Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Male TD pulls female colleague into his lap – in the Dáil chamber

Options
1246789

Comments

  • Options
    #92
    homerjay2005
    Registered Users Posts: 29,346 ✭✭✭✭homerjay2005


    as usual, we moan, cry and whinge over irrelevant things that go on in politics.

    fair play to them for having a bit of a laugh after all the crap that has gone on in there. she has no problem with it, its a nothing story.


  • Options
    #93
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    homerjay2005 wrote: »
    as usual, we moan, cry and whinge over irrelevant things that go on in politics.

    fair play to them for having a bit of a laugh after all the crap that has gone on in there. she has no problem with it, its a nothing story.

    I dont think casual sexism is acceptable in the workplace. Particularly a workplace where staff are paid from my taxes.


  • Options
    #94
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    username123 wrote: »
    The relevance is that he thinks it is ok to treat women like this in the workplace. Its sexism.



    I'm sure when he meet Anne Collins for the first time that night he probably kissed her on the cheeck. I doubt he did it to any of his male colleagues. When I first see females friends I kiss them on the check when saying hello, I never do it to my male friends. Does that make me sexist now?


  • Options
    #95
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    I'm sure when he meet Anne Collins for the first time that night he probably kissed her on the cheeck. I doubt he did it to any of his male colleagues. When I first see females friends I kiss them on the check when saying hello, I never do it to my male friends. Does that make me sexist now?

    What? Do you usually go round kissing your female workmates on the cheek when you go into work?

    I dont care what you do in social situations.


  • Options
    #96
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    I'm sure when he meet Anne Collins for the first time that night he probably kissed her on the cheeck. I doubt he did it to any of his male colleagues. When I first see females friends I kiss them on the check when saying hello, I never do it to my male friends. Does that make me sexist now?

    How are you sure of that?

    And you'll notice that you said you kiss your female friends on the cheek when you meet them; are you in the habit of giving the women in your office a kiss and a cuddle every morning?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #97
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    username123 wrote: »
    What? Do you usually go round kissing your female workmates on the cheek when you go into work?

    I dont care what you do in social situations.



    If one was a good friend and depending on how long it had been since I had seen her I might. Even in work situations I think it's pretty common for males to have a different kind of interaction with their good friends female friends in work compared to males. The incident is either sexist or it's not, the situation doesn't matter. Maybe you just don't care if he's sexist outside of work? On a Lunch break it would be a lot more common for a guy to tickle a female work friend than a male one, I don't agree that he is sexist because of that.


  • Options
    #98
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    The_Kew_Tour wrote: »
    Tom Barry is from my constituency back home.

    Could not stop hearing about him before he got in Dail.

    Its first time I have heard his name mentioned since he got elected.

    Glad he is still alive.


    I can assure you that not only is he alive and well but like his peers he is making a killing while doing sweet f-all


  • Options
    #99
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    First of all people complained about sexism, inequality, whatever.

    Then they found out Aine didn't really have a major problem with what happened.

    So then they started complaining about it being unacceptable in the workplace. It is true I suppose.

    If it became acceptable in the workplace then they'd find something else to moan about.

    The point is that people will always try and break something down into the nitty gritty and find something wrong with it so they can have a good auld whinge.

    Get outside and enjoy the weather instead of trying to get involved in their relationship. And she doesn't really seem uncomfortable to me. She walks away. I don't know where she was going or what she had to do. Not does anyone else here I doubt. Maybe she was going to the toilet.


  • Options
    #100
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    kylith wrote: »
    How are you sure of that?

    And you'll notice that you said you kiss your female friends on the cheek when you meet them; are you in the habit of giving the women in your office a kiss and a cuddle every morning?



    I'm not sure. So does guys who kiss their female friends but not their males ones mean they are all sexist? Well Tom Barry doesn't drag Anne Collins onto his lap every morning either. Also he doesn't do it to every female in the Dail. If I had a female friend in work I would treat her differently than a female work colleague.


  • Options
    #101
    Timmyctc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,825 ✭✭✭Timmyctc


    kylith wrote: »
    How are you sure of that?

    And you'll notice that you said you kiss your female friends on the cheek when you meet them; are you in the habit of giving the women in your office a kiss and a cuddle every morning?

