Clamped one minute after the grace period....

K.Flyer

pickarooney wrote: »

I've no idea how it works currently but it can't be too hard to add a button where you indicate that you've left. With a 1000 euro fine for abusing it.

How does it notify the clampers when you've topped up?

When you have paid for your parking with Park by Text the information is on their system. The clampers carry hand held scanners. If they do not see a ticket in the window as they walk along checking the cars they point the scanner at the reg plate, it reads the reg and informs them what time the payment will expire at.
One of them showed it to me as they approached my van and I asked to see it.

Omackeral

jebus28 wrote: »

Or just let old people that didn't know any better and who are 5 mins late go home without fining them €120 .

If they are competent enough to operate a motor vehicle on a public road then they would wanna know better. Can't pick and choose which rules apply based on age. Ah it's a red light but he's old so go on....

jebus28

kylith wrote: »

And what's old enough, or sick enough? Will they be producing a doctors note or should the clamper take their word for it? Does the driver have to be ill, or is a passenger ok? What's the ranking? Does gout trump getting stitches or not?

The only fair way is the same rule for everyone.

Or stop clamping at hospital entrances?

Again, fixing a car to a position that desperately needs to be free? Laughable.

jebus28

Omackeral wrote: »

If they are competent enough to operate a motor vehicle on a public road then they would wanna know better. Can't pick and choose which rules apply based on age. Ah it's a red light but he's old so go on....

I've already said elderly and sick was one example of the kind of people coming out of hospitals. You want me to list every illness in the world? Clamping should not happen at hospitals is the point.

swampgas

jebus28 wrote: »

We are talking about hospital entrances where you are granted 20 minutes to collect relatives and how people get held up through the fault of the hospital. As as my experience working in a hospital. Reading is important isn't it?

If it's a regular occurrence then management should consider if the signage is correct, and whether the sign should say "Pick Up / Set Down Only", or whether the warnings about clamping after 20 minutes are clear enough.

Maybe a big warning sign to say that delays are common and to park in <alternative location> instead if your visit is likely to take longer than 20 minutes.

You'll always have a few chancers though that assume they'll get away with it for 30 or 45 minutes because they reckon the guy doing the checks probably doesn't come round that often.

kylith

jebus28 wrote: »

Or stop clamping at hospital entrances?

Again, fixing a car to a position that desperately needs to be free? Laughable.

So anyone can park there for as long as they like for free? That's going to be very handy if there's an actual emergency.

I agree that clamping the car is hardly ideal, but short of towing away every car parked illegally, which would need a fleet of tow trucks, somewhere to take them...

Omackeral

jebus28 wrote: »

You said people who feel victims or bankers, guards or clampers are most likely on the dole.

Look, this stems back to Teyla Emmagan saying clampers are decent because they work for a living. You challenged that. I counter challenged that by saying I'd find someone who actually gets out and works for a living far more decent than someone who doesn't bother their bollox but instead plays the perpetual victim. That's all. Wasn't a shot at you because I don't know you. It was making a point with regard the decency argument. That's all. I don't know your work situation and never claimed to know. For all I know, you're a clamper.

Allinall

jebus28 wrote: »

Sigh really? He sees them when he returns to remove the clamp.

Sure we've all parked at a hospital entrance to enjoy their delicious coffee.

So when the clamper returns to remove the clamp and sees that it's an old person, he goes back in time and doesn't clamp the car?

Young people get sick as well.

Are very sick young people fair game to be clamped?

jebus28

kylith wrote: »

So anyone can park there for as long as they like for free? That's going to be very handy if there's an actual emergency.

I agree that clamping the car is hardly ideal, but short of towing away every car parked illegally, which would need a fleet of tow trucks, somewhere to take them...

Fines for extreme cases. Most people go in and get out as soon as possible. Being cynically offered 20 minutes and then clamping them is exploitative.

Someone said park further away then collect the relative, what's the point of having spaces in the first place at the entrance then?

pickarooney

Victor wrote: »

Knock yourself out: http://www.dublincity.ie/sites/default/files/content/RoadsandTraffic/Parking/Documents/ParkingControlByeLaws2014.pdf

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1994/act/7/section/36/enacted/en/html

I got 20 pages in and gave up so many it's in the later pages, but you're saying that a clamper or traffics warden has the authority to adjudge a citizen guilty of a criminal offence based on being late back to retrieve a car from a marked parking space?

jebus28

Allinall wrote: »

So when the clamper returns to remove the clamp and sees that it's an old person, he goes back in time and doesn't clamp the car?

