Bishops Gate Kilternan

Richardsons Muff

The_Conductor wrote: »

Looking at the prices- and it is Kilternan- yep, the prices they're charging for this development have no grounding in reality whatsoever. However, if people will pay it, common sense dictates that they will charge it.

This takes the sting away somewhat do you think they are overpriced? I thought a 3 bed semi d for €430k wasn't too bad. €540k for a 4 bed pricey alright.

The_Conductor

Richardsons Muff wrote: »

This takes the sting away somewhat do you think they are overpriced? I thought a 3 bed semi d for €430k wasn't too bad. €540k for a 4 bed pricey alright.

Its all to do with location.

I'm not a snob by any means- but since when has Kilternan been desireable to the extent that people think these prices are reasonable?

There seems to be some bizarre reverse psychology on top of gentrification going on here.

Bigus

The_Conductor wrote: »

Its all to do with location.

I'm not a snob by any means- but since when has Kilternan been desireable to the extent that people think these prices are reasonable?

There seems to be some bizarre reverse psychology on top of gentrification going on here.

They are new houses built to today's high standard building regs , built by a very very reputable and long established quality builder, in a low density south Dublin location in the lee of the real Dublin mountains , not far from fox rock ,Brennan town road, cabinteely etc.

What else can they be compared to price wise this year ?

Also Just seeing the Durkan quality of the granite wall on the road boundary would inspire confidence in old money people helping out children and grandchildren with big lumps of cash to help purchase.

Jessica879

My poor Mum went to queue for us yesterday - she came home crying because she missed out. On her way home she drove by another new development called Kenler - its in Sandyford Village which would be amazing. Going to spend the weekend driving around the Stepaside Sandyford area to see what else is popping up.

emmacxxx

To be fair I think these houses are amazing value for money! When you look at the developments literally a 20 second drive away on Glenamuck Rd starting from €745k...

I do think it's absolutely terrible for people the lengths you've to go through these days to get your home - the world is cruel!

On a side note - does anyone know when these houses would be ready to move into?

SuiteCheex

Richardsons Muff wrote: »

I was up there about a half hour ago.

it's not people looking at tarmac getting laid as another poster said, that's ludicrous.

All I can say is that this is the approach I took and it bore fruit. There was no tipping off......it was blind hope that the launch was happening this weekend.

The_Conductor

Bigus wrote: »

They are new houses built to today's high standard building regs , built by a very very reputable and long established quality builder, in a low density south Dublin location in the lee of the real Dublin mountains , not far from fox rock ,Brennan town road, cabinteely etc.

What else can they be compared to price wise this year ?

Also Just seeing the Durkan quality of the granite wall on the road boundary would inspire confidence in old money people helping out children and grandchildren with big lumps of cash to help purchase.

You really are buying the advertising that's gone into these- honestly, the developer himself couldn't have come up with a more rosy spin that this spiel.

How familiar are you with the area? Have you looked into local troublespots/issues that have been booted down the road, rather than resolved?

Have a look at the recent lists of complaints lodged with the local authority by the Kilternan/Glenamuck residents association.

Its all well and good- looking at this with rosy spectacles- as you obviously are doing- but if you buy here, with the intention of living here long term- the very least you can do is a little research into the area............

The_Conductor

SuiteCheex wrote: »

All I can say is that this is the approach I took and it bore fruit. There was no tipping off......it was blind hope that the launch was happening this weekend.

There was tipping off though- its been acknowledged already by one national radio station (who were out there interviewing some of those queuing on Wednesday and Thursday). It did happen.

stuckinarut

not sure there was any tipping off, i was one of the very lucky ones to get a house and the reason we queued was based on driving by the development everyday checking.. this seems to be the norm for buying a new house these days, so if you really want a new house, these are things you have to do..

as for kilternan bashing, don't think anyone is forcing you to live there

godtabh

Which Durkan is this? There are two sides of the family that had a falling out. I'm familiar with one not the other.

emmacxxx

stuckinarut wrote: »

not sure there was any tipping off, i was one of the very lucky ones to get a house and the reason we queued was based on driving by the development everyday checking.. this seems to be the norm for buying a new house these days, so if you really want a new house, these are things you have to do..

as for kilternan bashing, don't think anyone is forcing you to live there

Thankfully I was one of the lucky ones too - genuinely feel terrible for those who missed out because I know how it feels!

