Teenager and child shot in Dublin halting site

Geuze

The Govt has poured resources into all sorts of supports for travellers for decades.

And still the outcomes are poor.


My grandparents lived in social housing in the 1950s, husband a lorry driver.

My grandmother was obsessed with education, getting a trade, etc.

Their children now own second homes in Spain, etc.

Social mobility is possible, thanks to education and hard work.

That was 50 years ago.

Travellers seem to reject this, and seem not to want to progress.

end of the road

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Government government government, always the governments fault with you isnt it?

in relation to giving services the resources and funding to cary out their job in full, absolutely. it's hardly my fault. if i voted for the party in government then yes i'd have some part to blame because i know what they are like.

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

You are everything left represents.

i'm not as i'm not on the left but middle of the road with views from across the political spectrum.

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

No personal responsibility and expect to be spoonfed from the cradle to the grave by someone other than yourself.

plenty of personal responsibility, and i don't expect to be spoonfed from the cradle to the grave by someone other than myself.
however when something happens, i do blame whoever needs to be blamed whether it be the individual or government.

Geuze wrote: »

The Govt has poured resources into all sorts of supports for travellers for decades.

And still the outcomes are poor.


My grandparents lived in social housing in the 1950s, husband a lorry driver.

My grandmother was obsessed with education, getting a trade, etc.

Their children now own second homes in Spain, etc.

Social mobility is possible, thanks to education and hard work.

That was 50 years ago.

Travellers seem to reject this, and seem not to want to progress.

we aren't talking about supports for travelers however. we are talking about law enforcement and child protection resources, which don't have the resources they need to cary out their duties in full.
social mobility is possible, but it can only go so far and it will depend on various circumstances. education will help hugely, and while it has more potential to guarantee then not having education, there are no guarantees.

splinter65

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

Government government government, always the governments fault with you isnt it?

You are everything left represents.

No personal responsibility and expect to be spoonfed from the cradle to the grave by someone other than yourself.

The most comfort I have had in my life is in taking personal responsibility for myself.
If things go right it’s all credit to me. If I balls up, it’s my fault.
Very easy very straightforward.
I watch posters in thread after thread twisting and turning like Olga Korbut to avoid ever ever having to appropriate personal responsibility to anyone.
Somehow some way, if it’s not “the government” it’s “society” ( honest decent hardworking people who have the temerity to house themselves and take financial care of the children they bring into the world themselves).
Apparently the young mother of two who shot a toddler and it’s mother this week is not to take any responsibility because it’s the judiciary’s fault that she’s not in prison.
The mental gymnastics are extraordinary.
There’s almost a fear of accepting that people make disastrous desicions one after the other and only have themselves to blame because they refuse to learn.

Wheeliebin30

splinter65 wrote: »

The most comfort I have had in my life is in taking personal responsibility for myself.
If things go right it’s all credit to me. If I balls up, it’s my fault.
Very easy very straightforward.
I watch posters in thread after thread twisting and turning like Olga Korbut to avoid ever ever having to appropriate personal responsibility to anyone.
Somehow some way, if it’s not “the government” it’s “society” ( honest decent hardworking people who have the temerity to house themselves and take financial care of the children they bring into the world themselves).
Apparently the young mother of two who shot a toddler and it’s mother this week is not to take any responsibility because it’s the judiciary’s fault that she’s not in prison.
The mental gymnastics are extraordinary.
There’s almost a fear of accepting that people make disastrous desicions one after the other and only have themselves to blame because they refuse to learn.

That's the way this country seems to be heading unfortunately.

PeterParker957

Wheeliebin30 wrote: »

splinter65 wrote: »

The most comfort I have had in my life is in taking personal responsibility for myself.
If things go right it’s all credit to me. If I balls up, it’s my fault.
Very easy very straightforward.
I watch posters in thread after thread twisting and turning like Olga Korbut to avoid ever ever having to appropriate personal responsibility to anyone.
Somehow some way, if it’s not “the government” it’s “society” ( honest decent hardworking people who have the temerity to house themselves and take financial care of the children they bring into the world themselves).
Apparently the young mother of two who shot a toddler and it’s mother this week is not to take any responsibility because it’s the judiciary’s fault that she’s not in prison.
The mental gymnastics are extraordinary.
There’s almost a fear of accepting that people make disastrous desicions one after the other and only have themselves to blame because they refuse to learn.

That's the way this country seems to be heading unfortunately.

Couldn't agree more. And it's not going to improve when people are afraid to say "you're a criminal" and not "there there, don't blame yourself. It was society, we let you down"

grumpy_mick

Geuze wrote: »

The Govt has poured resources into all sorts of supports for travellers for decades.

And still the outcomes are poor.


My grandparents lived in social housing in the 1950s, husband a lorry driver.

My grandmother was obsessed with education, getting a trade, etc.

Their children now own second homes in Spain, etc.

Social mobility is possible, thanks to education and hard work.

That was 50 years ago.

Travellers seem to reject this, and seem not to want to progress.

i never heard either of my grandparents say anything bad about travellers ( though they called them tinkers )

i think travellers problems began when middle class do gooders ( academic types and the vincent brownes of this world ) began telling them they were powerless victims of the settled community , this mindset and narrative has developed so strongly that a professional grievance monger like john connors is lauded everywhere as some sort of hero , were he anything other than a traveller , he would be dismissed as an incoherent hyper aggressive loudmouth who nearly always lets opinion get in the way of fact

Roger Hassenforder

end of the road wrote: »

if they burn the house down then they should be jailed. when they get out give them a shipping container.

Plumbed?
Insulated?
Wired?

I have a problem with 'giving' them anything after that which was already 'given' was burnt down.