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Ireland World Cup Bid for 2023 or 2027 - GAA coming on board...

  • 18-08-2012 6:04pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Confirmed today that Ireland, as has been speculated for some time, will be looking to make a sole world cup bid and also, the GAA will be going to congress with the view to allowing SIX stadiums to be used in the bid...

    http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2012/0818/334098-central-council-keen-on-rwc-bid/

    According to the article, 12 stadiums were used in New Zealand and 11 will be used in 2019...

    Presumably, the GAA will look to use the opportunity to get some outside funding into developing the stadiums and a big cut from rent and ticket sales...

    So, what stadiums may be used?

    Croke Park

    Croke%20Park.jpg

    Capacity: 82,500
    Status: Completed

    Aviva Stadium

    Aviva_Stadium_from_North_Stand.jpg

    Capacity: 51,700
    Status: Completed

    Thomond Park

    tickets_page.jpg&h=326&w=786&zc=1&q=100

    Capacity: 26,500
    Status: Completed

    RDS Arena

    RDS_Arena_Portrait.jpg

    Capacity: 18,500
    Status: Plans to extend to 23,000 - will be bosted by this bid prospect

    Ravenhill

    Ravenhill_Plans.JPG

    Capacity: 12,300
    Status: Plans confirmed and funding secured for 18,000 stadium

    Possible Other Stadiums

    Semple Stadium, Tipperary

    semplestadium.jpg

    Capacity: 55,000

    Gaelic Grounds, Limerick

    GaelicGrounds480.jpg

    Capacity: 49,500

    Páirc Uí Chaoimh, Cork

    000365c2-642.jpg

    Capacity: 43,500

    Fitzgerald Stadium, Killarney, Co. Kerry

    908564089_8de98a8108.jpg

    Capacity: 43,000

    Pearse Stadium, Galway

    7012296139_722af83450_z.jpg

    Capacity: 36,000

    kilkenny_nowlan.jpg

    Nowlan Park, Kilkenny

    Capacity: 30,000

    This bid, if passed by GAA congress, could also open the permanent opportunity for the likes of perhaps Munster being allowed host major games in Gaelic grounds in Limerick, similar to how Leinster use the Aviva.

    I think this would be a fantastic development for the country and I think we would have a very strong chance.

    In all honesty, I think we all knew a bid was coming, but I thought it would be a joint bid with Wales, but surprised and delighted at the GAA's progressive attitude and hopefully if they agree to share the stadia, it could be a massive leap forward in sporting infrastructure in this country for all sports.


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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    The GAA got some serious cash for the use of Croke Park in 2007-2010, from a financial POV it makes sense. For an RWC, Croke Park's availability might be limited given the RWC would clash with the All Ireland semis and finals.

    Pearse Stadium in particular is important, so that the games can be hosted in Connacht.

    You just hope the GAA traditionalists that were against Croke Park opening it doors before won't derail this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    True, but for the payday that could be in it, they make make arrangements to ensure that timing could be switched around on a once off basis to allow all the stadia to be used.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    GAA pitches are very big, too big really for a rugby game. I was never a fan of going to Croker to watch a game as I couldn't see an awful lot of it.

    So while it would be great to get the RWC here the actual match day experience in the GAA stadiums could be lacking for the match goer.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    The GAA got some serious cash for the use of Croke Park in 2007-2010, from a financial POV it makes sense. For an RWC, Croke Park's availability might be limited given the RWC would clash with the All Ireland semis and finals.

    Pearse Stadium in particular is important, so that the games can be hosted in Connacht.

    You just hope the GAA traditionalists that were against Croke Park opening it doors before won't derail this.

    Are they(the finals) not held on the 1st & 3rd WE of September? Surely things could be arranged to avoid any clash??


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    CatFromHue wrote: »
    GAA pitches are very big, too big really for a rugby game. I was never a fan of going to Croker to watch a game as I couldn't see an awful lot of it.

    So while it would be great to get the RWC here the actual match day experience in the GAA stadiums could be lacking for the match goer.

    True but nothing stops them putting in extra seats...................or advertising hoardings!!!...........Wonder which it'll be :rolleyes:


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    4PP wrote: »
    Are they(the finals) not held on the 1st & 3rd WE of September? Surely things could be arranged to avoid any clash??

    I can see some traditionalists not wanting to change for that. All sorts of bull**** was brought up when the decision to open Croke Park was debated.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    I can see some traditionalists not wanting to change for that. All sorts of bull**** was brought up when the decision to open Croke Park was debated.


