COVID-19: Vaccine and testing procedures Megathread Part 2 [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Gael23

Just seen a question asked to my local TD on Facebook, will older people being cared for at home with the help of home nursing services where do you fall on the list?

quokula

On almost every metric in the pandemic so far, from rates of testing, contact tracing app rollout, PPE procurement, and most importantly keeping overall infection rates down, Ireland has performed excellently compared to many other countries in Europe.

A couple of days won’t make a huge difference, and it’s unclear what kind of numbers are being vaccinated in other countries so far above the pure publicity / PR of vaccinating a few people quickly and putting some pictures out there. I’ll wait until we start to see a clearer picture of the real rate of vaccination deployment before I judge Ireland too harshly.

Wolf359f

quokula wrote: »

On almost every metric in the pandemic so far, from rates of testing, contact tracing app rollout, PPE procurement, and most importantly keeping overall infection rates down, Ireland has performed excellently compared to many other countries in Europe.

A couple of days won’t make a huge difference, and it’s unclear what kind of numbers are being vaccinated in other countries so far above the pure publicity / PR of vaccinating a few people quickly and putting some pictures out there. I’ll wait until we start to see a clearer picture of the real rate of vaccination deployment before I judge Ireland too harshly.

I have to say that part is true, some will argue it's down to harsher restrictions (debatable) or a slower opening.

I still believe every day counts in a pandemic though, waiting an extra day to vaccinate someone is another day they are at risk.

quokula

Wolf359f wrote: »

I have to say that part is true, some will argue it's down to harsher restrictions (debatable) or a slower opening.

I still believe every day counts in a pandemic though, waiting an extra day to vaccinate someone is another day they are at risk.

Every day does count. But vaccinating 100 people today and 1,000 over the rest of the week is worse than vaccinating 0 people today and 2,000 over the rest of the week. So without any real numbers to go on we can't say if Ireland is actually falling behind or not.

But as I said, based on prior evidence, we've been handling the pandemic well so far, and I think our handling of the pandemic has been more focussed on actual outcomes and less focussed on PR than some other countries, so I won't judge until we see some actual numeric data.

froog

namloc1980 wrote: »

Well as you seem to be an expert here can you explain why it'll take us to Wednesday to start vaccinating while nearly every other country in the EU started today/tomorrow?

i count 5 or 6 EU countries starting vaccinations today/tomorrow. out of 27 EU countries.

hynesie08

froog wrote: »

i count 5 or 6 EU countries starting vaccinations today/tomorrow. out of 27 EU countries.

Netherlands are supposedly waiting till the 8th of January.

namloc1980

froog wrote: »

i count 5 or 6 EU countries starting vaccinations today/tomorrow. out of 27 EU countries.

Germany, Hungary and Slovakia started today. Tomorrow is Malta, Cyprus, Sweden, Bulgaria, Finland, Estonia, Lithuania, Poland, Italy, Spain, Denmark, Greece, Slovenia.

On Monday is Latvia, Belgium.

This from a quick Google search of local news in those countries.

JacksonHeightsOwn

Gael23 wrote: »

Just seen a question asked to my local TD on Facebook, will older people being cared for at home with the help of home nursing services where do you fall on the list?

I know a chap that works in home care for the elderly and I was asking him this very question on Christmas eve, he told me his company where told to expect their staff and "clients" to be getting vaccinated around the middle of February. But no definitive date

JacksonHeightsOwn

namloc1980 wrote: »

Germany, Hungary and Slovakia started today. Tomorrow is Malta, Cyprus, Sweden, Bulgaria, Finland, Estonia, Lithuania, Poland, Italy, Spain, Denmark, Greece, Slovenia.

On Monday is Latvia, Belgium.

This from a quick Google search of local news in those countries.

Is it too presumptuous to say that if someone dies in a carehome, one month from now from contracting the virus in the next few days, that they could have been saved by rolling out the vaccine the same time as everyone else in Europe?

JTMan

On one hand nice to see main global BBC heading stating that "all of the EU will start vaccinations today" but some countries "jumped the gun and started yesterday due to the emergency" (fair play to them). On the other hand so sad to see that Ireland are not in the mix with this. It is awful that the HSE are not starting today. The sooner we start the sooner this emergency ends.

