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Ex RTÉ producer sentenced to 18 months in prison

1235

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,386 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    McCrack wrote: »
    Some people around here think these exposure groups are usurping the role and function of the police when that is not so.

    Another poster refers to them as "vigilantes" and when one actually looks up the precise definition of what a vigilante actually is we see that they could not possibly be when they are acting within the law and Ive referenced the legislation previously for this jurisdiction.

    The reality is these exposure groups are most certainly acting with lawful authority. When they have enough evidence and identify their target they make an arrest. They then call the police and hand the target over to police custody.

    The police then commence their investigation and submit a file to the prosecuting authority. A court appearance will follow with due process.


    Its no different to a retail security officer witnessing a theft (being an arrestable offence), following the person out of the shop, stopping them outside, arresting them and calling the police. Same idea, no usurption of the police function.

    You are referring to what is happening in England only. No person in the ROI and NI has ever been charged on the back of such an event (and I suspect the reason is that the authorities north and south regard such stings as illegal or that the "evidence" would be completely inadmisible in an Irish court).

    BBC NI reported recently that senior officers in the PSNI have warned such groups to cease their activities immediately and that they will not work with them in any way.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    The process is the exact same here-

    Identify target, arrest target, call Garda, hand custody of target over to Garda, Garda investigation, initial District Court appearance, bail, file to DPP, green light, summons, judicial process takes over


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Strazdas wrote: »
    You are referring to what is happening in England only. No person in the ROI and NI has ever been charged on the back of such an event (and I suspect the reason is that the authorities north and south regard such stings as illegal or that the "evidence" would be completely inadmisible in an Irish court).

    BBC NI reported recently that senior officers in the PSNI have warned such groups to cease their activities immediately and that they will not work with them in any way.

    But you're leaving out one important point here, the cops don't even know what these guys are up to in most cases.

    You and others might not like the methods they use but a paedo the public knows about and is reported to the police/guards is better than one who never gets caught.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Strazdas wrote: »
    You are referring to what is happening in England only. No person in the ROI and NI has ever been charged on the back of such an event (and I suspect the reason is that the authorities north and south regard such stings as illegal or that the "evidence" would be completely inadmisible in an Irish court).

    BBC NI reported recently that senior officers in the PSNI have warned such groups to cease their activities immediately and that they will not work with them in any way.

    For a long time I’ve argued that lessons in basic judicial procedures should be part of secondary school education.
    I’m often horrified when I hear otherwise sensible sane adults commenting on what they think their rights are as either victim or perpetrator.
    These vigilante gangs are pure poison.
    I doubt if they have very much empathy or sympathy for victims of paedophilia.
    They’re just angry angry vicious bullies who have found legitimate easily trapped targets for their pursuits.
    Disgusting.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    splinter65 wrote: »
    For a long time I’ve argued that lessons in basic judicial procedures should be part of secondary school education.
    I’m often horrified when I hear otherwise sensible sane adults commenting on what they think their rights are as either victim or perpetrator.
    These vigilante gangs are pure poison.
    I doubt if they have very much empathy or sympathy for victims of paedophilia.
    They’re just angry angry vicious bullies who have found legitimate easily trapped targets for their pursuits.
    Disgusting.

    Craven and others like him are the ones who make the first contact with the fake profiles they set up.

    He was also in contact with real children on FB, sent a pic of his cock to what he thought was a 13 year old girl and travelled to Leeds to sleep with her and yet you are angry with the people who outed him.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    You will always get apologists in any thread on Boards. Never thought it would get to the point of paedo apologists though. Sickening.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Craven and others like him are the ones who make the first contact with the fake profiles they set up.

    He was also in contact with real children on FB, sent a pic of his cock to what he thought was a 13 year old girl and travelled to Leeds to sleep with her and yet you are angry with the people who outed him.

