Creche charging for child's place during closure.

GreeBo

AdMMM wrote: »

You're coming at this from a really strange way. It's certainly not a black and white situation.

Would I expect a creche to keep a place for my child if I told them to go **** themselves and cancelled my direct debit? No, I wouldn't.

However, if I engaged with them, explained that we were both heavily affected by this but would be in a position to confirm either way once reopening dates are confirmed and we all know more about our own job situation? Yes, I would. Or at the very least come to some arrangement that suits us all.

But why is it a strang way?
The creche exists to make money, if you stop paying them because you cant afford it, why would they keep your child a place after this is all over?

Think of it from their point of view for a minute, many of the people who cant/wont pay will continue to not be able to pay after this is over, the creche only is perfectly entitled to give that place to another looking.

CaoinDory

GreeBo wrote: »

But why is it a strang way?
The creche exists to make money, if you stop paying them because you cant afford it, why would they keep your child a place after this is all over?

Think of it from their point of view for a minute, many of the people who cant/wont pay will continue to not be able to pay after this is over, the creche only is perfectly entitled to give that place to another looking.

The creche is shut. Right now it has no expenses right now surely?
Staff in many other creches have been told to sign on.

No child should lose their place during this crisis. And if they did, I would have that facitlity up in court.

salmocab

CaoinDory wrote: »

The creche is shut. Right now it has no expenses right now surely?
Staff in many other creches have been told to sign on.

No child should lose their place during this crisis. And if they did, I would have that facitlity up in court.

Of course they have expenses

CaoinDory

salmocab wrote: »

Of course they have expenses

Heating is not on.
Electricty is not being used.
No staff to pay.
Nothing in the facility is in use...

And regardless of all this, It is the creches choice to close - well government- not the parents. If they choose to shut its doors, the family can not be held accountable. No way should the family have to pay!

Seriously what world are you living in?

AdMMM

GreeBo wrote: »

But why is it a strang way?
The creche exists to make money, if you stop paying them because you cant afford it, why would they keep your child a place after this is all over?

Think of it from their point of view for a minute, many of the people who cant/wont pay will continue to not be able to pay after this is over, the creche only is perfectly entitled to give that place to another looking.

It's a strange way because these are unprecedented circumstances and if you outwardly have the attitude of trying to make as much money as possible, then it will end badly for you.

But to at least entertain your idea... there are tonnes of risks associated with immediately cutting a child's place. You lose out on any potential revenue you would have got from that family while that crisis goes on (and it is likely going to be months) and you also run into a similar problem with your entire waiting list. Can they afford creche when everything is over? They'll also be on multiple lists, so once this has all shaken out, you'll be offering places to families who a) will change their mind and b) might not be able to afford it.

Dobbit

I use two different creches for my kids for reasons and one has suspended the april payment and the other is hounding me for it. I'm really torn on it, I don't want to see the girls out of pocket but it's a lot of money when job security is an issue (we haven't been let go but our places of work have been impacted like everyone nearly). They don't seem willing to really engage on it, just reminding us to pay up. I haven't yet, waiting to see what Leo and co say.

salmocab

CaoinDory wrote: »

Heating is not on.
Electricty is not being used.
No staff to pay.
Nothing in the facility is in use...

And regardless of all this, It is the creches choice to close - well government- not the parents. If they choose to shut its doors, the family can not be held accountable. No way should the family have to pay!

Seriously what world are you living in?

Heating may be off, electricity is certainly being used and gas and electricity have standing charges, services like alarms have to paid as does rent and loans of course they have outgoings.

jlm29

sphinxicus wrote: »

The crazy thing is... some staff are now minding the same parents children in their homes and taking cash ontop of their wages while the creches are closed.

I know someone who’s paying €60/day to someone who works in the crèche she uses. I don’t think she’s paying crèche fees, but she knows that that girl is also getting benefit, so Is probably getting a nice bit more than usual.

CaoinDory

Dobbit wrote: »

I use two different creches for my kids for reasons and one has suspended the april payment and the other is hounding me for it. I'm really torn on it, I don't want to see the girls out of pocket but it's a lot of money when job security is an issue (we haven't been let go but our places of work have been impacted like everyone nearly). They don't seem willing to really engage on it, just reminding us to pay up. I haven't yet, waiting to see what Leo and co say.

The girls can sign on and be taken back when everything is operating again. This is what happens in playschools and creches that are term time. Its not rocket science.

CaoinDory

salmocab wrote: »

Heating may be off, electricity is certainly being used and gas and electricity have standing charges, services like alarms have to paid as does rent and loans of course they have outgoings.

And the rest of my post???

Leroy42

salmocab wrote: »

Heating may be off, electricity is certainly being used and gas and electricity have standing charges, services like alarms have to paid as does rent and loans of course they have outgoings.

And that is exactly why they are allowed to keep the profits when they make them.

This is putting the covering of risks bank onto the customers. If they were paying solely for the costs the creche were having to pay fair enough, but there are government supports (ie up to €203 per week to staff rather than let them go) which the company will receive back. Is that being taken into account?

If the economic hit is as predicted then creche places won't be a problem in the next few months. That exact creche maybe, but there are others.