    Genuine question: Do we know these two aren't friends?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #102
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    Timmyctc wrote: »
    Genuine question: Do we know these two aren't friends?


    They probably are. Think they're from the same county as well but different constituency. I mean it would be different if someone started a job tomorrow and did it on their first day. They know one another a while and just did it.

    It isn't acceptable behaviour in the workplace but all these people going on about how he treats women and sexism and all these things is just stirring sh1te.


  • Options
    #103
    Hitchens
    Registered Users Posts: 8,005 ✭✭✭Hitchens


    Did Aine say that she took pleasure in it?


  • Options
    #104
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    I wanted to break this down because you are making good points, so I want to answer them properly.
    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    If one was a good friend and depending on how long it had been since I had seen her I might.

    I have worked with guys who I was good friends with, even been dating guys from work. But kissing in work crosses a line imo. I would never allow anyone to kiss me on the cheek in work. Or to grab me. It simply isnt appropriate no matter what my relationship with the people I work with.
    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    Even in work situations I think it's pretty common for males to have a different kind of interaction with their good friends female friends in work compared to males.

    See my reply above. There may be different interaction but it should still be appropriate to the workplace.
    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    The incident is either sexist or it's not, the situation doesn't matter.

    Of course the situation matters. I wouldnt think he was sexist to pull his wife onto his lap at a BBQ. I do think he is sexist to pull a female work colleague onto his lap while at work. How do you think other women in that workplace feel to see that happening as apparently acceptable behaviour?
    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    Maybe you just don't care if he's sexist outside of work?

    I dont.
    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    On a Lunch break it would be a lot more common for a guy to tickle a female work friend than a male one, I don't agree that he is sexist because of that.

    Again, I cant say I ever would think it appropriate to be tickled by a work colleague, male, female or otherwise - while in work (irrelevant whether or not we were on a lunch break). I cant see how this example illustrates sexism because it shouldnt be happening in the first place.

    Maybe I have just worked in very quiet workplaces because the things you describe, kissing, tickling - would not have been considered appropriate in any of them between any genders!


  • Options
    #105
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    I'm not sure. So does guys who kiss their female friends but not their males ones mean they are all sexist?
    No, it doesn't, because they are your friends and you are in a relaxed and informal setting, not in work, being broadcast to the entire nation.
    If I had a female friend in work I would treat her differently than a female work colleague.
    Maybe you would, but I'd be surprised if you felt it acceptable to sit her in your lap before a board meeting, when the rest of your colleagues were there. I worked with family members for years, but we never behaved to each other in work like we would at home because it would be unprofessional to do so and would cast us in a bad light in front of clients.
    Timmyctc wrote: »
    Genuine question: Do we know these two aren't friends?
    It doesn't matter if they are. When you are in work, especially when you know that there are TV cameras all over the place, you show your best side and act in a professional manner.


  • Options
    #106
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    Hitchens wrote: »
    Did Aine say that she took pleasure in it?


    LOL. Don't think she put it like that. Think it was more like it wasn't a big issue. She was hardly going to say she had an orgasm in the Dail.


  • Options
    #107
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Timmyctc wrote: »
    Im glad people can find a reason to get up in the morning and get angry over what could potentially be two mates titting about on their break.

    For people saying its embarrassing, its a hell of a site less embarrassing than the childish bickering in the Dáil or by TD's on other forms of media. I for one would be happy if the only 'embarrassing' thing the TD's do is tit about on their break once in a while.

    Actually, titting about, as you put it, is what takes place on a TV reality programme, not in the parliament, where important decisions and votes are taken.


  • Options
    #108
    Clarehobo
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭Clarehobo


    Neeson wrote: »
    They probably are. Think they're from the same county as well but different constituency. I mean it would be different if someone started a job tomorrow and did it on their first day. They know one another a while and just did it.

    It isn't acceptable behaviour in the workplace but all these people going on about how he treats women and sexism and all these things is just stirring sh1te.
    Timmyctc wrote: »
    Genuine question: Do we know these two aren't friends?

    Guys, as far as I am concerned, this is not a sexism witch hunt. Whether or not they are friends in real life is irrelevant. This is about inappropriate behaviour in a work place.

