Relaxation of restrictions

Arghus

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I wonder have there been any 'supermarket clusters' yet. Be surprised if not...If one employee at a store tested positive, presumably it would have to close for a fortnight and the rest go into self-isolation...

It's the big conundrum really. If someone does get infected you would think that a lot of people who also work there would have to go into isolation and they'd have to shut the store in question.

But, then supermarkets themselves are classed as essential services and basically can't shut. So what happens?

This is presumably why there is a hiring drive going on right now across the sector. Because people will get sick sooner or later.

I can assure that absolutely no clue is possessed about what to do about this at any level of supervisor or management where I am at least, and I don't see why it is any different elsewhere.They aren't proactive about anything and only do the bare minimum of what they are advised to do. It's maddening. I've really seen the mediocrity of people in authority over the last couple of weeks.

Rotweiler

cherryghost wrote: »

I'm in a position where I need to shop for my family due to missing online groceries and have a car sitting in my driveway, for presumably months on end. I have a friend who works in healthcare that is affected similarly. Just going to post what I mailed to local TD.

In my friends case, she carpooled with healthcare workers (and 1 non)
right up until social distancing and from seperate households came
into force. There was a reliance on a fully experienced driver at the
time. My friend is a Learner driver, and has nobody to drive into work
with. At this point, she now walks 30 minutes to her nearest bus stop
(the 13), and another hour to get into a northside hospital that she
works in. She has also had to change work hours as bus doesnt come
early enough for her. Previously with carpool she was 45 mins in and
out each way (due to early nature of her hours with the carpool). She
is now spending the guts of 3 hours a day commuting on top of her 10
(often 12 due to pressure of healthcare work currently ongoing)
working hours daily. As she is a Learner Driver, she has the potential
to drive into work herself, but due to the current enforcements,
Learner Drivers must be accompanied by experienced driver, which
cannot happen due social distancing measures, and nobody in her
household to drive with.

There is a handful (at least) of similar healthcare and essential
workers at this time browsing the RSA Facebook comments, RSA Twitter
comments and Shane Ross' Twitter feed.

I myself am also a Learner Driver. Although not a healthcare worker
and in all seriousness nowhere near as screwed as my friend, I too
cannot drive my car due to no sponsor/experienced driver to sit with
me. I have a family, my wife is self isolating, and I had been
previously after my father tested positive. All good here but means
the family relies heavily on myself and online grocery orders. I have
had 2 situations in the past 3 weeks, where my online grocery
deliveries lacked essentials (nappies, bread, potatoes to name a few),
where I had to walk shop to shop around Clondalkin (I am west
Clondalkin based), do multiple walks back and forth as I dont have the
ability to carry a familys worth of groceries. I probably clocked more
than 10km in a day walking.

Couldn'T agree more. On top of that; RSA test are cancelled as well. So it is a loop for unforeseen amount of time.

GT89

Rotweiler wrote: »

Couldn'T agree more. On top of that; RSA test are cancelled as well. So it is a loop for unforeseen amount of time.

Should relax the restrictions on unaccompanied drivers temporarily

Jim Gazebo

I personally don't see a relaxation until May at least. I think they'll make a decision eventually either way, it's a lot to ask of people. Some people don't get out much anyway and find this easy.

I lived off running, walking and cycling for exercise, im doing all that at brief times inside the 2km limit and I am finding it hard, there's no point lieing to make friend with you guys. I know people out there are in worse positions. I have a lot on my plate with vulnerable people in my own house. It's hard to cope at the moment. Take away exercise and I'd be unbearable. I'd find it very very hard.

In Spain they weren't allowing people walk, but you could walk your dog.... Dogs will have more right to life in that situation.

We have a sad situation developing, we are only at the start, everyone needs to work hard, keep to the 2km and get some fresh air. I think most people are doing it with some exceptions who you'll never tame. I ask you please don't look for a hard lockdown, we are doing well now.

Rotweiler

Definitely. I mean it is a total loop. Plus the surcharge you pay to the insurance.

@Jim

It is necessary and it will be for the majority of the world. As well as I respect you and your family or similar people who obey, there is a mast majority especially in Dublin central who totally disregard the rules and social distancing.

YOu can not say "Wicklower are allowed to walk whereas Dublineers are not" so...

easypazz

YFlyer wrote: »

Yes Yes Yes

Why wait a week?

I need something tomorrow, down to local shop, pick item up with left hand, reach out to pay contactless with right hand and off I go.

If this thing is so contagious that the above is dangerous then we are all fcuked anyway.

Speakerboxx

I think we have turned the corner and normality starts in 2 weeks. We be fine. In anothet month we wont be even talking about covid 19.

IAMAMORON

The restrictions are in place to slow the escalation of the virus. Until the deaths and positive tests recede nothing will change.

