain significant benefits from rugby tourism.

4PP · 18-08-2012 7:07pm

wprathead wrote: »

the camogie and ladies football are on the other weekends i think though

No disrespect to either codes but I'm fairly sure that the games could be played "in the middle" of the WC , on the Sundays, without anyone taking undue offense. It may even attract extra media attention as suggested by Capt B above.

Whatever happens I'm certain Neil Diamonds Golden Rule will apply......"Money Talks";)

Big Ears · 18-08-2012 7:07pm

4PP wrote: »

No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
The World is round, not Oval.

Actually it would, Landsdowne isn't big enough for the final, which must be in a 60,000+ capacity stadium.

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:09pm

Cpt_Blackbeard wrote: »

I'd actually prefer to see the final in Croke Park. Its the biggest stadium we have and it would be a great way to advertise our sporting culture and history to the rest of the world.

Lansdowne isn't big enough to host the final. It will have to be in Croke Park.

4PP · 18-08-2012 7:09pm

Big Ears wrote: »

Actually it would, Landsdowne isn't big enough for the final, which must be in a 60,000+ capacity stadium.

In October? problem solved

Hazys · 18-08-2012 7:11pm

[Jackass] wrote: »

This bid, if passed by GAA congress, could also open the permanent opportunity for the likes of perhaps Munster being allowed host major games in Gaelic grounds in Limerick, similar to how Leinster use the Aviva.

Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

Reekwind · 18-08-2012 7:13pm

4PP wrote: »

No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice

Wouldn't work. A minimum capacity of 60,000 is required for the final

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:14pm

Hazys wrote: »

Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

50K capacity.

Cpt_Blackbeard · 18-08-2012 7:14pm

Hazys wrote: »

Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

I could see a benefit of HEC semi-finals being hosted there, as they cannot be in your home stadium and Thomond is too small. Besides that, all games should take place in Thomond Park. It's the home of Munster rugby, has a huge history surrounding it, and should not be abandoned for a few cheap bucks.

4PP · 18-08-2012 7:16pm

Reekwind wrote: »

Wouldn't work. A minimum capacity of 60,000 is required for the final

see post #19

P_1 · 18-08-2012 7:17pm

Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:18pm

4PP wrote: »

In October? problem solved

I heard a bit of a discussion on radio this afternoon about it - they were talking about how the timing suited the GAA really well.

And when you think about it - group games being played in Aviva and All Ireland's going on in Croke Park in early Sept - everyone would be a winner! Brilliant opportunity for GAA to get worldwide exposure.

P_1 · 18-08-2012 7:19pm

Big Ears wrote: »

Actually it would, Landsdowne isn't big enough for the final, which must be in a 60,000+ capacity stadium.

Possibly an excuse to knock Havelock Square so

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:21pm

pithater1 wrote: »

Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

From what I heard today on radio, I don't think Semple is included.

All other stadia are well located with regard to access from airports and hotel accommodation.

P_1 · 18-08-2012 7:24pm

jm08 wrote: »

From what I heard today on radio, I don't think Semple is included.

All other stadia are well located with regard to access from airports and hotel accommodation.

Well that would cover the Camogie finals so.
What stadiums were mentioned?
I presume the 3 in Dublin, 2 in Limeirck, 1 each for Cork, Belfast and Galway?

ArmaniJeanss · 18-08-2012 7:26pm

[Jackass] wrote: »

Presumably, the GAA will look to use the opportunity to get some outside funding into developing the stadiums and a big cut from rent and ticket sales...

Going on the presumably safe assumption that the IRB have enough countries lining up to host this competition that they won't actually feel the need to pay a cent of ticket sales or rent to the GAA, how does the financing of this work?

I assume that the government would be expected to give money directly to the GAA as compensation for the use of their grounds?

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:26pm

pithater1 wrote: »

Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

Teams could base themselves in the UK (much in the same way as some Olympic teams based themselves in Ireland). Its less than an hour on a plane.