Totally agree that that's the way things are now and you just have be cute about it really!

Also Kilternan is a fantastic area in South Dublin 18 so don't get the bashing myself 😉

Richardsons Muff

stuckinarut wrote: »

this seems to be the norm for buying a new house these days

No. This is not the norm and there is nothing normal about people driving by half built estates in anticipation of camping outside in order to spend a huge whack of money on a property. In a normal functional property market the developer and estate will try their best to sell a house or whatever and the potential buyer who is entering into a loan agreement of maybe 30 years has time to consider everything. There is nothing 'normal' about this and this abnormality should really be highlighted and protested against instead of embraced but we live in a society where we step over each other ..and that is what happened. Being smug about it doesn't help, it's a fairly himiliating excericse. You got a house...ahead of others who were willing to play ball at a designated launch date, maybe take a back seat and pipe down during this chaos.

Richardsons Muff

emmacxxx wrote: »

Thankfully I was one of the lucky ones too - genuinely feel terrible for those who missed out because I know how it feels!

Totally agree that that's the way things are now and you just have be cute about it really!

Also Kilternan is a fantastic area in South Dublin 18 so don't get the bashing myself 😉

I'd repeat the same to you, be happy. Good luck.

Big Nasty

A lot of bitterness in this thread

stuckinarut

Richardsons Muff wrote: »

No. This is not the norm and there is nothing normal about people driving by half built estates in anticipation of camping outside in order to spend a huge whack of money on a property. In a normal functional property market the developer and estate will try their best to sell a house or whatever and the potential buyer who is entering into a loan agreement of maybe 30 years has time to consider everything. There is nothing 'normal' about this and this abnormality should really be highlighted and protested against instead of embraced but we live in a society where we step over each other ..and that is what happened. Being smug about it doesn't help, it's a fairly himiliating excericse. You got a house...ahead of others who were willing to play ball at a designated launch date, maybe take a back seat and pipe down during this chaos.

Giving out because people go to lengths to ensure they get what they want? If something is out of your control ( the housing market in its current state ), then why try abide by the "normal system" and wait. Queuing has been happening at new launches for quite some time..
Don't hate the player, hate the game..

caviardreams

godtabh wrote: »

Which Durkan is this? There are two sides of the family that had a falling out. I'm familiar with one not the other.

I think it's Durkan Homes rather than Brian M Durkan

Lumen

The_Conductor wrote: »

Its all to do with location.

I'm not a snob by any means- but since when has Kilternan been desireable to the extent that people think these prices are reasonable?

There seems to be some bizarre reverse psychology on top of gentrification going on here.

LOL @ gentrification of Kilternan. This is the opposite - it's bringing a bunch of identical looking estate houses to a semi-rural location. There's a fair bit of this going on at the moment.

I'm not sure what the end game is - is the R117 going to turn into a car park twice a day?

Or maybe there's enough cycling and walking interconnectivity down the Ballycorus Road through the new Cherrywood development.

edit: I finally found a proper map of the Cherrywood plan
http://www.cherrywooddublin.com/masterplan/

youngfarmer

Went for a look and couldn't even get car parking spot today! 4 bed €565k and plus you don't get the €20k first time buyers grant as it's only available up to €500k house value (reduced from €600k house value in 2016). 1200 people on the interested list, long list of people on cancellations list for 3 and 4 beds. Asked would prices go up in next phase and they said yes but probably by around €10k not much higher. Madness alright and a good distance from luas. Next batches of houses available in about 5 weeks.