    No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
    The World is round, not Oval.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    4PP wrote: »
    No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
    The World is round, not Oval.

    true enough, bs was too strong a word.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    4PP wrote: »
    True but nothing stops them putting in extra seats...................or advertising hoardings!!!...........Wonder which it'll be :rolleyes:

    No the rugby pitch is too small for the grass area available. It just makes it tough to watch the game I found.

    800px-Croke_park_2.jpg

    704827_5b549dbc.jpg


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    4PP wrote: »
    No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
    The World is round, not Oval.

    I'd actually prefer to see the final in Croke Park. Its the biggest stadium we have and it would be a great way to advertise our sporting culture and history to the rest of the world.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,071 ✭✭✭✭wp_rathead


    4PP wrote: »
    Are they(the finals) not held on the 1st & 3rd WE of September? Surely things could be arranged to avoid any clash??

    the camogie and ladies football are on the other weekends i think though


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,889 ✭✭✭tolosenc


    I presume Wales and Scotland are in on it too? That would have us at 7 already.

    One caveat about the non-Croker GAA grounds is that those capacity figures are at least twice would be allowed at a RWC match when seats are put in.
    4PP wrote: »
    No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
    The World is round, not Oval.

    Croke Park was overwhelming funded by the taxpayer. Whatever about other stadia in GAA hands, it's a disgrace that fundamentally racist policies like Rule 42 are allowed to be applied to what should be a public ammenity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    As I've said in previous threads,our biggest problem will be ensuring quality training facilities for the 20 teams involved. IF that can be sorted, we should be in a great place to launch a bid. The RWC, Euros, and boxing in the Olympics, has allowed us to earn a reputation as "the best fans in the world". We have been the force in european club rugby since the advent of the professional game, and our hold on the HEC doesn't look like slipping any time soon.

    If the GAA can recognise how hosting the RWC would benefit all parties involved, we should be able to win the bid.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    I can see some traditionalists not wanting to change for that. All sorts of bull**** was brought up when the decision to open Croke Park was debated.


    It was unanimously agreed to put it to Congress and I heard the GAA president speaking very positively about it so lets not go down the usual route of slagging off the gaa, considering it would mean about 2 games per stadium for the GAA, so they are not going to make a huge amount of money from it but their members (country) would gain significant benefits from rugby tourism.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    wprathead wrote: »
    the camogie and ladies football are on the other weekends i think though
    No disrespect to either codes but I'm fairly sure that the games could be played "in the middle" of the WC , on the Sundays, without anyone taking undue offense. It may even attract extra media attention as suggested by Capt B above.

    Whatever happens I'm certain Neil Diamonds Golden Rule will apply......"Money Talks";)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,991 ✭✭✭Big Ears


    4PP wrote: »
    No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice. I wouldn't refer to their arguments as bull**** either. Its their code/sport/stadia & they are entiltled to their opinion, even if it may irritate you.
    The World is round, not Oval.

    Actually it would, Landsdowne isn't big enough for the final, which must be in a 60,000+ capacity stadium.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    I'd actually prefer to see the final in Croke Park. Its the biggest stadium we have and it would be a great way to advertise our sporting culture and history to the rest of the world.

    Lansdowne isn't big enough to host the final. It will have to be in Croke Park.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    Big Ears wrote: »
    Actually it would, Landsdowne isn't big enough for the final, which must be in a 60,000+ capacity stadium.

    In October? problem solved :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    This bid, if passed by GAA congress, could also open the permanent opportunity for the likes of perhaps Munster being allowed host major games in Gaelic grounds in Limerick, similar to how Leinster use the Aviva.

    Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,126 ✭✭✭Reekwind


    4PP wrote: »
    No reason to change it, CP wouldn't be the venue for the opening or closing match. Lansdowne would be the obvious choice
    Wouldn't work. A minimum capacity of 60,000 is required for the final


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    Hazys wrote: »
    Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

    50K capacity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,456 ✭✭✭Cpt_Blackbeard


    Hazys wrote: »
    Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

    I could see a benefit of HEC semi-finals being hosted there, as they cannot be in your home stadium and Thomond is too small. Besides that, all games should take place in Thomond Park. It's the home of Munster rugby, has a huge history surrounding it, and should not be abandoned for a few cheap bucks.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    Reekwind wrote: »
    Wouldn't work. A minimum capacity of 60,000 is required for the final
    see post #19


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    4PP wrote: »
    In October? problem solved :D

    I heard a bit of a discussion on radio this afternoon about it - they were talking about how the timing suited the GAA really well.

    And when you think about it - group games being played in Aviva and All Ireland's going on in Croke Park in early Sept - everyone would be a winner! Brilliant opportunity for GAA to get worldwide exposure.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    Big Ears wrote: »
    Actually it would, Landsdowne isn't big enough for the final, which must be in a 60,000+ capacity stadium.

