El Classico - Leinster v Munster 02/04/2016 - 1730 (TG4, SS3)

The Rape of Lucretia

You are probably right - but that is with the hindsight of Leinster playing poorly as well. Leinster are better fundamentally. But both teams performed at the lower end of their spectrums yesterday.
Had Munster won, Leinster would have been saying the same thing - 'we should have won that - Munster werent up to much at all, but we played badly'.

phog

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

You are probably right - but that is with the hindsight of Leinster playing poorly as well. Leinster are better fundamentally. But both teams performed at the lower end of their spectrums yesterday.
Had Munster won, Leinster would have been saying the same thing - 'we should have won that - Munster werent up to much at all, but we played badly'.

Munster and Leinster look poorly coached, the moves yesterday were laboured, slow and predictable. Leinster's defence and Sexton is the main difference between the two teams.

awec

phog wrote: »

Munster and Leinster look poorly coached, the moves yesterday were laboured, slow and predictable. Leinster's defence and Sexton is the main difference between the two teams.

There were no moves yesterday, it was like watching rugby league.

Not unique to yesterday either.

Mahatma Geansai

phog wrote: »

Haven't got around to reading the thread since kick off. My thoughts are we could and should have won the game, both teams played poor enough rugby but I think we blew a few opportunities that should have had us ahead.

I thought Archer had a good game in the scrum, Murray was close to MotM, Holland was great though he had two poor restarts. We missed Ryan particularly in the lineout.

Before the game I thought a LBP would be a good achievement but now, 24hrs after the game I still think we threw that game away.

Archer was possibly the best prop on the field yesterday which is great going.

We should have had a penalty to draw the game at the end; Kilcoyne was tackled by offside players when he tapped and went/fumbled. A draw would have been a fair reflection of the game and the extra point would have been very important for Munster.

phog

WTV's blog of the game.

vienne86

Munster

phog wrote: »

I thought Archer had a good game in the scrum, Murray was close to MotM, Holland was great though he had two poor restarts. We missed Ryan particularly in the lineout.

Murray really was excellent. I think every one of his box kicks was taken by a Munster player. And it seemed to me that every box kick by Reddan was taken by a Munster player.

But he did much more than box kick! I think he deserved MOTM, though I wouldn't argue with it going to Sexton.

Rigor Mortis

vienne86 wrote: »

Murray really was excellent. I think every one of his box kicks was taken by a Munster player. And it seemed to me that every box kick by Reddan was taken by a Munster player.

But he did much more than box kick! I think he deserved MOTM, though I wouldn't argue with it going to Sexton.

Totally agree regarding Murray and MOTM. There is an almost slavish tendency to give the award to someone from the winning team. Sexton was very good but Murray was excellent.

neelia11

Munster

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

Archer was possibly the best prop on the field yesterday which is great going.

We should have had a penalty to draw the game at the end; Kilcoyne was tackled by offside players when he tapped and went/fumbled. A draw would have been a fair reflection of the game and the extra point would have been very important for Munster.

Need to see again but kilcoyne chipped the ball about head height and nearly fumbled it so whoever tackled him was possibly onside as the poor tap gave time for players to come off the line.

CMOTDibbler

neelia11 wrote: »

Need to see again but kilcoyne chipped the ball about head height and nearly fumbled it so whoever tackled him was possibly onside as the poor tap gave time for players to come off the line.

Munster made that complaint to the ref and he wasn't having it. Kilcoyne's fumble gave plenty of time for defenders to come up, it was only 5m out.

jacothelad

Munster

phog wrote: »

Munster and Leinster look poorly coached, the moves yesterday were laboured, slow and predictable. Leinster's defence and Sexton is the main difference between the two teams.

It could read in general, Ulster, Munster and Leinster look poorly coached, their moves are generally laboured, slow and predictable.

Mahatma Geansai wrote: »

Archer was possibly the best prop on the field yesterday which is great going.

We should have had a penalty to draw the game at the end; Kilcoyne was tackled by offside players when he tapped and went/fumbled. A draw would have been a fair reflection of the game and the extra point would have been very important for Munster.

Archer was o.k. but he flopped stupidly onto a ruck that cost 3 points. On a separate note, I think the ref should have resiled his penalty decision on Ryan. How can you penalise a guy for not rolling away when he is k.o.'d? Poor refereeing.

I thought at first that Kilcoyne was tackled by offside players but when I rewound and looked again he wasn't. He was just crap at what he did. Given the unlikely chance of scoring, Munster should have taken the draw. That extra point could have been a season saver.

Clegg

Munster

I had another look at Kilcoyne's tap and I don't think Leinster had a player offside. The try line was only a few metres away and Leinster only had to retreat to there anyway. Te'o, I think, rushed up very fast to hit Kilcoyne after the tap.

Tbh I think the offside call is somethiing that has been repeated so much that its become fact rather than opinion.

leakyboots

*gritted teeth* Congrats Leinster on the win

Thought we threw that one away a bit, braindead at the end. Take the 3 points is what POC or POM would have said I'd have thought, or a scrum. I can understand Killer going for it 'cos he's lethal from that range but the execution was atrocious.

Very happy with how Archer, both Hollands, Murray and TOD went. I think Foley erred in bringing on Keatley at that stage. Zebo was uncharacteristically sloppy.

How far has Cian Healy's star fallen, he's atrocious.