I don't think the GAA will let foreign sports into the spiritual home of the GAA

4PP · 18-08-2012 7:26pm

pithater1 wrote: »

Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

I think you're forgetting how big the country is? as in tiny!!!
You can get to Galway Belfast Limerick or Cork in less than 3 hours from Dublin.
France 2007 had teams travelling further than the length of Ireland!

P_1 · 18-08-2012 7:30pm

4PP wrote: »

I think you're forgetting how big the country is? as in tiny!!!
You can get to Galway Belfast Limerick or Cork in less than 3 hours from Dublin.
France 2007 had teams travelling further than the length of Ireland!

True but you would want the fans to be able to stay in the same town after the match though?

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:31pm

pithater1 wrote: »

Well that would cover the Camogie finals so.
What stadiums were mentioned?
I presume the 3 in Dublin, 2 in Limeirck, 1 each for Cork, Belfast and Galway?

Those mentioned were Cork (being developed into 45k seater), Fitzgerald (Killarney - lots of tourist accommodation), Casement, Belfast - being redeveloped into 40K all-seater, Gaelic Grounds, Limerick plus Croke Park. All those mentioned are 40K+ seaters. Then there is Lansdowne, RDS, Thomond & Ravenhill for smaller games.

Thats 9 stadia.

ambid · 18-08-2012 7:33pm

I imagine they'd want somewhere in the north west (Derry or Ballybofey), south east, and midlands (Athlone) maybe.

I doubt they'd use two stadiums in Limerick (Thomond & Gaelic Grounds) and two in the south west (Cork & Killarney) as they'll probably want to spread it around more.

What a fantastic opportunity for the GAA to upgrade their stadiums though.

marienbad · 18-08-2012 7:37pm

wprathead wrote: »

the camogie and ladies football are on the other weekends i think though

Move them to the Aviva:)

P_1 · 18-08-2012 7:40pm

I suppose if you wanted a true geographical spread you might go for:

Dublin: Croker, Lansdowne, RDS
South: Thomand, Cork, Killarney
West: Pearse, McHale
North: Ravenhill, New Belfast Stadium.
Midlands: Nowlan, Portlaois.

Giving 13 stadia

jm08 · 18-08-2012 7:43pm

ambid wrote: »

I imagine they'd want somewhere in the north west (Derry or Ballybofey), south east, and midlands (Athlone) maybe.

I doubt they'd use two stadiums in Limerick (Thomond & Gaelic Grounds) and two in the south west (Cork & Killarney) as they'll probably want to spread it around more.

What a fantastic opportunity for the GAA to upgrade their stadiums though.

I think they might - from an accommodation point of view Cork/access to airports.

I can see some of the big teams wanting to base themselves in Limerick (like ABs/SA) who would need a 40K stadium. Ireland would want Dublin. The 6Ns teams would probably just fly in for their games (which is why they might be very supportive of an Ireland bid).

[Jackass] · 18-08-2012 8:43pm

Hazys wrote: »

Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

The same reason Leinster would want to hold games in the Aviva.

If you can sell 45,000 tickets for a match up to 5 times a season, compared to say 26,000 in Thomond, and the stadium is in the same city, why wouldn't you want to move games away from Thomond park when the capacity isn't sufficient?

connemara man · 18-08-2012 9:26pm

By then Connacht will be the super power in Irish rugby with a 30,000 seater stadium.
I called it here first ;-)
Hopefully anyway

ambid · 18-08-2012 9:32pm

pithater1 wrote: »

I suppose if you wanted a true geographical spread you might go for:

Dublin: Croker, Lansdowne, RDS
South: Thomand, Cork, Killarney
West: Pearse, McHale
North: Ravenhill, New Belfast Stadium.
Midlands: Nowlan, Portlaois.

Giving 13 stadia

I don't think there is going to be a new Belfast stadium. The last I heard they couldn't agree a location so are going to upgrade Ravenhill, Casement & Windsor Park instead.

phog · 18-08-2012 9:45pm

It's certainly doable and should be a runner, I honestly don't think the GAA will rule it out, my own guess is that Ulster GAA may not allow rugby in their grounds.

