Creche charging for child's place during closure.

GreeBo

lawred2 wrote: »

Not remotely the same thing.

This would be more like the landlord asking you out as they wanted use for six months. But they still wanted you to keep paying full rent so you could move back in in six months time.

This is not the same as a taking your kids out on holidays and expecting the creche to reduce fees because of your own decisions.

A balance needs to be found here. Our creche wants full fees in perpetuity to hold places. Yet we know all staff have been let go already.

You're ok with that. We're not.

Let's leave it there.

The creche arent asking you out, the government has ordered creches to be closed.

I'm not "ok with that" by the way, but I think expecting the creche to keep you a place when you arbitrarily decide to stop paying them is crazy.

lawred2

GreeBo wrote: »

The creche arent asking you out, the government has ordered creches to be closed.

I'm not "ok with that" by the way, but I think expecting the creche to keep you a place when you arbitrarily decide to stop paying them is crazy.

And that's why I said there needs to be a balance. Not 100% fees on threat of losing a place while they've no staff costs of their own.

GreeBo

lawred2 wrote: »

And that's why I said there needs to be a balance. Not 100% fees on threat of losing a place while they've no staff costs of their own.

Not all creches have laid off their staff, mine hasnt for example.

argentum

I think first of all that so many people have lost their jobs that all creche places wont be needed when this is over.
The knock on effect of it all is that some creches wont reopen at all as either they'll be empty or the staff wont go back .
I'd be pissed off if i paid full fees and the creche just closed and left you in the lurch anyway.
You'll be way down the list of creditors

lawred2

GreeBo wrote: »

Not all creches have laid off their staff, mine hasnt for example.

And that's great.

Ours has not. Hence our reluctance to keep handing over fees for a full service we're not in receipt of.

I don't know. Maybe I'm being unreasonable expecting some sort of recognition of that reality from the creche.

tart29016

Has anyone been told if full fee is not paid until a certain time then they will use the deposit to cover the fees.

We got their email yesterday to that effect.

I've checked the terms & conditions and do not see any clause allowing them to do that.

GreeBo

lawred2 wrote: »

And that's great.

Ours has not. Hence our reluctance to keep handing over fees for a full service we're not in receipt of.

I don't know. Maybe I'm being unreasonable expecting some sort of recognition of that reality from the creche.

I'd certainly have expected them to have contacted parents at this stage, even if you dont like what they tell you.

pc7

Still waiting to hear from our Creche (large chain), I'd hazard a guess that they will want and try to charge us full fees. I know the staff are paid until the end of the month. It was announced today that rates can be put off for 3 months, so take that off and then if they tell staff to sign on they can feck off. I would pay a fee per month to hold places, but if they want full fee I'll roll the dice and take the chance. It could be months before they reopen. We could be down to 1 wage next month so I can't sustain that.

AulWan

Heres just a wild and crazy thought.

What if creche owners arranged for their employees to mind 1/2 of their regular kids each in their own homes, creche keeps paying minder, parent keeps paying fees?

For those who still need the service, obviously.

I don't know if it would be workable, but it would help out frontline staff at least, like those working here?

And push less of it under the table.

(eta) Non high risk staff only (obviously) - and alternatively they could mind in the child's home, while still being paid by the creche.. surely some work around can be found for at least some cases?

mloc123

pc7 wrote: »

Still waiting to hear from our Creche (large chain), I'd hazard a guess that they will want and try to charge us full fees. I know the staff are paid until the end of the month. It was announced today that rates can be put off for 3 months, so take that off and then if they tell staff to sign on they can feck off. I would pay a fee per month to hold places, but if they want full fee I'll roll the dice and take the chance. It could be months before they reopen. We could be down to 1 wage next month so I can't sustain that.

Giraffe by any chance?

HelgaWard

Ww got an e-mail from our creche yesterday to say they will not be charging fees.

neris

Insurance would be an issue for a start

AulWan wrote: »

Heres just a wild and crazy thought.

What if creche owners arranged for their employees to mind 1/2 of their regular kids each in their own homes, creche keeps paying minder, parent keeps paying fees?

For those who still need the service, obviously.

I don't know if it would be workable, but it would help out frontline staff at least, like those working here?

And push less of it under the table.

(eta) Non high risk staff only (obviously) - and alternatively they could mind in the child's home, while still being paid by the creche.. surely some work around can be found for at least some cases?

AulWan

neris wrote: »

Insurance would be an issue for a start

You're right.

