Cork developments

0lddog

cgcsb wrote: »

And obviously Cork is only ever days behind new developments in Tokyo, Earth's largest City, that was proved when Cork recently completed it's 27th metro line obviously.

Apogee

https://twitter.com/EoinBearla/status/1384070120062873601

Mav11

Good to see that the old building is to be renovated and incorporated into the development.

marno21

Work to commence ASAP with first homes available in 2023.

https://lda.ie/lda-granted-planning-permission-for-266-homes-on-former-st-kevins-hospital-site/

Sooner the mess up there is cleared up the better. Fantastic development.

thejuggler

Are these private housing, build to let or social properties?
Hopefully it won’t end up half empty similar to the Atkins hall lee road apartment development. The stigma of its past played a part unfortunately.

opus

Some new apartments coming in Shandon as well, pretty close to where I live actually. Maybe a bit over the top for the site (an old pub) but good to see a long derelict building getting back into use.

Apartment plan gets green light for pub site despite fears it blocks views of Shandon

EnzoScifo

0lddog wrote: »

Cycle parking is charged for in some parts of Tokyo. Cant be long 'till Cork is the same

On street car parking is also illegal in Tokyo. Hopefully won't be long until Cork is the same!

Spideoige

thejuggler wrote: »

Are these private housing, build to let or social properties?
Hopefully it won’t end up half empty similar to the Atkins hall lee road apartment development. The stigma of its past played a part unfortunately.

Social and affordable housing. I hope they do strike a good balance between social and affordable housing, I would imagine their are plenty of lower income families who work in the city centre that these units would be ideal for.

opus

Great to see some redevelopment on Barrack St as it looks terrible in parts with abandoned buildings.

Development of 32 houses due to begin on Cork street this week

RINO87

thejuggler wrote: »

Are these private housing, build to let or social properties?
Hopefully it won’t end up half empty similar to the Atkins hall lee road apartment development. The stigma of its past played a part unfortunately.

No way in hell would I live in atkins hall or whatever goes into st kevin's. Both of these buildings just freak me out considering the awful, awful way the "inmates" were treated in the past. I'm not a spiritual person, but the bad vibes from those buildings are palpable.

Treehelpplease

at least with St Kevin's, pretty much all that's left is the front facade. Bad for the building, probably good for PR when getting people to live in it. Atkins Hall on the other hand looks the exact same now. the brown/black colour of Atkins Hall makes it look much more spooky though compared to the warm red brick of st kevin's which probably doesn't help AH either

the beer revolu

I got to go into Atkins Hall before it was developed and after it was closed as a "hospital".
It's was very strange and creepy. Bathroom with dozens of baths. Padded cells, just as you'd imagine them. Children's wards with Disney cartoons painted on the walls. It was horrible but I didn't say no to the offer of seeing the inside.
I was there with one other person taking photographs of the exterior when a security guard arrived. Satisfied that we weren't up to no good he offered to allow us inside. Just had a quick gander around the ground floor and got out there pretty quickly.

kub

So the proposed Retail Center for Carrigtohill will rumble on, it must be worth a fortune to Cork County Council if they are issuing Court proceedings against the Government :


Cork County Council has brought a High Court challenge to a minister's direction that it annul a change to its development plan which provides for a €100m retail "outlet centre" in the east of the county.

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40268249.html

whisky_galore

thejuggler wrote: »

Are these private housing, build to let or social properties?
Hopefully it won’t end up half empty similar to the Atkins hall lee road apartment development. The stigma of its past played a part unfortunately.

Is it still half-developed/half-derelict?
That would put me off, rats and whatever in the closed up part. Not spooks or rubbish.

I've yet to hear of any dead person hurting anybody. Plenty living will do so, and worse.

namloc1980

kub wrote: »

So the proposed Retail Center for Carrigtohill will rumble on, it must be worth a fortune to Cork County Council if they are issuing Court proceedings against the Government :


Cork County Council has brought a High Court challenge to a minister's direction that it annul a change to its development plan which provides for a €100m retail "outlet centre" in the east of the county.

https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/arid-40268249.html

They aren't going to give up on all that lovely rates and development fees money easily.

namloc1980

namloc1980 wrote: »

They aren't going to give up on all that lovely rates and development fees money easily.

After losing Douglas and Da'Collig I can't really blame them

shnaek

Deleted User wrote: »

After losing Douglas and Da'Collig I can't really blame them

Makes total sense for them to think this way. The city is becoming a place for bikes and pedestrians, so they want to hoover up the family\old people\less mobile market who will be in cars for the most part.

shnaek

shnaek wrote: »

Makes total sense for them to think this way. The city is becoming a place for bikes and pedestrians, so they want to hoover up the family\old people\less mobile market who will be in cars for the most part.

Basically those living in the county

opus

Massive development on site of old Ford distribution centre given green light

Outkast_IRE

opus wrote: »

Massive development on site of old Ford distribution centre given green light

Less of the 4 storey more of the 14 storey.



All the same it seems very difficult for developers to get residential over the line at the moment. Think of all the plans - Sextant Site, Link Road Site, Jacobs Island Site, Horgans Quay Site . And not one of them progressing.


Getting these residential projects to progress seems very difficult right now as the financial side is not stacking up. Which is a scary thought when you consider current house and rent prices !

questionmark?