The President of the Medical Council has criticised the HSE for their slow rollout ...https://twitter.com/ritakj/status/1342865391010394112

hmmm

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/covid-vaccine-boost-for-millions-as-hospitals-near-breaking-point-vj7fpj2hr

"Astra Zeneca’s chief executive, Pascal Soriot, today reveals that new data will show the vaccine is as effective as the Pfizer and Moderna jabs that have already been approved, protecting 95% of patients, and is “100% effective” in preventing severe illness requiring hospital treatment."

hmmm

"Soriot said: “We think we have figured out the winning formula and how to get efficacy that, after two doses, is up there with everybody else."

This is brilliant news.

noserider

Will all Health Care staff take the vaccine?

Cork2021

hmmm wrote: »

"Soriot said: “We think we have figured out the winning formula and how to get efficacy that, after two doses, is up there with everybody else."

This is brilliant news.

Absolutely huge news!! This is the real game changer as they’ve the production capacity to ramp up! How many doses would we be getting once approved?

gctest50

Cork2021 wrote: »

Absolutely huge news!! .......

Since it's going to take forever and a day it'll be sheer luck in a few months time covid19 doesn't mutate and render all the doses already given useless

JacksonHeightsOwn

noserider wrote: »

Will all Health Care staff take the vaccine?

I do alot of contract work in hospitals, and from the staff in in contact with, they'd all want it.

Away With The Fairies

hmmm wrote: »

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/covid-vaccine-boost-for-millions-as-hospitals-near-breaking-point-vj7fpj2hr

"Astra Zeneca’s chief executive, Pascal Soriot, today reveals that new data will show the vaccine is as effective as the Pfizer and Moderna jabs that have already been approved, protecting 95% of patients, and is “100% effective” in preventing severe illness requiring hospital treatment."

I'm confused with one thing. The vaccines seem to lessen severe illness. How do they figure that out with a virus that seems to affect everyone differently?

Some people get no symptoms, some people get it mild, some people needs hospitalisation, and some die. That's with the virus itself. So how can vaccine help with all this?

Sorry if it seems like a stupid question but I'm just confused with it all.

iamwhoiam

chrisbonnie wrote: »

I know a chap that works in home care for the elderly and I was asking him this very question on Christmas eve, he told me his company where told to expect their staff and "clients" to be getting vaccinated around the middle of February. But no definitive date

There is a full list of care homes with definitive dates for every home on the HSE site

Sky King

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

I'm confused with one thing. The vaccines seem to lessen severe illness. How do they figure that out with a virus that seems to affect everyone differently? .

I presume in the trials no one who got the vaccine ended up in hospital as a result of getting covid.

The Royal Scam

Wolf359f wrote: »

I'd actually love the hear the official reason behind the delay.
And an answer that stands up to reason, rather than the unofficial excuses I've seen on here.

I am directly involved in validating the critical part of the cold chain for the storage of the vaccines. Procurement of the freezers were as fast as they could have been and the testing and validation of each freezer is quite difficult and takes an frustrating amount of time but I can say with 100% confidence that these units are very fit for purpose.
The people involved in the logistics also are working around the clock making sure they have everything in place to do it the best way.
I would much rather things are done more slowly and correct than just rushing in to please everyone as the challenges involved with the first vaccine are very real

iamwhoiam

The Royal Scam wrote: »

I am directly involved in validating the critical part of the cold chain for the storage of the vaccines. Procurement of the freezers were as fast as they could have been and the testing and validation of each freezer is quite difficult and takes an frustrating amount of time but I can say with 100% confidence that these units are very fit for purpose.
The people involved in the logistics also are working around the clock making sure they have everything in place to do it the best way.
I would much rather things are done more slowly and correct than just rushing in to please everyone as the challenges involved with the first vaccine are very real

Absolutely agree . I three weeks time or two months time we won’t notice the three day delay . This has to be done right and every single cog oiled before they move the train .

Away With The Fairies

Sky King wrote: »

I presume in the trials no one who got the vaccine ended up in hospital as a result of getting covid.

I guess there would be alot of people in the trials that some would have to end up in hospital but they didn't.