    Paedophiles are a stain on humanity. They need to be hunted down captured and put somewhere where they can’t hurt anyone else.
    But not by a bunch of thugs with all their own unresolved issues.
    If a paedophile thinks he’s going to be trapped like this he’ll just find a further more underground way to get access to kids.
    And the vigilante will have to find another “deserving” victim for there bullying urges.
    Shoplifters?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    You will always get apologists in any thread on Boards. Never thought it would get to the point of pardo apologists though. Sickening.

    If you can point out where I apologized for a paedophile then please go ahead. Otherwise you can withdraw your comment.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,809 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    Always amazed by the fact that when we call out these phoney thugs for what they are - we are "Peado apologists".


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    Always amazed by the fact that when we call out these phoney thugs for what they are - we are "Peado apologists".

    You see you have just insulted a group of people that voluntarily give their time to identify and publicly expose dangerous and harmful men that want to sexually abuse children.

    A thug by definition is a violent criminal. It is clear from the video recording that violence is not used or threatened. Their actions are perfectly lawful.

    I think you need to reassess your opinion


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,809 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    McCrack wrote: »
    You see you have just insulted a group of people that voluntarily give their time to identify and publicly expose dangerous and harmful men that want to sexually abuse children.

    A thug by definition is a violent criminal. It is clear from the video recording that violence is not used or threatened. Their actions are perfectly lawful.

    I think you need to reassess your opinion

    Oh yeah thats why they are doing it !!

    What heroes !!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    McCrack wrote: »
    You see you have just insulted a group of people that voluntarily give their time to identify and publicly expose dangerous and harmful men that want to sexually abuse children.

    A thug by definition is a violent criminal. It is clear from the video recording that violence is not used or threatened. Their actions are perfectly lawful.

    I think you need to reassess your opinion

    Id give all my life savings on a bet that most of the people doing it are not considered kind or nice people by people they know

    What they're doing is grand..it is getting paedos off the streets..but Im pretty much certain the justice group are just narcissists who want to humiliate somebody without repercussion or with support from others for doing it. And this all but proven by the fact they publish it on Facebook, if they just wanted to save children, if it was their priority, then they'd send the evidence straight to police. But they go after themselves and videotape them. tell me why? Its because they're narcissists, want recognition/likes/moment of fame

    As I said if they actually cared about finding people who are a danger to children they'd be trawling the dark web not okcupid


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    Well Ill put it this way..the RTE man sting. There were chats for four months and probably daily. The decoy had to engage with that for four months reading his filth, pictures of his penis etc being sent and having to constantly engage with that.

    That takes quite some effort all the while being done voluntarily in an effort to identify and expose the abusers.

    Some might call that heroic.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    wakka12 wrote: »
    Id give all my life savings on a bet that most of the people doing it are not considered kind or nice people by people they know

    What they're doing is grand..it is getting paedos off the streets..but Im pretty much certain the justice group are just narcissists who want to humiliate somebody without repercussion or with support from others for doing it. And this all but proven by the fact they publish it on Facebook, if they just wanted to save children, if it was their priority, then they'd send the evidence straight to police. But they go after themselves and videotape them. tell me why? Its because they're narcissists, want recognition/likes/moment of fame

    As I said if they actually cared about finding people who are a danger to children they'd be trawling the dark web not okcupid

    Have you any life savings? If so how much?

    I might take you up on it


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    McCrack wrote: »
    Well Ill put it this way..the RTE man sting. There were chats for four months and probably daily. The decoy had to engage with that for four months reading his filth, pictures of his penis etc being sent and having to constantly engage with that.

    That takes quite some effort all the while being done voluntarily in an effort to identify and expose the abusers.

    Some might call that heroic.

