Way to go Sinn Fein

Dan_Solo · 24-05-2014 07:33PM

Aongus Von Bismarck wrote: »

I really hope that in all this internet hype built up by the shinnerbot legions that its remembered that the vast vast majority of this country chose NOT to vote for these lunatics. I hope the media continues to treat them as a fringe party.

Lame. The vast majority didn't vote for any specific party. So every single one, including whatever party you support, must be lunatics too.
Sad.

umop.episdn · 24-05-2014 07:33PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Guys Sinn Fein have done well. Celebrate that and ignore the trolls.

Stopignoringyourself Stopignoringyourself Stopignoringyourself Stopignoringyourself

Chinasea · 24-05-2014 07:34PM

Phoebas wrote: »

This was local elections - nothing to do with social welfare.

The money all comes from the same pool one way or another though.

mickydoomsux · 24-05-2014 07:39PM

Chinasea wrote: »

The money all comes from the same pool one way or another though.

You have a very poor understanding of how the public finances work and I can only hope you didn't vote for SF in this election thinking it would be a magic bullet for our economic woes.

moxin · 24-05-2014 07:40PM

Aongus Von Bismarck wrote: »

I really hope that in all this internet hype built up by the shinnerbot legions that its remembered that the vast vast majority of this country chose NOT to vote for these lunatics. I hope the media continues to treat them as a fringe party.

How many of your adult children have been forced to emigrate so far?

Dan_Solo · 24-05-2014 07:42PM

mickydoomsux wrote: »

You have a very poor understanding of how the public finances work and I can only hope you didn't vote for SF in this election thinking it would be a magic bullet for our economic woes.

It's about as clever as that "most people didn't vote for SF" that the goldencirclebots have been pushing on this thread.

mickydoomsux · 24-05-2014 07:43PM

moxin wrote: »

How many of your adult children have been forced to emigrate so far?

That has nothing to do with anything and is just populist rabble rousing.

My name is URL · 24-05-2014 07:43PM

Aongus Von Bismarck wrote: »

I really hope that in all this internet hype built up by the shinnerbot legions that its remembered that the vast vast majority of this country chose NOT to vote for these lunatics. I hope the media continues to treat them as a fringe party.

Hey Yitzhak, are you still singing the praises of Alan Shatter after him breaking the law on national television, misleading the Dail and blackening the name of a whistle-blower?

Bit rich for you to be calling others lunatics when you continuously ignore reality yourself.

suicide_circus · 24-05-2014 07:46PM

I think only when SF do get into power and then proceed to be exactly the same as FF/FG/LAB will a reasonable discussion on the merits of the party be possible.

24-05-2014 07:52PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I would like to live in an Irish republic.

Seems to me SF are the only party who never abandoned that aim.

I would not and could not support them while they tried the violent route to achieve that goal but I can understand why they felt the need.

Nor am I so hypocritical as to condemn the modern SF for doing exactly what those we laud as the founders of the state did to achieve independence - it's a shame most of our so-called founders then turned around and simply inserted themselves into the vacuum left by the British and nothing really changed bar we got a dose of extra added Roman Catholic ethos.

SF have proven themselves to have two qualities other Irish parties lack
1. Firmness of conviction and refusal to pander.
2. Willingness to find common ground with the 'enemy' for the sake of the wider community.

I say this as an ex life long Labour supporter and party member before anyone want to come in with the old 'bot' comments.

FG/FF/LP between them destroyed the republic and we would have been better off remaining in the Union imho then with what we ended up with on their watch - at least we would have had the NHS and decent roads.

There was a bit more to it then just seeking independence. Basic civil rights (including the right to vote being one) were the issue. Catholics in Northern Ireland were second class citizens and had to deal with collusion between loyalists and the British Soldiers.

Nevertheless, I dont condone the action that members of the party took and acknowledge that alot of their own people got caught up in the terrorism but I take them on the merits of what they are today. Everyone has moved on except for the moron minority.

All id ask of them is that they would demand more from Europe. Im sick of the gutless losers weve been voting. Only out for themselves

moxin · 24-05-2014 07:53PM

mickydoomsux wrote: »

That has nothing to do with anything and is just populist rabble rousing.

Tell that to the emigrants families.

There was an election poster pic on boards here that said "70,000 jobs created" and some bright spark of a passerby wrote "in Canada" after it, that's what the established parties represent for our young people - no hope.

LordSutch · 24-05-2014 07:55PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

I would not and could not support them while they tried the violent route to achieve that goal, but I can understand why they felt the need.

The need to put a bomb on a boat in Sligo.