Nika Bolokov

Bigus wrote: »

The_Conductor wrote: »

Its all to do with location.

I'm not a snob by any means- but since when has Kilternan been desireable to the extent that people think these prices are reasonable?

There seems to be some bizarre reverse psychology on top of gentrification going on here.

They are new houses built to today's high standard building regs , built by a very very reputable and long established quality builder, in a low density south Dublin location in the lee of the real Dublin mountains , not far from fox rock ,Brennan town road, cabinteely etc.

What else can they be compared to price wise this year ?

Also Just seeing the Durkan quality of the granite wall on the road boundary would inspire confidence in old money people helping out children and grandchildren with big lumps of cash to help purchase.

1. This is no where near Foxrock
2. I doubt old money people were inspired by the quality of the boundary wall and go so excited they started flinging cash out the car window
3. There's no decent public transport in this area
4. There not low density


The reason this happened and things like it are happening is the legacy of the boom.

Not everyone wasted all the cash they made speculating the last time and there's a lot of people sitting on cash who are happy to pass it on to the kids.

Thus instead of easy credit from Banks free cash from the Bank of Mum and Dad, the remnants of the cash pumped pumped out up to 2007 is now pushing up prices to such an extent that the guts of half a mill is seen as reasonable to live on the side of a mountain.

louser1

youngfarmer wrote: »

Went for a look and couldn't even get car parking spot today! 4 bed €565k and plus you don't get the €20k first time buyers grant as it's only available up to €500k house value (reduced from €600k house value in 2016). 1200 people on the interested list, long list of people on cancellations list for 3 and 4 beds. Asked would prices go up in next phase and they said yes but probably by around €10k not much higher. Madness alright and a good distance from luas. Next batches of houses available in about 5 weeks.

Hi

I thought the next phase wasn't being released until September?

emmacxxx

Nika Bolokov wrote: »

1. This is no where near Foxrock
2. I doubt old money people were inspired by the quality of the boundary wall and go so excited they started flinging cash out the car window
3. There's no decent public transport in this area
4. There not low density


The reason this happened and things like it are happening is the legacy of the boom.

Not everyone wasted all the cash they made speculating the last time and there's a lot of people sitting on cash who are happy to pass it on to the kids.

Thus instead of easy credit from Banks free cash from the Bank of Mum and Dad, the remnants of the cash pumped pumped out up to 2007 is now pushing up prices to such an extent that the guts of half a mill is seen as reasonable to live on the side of a mountain.

I live in Foxrock atm so to say it's 'no where near' wouldn't be correct at all. It's a 5-10 min drive away.

Also your comment about there being 'no decent public transport' would also be incorrect. There's a bus stop on your doorstep that goes straight into town and also the luas down the road with park and ride facilities.

The bitterness on this thread is unreal - begrudgery is just so typically Irish!

Lumen

emmacxxx wrote: »

The bitterness on this thread is unreal - begrudgery is just so typically Irish!

This is a discussion forum, people have different opinions about things.

emmacxxx wrote: »

I live in Foxrock atm so to say it's 'no where near' wouldn't be correct at all. It's a 5-10 min drive away.

Also your comment about there being 'no decent public transport' would also be incorrect. There's a bus stop on your doorstep that goes straight into town and also the luas down the road with park and ride facilities.

In an attempt to bring some facts into the debate about transport, how long does it take to get in to St Stephens Green (for instance) from this development by various modes of transport?

Google says 46 minutes on the 118 bus to Dawson St or 33 minutes on the Luas from Ballyogan, but that's a 35 min (3km) walk from Kilternan. Presumably once the SDZ gets built it'll be standing only (if it isn't already) on the Luas.

So unless you like walking over an hour a day, or are prepared to mix it up with a bike or folding bike, the bus is the main public transport option at around 45 minutes each way.

What's the Park and Ride like to use, practically, with morning traffic?

