The Jimbo Slice memorial thread, feat Nate Dogg - The new Off Topic thread

coffee_cake

someone going for a benching national record in the nationals. the lifting is cool to watch.
interesting how many don't want a lift out on benching. i might try that

Brian?

bluewolf wrote: »

someone going for a benching national record in the nationals. the lifting is cool to watch.
interesting how many don't want a lift out on benching. i might try that

Deadly.

Re: the lift out. Does not taking one keep the upper back tighter.

Mr. CooL ICE

I've stopped taking liftouts in comp because I don't take them in training. I've practised taking liftouts a handful of times before a comp before but I always get "jaysus that's fookin heavy" thoughts when they let go.

In all honesty, it is better to take liftouts because you're conserving a little bit more energy by not unracking yourself. I don't think upper back tightness has anything to do with it. I'd do it if I had regular training partners, so I don't.

Alf Veedersane

Brian? wrote: »

Deadly.

Re: the lift out. Does not taking one keep the upper back tighter.

Most people would be used to training on decent/comp racks that allow small adjustments on height, so they would be well practised in minimising loss in upper back tightness.

Majority probably don't train with a spotter so might not want to throw a new variable in there at a meet.

coffee_cake

Yeah i dont train with one and it does throw me a bit when i get the lift out. I understand its supposed to conserve energy so i guess the q is how much that gets offset

Alf Veedersane

I always take a liftout and I'd always had a really good liftout until one comp when it was a bit awkward...so was gonna lift it out myself last comp.

Except I realised the comp rack wasn't same as warm up tack so went safety first. Just as well cos it was waaayyy too high

Brian?

bluewolf wrote: »

Yeah i dont train with one and it does throw me a bit when i get the lift out. I understand its supposed to conserve energy so i guess the q is how much that gets offset

Fair enough. I would have had a reliable people around to give me a lift out when I trained heavy.

Alf Veedersane

The few times I went heavy on a comp rack, it was fine to lift out yourself...the pins aren't that high so mot much clearance needed to get the bar over and out.

Dtp1979

Anybody ever use these type of dumbbells before?

caviardreams

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Anybody ever use these type of dumbbells before?

Remember a thread on them before I think:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=96503337

I have thought of getting some before but I think they would be too bulky for my needs (and tbh for dumbbell stuff I usually use light enough weights as it is shoulder stuff mainly). Can see how they would have benefits though, and my hands / frame is smallish which makes them seem bigger than they actually are I'd say!

Mcsport have 10% off them atm: https://www.mcsport.ie/p/bodymax-selectabell-5in1-dumbbell-45kg-225kg/wtfd2121

Alf Veedersane

Damien Nam is some beast of a chap.

First 83 in the IrishPF to total 700 and then puts 5kg on the National squat record (272.5) and adds 15kg to his own National record with a 305 pull. Looked like a couple of kilos there on that too.

Srs!

whippet

He is insane alright .. there was another 5kg in the squat if he really wanted it and the 305 pull moved very quick ! 490+ Wilks .. 500 will be well beaten at his next comp .. will probably beat piggots all time Wilks score !

silverharp

Can I throw a question in here about arm/grip strength, I was able to measure that my grip strength was 10KG less for my left hand versus my right, and also doing one handed cable exercises that I would struggle more to do the same volume for my left arm v right for certain exercises. Do people generally try to correct for this? and if so is it just a matter of throwing in extra sets here and there on the weaker arm? I'd started doing this in the last month anyway also there is one plate loaded arm machine in the gym where you could have different weights for each arm? Any do’s or dont’s?

Alf Veedersane

silverharp wrote: »

Can I throw a question in here about arm/grip strength, I was able to measure that my grip strength was 10KG less for my left hand versus my right, and also doing one handed cable exercises that I would struggle more to do the same volume for my left arm v right for certain exercises. Do people generally try to correct for this? and if so is it just a matter of throwing in extra sets here and there on the weaker arm? I'd started doing this in the last month anyway also there is one plate loaded arm machine in the gym where you could have different weights for each arm? Any do’s or dont’s?

There are three types of grip strength: crush, pinch and support.

Support is the kind you're referring to when you're talking about the cable exercises, i.e. where you have to hold on for a long time. It's a good idea to work on it not least from the point of view that it seems to be a limiting factor on other exercises where your grip is potentially going to give out before you've done the same level of volume on that side.

Things like holding a heavy dumbbell for as long as you can will help. Do it on your stronger side and time how long before you drop it. Do the same on the other side. Now you know the difference to start working on it.

silverharp

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

There are three types of grip strength: crush, pinch and support.