****ing insurance.

Always a stumbling block.

Markcheese

What are the main expenses for a creche ,
staff .. obviously ,most got let go last week are on welfare ,they should be collecting last week's wages this week (week in hand )
Food costs are nill,
Insurance is still a cost
Licences for soft ware ,and fees for ongoing professional services are gonna be mainly the same .. rates .. a lot of council's are waving them ...
Rent and or loans ,it's up to the owner to negotiate with their bank and landlord ... But it'd be a pretty ****ty land lord who'd try dump a decent tenant with a recession on the way

Ultimately, imo if they're not providing the service ,they shouldnt be charging .. hard on the owners and staff .. but this whole thing is hard on loads of people ...

salmocab

Markcheese wrote: »

What are the main expenses for a creche ,
staff .. obviously ,most got let go last week are on welfare ,they should be collecting last week's wages this week (week in hand )
Food costs are nill,
Insurance is still a cost
Licences for soft ware ,and fees for ongoing professional services are gonna be mainly the same .. rates .. a lot of council's are waving them ...
Rent and or loans ,it's up to the owner to negotiate with their bank and landlord ... But it'd be a pretty ****ty land lord who'd try dump a decent tenant with a recession on the way

Ultimately, imo if they're not providing the service ,they shouldnt be charging .. hard on the owners and staff .. but this whole thing is hard on loads of people ...

Were most let go last week? Most I know of but certainly not all have not let staff go yet, some are doing reduced wages.
There is also ongoing bills for electricity and gas.

murphyebass

lawred2 wrote: »

So extortion then?

How exactly is it extortion for a business to drop places of anyone who doesn’t pay them?

Plenty of others will take your place if you choose not to pay.

Their crèche, their rules. You don’t like it, find a crèche that you do like the rules of.

I honestly can’t get over the entitlement that people feel they have in relation to this topic. Mental stuff.

lawred2

murphyebass wrote: »

How exactly is it extortion for a business to drop places of anyone who doesn’t pay them?

Plenty of others will take your place if you choose not to pay.

Their crèche, their rules. You don’t like it, find a crèche that you do like the rules of.

I honestly can’t get over the entitlement that people feel they have in relation to this topic. Mental stuff.

Pfffft

It's an entitlement now to expect a service in return for a service charge?

Do one pal.

murphyebass

lawred2 wrote: »

Pfffft

It's an entitlement now to expect a service in return for a service charge?

Do one pal.

You have an entitlement to go elsewhere if you’re not happy with having to pay for a service YOU agreed to pay for.

Also attack the post not the poster. Post reported.

lawred2

murphyebass wrote: »

You have an entitlement to go elsewhere if you’re not happy with having to pay for a service YOU agreed to pay for.

Also attack the post not the poster. Post reported.

Nobody agreed to pay for a service they weren't in receipt of. Where did you get that falsehood from?

Report away. As if your own non generic post wasn't personal. Give me a break.

Daz_

Looks to me that anyone agreeing that Crèches should charge full fees have some connection with one .

Markcheese

salmocab wrote: »

Were most let go last week? Most I know of but certainly not all have not let staff go yet, some are doing reduced wages.
There is also ongoing bills for electricity and gas.

The electricity and gas bills will be fairly low ( but still there) if the building is empty,the lights will be off ,the computers off ,the heating off ...

If they're paying all their staff full whack then maybe theres a case some charging ...

El Gato De Negocios

murphyebass wrote: »

How exactly is it extortion for a business to drop places of anyone who doesn’t pay them?

Plenty of others will take your place if you choose not to pay.

Their crèche, their rules. You don’t like it, find a crèche that you do like the rules of.

I honestly can’t get over the entitlement that people feel they have in relation to this topic. Mental stuff.

It kind of is tbh, whether you like it or not. And its hardly entitlement. We are paying €1600 a month, if our creche tells us we are expected to pay full fees next month but they wont be open and if we dont, we lose the place, what would you call it?

Creches have a captive market. We are saving for a house so cannot afford for one of us not to work, many other families are the same.

As I said previously, I'd have no problem making partial payment to hold our spot but being forced ie having no other option, to pay full fee for a service we cannot avail of, well that's pretty shytty behaviour.

rosmoke

That's like paying for a pizza but instead I'm not getting one as they don't serve pizza.
Who comes up with the idea of paying for a service they can't provide?
It just blows my mind.

