Doctor Strange In The Multiverse Of Madness *spoilers from post 118*

Spon Farmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032217#Comment_119032217

Coulson wasn’t a member of the public though - he was an Agent of S.H.I.E.L.D. with access to top secret information. He had cards featuring Cap but it was never specified what exactly these were - if these were trading cards then Captain America must have been an historical figure but was it known that he had superpowers? We’re the cards a S.H.I.E.L.D. thing like the American military use for terrorists?

This is the first appearance of Reed Richards in the MCU and he definitely has not featured in any way before.

And Strange was definitely mocking the team name.

The upcoming Fantastic Four movie doesn’t need to be an origin story but the MCU does need to show it as many people will not know it. This can be done in a show on Disney+ or in one the movies with the trip to space streaming to schools, etc. or maybe the space mission is for Fury in Secret Invasion.

Fantastic Four movie could be set several months after they get the powers with the origin being explained on a news programs with video footage from the space craft.

seraphimvc

Watched it on friday evening on lieMAX - would recommend it!

Quick one is that it is a Sam Raimi standard film (maybe the best cape film from the past 10 years hmmm), enjoyable overall but I would say the second half saved the first half of the film for me. Good performance from Benedict throughout the 2 hours (I really cant nitpick much, he is just on another caliber than the rest of the cast), very enjoyable side characters (Wong and new girl - especially I am so glad the new girl is likeable) - Wanda performance was ok that I wished her performance could have been better, and of course thank god no woke sh!te in it (and maybe just a little touch of M-She-U, which is acceptable).

First half of the film is mainly mediocre CG + the usual problems of a typical Marvel film - most actors cant act well that you can tell they are in a green screen they have no idea what they are supposed to see etc (most noticeable when wanda bombing the fortress, and...Wanda's performance throughout the film when she is in any CG scene). Overall for the first half I was 'reasonably' disappointed and I kept thinking 'well see this is actually the best quality of a marvel film that one can hope for, produced by an actual good director like Sam Raimi - but overall experience is still meh'. Some dialogue stood out to me already (Strange's dialogue with Wanda, Dr. West and his girl at the wedding), and I didn't feel bored.

Second half truly made up for me - best scene to me it was the good strange vs evil strange, the fight scene is just so Raimi and I just liked it so much. Again, good performance by Benedict, all his Strange are different lol. The plot started to be pulled together and the stories happened in the first half of the film ('build ups') made sense and the characters truly came alive near the end - Wong/zombie strange fought together, Chavez opening the portal for wanda, Wanda's performance in that last scene with 2 boys, and the last scene of wong/strange/chavez - it has been so long that I felt the characters are 'real' in a superhero film (last time was probably old Raimi spidey and Nolan's trilogy?). The Raimi style dialogue saved the day really - I just enjoyed them so much and they fit the characters so well.

Obviously the plot is not without flaws (like the Book of good basically did nothing aha), but overall as a whole, Raimi did an excellent job to manage so many nonvital stuffs in the plot and ensured the good balance on the pacing, characters, entertaining elements (humour, dark/horror stuff) and also managed to cramp in so many fan service stuffs. What a project yes, and suddenly we have a valuable example of 'how to do a capesh!t right in 2022'.

And ohya, imo the Illuminati stuff is pure distraction. But it was a pleasant surprise when I see Reed Richard ha (I have no spoiler on this and ya we knew Krasinski wanted to play the character in the past decades ha) and good to see Sir Patrick with the yellow wheelchair from our beloved 90s Xmen cartoon aha and the sound track was the bomb!) - but ye I dislike captain carter so much and I can't stand captain marvel (just because they are paper thin characters from Wandavision and 'What If') - good showcase of how powerful Wanda though.

Bonus point on the memory lane future machine scene - that is a delightful way to contribute to the plot/character and explains some key details in a concise manner.

All in all, best cape film for a long time, with actual directing and thoughts put into the project, commendable performance by Benedict and supporting actors (again, wished Wanda could performance better but overall ok, and what a pleasant feeling to have a new girl who is likeable).

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032525#Comment_119032525

Wow - the fragility to be upset about there being female superheroes

seraphimvc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032567#Comment_119032567

Wow the speed of yours to strawman the wall of text I said. Nope, I like/love so many fictional characters in any form of entertainment format - I never care less on the gender. It is marvel/disney who has been pushing out the sh!te (lots of bait and switch projects in the past years) and I am let's say 'suitably' aware of the 'norm'. I dislike crap characters i.e paper thin shallow character aka Mary Sue because they are boring, simple as that.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119026205#Comment_119026205

I don't really understand a lot of those complaints.

Wanda has the best arc but Strange and Chavez also go through a decent amount of development.