    No 13 year old girl would meet a 45 year old men sending her dick pics. How brain dead or naive do you think 13 year olds are?Do you even know any 13 year olds? Would you have when you were 13, of course you wouldn't have. They didn't save anybody, heroic people are ones who take out actual criminals, one who are actually manipulative and extremely dangerous individuals, and they will not be found on okcupid and the dangerous ones will be much too smart to be caught by this justice lot

    Not heroic, they're doing it for likes. you're giving them way too much credit


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    wakka12 wrote: »
    No 13 year old girl would meet a 45 year old men sending her dick pics. How brain dead or naive do you think 13 year olds are?Do you even know any 13 year olds? Would you have when you were 13, of course you wouldn't have. They didn't save anybody, heroic people are ones who take out actual criminals, one who are actually manipulative and extremely dangerous individuals, and they will not be found on okcupid and the dangerous ones will be much too smart to be caught by this justice lot

    Not heroic, they're doing it for likes. you're giving them way too much credit

    Youre missing the point completely.

    Im saying the decoy who is voluntarily giving up their time had to endure on I suspect an almost daily basis for four whole months his chats and receiving pictures of his penis in order to successfully identify and expose him. That deserves respect in my view.

    And if you think someone like Creavin is not manipulative or dangerous then you are deluded and you care little for child protection.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,511 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    I didn't realize penises ( or is it penii? ) were so traumatic to look at. I'll send them on a donation to contribute towards their therapy sessions.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    a
    Craven and others like him are the ones who make the first contact with the fake profiles they set up.

    He was also in contact with real children on FB, sent a pic of his cock to what he thought was a 13 year old girl and travelled to Leeds to sleep with her and yet you are angry with the people who outed him.

    there is no dispute that he is a creten and deserves to be locked up. however lets be honest here, normal everyday people don't set up fake profiles and pretend to be children. that is also concerning.
    You will always get apologists in any thread on Boards. Never thought it would get to the point of pardo apologists though. Sickening.

    nope. you can be against these facebook attention seekers and paedophilia at the same time.
    McCrack wrote: »
    You see you have just insulted a group of people that voluntarily give their time to identify and publicly expose dangerous and harmful men that want to sexually abuse children.

    A thug by definition is a violent criminal. It is clear from the video recording that violence is not used or threatened. Their actions are perfectly lawful.

    I think you need to reassess your opinion

    yeah i have no problem insulting them. someone "volunteering" to set up fake profiles and pretend to be a child is just not normal behaviour. especially when it is so obviously in the name of fishing for facebook likes and thanks. if the police were doing it then so be it, that's the job and they are paid for it.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,386 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    splinter65 wrote: »
    For a long time I’ve argued that lessons in basic judicial procedures should be part of secondary school education.
    I’m often horrified when I hear otherwise sensible sane adults commenting on what they think their rights are as either victim or perpetrator.
    These vigilante gangs are pure poison.
    I doubt if they have very much empathy or sympathy for victims of paedophilia.
    They’re just angry angry vicious bullies who have found legitimate easily trapped targets for their pursuits.
    Disgusting.

    Agree completely, and there also seems to some links between these groups and Loyalist paramilitaries in NI and with the far right in Britain.

    I would say the Gardai and PSNI are showing eminent common sense in refusing to have anything to do with these groups and not encouraging them in any way. There is only one legitimate police force.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    And yet if it wasn't for these people Craven would be happily working in his cushy well paid job by day and looking to meet up with kids by night instead of sitting in a jail cell.

    The facts speak for themselves.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Strazdas wrote: »
    Agree completely, and there also seems to some links between these groups and Loyalist paramilitaries in NI and with the far right in Britain.

    I would say the Gardai and PSNI are showing eminent common sense in refusing to have anything to do with these groups and not encouraging them in any way. There is only one legitimate police force.

    So why aren't they catching them then?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    McCrack wrote: »
    You see you have just insulted a group of people that voluntarily give their time to identify and publicly expose dangerous and harmful men that want to sexually abuse children.

    A thug by definition is a violent criminal. It is clear from the video recording that violence is not used or threatened. Their actions are perfectly lawful.

    I think you need to reassess your opinion

    That’s not the accepted universal opinion of pitchforking mobs but you’re ,as ever, entitled to your opinion


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,809 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    McCrack wrote: »
    Youre missing the point completely.

