Covid 19 Part XXXII-215,743 ROI (4,137 deaths)111,166 NI (2,036 deaths)(22/02)Read OP

wadacrack

Thread is becoming like a conspiracy theories now on Covid. Were dealing with a virus that's more serious and more transmissible. Data does not lie. Theirs no credible evidence scientists in Ireland are trying to inflict fear on the entire nation. People are tired and fatigued and in a vulnerable state of mind. Its understandable I guess some are failing to look at the situation logically. Its going to get better but not as quickly as we had hoped when the vaccines were approved in December. Hopefully some goo news on the J & J vaccine in the next few weeks can accelerate the rollout.

Plumbthedepths

Ficheall wrote: »

Fyp.

How did you fix a post by using the exact same words in the same order as the OP? Is it the slight angle on the 'if'.
Btw the OP already acknowledged the 'If' caveat.

stephenjmcd

645 swabs from 13,841 tests. 4.66%

Drops the 7 day rate to 5.1 from 5.3

Hulk Hands

Arghus wrote: »

It isn't groundbreaking stuff, it's a load of unsubstantiated hearsay.

Gript are making claims without providing any evidence. Surely you'd want to see to see evidence before you believe such things?

This tweet is going to circulate around and get talked about and will be accepted as fact by some people, but, if you look at it, there's no hard evidence for the things that the article alleges.

It's boilerplate misinformation designed to generate clicks and "engagement".

How do you know, exactly?

You're guilty of exactly the same thing you're accusing others of, of accepting something as a definite without evidence. You have no idea if this is true or not but are dismissing it as 'boilerplate misinformation'.

The onus is on the publication to release their copy of the email. Until then nobody knows either way. The author seems to be confident in his assertions but again, none of us know

https://twitter.com/G_L_Kavanagh/status/1364212835769856001

CruelSummer

wadacrack wrote: »

Thread is becoming like a conspiracy theories now on Covid. Were dealing with a virus that's more serious and more transmissible. Data does not lie. Theirs no credible evidence scientists in Ireland are trying to inflict fear on the entire nation. People are tired and fatigued and in a vulnerable state of mind. Its understandable I guess some are failing to look at the situation logically. Its going to get better but not as quickly as we had hoped when the vaccines were approved in December. Hopefully some goo news on the J & J vaccine in the next few weeks can accelerate the rollout.

And what about the Professors on the radio yesterday - Staines and Killeen that stated that the vaccines won’t work - and that the only way out is through zero Covid and a harsher lockdown to get there - then County by County basis from there on out on who’s lucky enough to be allowed to live. The conspiracy theories dig doesn’t wash when you’ve Professors, NPHET and Government shifting the goalposts and keeping us in lockdown indefinitely, banning indoor dining for the summer of 2021, and foreign travel. Meanwhile our nearest neighbour sets a timeline to be fully opened by end of June.

Turtwig

CruelSummer wrote: »

This group need to be taken off air immediately or at the very least challenged hard by presenters. Yesterday trying to stop schools reopening, claiming vaccines don't work...there is no balance to the debate in Ireland and we've normalised the extremists. Shame on the media for promoting this shower.

I thought Ryan's point on schools was a salient one. There's no reason why they shouldn't try reopening schools where COVID is practically zero in the community. Some locales still have a very high incidence rate. There is a significant difference in the level of risk between opening a school in Cork compared to a school in Offaly. Ryan's point that schools should be based on the community level of infection is a very fair one. Determining all schools on a national level is inefficient.

Gruffalux

CruelSummer wrote: »

I agree there needs to be evidence provided otherwise it’s just hot air. However if evidence is provided what would your opinion be?

My opinion, if the leak is true, would be that it is quite weird. Not good at all.

Makes me also think with the way things leak so freely these days we should only ever talk about important stuff in person in a huge field far from all habitation with a cone of silence over our heads :pac:

Arghus

CruelSummer wrote: »

I agree there needs to be evidence provided otherwise it’s just hot air. However if evidence is provided what would your opinion be?

If the facts change I change my mind.

But there's no actual facts there.