I do think it's a bit funny how people reject Dublin 15 as an option citing poor transport options (25 minutes from Clonsilla to Docklands) but crawl over each other to pay twice as much for a 45 minute commute in South Dublin.

LirW

I do think it's a bit funny how people reject Dublin 15 as an option citing poor transport options (25 minutes from Clonsilla to Docklands) but crawl over each other to pay twice as much for a 45 minute commute in South Dublin.

The thing about huge parts of D15 is that it's estate after estate after estate after estate. I viewed a few houses there and gave up on D15 because I couldn't warm up with it in general. And the older parts of Clonsilla can be pretty expensive (granted, it's still cheaper than Kilternan).
I get your point though, for the same amount of money you can buy some pretty sweet houses in Marino or Fairview where you're in town really really fast.

It seems to be a thing with new houses now in general, because wherever new built houses come up and it's not the top end of the market you'll probably see queues from now on. And I honestly don't consider any of the new estates as nice and I've seen a few over the last year.

NinjaTruncs

Lumen wrote: »

Google says 46 minutes on the 118 bus to Dawson St or 33 minutes on the Luas from Ballyogan, but that's a 35 min (3km) walk from Kilternan. Presumably once the SDZ gets built it'll be standing only (if it isn't already) on the Luas.

The 118 only goes once a day, at least that's how I interpret the timetable, there is also the 44 but that isn't great either as it, takes 60 minutes to get into town and only runs about once an hour, if you're moving into Kilternan, you don't want to be relying on public transport imo, I lived in Stepaside for a number of year and there was a pain too.

Lumen

LirW wrote: »

The thing about huge parts of D15 is that it's estate after estate after estate after estate. I viewed a few houses there and gave up on D15 because I couldn't warm up with it in general. And the older parts of Clonsilla can be pretty expensive (granted, it's still cheaper than Kilternan).
I get your point though, for the same amount of money you can buy some pretty sweet houses in Marino or Fairview where you're in town really really fast.

It seems to be a thing with new houses now in general, because wherever new built houses come up and it's not the top end of the market you'll probably see queues from now on. And I honestly don't consider any of the new estates as nice and I've seen a few over the last year.

I don't dispute that Kilternan is "nicer" than most parts of D15, I moved out this way myself, but D15 has other things going for it, like the superb (and improving) sports facilities around the NAC. We live in north Wicklow now, but last week my son went on his school tour to the NAC, taking in the various new athletics facilities. That place used to be 5 mins from our house!

People are very attached to where and what they grew up in. I yearn for a red brick terrace cos I grew up in one. I remember taking the kids to an absolutely stunning restored French gite a couple of years back. Having grown up in legoland yellow-brick-and-gravel-dash semi-d they announced that it was "ugly". Morto!

South Dublin grew massively a generation ago, in the last 15 years a lot of the growth has been north and west. I wonder whether people will have the same attachment to D15 and Swords in 20 years time.

markpb

emmacxxx wrote: »

Also your comment about there being 'no decent public transport' would also be incorrect. There's a bus stop on your doorstep that goes straight into town and also the luas down the road with park and ride facilities.

When people say there "no decent public transport", they mean no public transport that most people would reasonably rely on to get to work. Google Maps say that someone living in Kiltiernan and working in Sandyford (which seems reasonable) would have a choice of four routes, each one taking about an hour and most of them needing a connection. Those options include the once-a-day and no-return-trip 118, the once an hour 44 and the twice an hour 63. Now it's possible that a few people might do that but it's more likely that they'll drive because it takes 20 minutes.

Ironically, if those people ditched their jobs in nearby Sandyford and worked in the south city centre, their commute would only increase by a few minutes but it'll still take an hour whether they drive or take public transport. An hour each way is a lot of commuting plus you're beholden to a few infrequent bus routes which means if you're in work a few minutes late, you could have a 30-60 minute wait just to start your commute home.