    Im saying the decoy who is voluntarily giving up their time had to endure on I suspect an almost daily basis for four whole months his chats and receiving pictures of his penis in order to successfully identify and expose him. That deserves respect in my view.

    And if you think someone like Creavin is not manipulative or dangerous then you are deluded and you care little for child protection.

    They're not giving up their time, they get a kick out of this !!
    Do you give up your time to watch a film ? or play a sport you like ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,386 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    So why aren't they catching them then?

    Well, that's a question for them (and maybe one they should be answering). The thing is though, ordinary citizens cannot set themselves up as a private police force and even wear uniforms just because they are unhappy with the way specific things are being policed. Pretending that they are working hand in hand with the authorities and doing them a favour is obviously nonsense.

    Also, quite a few members of these groups seem to be shady characters themselves, never mind the people they are going after.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Strazdas wrote: »
    Well, that's a question for them (and maybe one they should be answering). The thing is though, ordinary citizens cannot set themselves up as a private police force and even wear uniforms just because they are unhappy with the way specific things are being policed. Pretending that they are working hand in hand with the authorities and doing them a favour is obviously nonsense.

    Also, quite a few members of these groups seem to be shady characters themselves, never mind the people they are going after.

    What evidence have you got that “quite a few members of these groups seem to be shady characters themselves”. I’ve seen that posted a few times with absolutely nothing to back it up.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Strazdas wrote: »
    Well, that's a question for them (and maybe one they should be answering). The thing is though, ordinary citizens cannot set themselves up as a private police force and even wear uniforms just because they are unhappy with the way specific things are being policed. Pretending that they are working hand in hand with the authorities and doing them a favour is obviously nonsense.

    Also, quite a few members of these groups seem to be shady characters themselves, never mind the people they are going after.

    So you would prefer they had done nothing and Craven and the 40 nonces they outed in the UK remained hidden because you don't like people like Phil.

    I watched Phil on PK the other night, why would you think he is shady?

    Is that what you are saying?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    These vigilante type groups can be dangerous (and the non the other hand catching people grooming kids is ridiculously difficult otherwise) and a lot of these "pedo hunter" types are often nothing but scumbags looking for an excuse to attack someone. But having quickly skimmed the video posted on the first page and seeing a few bits of the leader's comments after the court case I've got to say they've given a pretty decent showing of themselves and seemed particularly aware of keeping everything above board and on camera, and not escalating the situation.

    That's a really low sentence, mind you.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    They're not giving up their time, they get a kick out of this !!
    Do you give up your time to watch a film ? or play a sport you like ?

    Your're confusing a person having pasttimes with volunteering.

    Clearly the exposure groups who are volunteering their time and patience are going to feel a sense of satisfaction when they get a catch like Creaven and they are entitled to that same way a volunteer collecting money for a clarity might feel satisfaction at the end of the day when they look in the collection box


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Ian O Doherty made a right tit of himself on Wednesday night attacking Phil the way he did.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Ian O Doherty made a right tit of himself on Wednesday night attacking Phil the way he did.


    how so.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    What happened? O'Doherty is usually on the ball.

    He accused him of being a thug and basically disagreed with everything Phil was saying.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    That's disappointing. O'Doherty is usually one of the good guys.

    I was surprised myself.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    He accused him of being a thug and basically disagreed with everything Phil was saying.

    that's rather different to "making a tit" of oneself.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    So you would prefer they had done nothing and Craven and the 40 nonces they outed in the UK remained hidden because you don't like people like Phil.

    I watched Phil on PK the other night, why would you think he is shady?

    Is that what you are saying?

    4000 nonces are gone further underground because people like Phil are quite literally getting off on their little tin pot dictator purges.
    Is that what you want?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    splinter65 wrote: »
    4000 nonces are gone further underground because people like Phil are quite literally getting off on their little tin pot dictator purges.
    Is that what you want?

    Where are you getting your figures from?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Ian O Doherty made a right tit of himself on Wednesday night attacking Phil the way he did.