Support is the kind you're referring to when you're talking about the cable exercises, i.e. where you have to hold on for a long time. It's a good idea to work on it not least from the point of view that it seems to be a limiting factor on other exercises where your grip is potentially going to give out before you've done the same level of volume on that side.

Things like holding a heavy dumbbell for as long as you can will help. Do it on your stronger side and time how long before you drop it. Do the same on the other side. Now you know the difference to start working on it.

thats a great idea with the dumbbells , i like the idea of timing one against the other, ill give that a try next time. im guessing pinch could be holding a plate between thumb an fingers?

Alf Veedersane

silverharp wrote: »

thats a great idea with the dumbbells , i like the idea of timing one against the other, ill give that a try next time. im guessing pinch could be holding a plate between thumb an fingers?

Yep, exactly. Holding plates is probablythe most straightforward way.

And crush strength would be trained using those handles that look like the spring collars for holding plates on in the gym.

Mellor

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

There are three types of grip strength: crush, pinch and support.

The crush/pinch/support model is generally considered to be flawed these days. Specifically that support grip doesn't exist - on the basis that a support grip is actually crush grip for time/endurance.

Everything is either crush or pinch.
Then endurance/max-effort and open/closed, are sub variables.

If you train pinch and crush, at both endurance and max effort loads. You should cover most aspects.

Alf Veedersane

Mellor wrote: »

The crush/pinch/support model is generally considered to be flawed these days. Specifically that support grip doesn't exist - on the basis that a support grip is actually crush grip for time/endurance.

Everything is either crush or pinch.
Then endurance/max-effort and open/closed, are sub variables.

If you train pinch and crush, at both endurance and max effort loads. You should cover most aspects.

It still makes for an easy distinction for training though

Mellor

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

It still makes for an easy distinction for training though

I was talking about in relation to training.
It's easy, but I feel it neglects some, and bias others.

Fat bar FTW imo

silverharp

this is what got me looking into grip strength.

http://www3.scienceblog.com/community/older/archives/K/3/pub3165.html

COLUMBUS, Ohio, Oct. 13 -- A recent study performed at McMaster University in Hamilton, Ontario has verified that high blood pressure can be lowered through controlled hand isometric exercises. The study showed that participants using this methodology reduced their systolic and diastolic blood pressure by 19mm and 7mm, respectively, over an eleven-week period. Details of this study were reported in Medicine & Science in Sports and Exercise, an American College of Sports Medicine publication and can be found on their website at http://www.acsm-msse.org/ (QuickSearch Journal Content with the key words "isometric training lowers").

Dr. Ronald L. Wiley, a professor of cardiopulmonary physiology at Miami University in Oxford, Ohio, first discovered the effect of controlled hand isometric exercises on blood pressure when he was working with U.S. Air Force F-16 fighter pilots during the 1970's as a scientist at Wright Patterson Air Force Base.

Alf Veedersane

Mellor wrote: »

I was talking about in relation to training.
It's easy, but I feel it neglects some, and bias others.

As by defining it as three elements (as opposed to two types broadly broken into max and endurance) that 2 of the 3 are essentially giving more importance to crush at the expensive of pinch?

Framed like that it makes sense.

In and of itself though I just prefer the use of support/crush because they sound more like what it is.

As an aside, I don't really train pinch strength, aside from carrying bumpers to the bar...

Mellor

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

As by defining it as three elements (as opposed to two types broadly broken into max and endurance) that 2 of the 3 are essentially giving more importance to crush at the expensive of pinch?

Framed like that it makes sense.

In and of itself though I just prefer the use of support/crush because they sound more like what it is.

As an aside, I don't really train pinch strength, aside from carrying bumpers to the bar...

Kinda.
Crush (finger dominant) gets biased over pinch (thumb dominant). But it encourages certain crush over another.
"Support" tends toward on closed hand endurance. Then "crush" tends to be reduced to grippers - which have little carry over to other moves.
I like to do open hand crush too (like fat bar). Open hand involves the thumb more, which reduces the crush bias. Fat bars also replicate grabbing wrists/arms.

I just try and do a mix of types in my limited time, at heavy and endurance loads. You couldn't cover all varibles unless you are a grip sort competitor.

coffee_cake

With this vat thing coming up, i decided to order again from bulkpowders to stock up a bit. i thought i would throw up a post about it in case anyone is interested and/or maybe has some more tips.
I got a vitamins powder. I have vitamins but never take them. but i do take shakes the odd time. soo.