The ref missed things for both sides, especially against Leinster in the last minutes. Draw would have been a fair result for me but them's the breaks

the perfect ten

DDC1990 wrote: »

Ridiculous from the referee.

I reckon it was 1 minute and 25 seconds from indicating to go for the kick at goal until Sexton actually struck the ball.

Pretty poor refereeing in my opinion.

leakyboots

the perfect ten wrote: »

I reckon it was 1 minute and 25 seconds from indicating to go for the kick at goal until Sexton actually struck the ball.

Pretty poor refereeing in my opinion.

Yeah, very much so. Especially in the context of the final score, there were Munster players standing near enough too to possibly hear the warning, they should have done a Stringer and ran up and grabbed the ball.

Actually, in that hypothetical situation... is it play on or do Munster get a penalty?

irishbucsfan

leakyboots wrote: »

Yeah, very much so. Especially in the context of the final score, there were Munster players standing near enough too to possibly hear the warning, they should have done a Stringer and ran up and grabbed the ball.

Actually, in that hypothetical situation... is it play on or do Munster get a penalty?

Was it a penalty or a conversion? I thought it was a penalty

leakyboots

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Was it a penalty or a conversion? I thought it was a penalty

It was a penalty yeah. I'm just wondering the protocols around when the time is up - I presume Munster players can't move regardless in this instance?

irishbucsfan

leakyboots wrote: »

It was a penalty yeah. I'm just wondering the protocols around when the time is up - I presume Munster players can't move regardless in this instance?

Nah, it's up to the referee. It'd be a free kick to Munster I think but happy to be corrected on that.

neelia11

Munster

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Nah, it's up to the referee. It'd be a free kick to Munster I think but happy to be corrected on that.

Scrum i think. Poite pulled sexton up on it before

Journeyman_1

Munster

I think the commentators said he had 60 seconds, but is it not 90 for a penalty and 60 for a conversion? Maybe I have those mixed up. In any case, I really wish Sexton could take his kicks a bit quicker in general, its frustrating.

Teferi

https://twitter.com/murray_kinsella/status/716946927745634304

the perfect ten

Is it the arrival of the tee or the indication to kick that starts the clock ?

CatFromHue

Munster

No delay. If a kicker indicates to the referee the intention to kick a penalty kick at goal, the kick must be taken within one minute from the time the player indicates the intention to kick at goal. The intention to kick is signalled by the arrival of the kicking tee or sand, or when the player makes a mark on the ground. The player must complete the kick within one minute even if the ball rolls over and has to be placed again. If the one minute is exceeded, the kick is disallowed, a scrum is ordered at the place of the mark and the opponents throw in the ball. For any other type of kick, the kick must be taken without undue delay.

I would have thought it's from they tell the ref they're having a kick at goal but there you go.

jacothelad

Munster

CatFromHue wrote: »

I would have thought it's from they tell the ref they're having a kick at goal but there you go.

Here's a novel idea. Why don't the ref's carry players the kicking tees? Think of the time saved.

Teferi

jacothelad wrote: »

Here's a novel idea. Why don't the ref's carry players the kicking tees? Think of the time saved.

Surely driving the tee onto the pitch on top of a little remote control car is the superior option?

Buer

the perfect ten wrote: »

Is it the arrival of the tee or the indication to kick that starts the clock ?

Law 21.4c

The intention to kick is signalled by the arrival of the kicking tee or sand, or when the player makes a mark on the ground. The player must complete the kick within one minute even if the ball rolls ove

leakyboots

It was just another example of the ref bottling key decisions - for both sides - at the end of both halves. I missed part of the first half but I gather Donnacha Ryan was unconscious and he gave a penalty against him. Zebo batting the ball out of play on halftime, Heaslip lying in front of the ruck blocking Murray from the ball... on the tryline... in the last minute... and he gives a Munster scrum because (paraphrasing) "it's messy ball, bodies everywhere". Munster players were asking him to go to TMO over T'eo's no arms offside tackle at the end and he wouldn't.

In a game when the margins/score are close it's frustrating when you see a ref out of his depth like that

leinstertalk

Interesting that munster fans seem to be focusing on the ref and not the low level of rugby their team played.

sydthebeat

leinstertalk wrote: »

Interesting that munster fans seem to be focusing on the ref and not the low level of rugby their team played.

For the very last scrum i was behind the goals at pitch level.
Kirtchner had gone off to allow mcgrath back in to prop. leinster were a man down in the back line

McFadden was at the RHS post, i think it was conway who was off hogging the rhs touch line. Sexton, teo, ringrose and FMC covered from the 15 to the posts... leaving a half of the pitch open.

ALL munster needed to do was hold a steady scrum and Keatley to kick across... he literally has a whole half of the pitch to kick to.

Instead the play was to run into leinster traffic in the center of the pitch.
Idioctic choice of game tactics.

Bazzo

leinstertalk wrote: »

Interesting that munster fans seem to be focusing on the ref and not the low level of rugby their team played.

As a neutral there's been plenty of whinging about the refereeing from both sides in this thread so I'm not sure I'd pull that card.

leinstertalk

Bazzo wrote: »

As a neutral there's been plenty of whinging about the refereeing from both sides in this thread so I'm not sure I'd pull that card.

leinster were poor, munster were poor. Using the ref as some excuse is weak and doesn't address the huge fall in standards in both sides.