    He was dead right and on the ball calling out a bully with an ego the size of a mountain.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭Flippyfloppy


    splinter65 wrote: »
    He was dead right and on the ball calling out a bully with an ego the size of a mountain.

    Oh come on, I'm dead against bullying but who gives a **** if paedos are being bullied?!? Seriously


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    splinter65 wrote: »
    4000 nonces are gone further underground because people like Phil are quite literally getting off on their little tin pot dictator purges.
    Is that what you want?

    41 nonces are in prison because of Phil.

    Depraved perverts nobody in law enforcement knew about.

    Craven was found out by ordinary people in another country giving up their free time not the Guards who are paid to root out his kind.

    Where are you getting this 4000 figure from?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    splinter65 wrote: »
    If you can point out where I apologized for a paedophile then please go ahead. Otherwise you can withdraw your comment.

    If you can point out where I said you had, please go ahead. Very defensive stance.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,279 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    41 nonces are in prison because of Phil.

    Depraved perverts nobody in law enforcement knew about.

    Craven was found out by ordinary people in another country giving up their free time not the Guards who are paid to root out his kind.

    Where are you getting this 4000 figure from?


    a hell of a lot more are gone underground because of phil. the ones that phil supposibly helped to catch, went to prison because of the police, not phil, because the police did the actual work via insuring the evidence was admissible in court. craven was found out by people looking to be facebook superstars via seeking attention on facebook and needing to find some sort of cause to get support and legitimacy. it's good he is in jail, but the credit ultimately goes to the police via insuring the evidence was admissible in court.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    nonce-sense.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,985 ✭✭✭McCrack


    a hell of a lot more are gone underground because of phil. the ones that phil supposibly helped to catch, went to prison because of the police, not phil, because the police did the actual work via insuring the evidence was admissible in court. craven was found out by people looking to be facebook superstars via seeking attention on facebook and needing to find some sort of cause to get support and legitimacy. it's good he is in jail, but the credit ultimately goes to the police via insuring the evidence was admissible in court.

    You're displaying a level of ignorance/misunderstanding of the legal and judicial process.

    Creaven pleaded guilty on full facts. The question of admissibility or otherwise of the evidence against him did not arise because he pleaded guilty.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,386 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    Ian O Doherty made a right tit of himself on Wednesday night attacking Phil the way he did.

    And Ian is a self confessed right winger - like most of the supporters of these groups I would imagine. When even an outspoken right wing conservative like Ian is attacking them, it does suggest there is a problem,

    Adrian Kennedy wrote a good article about them recently, describing such groups as little more than thuggish and with very shady motives,


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    These groups look to get other nonces locked up leaving more kids for them to fiddle


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,992 ✭✭✭Mongfinder General


    These groups look to get other nonces locked up leaving more kids for them to fiddle

    And you know this how?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    And you know this how?

    If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then its probably a nonce.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,739 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    a hell of a lot more are gone underground because of phil. the ones that phil supposibly helped to catch, went to prison because of the police, not phil, because the police did the actual work via insuring the evidence was admissible in court. craven was found out by people looking to be facebook superstars via seeking attention on facebook and needing to find some sort of cause to get support and legitimacy. it's good he is in jail, but the credit ultimately goes to the police via insuring the evidence was admissible in court.

    So you credit the cops with a conviction of a person they knew nothing about.

    Ok so.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,992 ✭✭✭Mongfinder General


    If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then its probably a nonce.

    I think you have ducks confused with paedos. How come you know so much about paedos anyway?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    I think you have ducks confused with paedos. How come you know so much about paedos anyway?

    Paedophiles have more genes in common with crabs than they do with you and me. Now that's a scientific fact.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 656 ✭✭✭clairek6


    Absolute filthy pig. I feel sorry for his family and especially his elderly mother who I’m led to believe is compleley and utterly heartbroken over this.

    Both parents are dead but he has a couple of siblings


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