VW ID.4

the_amazing_raisin · 22-04-2021 9:42am

I've finally got a VIN, hopefully my car is approaching something car shaped!

gear_ie · 22-04-2021 10:11am

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

I've finally got a VIN, hopefully my car is approaching something car shaped!

Got mine too... and got told it has left the factory...

Redderneck · 22-04-2021 10:12am

Can't help feeling a sinking pit in my stomach when reading all about the wonders of software updates on a device that isn't a Euro 300-400 low-mid range mobile phone. You lads who have bought, clearly have a far higher appetite for risk than I do; and certainly far more tolerance than I'd have, having shelled out on a big-ticket item. Guess every market needs its early adopters, fair dues lads.

I've always been of the plan your exit before you go in line of thinking. Nobody gives much of a fiddlers about the resale value of their smartphone. But a car?

I've never leased, or PCP'd. For 30 years now I've either saved or saved/borrowed and bought. But the resale market has generally had some predictability built into it. So much uncertainty involved now, the only way that seems to make sense is to go the leasing route. Modern cars really are merely channels for finance companies to access our bank accounts on a tied-in monthly basis.

I don't bloody like it. Bah humbug.

Enyaq for me FWIW, even if they are being cheeky on their pricing. Will be keen on seeing the new Kia effort too.

liamog · 22-04-2021 10:25am

Redderneck wrote: »

Enyaq for me FWIW, even if they are being cheeky on their pricing. Will be keen on seeing the new Kia effort too.

The Enyaq will follow the same model of software updates

the_amazing_raisin · 22-04-2021 10:27am

Redderneck wrote: »

Can't help feeling a sinking pit in my stomach when reading all about the wonders of software updates on a device that isn't a Euro 300-400 low-mid range mobile phone. You lads who have bought, clearly have a far higher appetite for risk than I do; and certainly far more tolerance than I'd have, having shelled out on a big-ticket item. Guess every market needs its early adopters, fair dues lads.

I've always been of the plan your exit before you go in line of thinking. Nobody gives much of a fiddlers about the resale value of their smartphone. But a car?

I've never leased, or PCP'd. For 30 years now I've either saved or saved/borrowed and bought. But the resale market has generally had some predictability built into it. So much uncertainty involved now, the only way that seems to make sense is to go the leasing route. Modern cars really are merely channels for finance companies to access our bank accounts on a tied-in monthly basis.

I don't bloody like it. Bah humbug.

Enyaq for me FWIW, even if they are being cheeky on their pricing. Will be keen on seeing the new Kia effort too.

I get what you're saying, but the unfortunate reality is that for many buying a new car for cash is unrealistic. Leasing would have been tempting but I doubt the monthly payment would work out cheaper and at least with a PCP or HP you can own a car at the end

Software has been a risk in cars for years, they've been installing microcontrollers on cars since the 90s and the number of programmable components is only going up. At least with OTA updates it's easier to fix things, rather than having to bring the car into the dealership

I agree that VW did a poor job with the software on the ID cars. It was lagging behind, the cars needed to be sold, so they released an unfinished version of the software. This was the deal the early ID.3 owners got and they got incentives to compensate for it

The good thing is that VW have committed to updates, so it's not something that is permanently broken, it can be fixed and the process of updating should be relatively simple. We'll just have to wait and see how the first few OTA updates go

I think the Hyundai/Kia EVs are going to be great, based on the job they did with the E-Niro. I do think they'll be a rarity item for 2021 and possibly 2022 as they ramp up supply

If I didn't need a bigger car now then I'd be seriously tempted to wait and get an Ioniq 5

slave1 · 22-04-2021 10:48am

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

Software has been a risk in cars for years, they've been installing microcontrollers on cars since the 90s and the number of programmable components is only going up. At least with OTA updates it's easier to fix things, rather than having to bring the car into the dealership

Nissan Leaf is rock solid, never an issue, when you read about these VW issues a full decade later it really makes you appreciate the Leaf and how good it was/is for the era.

cannco253 · 22-04-2021 11:23am

eh my 2016 Leaf had the brakes fail....then the main battery started having issues. Even though it was within the 8yr battery warranty Nissan Ireland refused to fix it, claiming it was wear and tear.

No car is perfect

deravarra · 22-04-2021 11:32am

cannco253 wrote: »

Even though it was within the 8yr battery warranty Nissan Ireland refused to fix it, claiming it was wear and tear.

The very same as "unlimited broadband" and "fair usage applies"

aka - "you'll be grand, until there's an issue"

the_amazing_raisin · 22-04-2021 12:16pm

slave1 wrote: »

Nissan Leaf is rock solid, never an issue, when you read about these VW issues a full decade later it really makes you appreciate the Leaf and how good it was/is for the era.

While the Leaf has it's shortcomings (long trips being the obvious one) it is pretty amazing how Nissan were doing things with the Leaf in 2011 that other manufacturers struggle with today

Charging timers would seem to be the pertinent example for the ID cars

forumdedum · 22-04-2021 12:39pm

Bought brand new Audi A4. After a few years clutch went. Normal enough sometimes of course. However, having browsed car/Audi forums I discovered it was a common issue. At the time Audi were experimenting with a hydraulic clutch and that there were a lot of problems. However, Audi would never admit to this. It was a €3,000 job.