How is deaths in other universes 'disrespectful'? The deaths in 838 were in a large part due to them not listening to the 616 Strange in relation to the danger of Wanda. The 'good' characters care about what happens to other universes and therefore they set the audience up to also care about them. We don't see the aftermath of the deaths in that universe just like we didn't see the majority of what lead up to that point - because it isn't the story we're following. Now that doesn't mean it won't reappear at another point in the future, there were plenty of complaints about the movies right up to Civil War that they never dealt with the aftermath of the destruction the Avengers were a part of only for it ending up being a key to the Sokovia accords and what breaks up the Avengers, which sets up what happens across several shows and movies - including Infinity War.

Also, which characters from the original Strange are abandoned? Practically every one of note is revisited - even Strange's colleague from the hospital.

Spon Farmer

@seraphimvc

I stopped reading your post at the point were Elizabeth Olsen was “okay” becasue you clearly have had trip through the Multiverse yourself and seen a Doctor Strange sequel from a different Earth.

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032217#Comment_119032217

They've laid potential groundwork with those comments about lost SWORD space craft from Wandavision.

With Captain Marvel and Fury out in space they could intro there.

We also don't know who bought Stark Tower yet which can be another connection.

Agree with not dwelling on an origin story but I think they could knock it out pretty quickly in a movie and get on with it. What we've seen so far from MCU is that they don't like to rethread the same origin story like Sony and Fox did - they'll have some different approach.

Spon Farmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032681#Comment_119032681

What movie/show talks about Stark Tower being sold?

Is it No Way Home?

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032583#Comment_119032583

What strawman? Your fragility and upset is clear from you shoehorning the term 'M-She-U' twice into a single post - neither time it was even in anyway necessary or relevant to the point you were making.

Mary Sue is such a nonsense term given that it is something continuously ignored about similar male characters - the issue is bad writing and the only reason people use the Mary Sue term is because it annoys them more when the bad writing is about a strong female character and it gives them an opportunity to vent. Even if you want to use the term, there is simply no justification to try to link it to Wanda, who is one of the characters with the strongest arc and most depth in the MCU - far more than most of the male characters.

Midnight_EG

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032700#Comment_119032700

Happy said it was sold during Homecoming. IMO it'll be Reed Richards or Victor Von Doom

Foxtrol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032700#Comment_119032700

Spiderman Homecoming - they are moving out of Stark Tower when Vulture attacks

Spon Farmer

I know Richards is rich in the comics but another genius who is a billionaire genius in the MCU?

Might it be better if the money comes as result of the superpowers?

It would be good if Doom bought it for a dastardly scheme.

Agent Coulson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119030721#Comment_119030721

Strange says to Reed didn't you guys get lost in space? Or something to that effect.

Strange said "Didn't you guys chart in the 60's".

A joke on the Fantastic 4 name and the Fab 4 (The Beatles)

Homelander

I thought it was pretty good actually. Ending was a bit unconvincing but the film itself as a whole was solid enough. I really wished they shown us more of the multiverse though. The time spent in the alternative hipster-style New York and how it was presented was incredibly unsatisfying.

You would want to have watched Wanda Vision.

santana75

One other thing......I'm fairly sure Patrick Stewart said on live TV that Logan was he last turn as professor X. Yet here he is in this movie. Is this "Allowed" due to the multiverse and all that or has patrick Stewart gone back on the promise he made to Hugh Jackman live on air?

Fitz II

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032943#Comment_119032943

He probably got given a million quid for 2 days work....I am sure Jackman will learn to forgive him.

Agent Coulson

 But is there a chance you’d play Xavier again?

Charles Xavier? Yeah. There may be. You know, the whole X-Men comic series is so huge, so vast, there might be an opportunity in which he comes back. We’ll see.

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/patrick-stewart-doctor-strange-2-charles-xavier-x-men-1235260075/

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119030652#Comment_119030652

No those could be done after mutants go public. It wouldnt be all mutants at intro obviously.

Spon Farmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119033193#Comment_119033193

What do you mean it wouldn’t be all mutants at intro?

Im not familiar with Dawn of X at all - is it like the terrified contamination in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. ?

seraphimvc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032664#Comment_119032664

For human to human scenes, she did fine overall (few scenes well done, some meh some acceptable) - wait me to elaborate below.

What I meant in my post is only relating to how she acts in those green screen scenes - thats what mainly bothering me, her 'acting' just took me out of the scenes when I could clearly see that she was looking at a green screen. Again, when it comes to human-human scenes, she did fine overall.