But, even the way this conversation were having about it is framed is in a manner that gript would have intended.

They published an article - without any substance or verified facts - it gets retweeted, linked, posted...whatever and the conversation becomes about the maybe's, could have's and possibly's that are only part of the conversation because they were alleged, without evidence, in the initial piece.

bennyl10

CruelSummer wrote: »

I agree there needs to be evidence provided otherwise it’s just hot air. However if evidence is provided what would your opinion be?

it's gript. there wont be evidence, its bs to get a reaction, similar to the liberal etc

It's like trusting OAN with american election stuff

wadacrack

CruelSummer wrote: »

And what about the Professors on the radio yesterday - Staines and Killeen that stated that the vaccines won’t work - and that the only way out is through zero Covid and a harsher lockdown to get there - then County by County basis from there on out on who’s lucky enough to be allowed to live. The conspiracy theories dig doesn’t wash when you’ve Professors, NPHET and Government shifting the goalposts and keeping us in lockdown indefinitely, banning indoor dining for the summer of 2021, and foreign travel. Meanwhile our nearest neighbour sets a timeline to be fully opened by end of June.

I just that's their opinion, some evidence in Manuas Brazil of that.
Important to remember that if it goes well , we will copy that model. We know we lack leadership essentially just waiting for a template to follow. John Campbell who I think is very credible and has been extremely accurate so far, thinks its a good plan. That's encouraging for me.

igCorcaigh

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1364218149776863239?s=19

normanoffside

stephenjmcd wrote: »

645 swabs from 13,841 tests. 4.66%

Drops the 7 day rate to 5.1 from 5.3

The Positivity rate of this virus going down but the negativity rate of the Government and media is going up.

seamus

stephenjmcd wrote: »

645 swabs from 13,841 tests. 4.66%

Drops the 7 day rate to 5.1 from 5.3

It's a good outcome today across all metrics.

I have a speculation, but I've no idea if it'll pan out or if it's just wishful thinking;

When we started testing close contacts, we locked ourselves into testing entire chains of infection that would have been missed before.

That is, someone tests positive. That kicks off contact tracing and testing. Some of those contacts test positive. That kicks off new chains of tracing and testing.

And so on. That commits us to continuing to test these chains of infection until we hit the bottom - until we reach the point where there are way less close contacts to test.

And hitting the bottom would likely take a few weeks.

During those few weeks, the numbers will be a bit weird, like we've seen now. Flat some days, up the next, down the next. You see people asking, "Where TF are all these infections coming from?". And this would answer that question.

Again, all speculation. When we get to the end of these infection chains though, we would expect to see a significant drop-off in infection numbers. Which going by my speculation/hopeless optimisim, would be around now.

Plumbthedepths

Given the litigious nature of Irish society it seems quite stupid of the author of the Gript piece naming individuals if he has no evidence.
Hope he has deep pockets to quote a phrase used on the restrictions thread.

Stheno

stephenjmcd wrote: »

645 swabs from 13,841 tests. 4.66%

Drops the 7 day rate to 5.1 from 5.3

Good to see it drop below five.

Hopefully it will continue

seamus

retro:electro wrote: »

Hair cuts and other personal services are not permitted currently until level 3, so by Micheál stating that it is clear he sees us being in at least level 4 until the end of June, and if this new plan is anything like the last sure level 4 and level 5 are basically two cheeks of the same arse.

Again, the assertion was made by the poster that we would be in lockdown/level 5 until the end of June. That's what I responded to.

Nobody at any stage has said that lockdown will continue to the end of June.

I completely understand the frustration and confusion. But it's also easy to know what hasn't been said. By all means get annoyed about the confusing parts, but getting worked up about stuff that nobody has said, will do you no good.

Arghus wrote: »

It isn't groundbreaking stuff, it's a load of unsubstantiated hearsay.

Gript are making claims without providing any evidence. Surely you'd want to see to see evidence before you believe such things?

I wouldn't be surprised if it's legit, but it's also not the sinister stuff that Gript want to claim it is.

ISAG is backed by a fairly decent number of left groups, for whom socialism is not a naughty word. For the likes of Gript, the word "Marxism" is synonymous with Satan, but in the real world it's just economic theory.