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Less of the 4 storey more of the 14 storey.



All the same it seems very difficult for developers to get residential over the line at the moment. Think of all the plans - Sextant Site, Link Road Site, Jacobs Island Site, Horgans Quay Site . And not one of them progressing.


Getting these residential projects to progress seems very difficult right now as the financial side is not stacking up. Which is a scary thought when you consider current house and rent prices !

It really is hard to wrap the head around how with current demand that apartments are not worth building at the moment. How have we got ourselves into this situation!!

Outkast_IRE

questionmark? wrote: »

It really is hard to wrap the head around how with current demand that apartments are not worth building at the moment. How have we got ourselves into this situation!!

The quantity surveyors report on it from earlier this year is a real eye opener , if you just read the first few pages of the executive summary it tells the story and the same costs are found across the country .

https://scsi.ie/real-cost-of-new-apartment-delivery/

It's costing 320k or more to build a basic2 bed apartment . Who is going to buy that ? Their only option is to get investment funds to pay for build to let. Rents need to be a min of 1900 and usually more to generate a 4% return . In cork it's not viable in Dublin it's only investment funds keeping it going .

Looking at the surveyors report what can be cut ?
Vat on building costs.
Site costs , stop hoarding .

It's hard to reduce construction costs as the building standards and regulations are driving alot of that cost .

conjalu

shnaek wrote: »

Makes total sense for them to think this way. The city is becoming a place for bikes and pedestrians, so they want to hoover up the family\old people\less mobile market who will be in cars for the most part.

You're saying this like its a bad thing. Everyone needs to walk around the city to get to shops/bars etc. making the city more pedestrian friendly is only making it better for families/old people and less mobile people.

conjalu

opus wrote: »

This is great news. hopefully its the start of completely re-transferming the docklands area into a modern sustatinable part of the city.

Apogee

Apogee wrote: »

http://planning.corkcity.ie/AppFileRefDetails/2140076/0

Some more pics of this proposal here:
https://www.irishexaminer.com/property/developmentconstruction/arid-40272149.html

Austria!

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

The quantity surveyors report on it from earlier this year is a real eye opener , if you just read the first few pages of the executive summary it tells the story and the same costs are found across the country .

https://scsi.ie/real-cost-of-new-apartment-delivery/

It's costing 320k or more to build a basic2 bed apartment

Good link.

I wouldn't express it that way. I consider the cost to build as the actual cost to build the thing, which is less than half of the reported figures.



Percentage breakdown of the total development costs for a two-bedroom apartment (Category 2 – lower-range, 5-8 st.)


Site purchase 11%
Contributions 5%
Prof Fees 4%
Selling Cost 2%
Finance 6%
Contingency 2%
Margin/Risk 11%
VAT on sales 12%

Outkast_IRE

Austria! wrote: »

Good link.

I wouldn't express it that way. I consider the cost to build as the actual cost to build the thing, which is less than half of the reported figures.



Percentage breakdown of the total development costs for a two-bedroom apartment (Category 2 – lower-range, 5-8 st.)


Site purchase 11%
Contributions 5%
Prof Fees 4%
Selling Cost 2%
Finance 6%
Contingency 2%
Margin/Risk 11%
VAT on sales 12%

Its semantics really, as when you are building the cost of physically building the thing is only one factor. Sure you cant build it in the first place without the site purchase cost, the contributions , the professional fees or the finance.

All the same lets look at those remaining costs closely

-Site Purchase - In my opinion this can be tackled to a degree if we make it uneconomical to hoard land for long periods. Not going to fix it overnight but might help.
- Contributions - These are fair charges based to the size of the development and the connections to public utilities they will need and any upgrades.
- Professional Fess - 4% - I work in this area so there is very little that can be done to trim these , its a very competitive area already. The BCAR regulations have increased the formal workload to an extent.
-Selling Cost - 2% is standard enough -
Finance - No bank is going to go below 6% at the moment risk is too high in Ireland and they will finance other projects with a better margin if we tackle it directly. But maybe there are roundabout ways of lowering this . Government to take 0% interest loans from ECB and fund developments that meet certain criteria ?
Contingency - 2% - Its actually a very small amount given the complexity of some developments.
Margin - 10-12% in many industries is seen as what you need to make in profit in order to survive and grow, any less than this and companies wont want to be involved.
VAT - This could be reduced - Or a break given if the developments meet certain critera - such as housing for direct sale to individuals or local authority. No breaks given if selling to investment funds or similar entities.

Mav11

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

- Contributions - These are fair charges based to the size of the development and the connections to public utilities they will need and any upgrades.

How is fairness determined or who determines it?

Outkast_IRE

Mav11 wrote: »

How is fairness determined or who determines it?

The local council and it's usually looks at the infrastructure capacities in the area , including waste water , water , lighting , footpaths, transport links. , Roads .

These costs are for the benefit of the public. There is guidance from each council available. They typically fall into general contributions and supplementary contributions .

Apogee

Cork City Planning wrote:

Development Description: Permission is sought for the demolition of the existing building and construction of 22 no apartments, including 5 no. 1 bed apartments and 17 no. 2 bed apartments

Development Address:21-24 Leitrim Street, Cork

http://planning.corkcity.ie/AppFileRefDetails/2140106/0

Anyone happen to know what these buildings were previously used for?