Dublin North Quays - now double bus lane

Sleeper12 · 25-08-2017 08:34AM

Phil.x wrote:

12months time bus lanes will be gone.

I can't see that happening. I think they are a great idea. Like I said above I don't think too much thought went into them. I'm thinking maybe everyone should be able to use the second bus lane off peek.
Someone who telling me yesterday about the possibility of buses and cyclists using one side of the Quays going both ways and everyone else using the other side for two way traffic. I'm not sure if it would be better or worse. There would still be only one lane on the parts of the Quay

magicbastarder · 25-08-2017 09:26AM

Phil.x wrote: »

12months time bus lanes will be gone.

yep, they'll have rolled out turf and turned the quays into a long thin riverside park.

Marlay · 25-08-2017 09:40AM

beauf wrote: »

If you sitting in traffic use something that isn't. Electric bicycle or moped etc.

Both of those options cost a fairly significant initial outlay, which not everyone can afford. Also not everyone wants, or is capable of using them. I was pointing out that the journey time by bus is not necessarily any more attractive than that by car depending on where in the city your journey starts. As journey time is often the most important factor in choosing a mode of transport, that seemed relevant.

blanch152 · 25-08-2017 09:57AM

Marlay wrote: »

Both of those options cost a fairly significant initial outlay, which not everyone can afford. Also not everyone wants, or is capable of using them. I was pointing out that the journey time by bus is not necessarily any more attractive than that by car depending on where in the city your journey starts. As journey time is often the most important factor in choosing a mode of transport, that seemed relevant.

You can get a new electric scooter for €1495.

https://www.bikeworld.ie/site/motorcycle/new-artisan-electric-scooter/

Costs of running it would be far cheaper than a car.

You must be driving some shoddy car if you couldn't sell it and buy a second-hand scooter, meaning that there is no initial outlay at all.

Marlay · 25-08-2017 10:07AM

blanch152 wrote: »

You can get a new electric scooter for €1495.

https://www.bikeworld.ie/site/motorcycle/new-artisan-electric-scooter/

Costs of running it would be far cheaper than a car.

You must be driving some shoddy car if you couldn't sell it and buy a second-hand scooter, meaning that there is no initial outlay at all.

I'm sorry at what point did I say I was driving? Also that was a general comment that not everyone (including people without cars) could afford those options, it was not about me. You know some people need cars for more than getting to work also.

25-08-2017 10:14AM

blanch152 wrote: »

You can get a new electric scooter for €1495.

https://www.bikeworld.ie/site/motorcycle/new-artisan-electric-scooter/

Costs of running it would be far cheaper than a car.

You must be driving some shoddy car if you couldn't sell it and buy a second-hand scooter, meaning that there is no initial outlay at all.

I don't need a car to commute but I need a car.

beauf · 25-08-2017 10:32AM

Marlay wrote: »

Both of those options cost a fairly significant initial outlay, which not everyone can afford. Also not everyone wants, or is capable of using them. I was pointing out that the journey time by bus is not necessarily any more attractive than that by car depending on where in the city your journey starts. As journey time is often the most important factor in choosing a mode of transport, that seemed relevant.

Bus ticket tax saver per year €1,320...

I was making a simple point. That if your main issue is door to door time, and being stuck in traffic is a problem on your route. Then there are options to avoid that. Bus and car are not the only options which is what is being implied by some.

beauf · 25-08-2017 10:34AM

Natalia Scruffy Shortbread wrote: »

I don't need a car to commute but I need a car.

I assume this thread is only about commuting...

Dravokivich · 25-08-2017 10:36AM

blanch152 wrote: »

You can get a new electric scooter for €1495.

https://www.bikeworld.ie/site/motorcycle/new-artisan-electric-scooter/

Costs of running it would be far cheaper than a car.

You must be driving some shoddy car if you couldn't sell it and buy a second-hand scooter, meaning that there is no initial outlay at all.

That's just an electric motorbike you are showing us.

You could get a normal motorbike for that price and still have cheaper running costs than a car.