The use of protest tactics to get their message across, while it makes a mockery of ISAG's "science-based" claims, isn't the sinister insurrectionism that lunatics like Gript are implying.

quokula

wadacrack wrote: »

I just that's their opinion, some evidence in Manuas Brazil of that.
Important to remember that if it goes well , we will copy that model. We know we lack leadership essentially just waiting for a template to follow. John Campbell who I think is very credible and has been extremely accurate so far, thinks its a good plan. That's encouraging for me.

The revisionism here is astounding - the UK government has consistently been a disaster throughout the pandemic and has regularly been well behind Ireland in locking down in time and reacting to the reality of the data and the science. That's the reason why hundreds of thousands of people in the UK are grieving for lost family members and a proportionally much more tiny percentage of people here have been left in that same situation.

They've tried to open up too quickly and put money ahead of health repeatedly, brought in disastrous schemes like eat out to help out, killed many thousands of people in the process, and people are still falling for it? How?

They're ahead of the curve on vaccine rollout thanks to AZ reneging on their commitments to the EU, so maybe it will be different for them this time. But to suggest that Ireland has always just followed their lead through the pandemic is just utterly wrong when we've consistently handled the situation so much better than them.

Tyrone212

Happydays2020 wrote: »

If this is true, it is quite sinister

https://twitter.com/griptmedia/status/1364193937955692545?s=21

Gript is full of loons, more like an American conspiracy entity than anything else. They'd make the daily mail look reputable. The government message is confusing and the over riding emotion they are producing is anger due to the mixed messaging so I doubt that's true.

stephenjmcd

seamus wrote: »

It's a good outcome today across all metrics.

I have a speculation, but I've no idea if it'll pan out or if it's just wishful thinking;

When we started testing close contacts, we locked ourselves into testing entire chains of infection that would have been missed before.

That is, someone tests positive. That kicks off contact tracing and testing. Some of those contacts test positive. That kicks off new chains of tracing and testing.

And so on. That commits us to continuing to test these chains of infection until we hit the bottom - until we reach the point where there are way less close contacts to test.

And hitting the bottom would likely take a few weeks.

During those few weeks, the numbers will be a bit weird, like we've seen now. Flat some days, up the next, down the next. You see people asking, "Where TF are all these infections coming from?". And this would answer that question.

Again, all speculation. When we get to the end of these infection chains though, we would expect to see a significant drop-off in infection numbers. Which going by my speculation/hopeless optimisim, would be around now.

Would make sense really. The testing of close contacts helps of course, your catching cases you would have missed otherwise

Ficheall

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

How did you fix a post by using the exact same words in the same order as the OP? Is it the slight angle on the 'if'.
Btw the OP already acknowledged the 'If' caveat.

It's in giant bold font - may not show up on a phone?
And I know the OP acknowledged the "if", but a lot of people seem to be leaping on the possibility with an (as of yet undeserved) amount of gusto.

Ficheall

quokula wrote: »

They're ahead of the curve on vaccine rollout thanks to AZ reneging on their commitments to the EU, so maybe it will be different for them this time. But to suggest that Ireland has always just followed their lead through the pandemic is just utterly wrong when we've consistently handled the situation so much better than them.

Yup - their vaccination seems better, but they've had twice as many deaths per capita as us.. Wouldn't be blindly following them just yet.

Plumbthedepths

Ficheall wrote: »

It's in giant bold font - may not show up on a phone?
And I know the OP acknowledged the "if", but a lot of people seem to be leaping on the possibility with an (as of yet undeserved) amount of gusto.

Thanks for clarifying, so the same word but put in 'giant bold font' gives the correct meaning in your opinion to what the OP was saying.
I can see the urgent necessity of what you did now. Thanks.

Ficheall

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Thanks for clarifying, so the same word but put in 'giant bold font' gives the correct meaning in your opinion to what the OP was saying.
I can the urgent necessity of what you did now. Thanks.