Another question, is there anything on the vaccines and if they can prevent what they call long covid?

thomasdylan

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

I guess there would be alot of people in the trials that some would have to end up in hospital but they didn't.

Another question, is there anything on the vaccines and if they can prevent what they call long covid?

I presume it would. Long Covid seems to be a form of post viral fatigue to me.

Van.Bosch

The Royal Scam wrote: »

I am directly involved in validating the critical part of the cold chain for the storage of the vaccines. Procurement of the freezers were as fast as they could have been and the testing and validation of each freezer is quite difficult and takes an frustrating amount of time but I can say with 100% confidence that these units are very fit for purpose.
The people involved in the logistics also are working around the clock making sure they have everything in place to do it the best way.
I would much rather things are done more slowly and correct than just rushing in to please everyone as the challenges involved with the first vaccine are very real

So if the freezers are working perfectly - they aren’t to blame for the delay, that’s something we got spot on so well done.

So what is the delay? Maybe I’m naive but I don’t think it’s HSE just being slow or on holidays so I’m genuinely curious as to the reasoning.

Stheno

The Royal Scam wrote: »

I am directly involved in validating the critical part of the cold chain for the storage of the vaccines. Procurement of the freezers were as fast as they could have been and the testing and validation of each freezer is quite difficult and takes an frustrating amount of time but I can say with 100% confidence that these units are very fit for purpose.
The people involved in the logistics also are working around the clock making sure they have everything in place to do it the best way.
I would much rather things are done more slowly and correct than just rushing in to please everyone as the challenges involved with the first vaccine are very real

What are these mysterious challenges that only the HSE appear to be facing?

Sloth perhaps? Lack of planning perhaps? Typical HSE ineptitude perhaps?

Morries Wigs

hmmm wrote: »

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/covid-vaccine-boost-for-millions-as-hospitals-near-breaking-point-vj7fpj2hr

"Astra Zeneca’s chief executive, Pascal Soriot, today reveals that new data will show the vaccine is as effective as the Pfizer and Moderna jabs that have already been approved, protecting 95% of patients, and is “100% effective” in preventing severe illness requiring hospital treatment."

ya great but does it stop transmission no

Morries Wigs

The Royal Scam wrote: »

I am directly involved in validating the critical part of the cold chain for the storage of the vaccines. Procurement of the freezers were as fast as they could have been and the testing and validation of each freezer is quite difficult and takes an frustrating amount of time but I can say with 100% confidence that these units are very fit for purpose.
The people involved in the logistics also are working around the clock making sure they have everything in place to do it the best way.
I would much rather things are done more slowly and correct than just rushing in to please everyone as the challenges involved with the first vaccine are very real

doing 30 vaccinations a day couldnt get any slower

The Royal Scam

The Royal Scam wrote: »

I am directly involved in validating the critical part of the cold chain for the storage of the vaccines. Procurement of the freezers were as fast as they could have been and the testing and validation of each freezer is quite difficult and takes an frustrating amount of time but I can say with 100% confidence that these units are very fit for purpose.
The people involved in the logistics also are working around the clock making sure they have everything in place to do it the best way.
I would much rather things are done more slowly and correct than just rushing in to please everyone as the challenges involved with the first vaccine are very real

Is it that difficult? Is there an issue getting it to the required locations for example? Or does the difficulty lie with determining who is getting it first and arranging for them to be present?

iamwhoiam

Stheno wrote: »

What are these mysterious challenges that only the HSE appear to be facing?

Sloth perhaps? Lack of planning perhaps? Typical HSE ineptitude perhaps?

Just reading online about major issues in the UK with distribution .One centre had 75 doses left over as the elderly couldnt not make their way there . They had to give it to healthy people before it was out of date .

The Royal Scam

Stheno wrote: »

What are these mysterious challenges that only the HSE appear to be facing?

Sloth perhaps? Lack of planning perhaps? Typical HSE ineptitude perhaps?

It is the first time the HSE has ever had to store anything less than -20 degrees and it critical that it is done correctly. I have been extremely impressed in my dealings with them. All other countries have had the same challenges and I am aware of some information on how other countries have dealt with it. Put it this way I would rather be getting my vaccine in Ireland