Someone will have to get licensed for a motorbike to operate that, and I don't think this would meet the criteria to use at a test to obtain a license for it.

I'm not sure what you are getting at here?

beauf · 25-08-2017 10:41AM

I assume he thought they would be cheaper than a petrol. I'm not sure that's true in the long run. I think I'd go petrol or electric bicycle.

bk · 25-08-2017 12:20PM

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

There are good arguments for the likes of MN but from a cost and practical perspective, providing the ability to have buses travel as freely as possible is the most effective improvement for the lives of thousands upon thousands of people.

Even when we finally have both MN and DU in 20 years, we will still need these sorts of bus priority measures and likely a lot more of them before then.

Look at London, one of the best underground systems in the world, yet London Bus still carries more passengers then London Underground and London still has congestion charging and similar bus priority measures.

It is the same when you look at pretty much any major city. Even when you have high quality underground system, you still need high quality bus, cycling and walking infrastructure above ground.

Yes we need MN and DU, but we also need a top quality bus service and infrastructure above ground too. Specially now as it will be years until we get MN/DU and the city is already way too congested.

LuckyLloyd · 25-08-2017 12:46PM

Has there ever been a piece of investigative journalism on the owners of car parks in Dublin City Centre that looks into their links to lobby groups and politicians? They seem to wield a power over transport plans / management way above and beyond what's reasonable.

markpb · 25-08-2017 12:56PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Has there ever been a piece of investigative journalism on the owners of car parks in Dublin City Centre that looks into their links to lobby groups and politicians? They seem to wield a power over transport plans / management way above and beyond what's reasonable.

Personally I don't believe there's any corruption or undue influence going on. A very long time ago, the courts ruled that constitutional property rights could extend to lots of things, not just property in the normal sense. If DCC make life too difficult to motorists to reach the private car parks in the city centre, the owners/operators could sue the council on the grounds that their property rights are being infringed. DCC have to walk a careful tightrope on this one. The fact that the government gave those car park owners a grant to build there probably makes it even harder for DCC.

beauf · 25-08-2017 01:53PM

They could argue its not dcc but traffic that's making it hard for them

Dravokivich · 25-08-2017 01:59PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Has there ever been a piece of investigative journalism on the owners of car parks in Dublin City Centre that looks into their links to lobby groups and politicians? They seem to wield a power over transport plans / management way above and beyond what's reasonable.

I don't get the ire for multi-story car parks.

i think they should be spread a bit more around the city instead of so closely packed around Jervis and Dame St areas. But I feel they can present a very viable alternative to on-street parking, which can then open up the potential for greater pedestrian / cyclist usage.

LuckyLloyd · 25-08-2017 02:00PM

markpb wrote: »

Personally I don't believe there's any corruption or undue influence going on. A very long time ago, the courts ruled that constitutional property rights could extend to lots of things, not just property in the normal sense. If DCC make life too difficult to motorists to reach the private car parks in the city centre, the owners/operators could sue the council on the grounds that their property rights are being infringed. DCC have to walk a careful tightrope on this one. The fact that the government gave those car park owners a grant to build there probably makes it even harder for DCC.

So, what, we need legislation or planning permission changes to fundamentally transform the city centre? Or are you suggesting that, because these car parks are now there, we're stuck cowtowing to them indefinitely?

stop · 25-08-2017 02:30PM

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Only hopefully?

I thought they WOULD be gone. Hmmm... I think you need to think that through.

---

First time I've managed to be awake going down the quays this week.

It's working very well. Even the sequencing letting cars through seems to calm the whole thing. ie. Drivers know they'll be moving soon enough.

Garda car on eastside of OCB so I'm guessing there was a guard in the middle on the island. Couldn't see.over.

Hopefully that shared that eejit ahead of my bus who thought he was going to be turning right!