    Genuine Question: You are in work, female colleague stops for a chat on the office floor as she is walking past, you consider her a friend, she remarks how cold it is due to the aircon being on because of the balmy weather. Do you:
    a) pull her into your lap and restrain her while saying "I'll warm you up" and the pat her on the lower back after she gets up and is walking away
    b) say it is cold, agree with her sentiments and suggest she turn up the temp on the aircon as it is not just her finding it cold
    c) suggest she put on jumper or coat to keep warm

    If you choose option a) and your manager witnesses it, does your manager:
    a) Guffaw, clap you on the back and say "Sure it's only office banter"
    b) Call you into their office for a talk to explain appropriate work place behaviour, call her in separately to determine does she want to take it further - she will refuse because she has to work with you and doesn't want trouble, fill out an incident form anyway to cover their ass and submit to HR.

    If your manager chooses option a and ignores the incident, they will be in deep ****e if it comes out.
    If you manager chooses option b, you will be in deep ****e.

    There is a reason there is legislation in place protecting people in their own WORKplaces...


  • Options
    #109
    Timmyctc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,825 ✭✭✭Timmyctc


    darkhorse wrote: »
    Actually, titting about, as you put it, is what takes place on a TV reality programme, not in the parliament, where important decisions and votes are taken.

    On their break. They are humans too ya know. Maybe they just didnt consider they'd still be recorded.


  • Options
    #110
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    When I first see females friends I kiss them on the check when saying hello.

    Do you pull them onto your lap?


  • Options
    #111
    chipsdave
    Registered Users Posts: 316 ✭✭chipsdave


    It could have been a lot worse had Miss Collins landed clumsily on Minister Barrys erection.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #112
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Chucky the tree wrote: »
    Even in work situations I think it's pretty common for males to have a different kind of interaction with their good friends female friends in work compared to males.

    But, do you think that particular kind of interaction of said TD is appropriate in the main chamber in the Dail, in camera?


  • Options
    #113
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    Clarehobo wrote: »
    Guys, as far as I am concerned, this is not a sexism witch hunt. Whether or not they are friends in real life is irrelevant. This is about inappropriate behaviour in a work place.

    Genuine Question: You are in work, female colleague stops for a chat on the office floor as she is walking past, you consider her a friend, she remarks how cold it is due to the aircon being on because of the balmy weather. Do you:
    a) pull her into your lap and restrain her while saying "I'll warm you up" and the pat her on the lower back after she gets up and is walking away
    b) say it is cold, agree with her sentiments and suggest she turn up the temp on the aircon as it is not just her finding it cold
    c) suggest she put on jumper or coat to keep warm

    If you choose option a) and your manager witnesses it, does your manager:
    a) Guffaw, clap you on the back and say "Sure it's only office banter"
    b) Call you into their office for a talk to explain appropriate work place behaviour, call her in separately to determine does she want to take it further - she will refuse because she has to work with you and doesn't want trouble, fill out an incident form anyway to cover their ass and submit to HR.

    If your manager chooses option a and ignores the incident, they will be in deep ****e if it comes out.
    If you manager chooses option b, you will be in deep ****e..


    I suppose it would depend on how well I know the colleague and what type of office environment was it. Was it one where I though everyone was laid back and not so serious and where they wouldn't go home and go online to moan about what happened in the office today which didn't really involve or hurt them.

    And of course around we go again about it not being acceptable. Probably but I'd say sometimes depending on the circumstances and scenario it could be grand.

    Oh no. Please don't eat me for saying that now. I hear the brigade coming already.


  • Options
    #114
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    darkhorse wrote: »
    But, do you think that particular kind of interaction of said TD is appropriate in the main chamber in the Dail, in camera?

    No. I think we all agree he shouldn't have done it in a job like that and when it was recorded.

    But people are creating these other scenarios saying would you do this here and there with such and such and think it was acceptable. We don't know until we are in the situation. The same wouldn't apply to all.

    It depends on how well you know the person and what type of environment and what other people are around you. If I knew I was working with a load of stuck up politically correct ones I definitely wouldn't do it because of the reaction it would have - one like the one here - going way overboard.