I'd love to see McHale Park and Semple Stadium being used, it would bring rugby to the masses outside the cities.

While I'd love to see the Gaelic Grounds in Limerick getting games, I doubt the scheduling would allow for two grounds that are about a kilometer away from each other to be used. It would be fantastic for the city itself and for rugby there.

LETS BE AVN IT · 18-08-2012 10:03pm

You could definitely see a new 20,000 + stadium being built in Waterford aswell

GerM · 18-08-2012 10:25pm

GAA already said they've been asked for use of 6 stadia. Listed them on main evening news as Croke, P Ui C, Fitzgerald, Gaelic Grounds and Pearse. He listed Gaelic Grounds twice but if I was to guess, I would say the other ground is Semple Stadium or Casement Park.

18-08-2012 10:34pm

GerM wrote: »

GAA already said they've been asked for use of 6 stadia. Listed them on main evening news as Croke, P Ui C, Fitzgerald, Gaelic Grounds and Pearse. He listed Gaelic Grounds twice but if I was to guess, I would say the other ground is Semple Stadium or Casement Park.

For capacity it should be Semple but perhaps im being biased

. I think this could be a hugely positive step for the GAA. I'm glad to see their attitudes are more open these times. Ive no doubt it will be a huge success if it comes to pass.

stepbar · 18-08-2012 10:42pm

Realistically, how many stadia would you need at a min?

Ireland needs a World Cup... it would be brilliant.

[Jackass] · 18-08-2012 10:49pm

Well, as mentioned in the article, the last world cup was 12 and the 2019 Japan world cup will use 11 (two of which will be outside of Japan).

In the opening post, I listed 11 stadia which would very similar in capacity terms to those of previous world cups, although some moderniseation and external facilities may be required, but nothing major.

There is also an option of using 9 to 10 domestic stadia and perhaps bringing in Wales and Scotland to have Millenium and Murrayfield also if that was feasable.

Ideally it would be great to host every single game on this island though.

There's also the option of Windsor Park which is being redeveloped and will have a 20,000 capacity, although we're fairly covered at the lower end of stadia capacity required.

I know the New Zealand world cup lost money (in tanagable terms), but I think there is a lot less work to do in Ireland than there was to do in New Zealand and I think geographically, we have a much stronger position to sell tickets (as some of the world cup in NZ was poorly attended, with the All Blacks not even managing to sell out all of their games...) and I think it would not only be a major Economic success, but it would be a marker in Irish history of being a major nation and capable of hosting such an event.

iwasonbwh · 18-08-2012 10:54pm

St Tiernachs Park Clones is a place where I would love to see RWC. 36000 capacity, and it brings money to a part of the country that could do with it

It shows much about the history of GAA also; trips to small towns, atmosphere, history. It also straddles the border, so it is part of both sides of the border, and is under 90 mins from many big towns.

PS The stadium is built in a bowl and is a wonderful place to watch sport.

CoDy1 · 18-08-2012 11:05pm

Stadia aside, just wondering whether people think we have the proper infrastructure, accommodation and facilities to host all on our own, a major international sporting tournament?

stepbar · 18-08-2012 11:12pm

CoDy1 wrote: »

Stadia aside, just wondering whether people think we have the proper infrastructure, accommodation and facilities to host all on our own, a major international sporting tournament?

I think we do. But consideration must be given to stadia in cities such as Waterford and Sligo also even though both cities would not be rugby strongholds.

ArmaniJeanss · 18-08-2012 11:19pm

CoDy1 wrote: »

Stadia aside, just wondering whether people think we have the proper infrastructure, accommodation and facilities to host all on our own, a major international sporting tournament?

100% true, but an event like this can be used as a valid excuse to get those facilities and infrastructure organised.
This only works as long as all parties accept that by the time you add up the money you've spent bidding (apparently NZ bid €100M) and building this infrastructure, then subtract your direct revenue streams, that you are going to be left with a loss. It falls apart if, for example, one particular party to the bid expects to make a direct profit from the use of their grounds.

Ireland World Cup Bid for 2023 or 2027 - GAA coming on board...

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