Yup cycled this morning around 9am, single Garda alternating between OCB and OCS, I'm guessing watching for cars sneaking through the bus gate as well as looking for right turns to OCB.

magicbastarder · 25-08-2017 02:46PM

Dravokivich wrote: »

I don't get the ire for multi-story car parks.

brown thomas getting the planning permission (from DCC, one would assume) was one of the most idiotic planning decisions i can think of. a multi-storey car park with an entrance on clarendon street and an exit on south william street, preventing proper pedestrianisation on two of the most obviously pedestrianisable (is that a word?) streets in the city centre.

Phil.x · 25-08-2017 03:51PM

magicbastarder wrote: »

yep, they'll have rolled out turf and turned the quays into a long thin riverside park.

Now wouldn't that be great, but then the cyclists would moan that the grass is too long and people are in their way.

markpb · 25-08-2017 03:55PM

magicbastarder wrote: »

brown thomas getting the planning permission (from DCC, one would assume) was one of the most idiotic planning decisions i can think of. a multi-storey car park with an entrance on clarendon street and an exit on south william street, preventing proper pedestrianisation on two of the most obviously pedestrianisable (is that a word?) streets in the city centre.

I assume permission was granted in the 70s or 80s when cars were king and pedestrianising streets was almost entirely unheard of.

Different things are considered important at different times. IIRC those car parks were built at a time when Dublin was suburbanising and the city centre was being abandoned. Car parks were seen as the best way to attract people into town.

magicbastarder · 25-08-2017 03:58PM

markpb wrote: »

I assume permission was granted in the 70s or 80s when cars were king and pedestrianising streets was almost entirely unheard of.

the car park was opened in 1997.

beauf · 25-08-2017 04:14PM

Phil.x wrote: »

Now wouldn't that be great, but then the cyclists would moan that the grass is too long and people are in their way.

...what are they smoking...

07Lapierre · 25-08-2017 04:17PM

Phil.x wrote: »

Have you ever seen a toolbox let alone carry one, never mind the lengths of copper piping.

Edit: here's a better example:

stock-photo-bremen-germany-21st-jan-2015-plumber-theodor-roehm-rides-with-his-78621976.html

http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-bremen-germany-21st-jan-2015-plumber-theodor-roehm-rides-with-his-78621975.html

ArmaniJeanss · 25-08-2017 04:49PM

Phil.x wrote: »

Now wouldn't that be great, but then the cyclists would moan that the grass is too long and people are in their way.

Weren't you a cyclist only a year or so ago, extolling the virtues of two wheel commuters and giving out about vans and trucks?

AndrewJRenko · 25-08-2017 05:05PM

Dravokivich wrote: »

I don't get the ire for multi-story car parks.

i think they should be spread a bit more around the city instead of so closely packed around Jervis and Dame St areas. But I feel they can present a very viable alternative to on-street parking, which can then open up the potential for greater pedestrian / cyclist usage.

The ire isn't so much for the car parks themselves, but for the degree of influence they have over the city's transport policy. Much of the commentary from 'city centre businesses' is actually commentary from city centre car park operators.

Phil.x · 26-08-2017 12:00AM

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Weren't you a cyclist only a year or so ago, extolling the virtues of two wheel commuters and giving out about vans and trucks?

No

Phil.x · 26-08-2017 12:02AM

07Lapierre wrote: »

Edit: here's a better example:

http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-bremen-germany-21st-jan-2015-plumber-theodor-roehm-rides-with-his-78621975.html

Yes, the Germans rule, I really love Germany, I should of moved there when I was younger.

Phil.x · 26-08-2017 12:05AM

Deedsie wrote: »

These changes are to accommodate bus and luas users. The only one moaning nonsensically here is you.

Well somebody has to stick up for the motorists.

NB: I haven't driven into the city for work in years.

LeinsterDub · 26-08-2017 12:15AM

Phil.x wrote: »

No

Phil.x wrote: »

I blame the likes of George hook for being anti cyclist on national airwaves and subconsciously brainwashing motorists to hate cyclists.

Must of been someone else

Peter Flynt · 26-08-2017 12:23AM

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Get out of your car so

This.

It's all about forcing people to use public transport even if the areas in which they live either have poor or no public transport facilities.

Typically Irish.

Dublin North Quays - now double bus lane

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