I do think however that the virus is slowly turning political. Already opposition TD's are complaining about the testing issues and before long the release of restrictions will become a hot potato for whoever is in government. All along the message from WHO has been get there first and be safer than sorry. Politicians are shítting themselves about making the wrong decisions. I reckon they will need some serious evidence of a decline in deaths and positive cases before they start removing restrictions. Given the level of begrudgery and blame this country is fond of - the politicians won't be making any hasty calls. A lot with depend also on how things pan out elsewhere in Europe and the UK. The virus is political now.

I can see the Leaving cert happening as planned in June. The Junior cert can get kicked down the street, it is no biggie, it could easily be sat before Hallloween, job done. But the leaving is a requirement and is heavily monitored. 3rd level need to know where they are for September. I think uni exams will also go ahead if possible. Things have to progress.

This virus is not going anywhere. But it can be beaten if people do what they are told and stay the phuck in doors. Cocooning cannot eradicate the virus but it offers the HSE time to deal with it given its' limited resources.

This is a virus, it has no conscience, it will not relent. This pandemic looks to be in its infancy. Given what has happened in Italy and Spain I could not be trusting what the Chinese government is telling everyone. Over the next few weeks it could well get nasty in the US, they are projecting 100,000 deaths at best with a potential for over a million dead, that shít will get nasty. If that is all over your TV sets and deaths are not curtailed here get ready for a long summer.

The grim reality is that no one knows how bad this is going to get yet. I have spoken with health workers in the city centre and things are getting heavy in there. The next few weeks will be crucial. Hopefully the current restrictions are helping.

YFlyer

easypazz wrote: »

Why wait a week?

I need something tomorrow, down to local shop, pick item up with left hand, reach out to pay contactless with right hand and off I go.

If this thing is so contagious that the above is dangerous then we are all fcuked anyway.

Lol

storker

storker wrote: »

How many deaths were attributable to the last recession?

Depends, how many suicides left notes?

How many homeless and alcoholic as a result of losing everything?

Just because it can't be put on a death certificate doesn't mean it wasn't a factor

Jim Gazebo

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

I personally don't see a relaxation until May at least. I think they'll make a decision eventually either way, it's a lot to ask of people. Some people don't get out much anyway and find this easy.

I lived off running, walking and cycling for exercise, im doing all that at brief times inside the 2km limit and I am finding it hard, there's no point lieing to make friend with you guys. I know people out there are in worse positions. I have a lot on my plate with vulnerable people in my own house. It's hard to cope at the moment. Take away exercise and I'd be unbearable. I'd find it very very hard.

In Spain they weren't allowing people walk, but you could walk your dog.... Dogs will have more right to life in that situation.

We have a sad situation developing, we are only at the start, everyone needs to work hard, keep to the 2km and get some fresh air. I think most people are doing it with some exceptions who you'll never tame. I ask you please don't look for a hard lockdown, we are doing well now.

That's not true for Spain. You are allowed walk within ten minutes of your home for essential reasons.

My wife and kids are currently in lockdown there, trust me when I say I know the situation there.

s1ippy

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Depends, how many suicides left notes?

How many homeless and alcoholic as a result of losing everything?

Just because it can't be put on a death certificate doesn't mean it wasn't a factor

Tonnes of women getting their heads kicked in right now across the country and indeed across the globe due to lockdown. Three dead women in the papers the last two days in the UK and Ireland. I'm not saying that this means we should lessen the restrictions, it's just another cause of death which will go unreported and unattributed to all this carnage.

lalababa

I think that if serious/critical (probably icu ventilator type scenario) type cases don't rise above 400 before Easter then there will be a relaxation on the 2km rule & maybe also a relaxation on DIY/Gardening stores. A further 2 weeks after that on the 28th of April if icus are 400 or less then some more jobs would be let back such as construction workers, and maybe a little derestriction of cocooning.
2 weeks later on 12th May, if Icus less than 400- some more jobs let back/end of cocooning. All the while a massive roll out of testing and antibody testing.
2 weeks later on 26 May some more jobs back and some seemingly essential things to go ahead... such as social distance exams, sports events behind closed doors etc.

s1ippy

s1ippy wrote: »

Tonnes of women getting their heads kicked in right now across the country and indeed across the globe due to lockdown. Three dead women in the papers the last two days in the UK and Ireland. I'm not saying that this means we should lessen the restrictions, it's just another cause of death which will go unreported and unattributed to all this carnage.

Due to the lockdown? No, due to their partners being abusive scum! There's many more not getting beaten by their partners.

I get your point though

GT89

GT89 wrote: »

Should relax the restrictions on unaccompanied drivers temporarily

No, they shouldn't. Your not qualified to drive. Simple as.

If there's a boom of transport at the end of this and not enough pilots, would we let unlicensed trainees fly?

brick tamland

These restrictions are not about getting the cases down to 0 or getting rid of the disease. Thats not happening. This is probably here to stay for a while yet.

Cases just need to be brought down to a level the health service can handle and thrm with then mitigating factors introduced to keep them low, then restrictions will be eased.

So when number come fown a little and we have in place....