Now on the actual acting part, from what I have seen, she only has 3 expressions: blank face, cry, and angry - there is no in-between. Obviously all these are subjective but hey Benedict did so well for his parts (lets say 45% of the movie), Olsen has like 40% of the movie as well, I am sorry (again hey is just personal opinion), most of her scenes took me out of the scenes - except in the end the last scene she was talking to the 2 boys, that felt real - but then immediately when 2 Olsens came on the same scene I lost it again. Is something to do with her eyes expression or something, the 'normal' wanda couldn't see the scarlet witch or it doesn't feel 'real' when she was imagining to look at the different version of herself.

jo187

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032943#Comment_119032943

My thinking on this is, it's not professor x from the fox x men films. So technically not going back on his word as it's a different professor x.

jo187

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032875#Comment_119032875

Ahh ok, I though chart was like a flight, like your chartered flight, jesus what a lame joke.

Eduard Khil

The fly by through each universe showed a water one was really hoping to see Namor in this as he is an arrogant fucker of a character would be a great antagonist on screen if now the door is open that anyone and everyone is on the table as a potential character for upcoming projects.

The Illuminati scenes were amazing.

Spon Farmer

I’m sure Jackman is terribly heart broken. McKellan too.(I don’t know to make a rolling eyes emoji)

seraphimvc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032771#Comment_119032771

I think you are overreacted - i didn't mean that Wanda is a Mary Sue.

My first sentence of M-She-U is a general comment due to the fact that we have been getting some woke sh!te from Disney in the past years - is a quick note that I am aware of the 'norm'.

My second sentence - apologies hey maybe i wasnt being abundantly clear - it was meant for Cap Marvel and Carter - they are Mary Sue, and I dislike them. Obviously hey this is just my opinion - but their first appearance from Wandavision and 'What If' are rather...shallow and paper thin character development and oh they are uber strong for no reason.

So I will repeat again (without you strawman'ized my wall of text), I think the whole lluminati is a distraction (consists of 4 guys + 2 women, I clarify the genders fyi, again I couldn't care less but for clarification sake), and the fact that 3 guys get one hit KO in seconds while the Cap Marvel and Carter have some showdown - in which the whole thing is fine - because Scarlet Witch is supposed to be this powerful. Cool fight scenes nonetheless (like Xavier get neck break).

So my previous post was purely saying that hey i dislike the mary sue characters (ie part of the whole M-She-U thingy) aka Cap Marvel and Carter and somehow they get some minutes of showdown here - which is...i said it...is acceptable. I mean like, it is hard to not relate to M-She-U when the 3 guys just get destroyed in split seconds - I purely based this on marvel/disney's track record, which I think...I am not being unreasonable.

But again, my initial post (i edited out the 2nd sentence now - just to avoid confusion...) praised on the whole main cast etc - and all you took it from that wall of text was...'fragility' stuff? I think I am being nice here to give you the benefit of doubt that you are not ad hominem. Hey all is my opinion - and I typed that wall of text to hope for....meaningful discussion on the movie (like i have maybe 10 key points there and you picked up the 2 sentences out of that).

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119032943#Comment_119032943

I'm pretty sure he just changed his mind, and I doubt Hugh Jackman would ever hold it against him.

Eduard Khil

It's a different universe doesn't mean Reed Richards doesn't exist in the 616 universe they may not have even gone to space yet if so he is or was just a brilliant scientist who shield or Tony Stark may have been aware of. They don't become players until they aquire powers then they enter the game.

TheIrishGrover

[deleting my rant on people who have a problem with strong female characters and their Woke emasculation conspiracy theory as I had misread previous posts and is been done to death anyway]

Anyway, as for the film. Yeah, it wasn't bad. I wasn't gone on the first one. Thought it was up (down?) There with Thor 2 and Iron Man 2 (and later Eternals) in being pretty dull and poor.

But I thought this was an improvement. Not going to change the world and telling that some of the best bits involved the cameos. Bucket Crunderduster's accent still grates but it is better (still going for the Hugh Laurie nasal voice thing as opposed to Martin Freeman's better version)

It was forgettable enough but at least we got to see Bruce Campbell fight with his hand again (and loved the post credit sequence. "Thank God. It's over").

Thought it was surprisingly scary and violent for a PG movie. I know, I know, in Gremlins, they microwaved one and straight up stabbed another in the chest, but I just want expecting it is all. Would tell my friend to be a bit cautious bringing his 6-year-old.

I know this was initially intended to be released shortly before Spider-Man. That Multiverse usage was half MUCH better. (And obviously it goes without saying that Spiderverse is the pinnacle 😃). It would have been interesting to have seen how this would have worked in original release timeline.

Edit: deleted initial rant as misread previous posts.:)

Spon Farmer

@seraphimvc

I got a little further in this last post of yours than the previous one but this time I bailed mainly because of the size of it.

You’ve been devoting a lot of time and energy to something you don’t like.

Anyway what “woke shite” has been coming out of Marvel under Disney’s ownership?

Ans how are Captain Carter and Captain Marvel “Mary Sues” in this movie?

Spon Farmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119033291#Comment_119033291

The joke is million times better than the bizarre thing you claimed was said.

When did chartered space flights become a thing in the MCU ?