Ah now - if we restricted ourselves to urgent or necessary posts, these threads would be very sparse indeed

wadacrack

quokula wrote: »

The revisionism here is astounding - the UK government has consistently been a disaster throughout the pandemic and has regularly been well behind Ireland in locking down in time and reacting to the reality of the data and the science. That's the reason why hundreds of thousands of people in the UK are grieving for lost family members and a proportionally much more tiny percentage of people here have been left in that same situation.

They've tried to open up too quickly and put money ahead of health repeatedly, brought in disastrous schemes like eat out to help out, killed many thousands of people in the process, and people are still falling for it? How?

They're ahead of the curve on vaccine rollout thanks to AZ reneging on their commitments to the EU, so maybe it will be different for them this time. But to suggest that Ireland has always just followed their lead through the pandemic is just utterly wrong when we've consistently handled the situation so much better than them.

I didnt suggest we have followed their lead. With the data on the vaccine in Israel and other countries I think we will follow something similar in this instance. UK approach has been overall very poor but I think their current plan is a good one (foreign travel aside)

Happydays2020

Tyrone212 wrote: »

Gript is full of loons, more like an American conspiracy entity than anything else. They'd make the daily mail look reputable. The government message is confusing and the over riding emotion they are producing is anger due to the mixed messaging so I doubt that's true.

Thanks. Never heard about it before - saw the tweet via an IT journalist.

Maxface

igCorcaigh wrote: »

https://twitter.com/newschambers/status/1364218149776863239?s=19

Had to travel from Donegal to Dublin yesterday for an essential reason. Met two checkpoints at first, one in town and one before the border. Traffic was very light before the border. In the North it was a free for all, as busy on the roads as I can remember. Then another checkpoint when I left the border again. Traffic in Dublin is way down. I don't be up too often but it was enjoyable driving up there. I think the North is gonna be an issue if we ever do open up, hopefully their vaccination drive will help this but it is a concern.

CoronaBlocker

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Thanks for clarifying, so the same word but put in 'giant bold font' gives the correct meaning in your opinion to what the OP was saying.
I can see the urgent necessity of what you did now. Thanks.

It's like when people use a string of exclamation points after their joke. It makes it funnier. :rolleyes:

Dubit11

Maxface wrote: »

Had to travel from Donegal to Dublin yesterday for an essential reason. Met two checkpoints at first, one in town and one before the border. Traffic was very light before the border. In the North it was a free for all, as busy on the roads as I can remember. Then another checkpoint when I left the border again. Traffic in Dublin is way down. I don't be up too often but it was enjoyable driving up there. I think the North is gonna be an issue if we ever do open up, hopefully their vaccination drive will help this but it is a concern.

At the rate the UK is vaccinating they are likely to be more concerned (rightfully) about people from here travelling up to the North.

Plumbthedepths

quokula wrote: »

The revisionism here is astounding - the UK government has consistently been a disaster throughout the pandemic and has regularly been well behind Ireland in locking down in time and reacting to the reality of the data and the science. That's the reason why hundreds of thousands of people in the UK are grieving for lost family members and a proportionally much more tiny percentage of people here have been left in that same situation.

They've tried to open up too quickly and put money ahead of health repeatedly, brought in disastrous schemes like eat out to help out, killed many thousands of people in the process, and people are still falling for it? How?

They're ahead of the curve on vaccine rollout thanks to AZ reneging on their commitments to the EU, so maybe it will be different for them this time. But to suggest that Ireland has always just followed their lead through the pandemic is just utterly wrong when we've consistently handled the situation so much better than them.

I don't see any revisionism here at all, I doubt anyone disputes the UK's manner of handling the crisis prior to the presence of the vaccine was anything other than appalling.
Your claim about AZ in the British context is strange tbh. The UK government took a gamble and signed a deal with AZ and approved the vaccine before the EMA I believe by a month .
The UK authorities are responsible for an outrageous excess death toll, but they are at present whether you agree or not , leading the way out of this crisis.

copeyhagen

Dubit11 wrote: »

At the rate the UK is vaccinating they are likely to be more concerned (rightfully) about people from here travelling up to the North.

so true, im due a fresh booze run up to newry, ill probably be ran out of tesco when they hear me.