It's not my responsibility how they pay their staff, it's not my business to think about their profits or revenue.
There are many people that are going to lose their jobs as companies are too greedy or just not profitable enough to put away rainy funds and they can avail of social services.

I am sorry but this is my opinion and from reading through the posts here it appears that some creches charge parents the full whack and still don't pay employees.

thomas 123

murphyebass wrote: »

Plenty of others will take your place if you choose not to

I honestly can’t get over the entitlement that people feel they have in relation to this topic. Mental stuff
.

Who’s going to take the places and start paying when someone else stops?

I think you’ll find the entitlement is coming from crèches not parents, most of whom are or will be on the breadline in the coming weeks.

murphyebass

thomas 123 wrote: »

Who’s going to take the places and start paying when someone else stops?
.

I take it you don’t live in Dublin. It’s as bad as school here for places in crèches.

Ultimately it’s their business, they can run it how they like and if someone doesn’t like it they have the choice to leave and go elsewhere. Nobody is forcing a person not to cancel their standing order and go elsewhere.

Crèches have insurance, staff costs etc whether you have a child / children are there or not.

A lot of the people here and elsewhere who say “but they’re not paying their staff”, what actual evidence of this do you have? All antidotal hearsay or what someone wants to think as it suits their situation. ie. not wanting to pay.

The insurance is probably the biggest cost though out of anything here so unless the government steps in and pays that for all the crèches (never going to happen) I don’t see why they wouldn’t expect payment.

For the record I do not own or know anyone involve in the industry. This isn’t an alias account. It’s my only boards account. Check my posts.

Daz_

murphyebass wrote: »

I take it you don’t live in Dublin. It’s as bad as school here for places in crèches.

Ultimately it’s their business, they can run it how they like and if someone doesn’t like it they have the choice to leave and go elsewhere. Nobody is forcing a person not to cancel their standing order and go elsewhere.

Crèches have insurance, staff costs etc whether you have a child / children are there or not.

A lot of the people here and elsewhere who say “but they’re not paying their staff”, what actual evidence of this do you have? All antidotal hearsay or what someone wants to think as it suits their situation. ie. not wanting to pay.

The insurance is probably the biggest cost though out of anything here so unless the government steps in and pays that for all the crèches (never going to happen) I don’t see why they wouldn’t expect payment.

For the record I do not own or know anyone involve in the industry. This isn’t an alias account. It’s my only boards account. Check my posts.

You come across very passionate in defensive of the Crèche to be honest .
Unusual for someone to be like that about a topic unless they have some connection .

thomas 123

murphyebass wrote: »

I take it you don’t live in Dublin. It’s as bad as school here for places in crèches.

Ultimately it’s their business, they can run it how they like and if someone doesn’t like it they have the choice to leave and go elsewhere. Nobody is forcing a person not to cancel their standing order and go elsewhere.

Crèches have insurance, staff costs etc whether you have a child / children are there or not.

A lot of the people here and elsewhere who say “but they’re not paying their staff”, what actual evidence of this do you have? All antidotal hearsay or what someone wants to think as it suits their situation. ie. not wanting to pay.

The insurance is probably the biggest cost though out of anything here so unless the government steps in and pays that for all the crèches (never going to happen) I don’t see why they wouldn’t expect payment.

For the record I do not own or know anyone involve in the industry. This isn’t an alias account. It’s my only boards account. Check my posts.

I mean to say while crèches are closed who is going to take on a place?

Also can’t you cancel insurance and then get it again?

Sleeper12

lawred2 wrote:

Nobody agreed to pay for a service they weren't in receipt of. Where did you get that falsehood from?

Whilst I don't agree with the charge nor the charge for the Christmas holiday these charges are in many of the contracts that parents signed. So in reality plenty of pare did agree to pay for a service that they won't get.

Have you looked at your own contract? You might find that you have agreed to this too

Daz_

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Whilst I don't agree with the charge nor the charge for the Christmas holiday these charges are in many of the contracts that parents signed. So in reality plenty of pare did agree to pay for a service that they won't get.

Have you looked at your own contract? You might find that you have agreed to this too

Don’t think anyone minds paying for Christmas - staff have to get paid hols too.

Ridiculous comparison to be honest .

lawred2

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Whilst I don't agree with the charge nor the charge for the Christmas holiday these charges are in many of the contracts that parents signed. So in reality plenty of pare did agree to pay for a service that they won't get.

Have you looked at your own contract? You might find that you have agreed to this too

Not the same thing.