This isn't me being bitter by the way, that's one of the things I had in mind when I was buying a house only a few months ago. I was happy to pay a premium for my house because it's proximity to Sandyford (for work) and the Luas (for future work, childrens schools, socialising, etc). I would not be happy to pay the significant premium to live in Bishops Gate where public transport is poor.

LirW

I think this is probably the reason why I'll never get this really, I'm didn't grow up here and I'm not Irish, I moved 8 times with my mother when I hit the age of 18. In general back home we don't have this kind of attachment to areas because renting for your entire life is not unusual and you get around a bit.
Being together with an irish man who lived in the same house his entire life in Glasnevin it took him months to accept the fact we can't life here because it's too expensive and it was pretty difficult for his parents too.

I met a german lady a few weeks ago living in Goatstown very close to St. Kilians. She's in Dublin for more than 12 years and she genuinely couldn't understand why I wouldn't enroll my boy there, since we're german speaking too. Beside not being able to afford the fees I don't wanna go to the southside everyday and can't afford living there anyway. 2 Minutes later she tells me her rental apartment is too small and they need to move but they can't afford to buy anywhere near Goatstown/Dundrum.

I think by now being so attached doesn't go together with the market and Kilternan shows that. People take a lot to be anywhere near the place they'd grow up. Is Kilternan nice? Yes, I don't find it too bad but I find the development itself very soulless. Is it ideal for commuting? Genuinely not as you said, there are many houses a lot closer to the city in a very similar price bracket, epecially on the northside. A waiting list of 1200 people is completely mental but there must be a reason for it, I might just not see that.

Anyway, regarding the prices, probably the next phase will be a bit more expensive, happened in every single development that I had a look at in person that prices went up 20-50k and I'm curious if it'll be the same when the next phase out there launches.

LirW

markpb wrote: »

When people say there "no decent public transport", they mean no public transport that most people would reasonably rely on to get to work. Google Maps say that someone living in Kiltiernan and working in Sandyford (which seems reasonable) would have a choice of four routes, each one taking about an hour and most of them needing a connection. Those options include the once-a-day and no-return-trip 118, the once an hour 44 and the twice an hour 63. Now it's possible that a few people might do that but it's more likely that they'll drive because it takes 20 minutes.

Ironically, if those people ditched their jobs in nearby Sandyford and worked in the south city centre, their commute would only increase by a few minutes but it'll still take an hour whether they drive or take public transport. An hour each way is a lot of commuting plus you're beholden to a few infrequent bus routes which means if you're in work a few minutes late, you could have a 30-60 minute wait just to start your commute home.

This isn't me being bitter by the way, that's one of the things I had in mind when I was buying a house only a few months ago. I was happy to pay a premium for my house because it's proximity to Sandyford (for work) and the Luas (for future work, childrens schools, socialising, etc). I would not be happy to pay the significant premium to live in Bishops Gate where public transport is poor.

Just had a look there, Jesus Christ Kilternan to O'Connell street is 10 minutes shorter than the commute my man has from Arklow to Custom House quay where he gets off right in front of his office by bus :eek:

Viscount Aggro

Is this the place with the council housing right across the road?

Dearg81

Richardsons Muff wrote:

No. This is not the norm and there is nothing normal about people driving by half built estates in anticipation of camping outside in order to spend a huge whack of money on a property. In a normal functional property market the developer and estate will try their best to sell a house or whatever and the potential buyer who is entering into a loan agreement of maybe 30 years has time to consider everything. There is nothing 'normal' about this and this abnormality should really be highlighted and protested against instead of embraced but we live in a society where we step over each other ..and that is what happened. Being smug about it doesn't help, it's a fairly himiliating excericse. You got a house...ahead of others who were willing to play ball at a designated launch date, maybe take a back seat and pipe down during this chaos.

It is quite normal now but whether you like it is a different topic. Everyone queuing up to buy the house had months to consider the plans so they had already had made their decision. If you want to see the house before making your final decision then you have to accept that you're more than likely gonna have to queue, put down your deposit which is refundable and then make your decision.