When the car broke down I was tempted to pay the tow truck driving extra money to drive around for a day so everyone could see a reasonably new Audi. I would never buy another Audi (yes i know the VW connection)

Redderneck · 22-04-2021 3:08pm

The thing that is so hard to wrap the head around for me is the sheer pace of change, in something which is such a big ticket expense. We're definitely approaching the "pay your monthly sub and climb in" realm - which Volvo have already had a stab at.

If you are opting for something today, the risk that the market will have moved on so much by the time it comes to change, that someone - you/dealer/distributor/manufacturer/finance house (or combo therof) are going to be left with a serious headache given where the resale value could end up, is just properly scary.

I've gone from thinking 2 years ago that based on family variables/driving profiles, the reasonable plan would be to retain one IC car and explore hybrid for purchase of the next 'other' car in the household, to thinking that other next car could be a PHEV about a year ago, to now thinking it'll be an EV; and fast approaching the dump the IC one in favour of 2 EVs (or just the one, if working from home sticks).

It's going to be a fascinating ride over the next decade. My money is on a lovely yet to be designed by Huawei, styled by Brabus, delivered by Eirtricity, Gobsheen GTX.

Padraig Mor · 22-04-2021 4:51pm

Finally got confirmation re pricing etc for the service plans - the L package at €18 per month is a no brainer given it includes tyres. Screenshot from dealer:

Black_Knight · 22-04-2021 6:40pm

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Finally got confirmation re pricing etc for the service plans - the L package at €18 per month is a no brainer given it includes tyres. Screenshot from dealer:

Cheers!

Makes you worry what the 2 year service cost will be. The most basic seems expensive for an EV. The most expensive is great value only because of the tyres. It does suggest the service plans are no longer valid (31-03-21)

the_amazing_raisin · 22-04-2021 8:21pm

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Finally got confirmation re pricing etc for the service plans - the L package at €18 per month is a no brainer given it includes tyres. Screenshot from dealer:

Is that a new set of tyres every 2 years? It doesn't really say

Still a bit of a rip off if your mileage is below 15,000km per year I reckon, doubt you'll be needing a new set of tyres in the first 4 years anyway

Black_Knight · 22-04-2021 9:48pm

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

Is that a new set of tyres every 2 years? It doesn't really say

Still a bit of a rip off if your mileage is below 15,000km per year I reckon, doubt you'll be needing a new set of tyres in the first 4 years anyway

Check the cost of tyres. ~€200 a corner if you buy them yourself (for good tyres). 2 years on bridgestones you'd not be far off needing to replace them. Assuming they replace with premium tyres (as they should do) it's worth it.

the_amazing_raisin · 22-04-2021 10:03pm

Black_Knight wrote: »

Check the cost of tyres. ~€200 a corner if you buy them yourself (for good tyres). 2 years on bridgestones you'd not be far off needing to replace them. Assuming they replace with premium tyres (as they should do) it's worth it.

Again, depends on your mileage (and driving style). If you're doing medium to high mileage, more than 15,000km per year then you'd probably be looking at a set of tyres every 2 years

Less than that, I'd say you'd get 3 years easily enough. 4 years if you can avoid too many drag races at the traffic lights

I'm on my 3rd year with a set of budget tyres on my Leaf and they've plenty of tread left. I was doing about 12,500km per year before covid times, about half of that nowadays, so I'm expecting at least another year out of them

the_amazing_raisin · 22-04-2021 10:08pm

Black_Knight wrote: »

Cheers!

Makes you worry what the 2 year service cost will be. The most basic seems expensive for an EV. The most expensive is great value only because of the tyres. It does suggest the service plans are no longer valid (31-03-21)

Strictly speaking, if it's a 2 year service interval and a 3 year plan, then that's 1 service paid for

Pretty poor value as you say except for the L plan based on the tyres

I'm interested to see how much the service cost is without the plan

Black_Knight · 22-04-2021 10:23pm

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

Strictly speaking, if it's a 2 year service interval and a 3 year plan, then that's 1 service paid for

Pretty poor value as you say except for the L plan based on the tyres

I'm interested to see how much the service cost is without the plan

Yes I'm worried too.

Black_Knight · 22-04-2021 10:27pm

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

Again, depends on your mileage (and driving style). If you're doing medium to high mileage, more than 15,000km per year then you'd probably be looking at a set of tyres every 2 years

Less than that, I'd say you'd get 3 years easily enough. 4 years if you can avoid too many drag races at the traffic lights

I'm on my 3rd year with a set of budget tyres on my Leaf and they've plenty of tread left. I was doing about 12,500km per year before covid times, about half of that nowadays, so I'm expecting at least another year out of them

That's the difference. I'd never put budget tyres on my car. Doubt dealers would give you any guarantee what they'd put on the car after 2 years.

forumdedum · 22-04-2021 10:32pm

Back tyres on my Tiguan have done 73,000km. Continental Primacy Mark V (€190 each). Still 4mm left on them. I can't believe it.