*Full testing procedures ( we're not where government want to be yet )
*Extensive contact tracing team in place
*HSE in a better place to handle numbers
* Reckon there well be a tracing smartphone app like in Asia

Older and vulnerable may still have to cocoon

Whens that going to happen is hard to tell, my guess 2 more weeks after easter. They may have to be brought back in if number raise for a period and then back down again. These restrictions will not be long term as the longer they go on the less they are abided by and become a bit pointless.

facehugger99

The restrictions will be extended for a further 2 weeks on Easter Sunday. After that they will start to be relaxed.

The penny will start to drop that continuing in a state of shutdown is ultimately more damaging and just prolonging the inevitable.

The death toll will be between 1-2%, primarily concentrated among the very, very old and very, very sick. It will be near negligible among other demographics,

Even so, the damage to the economy will take may years to recover.

BanditLuke

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I'd go with the end of July for the beginning of relaxing measures across Europe and in Ireland and the middle of 2021 to see a return to normality.

No government is going to relax the measures so long as the threat of a renewed explosion in cases is there.

Because we will just be shut down again within a week.

A lot of unrealistic expectations around.

Absolutely and that's the worry. A lot of people still with their head buried deep in the sand thinking restrictions wil be lifted by May/June :rolleyes:

People need to mentally prepare themselves for the long haul.

BanditLuke

Speakerboxx wrote: »

I think we have turned the corner and normality starts in 2 weeks. We be fine. In anothet month we wont be even talking about covid 19.

Ladies and gentlemen the president of Belarus Alexander Lukashenko.

ZX7R

The covid-19 sub committee chaired by our fine leo.
Are meeting today to discuss the current restrictions.
I'm sure we will find out what will be happening later

easypazz

BanditLuke wrote: »

Absolutely and that's the worry. A lot of people still with their head buried deep in the sand thinking restrictions wil be lifted by May/June :rolleyes:

People need to mentally prepare themselves for the long haul.

Not a hope. Another few weeks and people will have had enough.

We will all do our bit for a few weeks, if it works it works, but if not something has to give.

It will come down to the body count, big numbers will scare people, small numbers and people will be asking questions.

Jim Gazebo

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

That's not true for Spain. You are allowed walk within ten minutes of your home for essential reasons.

My wife and kids are currently in lockdown there, trust me when I say I know the situation there.

Oh that's good. I had read in the news that you weren't allowed only to walk the dog. Don't read the news I suppose. I hope they are coping ok.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

It's more about number of new and active cases than deaths. Also key is HSE capacity: how many sick people require ICU care and hour many ICU beds and staff are there available.

Get that under control and you'll see restrictions eased, but with an appeal to common sense: don't go crazy and all head to the same shops at the same time.

suicide_circus

i think sedatives would make this a lot easier

niallo27

BanditLuke wrote: »

Absolutely and that's the worry. A lot of people still with their head buried deep in the sand thinking restrictions wil be lifted by May/June :rolleyes:

People need to mentally prepare themselves for the long haul.

People dont have their heads buried in the sand believe me, people that want restrictions lifted want it for social and economic reasons not because they think this virus will have disappeared. You could say that people who think we can isolate like this for months have their heads stuck in the sand and are completely out of touch with reality.

marno21

The effectiveness of the restrictions is already under pressure in Italy. They are roughly 4 weeks in. It does take its toll on people

The idea that we’re going to have this level of restriction for 12 months is laughable. These restrictions should last a few weeks and be lifted slowly.

The whole country can’t go on unemployment for 12 months. The economy would collapse and the country would go broke. If that happened the death rate and absolute havoc caused would far outweigh the coronavirus effects on its own

This is about balance and a balance has to be struck. Extremism in either direction will not work.

Blueshoe

Restrictions must stay in place until new cases drop almost fully away. China did it and that's the rough model being followed by most countries.
I personally know someone in Paris who hasn't been outside in 3 weeks.
It's been a week or so here. I feel there is a long way to go yet.

People need to pull themselves together and deal with it. There are millions and millions around the world in the same position.

AdamD

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

No, they shouldn't. Your not qualified to drive. Simple as.

If there's a boom of transport at the end of this and not enough pilots, would we let unlicensed trainees fly?

You've just equated untrained pilots flying hundreds of people through the sky with a learner driver using a car unaccompanied. Well done, just take a minute to think about that one.

GreeBo

jayp2020 wrote: »

For people who live alone and/or are cocooning they're not seeing another person from one end of the week to the next. That's kind of a big deal really. If that's extended for months it's basically a big social experiment that could have dire results for people's mental health.

Not practicing social distancing could also have dire results for people health...it could have dire results for even more people than the person impacted by social isolation.

So do you worry about 1 persons potential mental health impact, or the multiple people that this 1 person could infect ?

Jim Gazebo

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

Oh that's good. I had read in the news that you weren't allowed only to walk the dog. Don't read the news I suppose. I hope they are coping ok.

i think those more serious restrictions are in Italy not Spain.
I heard of a guy in Sicily who was so desperate for exercise that he walked his chicken on a lead!!:D
Needless to say him and his chicken were frogmarched back home !