What are you jabbering on about? A decent thing to do would be not charge them 120 euro to remove it. For the 20th time, old people was an example. Get out a medical encyclopedia, anyone with those conditions shouldn't be clamped in hospital entrances. Better?

pickarooney

kylith wrote: »

So anyone can park there for as long as they like for free? That's going to be very handy if there's an actual emergency.

I agree that clamping the car is hardly ideal, but short of towing away every car parked illegally, which would need a fleet of tow trucks, somewhere to take them...

Valet parking maybe.

jebus28

You know guys, it's ok to admit that clamping in hospitals is wrong without comprising your whole view on clamping. The man on the internet won't judge you.

kylith

jebus28 wrote: »

Fines for extreme cases. Most people go in and get out as soon as possible. Being cynically offered 20 minutes and then clamping them is exploitative.

Someone said park further away then collect the relative, what's the point of having spaces in the first place at the entrance then?

So that if someone is having difficulty walking you can park, bring them to the waiting area, leave them there, then go move the car; and do it in reverse when they are ready to leave. Very, very few hospital appointments/A&E visits take 20 minutes or less, and the majority of people are under no illusion that they would.

swampgas

jebus28 wrote: »

Fines for extreme cases. Most people go in and get out as soon as possible. Being cynically offered 20 minutes and then clamping them is exploitative.

Someone said park further away then collect the relative, what's the point of having spaces in the first place at the entrance then?

It's up to 20 minutes. That's plenty of time enough to park, load a few bags, help somebody infirm into a car, and head off.

It's usually not long enough to go through the process of discharging a patient, in my experience anyway, which has often taken me hours.

kylith

pickarooney wrote: »

Valet parking maybe.

But then you'd have to tip the valet, which would be exploitative.

jebus28

kylith wrote: »

So that if someone is having difficulty walking you can park, bring them to the waiting area, leave them there, then go move the car; and do it in reverse when they are ready to leave. Very, very few hospital appointments/A&E visits take 20 minutes or less, and the majority of people are under no illusion that they would.

Well, from my experience we had daily occurrences of people running out of time. You never know when someone needs the bathroom or is sick on the way to the car.

Just get rid of clamping there, it's unnecessary hardship on people that just want to get home. The actions of a few chancers don't justify it.

wexandproud

jebus28 wrote: »

You dont know what you're talking about really. When I worked in Ardkeen you had 20 minutes to get in and get the patient in the car if you parked in the spaces by the main entrance. Sometimes a doctor would wish to speak to the family and by the time they got out they were clamped.

But sure their family member shouldn't have been sick in the first place.[/QUOT
so you worked in ardkeen so what, its not like i was never in a hospital in wexford or ardkeen for that matter or i have never had to visit someone who was sick or terminally ill .a few years back someone very close to me was brought to hospital and i got a call to come in but i did not just abandon the car at the hospital door nor indeed did any of the rest of the family , a little bit of respect was shown for other people who might use the place therefore none of us were clamped . On a sidenote and i only speak about wexford , if staff would park their cars in the farther away spots it would free up spaces nearer the door for the actual visitors

Sofiztikated

jebus28 wrote: »

We are talking about hospital entrances where you are granted 20 minutes to collect relatives and how people get held up through the fault of the hospital. As as my experience working in a hospital. Reading is important isn't it?

Does it suck that sick people or elderly people get fined/clamped? Yes. Noone is disagreeing that it's a ****ty thing to have happen. But it's still their own fault.

I've been in and out of hospital for years, I've picked people up, I've dropped people off, I've spent days in there when I expected to be there for a few hours. D'you know how many times I've been clamped/fined? Once. When I parked in a place that was parking over night, and a clearway during the day. I returned to the car to find it in the air, because I had mistakeningly thought that the clearway started at 9, when it was 8.

amcalester

jebus28 wrote: »

Well, from my experience we had daily occurrences of people running out of time. You never know when someone needs the bathroom or is sick on the way to the car.

Just get rid of clamping there, it's unnecessary hardship on people that just want to get home. The actions of a few chancers don't justify it.

What alternative do you propose?

If it's left as a free for all then most hospital spaces would be full all the time leaving no spaces for those collecting/dropping off patients.

wexandproud

kylith wrote: »

So that if someone is having difficulty walking you can park, bring them to the waiting area, leave them there, then go move the car; and do it in reverse when they are ready to leave. Very, very few hospital appointments/A&E visits take 20 minutes or less, and the majority of people are under no illusion that they would.

ah here , ya cant come on here spewing out common sense stuff like that:D

jebus28

amcalester wrote: »

What alternative do you propose?