    Possibly an excuse to knock Havelock Square so ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    pithater1 wrote: »
    Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

    From what I heard today on radio, I don't think Semple is included.

    All other stadia are well located with regard to access from airports and hotel accommodation.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    jm08 wrote: »
    From what I heard today on radio, I don't think Semple is included.

    All other stadia are well located with regard to access from airports and hotel accommodation.

    Well that would cover the Camogie finals so.
    What stadiums were mentioned?
    I presume the 3 in Dublin, 2 in Limeirck, 1 each for Cork, Belfast and Galway?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,541 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    [Jackass] wrote: »
    Presumably, the GAA will look to use the opportunity to get some outside funding into developing the stadiums and a big cut from rent and ticket sales...

    Going on the presumably safe assumption that the IRB have enough countries lining up to host this competition that they won't actually feel the need to pay a cent of ticket sales or rent to the GAA, how does the financing of this work?

    I assume that the government would be expected to give money directly to the GAA as compensation for the use of their grounds?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    pithater1 wrote: »
    Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

    Teams could base themselves in the UK (much in the same way as some Olympic teams based themselves in Ireland). Its less than an hour on a plane.

    I don't think the GAA will let foreign sports into the spiritual home of the GAA ;)


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 756 ✭✭✭4PP


    pithater1 wrote: »
    Good news, I agree that training facilities could be the main 'sticky wicket'. Hotels etc in the host towns/cities may well be another problem. For example, Semple in Thurles holds 50k but I think Hayes Hotel is the only hotel in the town.

    I think you're forgetting how big the country is? as in tiny!!!
    You can get to Galway Belfast Limerick or Cork in less than 3 hours from Dublin.
    France 2007 had teams travelling further than the length of Ireland!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    4PP wrote: »
    I think you're forgetting how big the country is? as in tiny!!!
    You can get to Galway Belfast Limerick or Cork in less than 3 hours from Dublin.
    France 2007 had teams travelling further than the length of Ireland!

    True but you would want the fans to be able to stay in the same town after the match though?


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    pithater1 wrote: »
    Well that would cover the Camogie finals so.
    What stadiums were mentioned?
    I presume the 3 in Dublin, 2 in Limeirck, 1 each for Cork, Belfast and Galway?

    Those mentioned were Cork (being developed into 45k seater), Fitzgerald (Killarney - lots of tourist accommodation), Casement, Belfast - being redeveloped into 40K all-seater, Gaelic Grounds, Limerick plus Croke Park. All those mentioned are 40K+ seaters. Then there is Lansdowne, RDS, Thomond & Ravenhill for smaller games.

    Thats 9 stadia.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,591 ✭✭✭ambid


    I imagine they'd want somewhere in the north west (Derry or Ballybofey), south east, and midlands (Athlone) maybe.

    I doubt they'd use two stadiums in Limerick (Thomond & Gaelic Grounds) and two in the south west (Cork & Killarney) as they'll probably want to spread it around more.

    What a fantastic opportunity for the GAA to upgrade their stadiums though.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    wprathead wrote: »
    the camogie and ladies football are on the other weekends i think though

    Move them to the Aviva:)


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,681 ✭✭✭✭P_1


    I suppose if you wanted a true geographical spread you might go for:

    Dublin: Croker, Lansdowne, RDS
    South: Thomand, Cork, Killarney
    West: Pearse, McHale
    North: Ravenhill, New Belfast Stadium.
    Midlands: Nowlan, Portlaois.

    Giving 13 stadia


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    ambid wrote: »
    I imagine they'd want somewhere in the north west (Derry or Ballybofey), south east, and midlands (Athlone) maybe.

    I doubt they'd use two stadiums in Limerick (Thomond & Gaelic Grounds) and two in the south west (Cork & Killarney) as they'll probably want to spread it around more.

    What a fantastic opportunity for the GAA to upgrade their stadiums though.

    I think they might - from an accommodation point of view Cork/access to airports.

    I can see some of the big teams wanting to base themselves in Limerick (like ABs/SA) who would need a 40K stadium. Ireland would want Dublin. The 6Ns teams would probably just fly in for their games (which is why they might be very supportive of an Ireland bid).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Hazys wrote: »
    Why would Munster want to host games in the Gaelic Grounds over Thomond Park?

    The same reason Leinster would want to hold games in the Aviva.

    If you can sell 45,000 tickets for a match up to 5 times a season, compared to say 26,000 in Thomond, and the stadium is in the same city, why wouldn't you want to move games away from Thomond park when the capacity isn't sufficient?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,773 ✭✭✭connemara man


    By then Connacht will be the super power in Irish rugby with a 30,000 seater stadium.
    I called it here first ;-)
    Hopefully anyway


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,591 ✭✭✭ambid


    pithater1 wrote: »
    I suppose if you wanted a true geographical spread you might go for:

    Dublin: Croker, Lansdowne, RDS
    South: Thomand, Cork, Killarney
    West: Pearse, McHale
    North: Ravenhill, New Belfast Stadium.
    Midlands: Nowlan, Portlaois.