The need to put a bomb in a pub.

The need to put a bomb on a bus.

The need to kneecap people.

The need to blow up shops, restaurants, police stations, etc etc etc.

The need to murder policemen.

The need to murder anybody who got in their way.

The need to make people disappear.

Sorry Bannasidhe, but I just never saw the need at the time, and in retrospect I still don't see why they did a lot of what they did. Yes they're all politically suited up and clean of guns & semtex now, but they still defend their past actions, and I for one cannot forgive them, even if they don't persue those actions anymore. Only recently on the TV I heard Adams defending the bombing of the Grand Hotel in Brighton < he actually defended the attack.

Karl Stein · 24-05-2014 08:00PM

LordSutch wrote: »

I for one cannot fotgive

They neither seek nor need your forgiveness. They've expressed regret for the hurt they caused during the troubles and apologised to the families of the civilians they killed.

That's more than can be said for the union/loyalist scum that caused the troubles, the British Army, the RUC, UDR and Unionist politicians you laud.

Smidge · 24-05-2014 08:02PM

LordSutch wrote: »

The need to put a bomb on a boat in Sligo.

The need to put a bomb in a pub.

The need to put a bomb on a bus.

The need to kneecap people.

The need to blow up shops, restaurants, police stations, etc etc etc.

The need to murder policemen.

The need to murder anybody who got in their way.

The need to make people disappear.

Sorry Bannasidhe, but I just never saw the need at the time, and in retrospect I still don't see why they did a lot of what they did. Yes they're all politically suited up and clean of guns & semtex now, but they still defend their past actions, and I for one cannot fotgive them, even if they don't persue those actions anymore. Only recently on the TV I heard Adams defending the bombing of the Grand Hotel in Brighton < he actually defended the attack.

Really?? You think it was all done for giggles?
So, how should they have dealt with how the Catholics of the North were treated?
Through peaceful protests?
Worked out real well for the people of Armritsar :rolleyes:

Phoebas · 24-05-2014 08:02PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

SF have proven themselves to have two qualities other Irish parties lack
1. Firmness of conviction and refusal to pander.
2. Willingness to find common ground with the 'enemy' for the sake of the wider community.

These two things a.k.a. sticking to your principle and making compromises are often conflicting.
SF will now have the opportunity (albeit in a limited way in local councils) to demonstrate all of the qualities that you think they have ( they can deliver an actual republic? - that sounds impressive ).
I wish them well, but I've got a feeling that real politics might get in the way.

fran17 · 24-05-2014 08:03PM

LordSutch wrote: »

The need to put a bomb on a boat in Sligo.

The need to put a bomb in a pub.

The need to put a bomb on a bus.

The need to kneecap people.

The need to blow up shops, restaurants, police stations, etc etc etc.

The need to murder policemen.

The need to murder anybody who got in their way.

The need to make people disappear.

Sorry Bannasidhe, but I just never saw the need then at the time, and in retrospect I still don't see why they did a lot of what they did. Yes theyre all politically suited and cleaned up, but they still defend their past actions, and I for one cannot fotgive them, even if they don't persue those actions anymore.

who are you to judge,in fact who are any of us to judge the atrocities that were commited during the troubles.while i dont condone any of it,and most of them were heinous acts,we did'nt live through it or know of the circumstances surrounding them

Phoebas · 24-05-2014 08:04PM

Smidge wrote: »

So, how should they have dealt with how the Catholics of the North were treated?
Through peaceful protests?
Worked out real well for the people of Armritsar :rolleyes:#

That was the wish of the majority of northern nationalists throughout the troubles - who voted for the SDLP until SF went the peaceful route.

mickydoomsux · 24-05-2014 08:05PM

moxin wrote: »

Tell that to the emigrants families.

There was an election poster pic on boards here that said "70,000 jobs created" and some bright spark of a passerby wrote "in Canada" after it, that's what the established parties represent for our young people - no hope.

Bull****. We used to call this "going travelling" during the boom and parents actively encouraged their kids to do it.

There is a tiny minority of people who actually had to move for work.

Bannasidhe · 24-05-2014 08:06PM

Deleted User wrote: »

There was a bit more to it then just seeking independence. Basic civil rights (including the right to vote being one) were the issue. Catholics in Northern Ireland were second class citizens and had to deal with collusion between loyalists and the British Soldiers.

Nevertheless, I dont condone the action that members of the party took and acknowledge that alot of their own people got caught up in the terrorism but I take them on the merits of what they are today. Everyone has moved on except for the moron minority.