If it's left as a free for all then most hospital spaces would be full all the time leaving no spaces for those collecting/dropping off patients.

I've already said. Fines for extreme cases.

jebus28

wexandproud wrote: »

jebus28 wrote: »

You dont know what you're talking about really. When I worked in Ardkeen you had 20 minutes to get in and get the patient in the car if you parked in the spaces by the main entrance. Sometimes a doctor would wish to speak to the family and by the time they got out they were clamped.

But sure their family member shouldn't have been sick in the first place.[/QUOT
so you worked in ardkeen so what, its not like i was never in a hospital in wexford or ardkeen for that matter or i have never had to visit someone who was sick or terminally ill .a few years back someone very close to me was brought to hospital and i got a call to come in but i did not just abandon the car at the hospital door nor indeed did any of the rest of the family , a little bit of respect was shown for other people who might use the place therefore none of us were clamped . On a sidenote and i only speak about wexford , if staff would park their cars in the farther away spots it would free up spaces nearer the door for the actual visitors

No one is talking about visiting patients.

Sofiztikated

jebus28 wrote: »

I've already said. Fines for extreme cases.

Which is what your clampers are doing.

20 minutes to move from a drop off/pick up zone. Anything over that is extreme.

amcalester

jebus28 wrote: »

I've already said. Fines for extreme cases.

Apologies, I must have missed that post.


What classifies as an extreme case though, and how is anyone meant to know the particulars, 1 car parked by a person using it as a free parking, and another collecting a patient look the same.

Obviously there are steps that could be taken by the hospital, such as tags etc, but these would all incur a cost and would require additional staff.

So how much of the HSE budget would you want diverted to pay for this?

And even before that, how much of a problem is it actually? What percentage of total patient collections actually get clamped?

I'm sure you remember those that do, because it must be quite stressful for all involved, but how many people don't get clamped?

jebus28

Sofiztikated wrote: »

Which is what your clampers are doing.

20 minutes to move from a drop off/pick up zone. Anything over that is extreme.

Clampers are trapping the car in the space thats badly needed. Cars end up there for hours if they don't have the cash handy to pay the fine.

Anything over 20 minutes is extreme, but trapping the car there indefinitely is fine. Right so.

Sofiztikated

jebus28 wrote: »

Clampers are trapping the car in the space thats badly needed. Cars end up there for hours if they don't have the cash handy to pay the fine.

Anything over 20 minutes is extreme, but trapping the car there indefinitely is fine. Right so.

The clamping deters others from doing the same, all day long. Having one space out of action because of a clamped car is infinitely better than having all spaces unavailable.

jebus28

amcalester wrote: »

Apologies, I must have missed that post.


What classifies as an extreme case though, and how is anyone meant to know the particulars, 1 car parked by a person using it as a free parking, and another collecting a patient look the same.

Obviously there are steps that could be taken by the hospital, such as tags etc, but these would all incur a cost and would require additional staff.

So how much of the HSE budget would you want diverted to pay for this?

And even before that, how much of a problem is it actually? What percentage of total patient collections actually get clamped?

I'm sure you remember those that do, because it must be quite stressful for all involved, but how many people don't get clamped?

I would say an hour is extreme unless there's a valid reason. Someone collapsed etc worried family members forgot about the car.

You see the issue is that nurses would explain to clampers that it was their fault etc that such and such got held up. And no budging. A black and white policy doesn't suit the environment.

With regards to frequency, at least once a day. And predominantly with elderly people, but there were different things like babies needed changing or someone was sick on themselves or wet themselves.

A Garda for example will listen to your situation and make a decision based on circumstances, clampers won't because it's all about money.

jebus28

Sofiztikated wrote: »

The clamping deters others from doing the same, all day long. Having one space out of action because of a clamped car is infinitely better than having all spaces unavailable.

I would argue that a fine in hospitals would achieve the same goal.

amcalester

jebus28 wrote: »

I would say an hour is extreme unless there's a valid reason. Someone collapsed etc worried family members forgot about the car.

You see the issue is that nurses would explain to clampers that it was their fault etc that such and such got held up. And no budging. A black and white policy doesn't suit the environment.

With regards to frequency, at least once a day. And predominantly with elderly people, but there were different things like babies needed changing or someone was sick on themselves or wet themselves.

A Garda for example will listen to your situation and make a decision based on circumstances, clampers won't because it's all about money.

If you allow an hour, then every other chancer will know this and just park there for the hour.

Not nice being clamped in a hospital but until someone suggests a workable alternative, I don't see the issue.

Ultimately it's up to the hospital to decide how much leniency to afford offenders, the clampers just enforce hospital management's instructions.