    If I knew my colleagues were all sound enough people I probably wouldn't have such a fear. I think people know what I mean. I don't have to keep going around in circles.


  • Options
    #115
    Clarehobo
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭Clarehobo


    Neeson wrote: »
    I suppose it would depend on how well I know the colleague and what type of office environment was it. Was it one where I though everyone was laid back and not so serious and where they wouldn't go home and go online to moan about what happened in the office today which didn't really involve or hurt them.

    And of course around we go again about it not being acceptable. Probably but I'd say sometimes depending on the circumstances and scenario it could be grand.

    Oh no. Please don't eat me for saying that now. I hear the brigade coming already.

    Are you seriously saying that your manager in your current work environment would not be concerned about complying with workplace legislation?

    Out of curiosity, what type of work place are you in?


  • Options
    #116
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Timmyctc wrote: »
    On their break. They are humans too ya know. Maybe they just didnt consider they'd still be recorded.

    Ah nuts, Timmy, maybe you're right. If only the camera man had taken a break at the same time, well then the whole country wouldn't be any the wiser.:rolleyes:


  • Options
    #117
    Chucky the tree
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    username123 wrote: »
    Of course the situation matters. I wouldnt think he was sexist to pull his wife onto his lap at a BBQ. I do think he is sexist to pull a female work colleague onto his lap while at work. How do you think other women in that workplace feel to see that happening as apparently acceptable behaviour?



    Why did you change the person to his wife? If he pulled a female friend onto his lap at a BBQ would that make his sexist? I don't think many people have said it's acceptable behaviour.

    kylith wrote: »
    No, it doesn't, because they are your friends and you are in a relaxed and informal setting, not in work, being broadcast to the entire nation.


    So if I kiss a friend on the check in work I am sexist man, If I do it in public then I am not? That logic makes little sense to me I have to say.
    kylith wrote: »
    Maybe you would, but I'd be surprised if you felt it acceptable to sit her in your lap before a board meeting, when the rest of your colleagues were there. I worked with family members for years, but we never behaved to each other in work like we would at home because it would be unprofessional to do so and would cast us in a bad light in front of clients.


    I never said what Tom Barry did was acceptable though.
    kylith wrote: »
    It doesn't matter if they are. When you are in work, especially when you know that there are TV cameras all over the place, you show your best side and act in a professional manner.


    I have never said otherwise.

    darkhorse wrote: »
    But, do you think that particular kind of interaction of said TD is appropriate in the main chamber in the Dail, in camera?


    You should read the thread for this answer.


  • Options
    #118
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Neeson wrote: »
    No. I think we all agree he shouldn't have done it in a job like that and when it was recorded.

    But people are creating these other scenarios saying would you do this here and there with such and such and think it was acceptable. We don't know until we are in the situation. The same wouldn't apply to all.

    It depends on how well you know the person and what type of environment and what other people are around you. If I knew I was working with a load of stuck up politically correct ones I definitely wouldn't do it because of the reaction it would have - one like the one here - going way overboard.

    If I knew my colleagues were all sound enough people I probably wouldn't have such a fear. I think people know what I mean. I don't have to keep going around in circles.

    You were doing great, but ya had to keep going after your first sentence.


  • Options
    #119
    Neeson
    Registered Users Posts: 3,909 ✭✭✭Neeson


    darkhorse wrote: »
    Ah nuts, Timmy, maybe you're right. If only the camera man had taken a break at the same time, well then the whole country wouldn't be any the wiser.:rolleyes:

    They don't have a camera man!

    The cameras are mounted on the walls. Probably someone there in a backroom to make sure the camera which points in the direction of the speaker is going to the broadcast when they are talking.

    They have the wide shot, the one seen in the incident, when there is a break in proceedings.


  • Options
    #120
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    homerjay2005 wrote: »
    its a nothing story.

    Yer right, homer. Sure, its what ya tend to do.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #121
    darkhorse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,274 ✭✭✭darkhorse


    Neeson wrote: »
    They don't have a camera man!

    The cameras are mounted on the walls. Probably someone there in a backroom to make sure the camera which points in the direction of the speaker is going to the broadcast when they are talking.

    They have the wide shot, the one seen in the incident, when there is a break in proceedings.

    Thank's for that info.


Advertisement