Breaking - explosions at Brussels Airport **Mod warning in post 1**

All it requires is respect for fellow humans. From us to them. And from them to us.

Impetus wrote: »

All it requires is respect for fellow humans. From us to them. And from them to us.

Yeah. They seem like the kinda folk that want to shake hands and hug it out alright...

foggy_lad wrote: »

They appear to know who and where these people are so why are they only "lifting" them now?

Probably (sensibly in my view) because non/less racist governments did not want to provoke a confrontation. In racist societies, one can get votes for hounding and destroying people who are labelled as terrorists (eg in tabloid newspapers).

Ireland, as a country would not exist today, if it was not for people who Maggie Thatcher would have branded as 'terrorists'. Even though her country back in the day tried to steal our country. In making this statement I have to declare that both my parents were of Norman/French origin. The very people who created the house of Normandy in GB. The same people who were labelled 'more Irish than the Irish themselves'.

We have lived in complex times for a century or more.

Europe needs more simplification and minimization. And more openness with neighbouring cultures.

foggy_lad wrote: »

They appear to know who and where these people are so why are they only "lifting" them now?

Because targeting terror suspects and criminals, may in fact be racist, i'll have to check with the committee.

Frenchman and algerians arrested in Rotterdam

Polo_Mint wrote: »

Everytime they catch someone, They then take the mobile phones, Laptops and also fingerprint the apartments and houses.

With the phones they can find out who A was in contact with and trace the phone numbers via GPS to other peoples locations.

They can also trace IP addresses from emails on peoples laptops.

for everyone that is caught, im sure they can trace 2 more.

This is my guess

Most data security conscious companies whose staff have to visit countries like China, give them a brand new Chromebook for their trip, and this is destroyed when they return home. They can use it for internet, and 'secure' https email - but in practice they say nothing until they get back home. Similar for mobile phones.

I thought this article was quite good

http://europe.newsweek.com/belgium-new-extremists-jihadi-cool-brussels-attacks-439640?rm=eu

These European attackers are not like the Al-Qaeda members of old—the radicalized adherents to fundamentalist Islam. Many of these new age killers were small children when the World Trade Center fell in 2001 and have spent much of their lives watching major wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and now Syria. Their knowledge of Islam is quite limited; they are more like jihadi hipsters than dedicated Islamists, or what some experts in the intelligence community call “jihadist cool.” They celebrate what the Dutch coordinator for security and counterterrorism called “pop-jihad as a lifestyle.”

These are youths who gather in groups, such as the recently dismantled Sharia4Belgium. They know less about Osama bin Laden than they do about Tupac Shakur;

Impetus wrote: »

What are you suggesting - intelligence 'services' = corrupt?

they are either corrupt or incredibly lame

These guys getting shipped back from syria/turkey border. We were told they weren't just on holidays. Netherlands and Belgium let them go with out as much as a by your leave.

Impetus wrote: »

If these guys are so 'hip' why doesn't EU/gov work to convince these people how hip Europe is, relative to living in the desert or blowing people up? European political circles and 'security agencies' are instead turning them into dangerous enemies. Many of these people are intelligent and should be encouraged to be software developers or whatever. Europe (like the US) is *issing into the wind, in terms of stopping this problem. Europe is leader-less, as is the US with Trumpification en route. We need intelligent politicians to run the place. Not idiots who will sign off on fingerprinting everybody (electronically or otherwise) before the fly on a plane or take EUR 100 out of an ATM.

In the absence of intelligent *leadership*, at state and EU level, the EU and nation states face disintegration.

Their version of what's hip is not the same as what Europe's is. They seem to "get a buzz" out of the desert lifestyle and blowing people up. Once that adrenaline is experienced, watching Toy story 2 at the local cinema just doesn't cut it anymore.


Why do they do it according to intelligence?

What lures these youths into the brutal culture of radical Islam? The answer, according to intelligence officials, would be laughable if it was not so deadly: peer pressure and what might be called Rambo-envy.

How can Europe convince them other things is cool?....They are hiding here in the west under the banner of "islam", but as the author says, how much do they know about islam in the first place and how can we re-educate them about something they know nothing about? Their version of "dying as a martyr" is what they do it for. What can Europe do about this? Nothing...the change for this must come from within the muslim communities within Europe. The more outsiders push them to change the more resistant they are. Within the community the reverence of "martyrs" needs to stop. Any "dissident" Imans who speak out about the abuse with the religion, needs to be respected, the rest, not so much.



Using the traditional de-programming techniques does not work on the "hipster" terrorists

British Muslims, both 22, purchased copies of Islam for Dummies and The Koran for Dummies in August 2014 just before they boarded a plane on the first leg of their trip to join ISIS fighters in Syria.

I hope that makes sense

Prison seems to be the hotbed of radicalization https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/how-belgian-prisons-became-a-breeding-ground-for-islamic-extremism/2016/03/27/ac437fd8-f39b-11e5-a2a3-d4e9697917d1_story.html I@m jyst waiting for them to say the solution is too shut down prisons.








I agree about the weak/no leadership

GT_TDI_150 wrote: »

There is a slightly more complicated version of events where it seems ONE person on the turkish side delayed informing the dutch/belgian authorities untill it was too late for them to action it or the ONE person in turkey waited 11days(stand to correction on this, thought it was 11 but could have been 7days) before sending follow up information ...

and as you can tell from Abdasalam being able to avoid capture for 126 days when being Europes most wanted man, and Mohamed Abrini, who they've been looking for as long as Abdasalam, hasnt been caught yet ... getting 'lost' may not be that difficult

I'll have to look a bit futher in to the times thing to be able to comment on that. but the second point, where where they looking for him? It seems they didn't check his neighborhood. I could be very busy looking for you in cork/dublin/anywhere and you at home!

stoplooklisten wrote: »

I'll have to look a bit futher in to the times thing to be able to comment on that. but the second point, where where they looking for him? It seems they didn't check his neighborhood. I could be very busy looking for you in cork/dublin/anywhere and you at home!

Oh, yes there were/are failings in Belgium ... the damn local cop never checked on the report that there were strange goings on at the flat where it seems the airport bombs were made ... with abdesalam, I suspect that they actually knew where he was but were monitor his movements / contacts ... that just my thoughts tho. the 2 brothers ... people do not just go missing!

GT_TDI_150 wrote: »

Oh, yes there were/are failings in Belgium ... the damn local cop never checked on the report that there were strange goings on at the flat where it seems the airport bombs were made ... with abdesalam, I suspect that they actually knew where he was but were monitor his movements / contacts ... that just my thoughts tho. the 2 brothers ... people do not just go missing!

2 days ago, Fayçal Cheffou charged over core role in Brussels bomb attacks
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/mar/26/man-charged-brussels-terror-attacks-faycal-c-belgian-barack-obama



Today
Faycal Cheffou was released as the police’s “suspicions were not substantiated”.
http://www.thejournal.ie/video-belgian-police-suspect-airport-2684345-Mar2016/

What is going on?

12Phase wrote: »

Fairly simple really : they're carrying out investigations and arresting *suspects*.

They can't really afford to miss someone so they'll arrest on fairly minimal evidence but then go through the details and if someone's innocent they'll be let go.

It's fairly normal policing but just under emergency circumstances.

Their intelligence mustn't be very good.