Padraig Mor · 22-04-2021 11:07pm

Black_Knight wrote: »

Cheers!

Makes you worry what the 2 year service cost will be. The most basic seems expensive for an EV. The most expensive is great value only because of the tyres. It does suggest the service plans are no longer valid (31-03-21)

Do they even 'service' them?

Anyway, some more detail and good news. The site vwserviceplans.ie sells VW service plans (errr......hence the name) but didn't have the ID models listed as of last week. They're there now though and it gives full details and pricing. L plan is as before - €18 a month, or €648 upfront. The other ones are cheaper than what the dealer sent me though - S plan is €8 a month or €288 upfront, and M plan €14/504. Pretty big saving on the S plan. And while 288 for a service might seem a bit much, remember that includes a brake fluid change too - long time since I had one of those, but I'm reckoning €200 anyway?

Also says the plans can be bought up to two years old (before first service) and they include one year roadside assistance (although we probably have that for three years already? I actually don't even know what warranty there is on the car!).

edit: fixed link.

Padraig Mor · 22-04-2021 11:14pm

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

Again, depends on your mileage (and driving style). If you're doing medium to high mileage, more than 15,000km per year then you'd probably be looking at a set of tyres every 2 years

Less than that, I'd say you'd get 3 years easily enough. 4 years if you can avoid too many drag races at the traffic lights

Changed all four on my ex-Leaf last December at 45000 km (2.5 years) and they really needed to be changed at that stage!

Black_Knight wrote: »

That's the difference. I'd never put budget tyres on my car. Doubt dealers would give you any guarantee what they'd put on the car after 2 years.

Dunno.....I would have presumed VW would put on tyres equivalent to the OEM. Hell, even budget tyres would cost €200 a corner at 20 inch.

forumdedum wrote: »

Back tyres on my Tiguan have done 73,000km. Continental Primacy Mark V (€190 each). Still 4mm left on them. I can't believe it.

:eek: What the hell?! Most I got out of a set of tyres was ~50k on a Lexus GS300. And that was too far - got a blowout (had been keeping an eye on them, but had worn unevenly which I hadn't realised so more far gone than I thought). Had Michelins from new on a Citroen C5 back in 2008 - had to replace the fronts after ~15k km IIRC.

forumdedum · 22-04-2021 11:44pm

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Changed all four on my ex-Leaf last December at 45000 km (2.5 years) and they really needed to be changed at that stage!

Dunno.....I would have presumed VW would put on tyres equivalent to the OEM. Hell, even budget tyres would cost €200 a corner at 20 inch.

:eek: What the hell?! Most I got out of a set of tyres was ~50k on a Lexus GS300. And that was too far - got a blowout (had been keeping an eye on them, but had worn unevenly which I hadn't realised so more far gone than I thought). Had Michelins from new on a Citroen C5 back in 2008 - had to replace the fronts after ~15k km IIRC.

I know, it's crazy. I've even visited garage a few times to replace them and the guy said they're still fine, 4mm a few weeks ago. I have been buying these tyres for all of my cars for years. You know when they're on a car, super quality.

Kramer · 22-04-2021 11:49pm

Break fluid!
Break fluid!!
Break Fluid!!!

That doesn't inspire great confidence. Was that from VW?

Padraig Mor wrote: »

I rotated our Ioniq's tyres at 25k approx & all 4 were ultimately replaced at 2mm, at approx 50k km. Just over a year's driving.
Good Dunlops were €250 odd IIRC, for all four.

My 530e needs rears at 40k km & fronts look good for another 20k most likely, so 60k km.
They're €600+ per pair though :eek:.

Padraig Mor · 23-04-2021 9:09am

Kramer wrote: »

Break fluid!
Break fluid!!
Break Fluid!!!

That doesn't inspire great confidence. Was that from VW?

Yeah, from VW. Wouldn't mind, except they got it correct in some places!

My 530e needs rears at 40k km & fronts look good for another 20k most likely, so 60k km.
They're €600+ per pair though :eek:.

Cheapest premium 255/45/R20 (ID4 1st rear size) runflats on Eiretyres are €260 a corner. Add in fitting and Paddy pricing and I'd say you're easily looking at €600 for the pair on the 1st as well. That L service plan is well worth it!

declan123 · 23-04-2021 9:51am

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Yeah, from VW. Wouldn't mind, except they got it correct in some places!

Cheapest premium 255/45/R20 (ID4 1st rear size) runflats on Eiretyres are €260 a corner. Add in fitting and Paddy pricing and I'd say you're easily looking at €600 for the pair on the 1st as well. That L service plan is well worth it!

Purchased the L plan during the week, you can pay for it by month with no interest. Well worth it

TitianGerm · 23-04-2021 2:03pm

Posting this here as there's a few mentions of the ID4 in the review. He's correct that you should be at least considering the ID4 if thinking about a Tiguan.