It is the companies responsibility to look after their staff, not the customers. If you are the creche owner, surely you would not want to let good staff go and then struggle to get staff again?

salmocab

CaoinDory wrote: »

And the rest of my post???

What about it? I said of course they have expenses that’s all. You went off on one about something I didn’t mention so I don’t see why you expect me to have something to say about it.

CaoinDory

salmocab wrote: »

What about it? I said of course they have expenses that’s all. You went off on one about something I didn’t mention so I don’t see why you expect me to have something to say about it.

Fair point. Sorry I thought you were someone else.

dubrov

I received notice today that no fees would be taken from April 1st until the creche reopens.

pc7

dubrov wrote: »

I received notice today that no fees would be taken from April 1st until the creche reopens.

Is it a small creche or chain can I ask

dubrov

Small chain numbering around 2-5 locations

Markcheese

neris wrote: »

I know of staff from abroad in creches who thought this was a holiday and have gone back to visit family and now dont know when they,ll b back. Even though the company never put them on lay off and told them to be available for work

I know of Spanish childcare workers who went home last Monday ... They were concerned for their families in Spain ,and didn't want to face the prospect of being in self isolation here on their own ..

Daz_

Markcheese wrote: »

I know of Spanish childcare workers who went home last Monday ... They were concerned for their families in Spain ,and didn't want to face the prospect of being in self isolation here on their own ..

So another reason why people shouldn’t be paying full fees .

mirrorwall14

I’ve emailed all my local TDs seeing if there is any discussion going on. Probably not but it’s a big bill, it’s worth asking I guess. I was supposed to have surgery for suspected endometriosis next month but without childcare we aren’t going to be able to do it. And forking over for additional childcare with the uncertainty around jobs doesn’t seem wise. I’ll have to live with the pain for another few months until we are more sure of things

GreeBo

Leroy42 wrote: »

And that is exactly why they are allowed to keep the profits when they make them.

This is putting the covering of risks bank onto the customers. If they were paying solely for the costs the creche were having to pay fair enough, but there are government supports (ie up to €203 per week to staff rather than let them go) which the company will receive back. Is that being taken into account?

If the economic hit is as predicted then creche places won't be a problem in the next few months. That exact creche maybe, but there are others.

It is the companies responsibility to look after their staff, not the customers. If you are the creche owner, surely you would not want to let good staff go and then struggle to get staff again?

The profits that they earn based on people paying their fees every month you mean?

Daz_

GreeBo wrote: »

The profits that they earn based on people paying their fees every month you mean?

So they they don’t make big profits for a few months - deal with it

We are all taking a hit here .

They are still getting the Govt subsidy as I’m sure you are fully aware .

GreeBo

Daz_ wrote: »

So they they don’t make big profits for a few months - deal with it

We are all taking a hit here .

They are still getting the Govt subsidy as I’m sure you are fully aware .

Ahh that old chestnut.
"Fat Cat Creche Owners" huh?

We will all have to "deal with it" if your creche goes out of business won't we though?

Leroy42

GreeBo wrote: »

Ahh that old chestnut.
"Fat Cat Creche Owners" huh?

We will all have to "deal with it" if your creche goes out of business won't we though?

It's not about them earning super profits, but the risk reward is that if they make profits they get to keep them. And nobody argues any different.

The risk is that if they don't make money they have to deal with it. Charging customers so no service is not part of the deal merely shifting the risk, but not the reward.

To be fair, before the parents take the hit, all prior profits should be put back, then risk/reward is fair.

Leroy42

GreeBo wrote: »

Ahh that old chestnut.
"Fat Cat Creche Owners" huh?

We will all have to "deal with it" if your creche goes out of business won't we though?

It's not about them earning super profits, but the risk reward is that if they make profits they get to keep them. And nobody argues any different.

The risk is that if they don't make money they have to deal with it. Charging customers so no service is not part of the deal merely shifting the risk, but not the reward.

To be fair, before the parents take the hit, all prior profits should be put back, then risk/reward is fair.

Leroy42

GreeBo wrote: »

The profits that they earn based on people paying their fees every month you mean?

Exactly, based on providing a service.

They now want to make super profits based on no service.

Daz_

GreeBo wrote: »

Ahh that old chestnut.
"Fat Cat Creche Owners" huh?

We will all have to "deal with it" if your creche goes out of business won't we though?

You seem very excited and into exaggeration.

Where did I say “Fat Cat “ crèche owners to use your own words ?

Del Griffith

Got a mail today asking everyone to pay the full amount for April, this is a 9-12:30 Montessori.

The One Doctor

We got s text from our crèche saying that they were asking us to keep paying as they were paying their staff. Fair enough, it's a great crèche and the child benefit covers the costs anyway. Worth it.

pc7

The One Doctor wrote: »

We got s text from our crèche saying that they were asking us to keep paying as they were paying their staff. Fair enough, it's a great crèche and the child benefit covers the costs anyway. Worth it.

Wow must be very cheap, are you based outside Dublin?

GreeBo

Daz_ wrote: »

You seem very excited and into exaggeration.

Where did I say “Fat Cat “ crèche owners to use your own words ?

Yes I'm terribly excited... :rolleyes:

You want it both ways, you cancel your agreement to keep paying them yet they have to honor the agreement to keep a place for your child.

When questioned as to why your answer is that they should simply "deal with it".