All id ask of them is that they would demand more from Europe. Im sick of the gutless losers weve been voting. Only out for themselves

There was a lot more than independence the first time around too. What we got was same-ol same ol with added Vatican input.

But yes - demanding more from Europe was one of the things that swayed me.

Santa Cruz · 24-05-2014 08:06PM

The Diabolical Monocle wrote: »

Indeed.

Dev was not publicly pro-nazi.

Good.

He was neither publicly or privately pro-Nazi unlike IRA Chief of Staff Sean Russell who Mary Lou admires

Smidge · 24-05-2014 08:07PM

Phoebas wrote: »

That was the wish of the majority of northern nationalists throughout the troubles - who voted for the SDLP until SF went the peaceful route.

Can you provide evidence of this claim?

Dan_Solo · 24-05-2014 08:10PM

Smidge wrote: »

Can you provide evidence of this claim?

Without using the moronic "majority didn't vote for them" as some desperate lunge at evidence please.

Phoebas · 24-05-2014 08:10PM

Smidge wrote: »

Can you provide evidence of this claim?

Not sure what evidence you need. Is the fact that the SDLP were the largest nationalist party in N.I. throughout the troubles not evidence enough?

davycc · 24-05-2014 08:10PM

This might be a news flash for you but they had a need to do all these deplorable acts as the violence has escalated so much on all sides and we needed to keep up with the loyalist/uvf death squads and we did try and go down the peaceful protest route originally many times infact, but this was not having any effect on the UK gov of the day who attempted to violently stamped them out and were not interested in talking peace and civil rights..

LordSutch wrote: »

The need to put a bomb on a boat in Sligo.

The need to put a bomb in a pub.

The need to put a bomb on a bus.

The need to kneecap people.

The need to blow up shops, restaurants, police stations, etc etc etc.

The need to murder policemen.

The need to murder anybody who got in their way.

The need to make people disappear.

Sorry Bannasidhe, but I just never saw the need at the time, and in retrospect I still don't see why they did a lot of what they did. Yes they're all politically suited up and clean of guns & semtex now, but they still defend their past actions, and I for one cannot fotgive them, even if they don't persue those actions anymore. Only recently on the TV I heard Adams defending the bombing of the Grand Hotel in Brighton < he actually defended the attack.

Iwasfrozen · 24-05-2014 08:11PM

fran17 wrote: »

who are you to judge,in fact who are any of us to judge the atrocities that were commited during the troubles.while i dont condone any of it,and most of them were heinous acts,we did'nt live through it or know of the circumstances surrounding them

A vote for SF is condoning all of it and more.

Dan_Solo · 24-05-2014 08:11PM

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Bull****. We used to call this "going travelling" during the boom and parents actively encouraged their kids to do it.

There is a tiny minority of people who actually had to move for work.

Laughable.
Sure nobody ever emigrated from Ireland...

mickydoomsux · 24-05-2014 08:12PM

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Laughable.
Sure nobody ever emigrated from Ireland...

I didn't say that.

Read.

Smidge · 24-05-2014 08:14PM

Phoebas wrote: »

Not sure what evidence you need. Is the fact that the SDLP were the largest nationalist party in N.I. throughout the troubles not evidence enough?

Thats not what you said though and you know its not what I'm asking for evidence of.
So to be clear, can you provide evidence that the people who may have voted for SDLP all wanted a pacifistic resolution in light of the atrocities they endured?

24-05-2014 08:14PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

I think only when SF do get into power and then proceed to be exactly the same as FF/FG/LAB will a reasonable discussion on the merits of the party be possible.

Exactly. If and/or when.

I've kept an open mind to Fine Gael/Labour but the fact is they haven't really worked out. People say the Shinners/ULA have unrealistic policies but how realistic is expecting a country with an unemployment rate which peaked at 14% (currently around 12% i think) to pay the following

Increased Vat on goods
Water charges
Property tax
Increased motor tax
Increased fuel charges

All the while we still have

Poorer regional and local roads
A health service which has arguably declined further
Less gardai and more crime
Exploitation in the form of job bridge
Bankers who have got away with bringing the economy down

FG/Labour have been extremely ineffective during their tenure.

Phoebas · 24-05-2014 08:21PM

Smidge wrote: »

Thats not what you said though and you know its not what I'm asking for evidence of.
So to be clear, can you provide evidence that the people who may have voted for SDLP all wanted a pacifistic resolution in light of the atrocities they endured?

Well, I can't give you evidence of what was in the mind of every nationalist voter in N.I. but I don't think any serious person would dispute that the SDLP rejected violence as a political tool whereas SF did not.

Way to go Sinn Fein

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