    Giving 13 stadia

    I don't think there is going to be a new Belfast stadium. The last I heard they couldn't agree a location so are going to upgrade Ravenhill, Casement & Windsor Park instead.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,547 ✭✭✭✭phog


    It's certainly doable and should be a runner, I honestly don't think the GAA will rule it out, my own guess is that Ulster GAA may not allow rugby in their grounds.

    I'd love to see McHale Park and Semple Stadium being used, it would bring rugby to the masses outside the cities.

    While I'd love to see the Gaelic Grounds in Limerick getting games, I doubt the scheduling would allow for two grounds that are about a kilometer away from each other to be used. It would be fantastic for the city itself and for rugby there.


  • Registered Users Posts: 373 ✭✭LETS BE AVN IT


    You could definitely see a new 20,000 + stadium being built in Waterford aswell


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,592 ✭✭✭GerM


    GAA already said they've been asked for use of 6 stadia. Listed them on main evening news as Croke, P Ui C, Fitzgerald, Gaelic Grounds and Pearse. He listed Gaelic Grounds twice but if I was to guess, I would say the other ground is Semple Stadium or Casement Park.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    GerM wrote: »
    GAA already said they've been asked for use of 6 stadia. Listed them on main evening news as Croke, P Ui C, Fitzgerald, Gaelic Grounds and Pearse. He listed Gaelic Grounds twice but if I was to guess, I would say the other ground is Semple Stadium or Casement Park.

    For capacity it should be Semple but perhaps im being biased :). I think this could be a hugely positive step for the GAA. I'm glad to see their attitudes are more open these times. Ive no doubt it will be a huge success if it comes to pass.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,123 ✭✭✭stepbar


    Realistically, how many stadia would you need at a min?

    Ireland needs a World Cup... it would be brilliant.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    Well, as mentioned in the article, the last world cup was 12 and the 2019 Japan world cup will use 11 (two of which will be outside of Japan).

    In the opening post, I listed 11 stadia which would very similar in capacity terms to those of previous world cups, although some moderniseation and external facilities may be required, but nothing major.

    There is also an option of using 9 to 10 domestic stadia and perhaps bringing in Wales and Scotland to have Millenium and Murrayfield also if that was feasable.

    Ideally it would be great to host every single game on this island though.

    There's also the option of Windsor Park which is being redeveloped and will have a 20,000 capacity, although we're fairly covered at the lower end of stadia capacity required.

    I know the New Zealand world cup lost money (in tanagable terms), but I think there is a lot less work to do in Ireland than there was to do in New Zealand and I think geographically, we have a much stronger position to sell tickets (as some of the world cup in NZ was poorly attended, with the All Blacks not even managing to sell out all of their games...) and I think it would not only be a major Economic success, but it would be a marker in Irish history of being a major nation and capable of hosting such an event.


  • Registered Users Posts: 103 ✭✭iwasonbwh


    St.Tiernachs.Park.07.jpg

    St Tiernachs Park Clones is a place where I would love to see RWC. 36000 capacity, and it brings money to a part of the country that could do with it :) It shows much about the history of GAA also; trips to small towns, atmosphere, history. It also straddles the border, so it is part of both sides of the border, and is under 90 mins from many big towns.

    PS The stadium is built in a bowl and is a wonderful place to watch sport.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,637 ✭✭✭CoDy1


    Stadia aside, just wondering whether people think we have the proper infrastructure, accommodation and facilities to host all on our own, a major international sporting tournament?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,123 ✭✭✭stepbar


    CoDy1 wrote: »
    Stadia aside, just wondering whether people think we have the proper infrastructure, accommodation and facilities to host all on our own, a major international sporting tournament?

    I think we do. But consideration must be given to stadia in cities such as Waterford and Sligo also even though both cities would not be rugby strongholds.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,541 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    CoDy1 wrote: »
    Stadia aside, just wondering whether people think we have the proper infrastructure, accommodation and facilities to host all on our own, a major international sporting tournament?

    100% true, but an event like this can be used as a valid excuse to get those facilities and infrastructure organised.
    This only works as long as all parties accept that by the time you add up the money you've spent bidding (apparently NZ bid €100M) and building this infrastructure, then subtract your direct revenue streams, that you are going to be left with a loss. It falls apart if, for example, one particular party to the bid expects to make a direct profit from the use of their grounds.


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