I also decided to try soya powder protein. I really love my soya high protein yogurt and would happily live off it so i figured it was worth a try. I also read some advice online to get the raspberry liquiflav thing as well since the soya is unflavoured.
It's very very thick (i mix all these with water). The beef protein is so light it goes foamy when in the blender but this stuff is super thick. It's also a little bit grainy, just a bit. The liquiflav thing definitely helped a lot though i wasn't brave enough to try it before adding.
So beef protein is still winning the game but I will definitely try the soya some more and see if i get used to it (unlike the rice protein which went straight into the bin)

I also tried a drop of the flav on some yogurt, it's very very strong!

Alf Veedersane

I did think about getting some in to beat the VAT and but if I'm checking the expiry dates to see if I need to or not, it's not going to be a big deal.

caviardreams

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I did think about getting some in to beat the VAT and but if I'm checking the expiry dates to see if I need to or not, it's not going to be a big deal.

I thought there was already vat on whey / protein bars etc? And it was just vitamins that had escaped up until now? God I better get a few things in if not!

Alf Veedersane

caviardreams wrote: »

I thought there was already vat on whey / protein bars etc? And it was just vitamins that had escaped up until now? God I better get a few things in if not!

Yeah mostly vitamins. Whey already subject to 23%

Must check the expiry on the whey and fine oats though. Had to throw 90% of a bag of creatine out the other week. Past it and...solid

coffee_cake

I thought vitargo and protein had escaped til now haha

rubadub

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Whey already subject to 23%

I said many years ago (and very recently in bargain alerts) if there is a photo of a muscular man on the front it is 23%, a photo a a skinny baker and it is zero. Some seemed to laugh this off or say it is not true or feasible. This was back when the likes of myprotein started charging 23% and having a .ie site. Pure whey powder with no other stuff can be sold as an ingredient/foodstuff.

I found this on revenue which seems to agree with my idea/understanding (I am pretty sure years ago I did find one clearly saying if it was bought as an ingredient it was zero)

https://www.revenue.ie/ga/vat/documents/report-on-the-definition-of-food.pdf

Currently sports products can be classed as foods or food supplements. Supplements should be clearly
identifiable from the product label (dosage/presentation) and if originating from the US through use
of a ‘Supplements Facts’ box on the label. Foods for sports people are also clearly identifiable through
their form and presentation e.g. isotonic sports drinks, milks or chocolate bars with added protein. For
protein powders (e.g. whey, casein, soy or pea), unless clearly listed as a supplement on-pack they may
be deemed a food. This situation arises as a result of the repositioning of sports food as regular food
in law and their increasing use or normalisation as an everyday and normal product by the general
population. Additional consideration to what is considered here may be required if desired to classify
all products for sports persons collectively.

FOOD SUPPLEMENTS ( Food and Drink )
Rate
Zero rated: 0%

Remarks
Zero rate only applies to Food Supplements type products where those products forms part of a personal normal diet for the purposes of sustenance being vitamins (excluding high vitamins drinks), minerals and fish oil products. However, eBrief 70/2011 led to certain Food Supplements types/ranges of products being liable to VAT at the Standard rate. These included food supplements such as milk/whey/protein based products, marketed as supporting lean muscle growth, performance and recovery and ergogenic aids for body building etc. Also included are products that contain vitamins, minerals, food ingredients etc. but whose purpose is other than for sustenance for example skin/hair/nail/eye improvement products, detox, antioxidant, immune, digestive, joint support, cholesterol etc. This list is not exhaustive. Please see eBrief 70/11 and eBrief 45/13. .

Value-Added Tax Consolidation Act 2010 (VATCA 2010) Ref
Section: 46(1)(b) Schedule: 2 Paragraph: 8(1)

https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-professionals/historic-material/ebrief/2011/no-702011.aspx

similar to glucose
https://www.revenue.ie/en/vat/vat-rates/search-vat-rates/G/glucose-food-and-drink-.aspx

GLUCOSE ( Food and Drink )
Rate
Zero rated: 0%

Value-Added Tax Consolidation Act 2010 (VATCA 2010) Ref
Section: 46(1)(b) Schedule: 2 Paragraph: 8(1)

Published: 03 August 2018

add water and its 23%

GLUCOSE DRINK
Rate
Standard rate: 23%

Value-Added Tax Consolidation Act 2010 (VATCA 2010) Ref
Section: 46(1)(a)

Published: 03 August 2018

I also think in the past they used to list dry glucose tablets or supplements as 23%

caviardreams

bluewolf wrote: »

I thought vitargo and protein had escaped til now haha

Yeah the way all the supplement stores were going on about it doing petitions etc. I thought it was going to affect everything, but when I looked into it it seemed a lot of supplement stuff already has VAT applied.

Alf Veedersane

Flash sale on Adidas website.

https://www.adidas.ie/outlet

Powerlifts for €50 and PP3s for €65.