Breaking - explosions at Brussels Airport Mod warning in post 1

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 04:31PM

conorhal wrote: »

You seem largely resistant to accepting ISIS reasoning for why ISIS do things, perhaps you should ask them to play 20 questions, but I suspect they're less interested in playing parlour games until you get the answers you think people should give then you are.

OMG. Parlour games?

Try it and then judge!

24-03-2016 04:32PM

Anyone have trips to Brussels booked and plan on still going? Personally, going at the end of April and will still go. If you don't, ISIS gets a mark in the win column I think.

Bob24 · 24-03-2016 04:37PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Anyone have trips to Brussels booked and plan on still going? Personally, going at the end of April and will still go. If you don't, ISIS gets a mark in the win column I think.

I possibly wouldn't go this weekend if I had a holiday booked as the atmosphere won't exactly be upbeat, but sure in a few weeks why not going? (if safety is a concern, you can't go anywhere: Brussels just had its bad episode but it is not really less safe than London, Paris, or Berlin)

Shurimgreat · 24-03-2016 04:37PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

Well answer your own damned questions 1 to 5 then!

I don't really have questions.

Take a look at Raqqa at the moment. Its an Islamic State "paradise" ...for IS men that is. They can do what they want there.

Ideally they'd like to impose the same on Europe. They are mad though, and not really rational. If they thought blowing themselves and others up would nudge the cause forward even a few inches they have no problem doing it.

TheHillOfDoom · 24-03-2016 04:37PM

Baggy Trousers. They are uncomfortable questions to answer. It is hard to accept any blame when you're the token victim. Btw - I'm a 'Why' person in general (drives my daughter mad!).

JaCrispy · 24-03-2016 04:38PM

I'm so fuct up of religion now. Islam, Christianity, whatever. The concept of believing in a deity is so fooking ludicrous.

stoplooklisten · 24-03-2016 04:38PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

Baggy Trousers. They are uncomfortable questions to answer. It is hard to accept any blame when you're the token victim. Btw - I'm a 'Why' person in general (drives my daughter mad!).

The people in Brussels were token victims?

Ok

wes · 24-03-2016 04:44PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Do you remember the reason they gave for the Bataclan massacre? They said it was because the concert was a place of devil worship, or something along those lines.

There was an attacker in the US, who failed, who said it was in retaliation to the drone strikes in Pakistan. You will get varying levels of motivation. Some are straight forward Religious fanatics, some want to retaliate to what they see as Western attacks on civilians, and others basically want to play a real life Call of Duty (ISIS even invoke that game for some of ther recruitment propaganda).

TheHillOfDoom · 24-03-2016 04:45PM

I don't know much about Raqqa, but I'm living in London and have met two sitting ducks for radicalisation.

1. A Somali guy (story varied from him being born in London to having come over to follow his mother as a refugee). Lovely guy. Young lad. About 18 (though that scéal varied depending on what day you talked to him). He was always stoned as an ass. Lived in North London. Had a complete and utter identity crisis innit.

2. A Moroccan housemate with clear mental health issues (though the post would suggest the church of Scientology have nabbed him before ISIS could). He was Muslim and thought that we were all racists. (RAASEESTS as he called it).

These are vulnerable young men. No. 1 worked in retail. No. 2 didn't work. (The government give him money because he is very important and born to be King of England - but that's another story).

TheHillOfDoom · 24-03-2016 04:47PM

stoplooklisten wrote: »

The people in Brussels were token victims?

Ok

Ok, that didn't come across well and apologies if I caused offence. What I'm trying to say is that they are indiscriminatory in their targets, you just need to be in a Western place for them to target you. They can't target everyone, so they do unfortunately use random targets.

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 04:52PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I don't really have questions.

Take a look at Raqqa at the moment. Its an Islamic State "paradise" ...for IS men that is. They can do what they want there.

Ideally they'd like to impose the same on Europe. They are mad though, and not really rational. If they thought blowing themselves and others up would nudge the cause forward even a few inches they have no problem doing it.

You are all over the place chief. Are you on illicit substances?

Shurimgreat · 24-03-2016 04:59PM

Baggy Trousers wrote: »

You are all over the place chief. Are you on illicit substances?

Now I remember why I put you on ignore before. It was because of childish posts like this. You wanna go back there or do you want to stay with the adults?

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 04:59PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

Baggy Trousers. They are uncomfortable questions to answer. It is hard to accept any blame when you're the token victim. Btw - I'm a 'Why' person in general (drives my daughter mad!).

I agree, it's not an easy exercise but it is effective. Often when you cannot get to #5 it means you need to go find the answers.

http://www.isixsigma.com/tools-templates/cause-effect/determine-root-cause-5-whys/

Blowing yourself up in order to kill other people, for whatever insane reason, is really hard to fathom. We owe it to ourselves to find out what would drive a man/women to do this.

“If you don’t ask the right questions, you don’t get the right answers. A question asked in the right way often points to its own answer. Asking questions is the ABC of diagnosis. Only the inquiring mind solves problems.” – Edward Hodnett

Bob24 · 24-03-2016 04:59PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

Ok, that didn't come across well and apologies if I caused offence. What I'm trying to say is that they are indiscriminatory in their targets, you just need to be in a Western place for them to target you. They can't target everyone, so they do unfortunately use random targets.

In that case yes, but the targets aren't all random. There are preferences for symbols of authority (attack on off duty soldiers and police officers in France), journalist or individuals who are critical of Islam (Charlie Hebdo, attack against cartoonist in Copenhagen, attack against Islam talk in the US), and the Jewish community (attack on Jewish school in Toulouse and the Jewish museum in Brussels)

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 05:00PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Now I remember why I put you on ignore before. It was because of childish posts like this. You wanna go back there or do you want to stay with the adults?

Please please please ignore me for good this time. Your spoof depresses me.

I beg you.

Shurimgreat · 24-03-2016 05:01PM

wes wrote: »

There was an attacker in the US, who failed, who said it was in retaliation to the drone strikes in Pakistan. You will get varying levels of motivation. Some are straight forward Religious fanatics, some want to retaliate to what they see as Western attacks on civilians, and others basically want to play a real life Call of Duty (ISIS even invoke that game for some of ther recruitment propaganda).

Exactly. There is no one single unifying root cause bar perhaps Islamic extremism. Each one of these guys seems to have a different set of motives. Baggy is talking nonsense, as usual, trying to tie it all back to "oil". Laughable really.

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 05:02PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Exactly. There is no one single unifying root cause bar perhaps Islamic extremism. Each one of these guys seems to have a different set of motives. Baggy is talking nonsense, as usual, trying to tie it all back to "oil". Laughable really.

I did not mention oil. You are a spoofer.

Shurimgreat · 24-03-2016 05:06PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

Baggy Trousers. They are uncomfortable questions to answer. It is hard to accept any blame when you're the token victim. Btw - I'm a 'Why' person in general (drives my daughter mad!).

Not everyone thinks alike and that includes terrorists. One guy will act because he doesn't like that we are "taking their oil". Another because of drone strikes in Pakistan. Another will act because he doesn't like the music in the local concert venue.

These nutters will always find reasons. Its more about making a statement than any specific cause. IS generally carries out acts like this in desperation to draw attention to its cause.

What we don't need is western apologists like some around here trying to justify their actions. I think we will be waiting for outright condemnation from such people.

Shurimgreat · 24-03-2016 05:09PM

Baggy Trousers wrote: »

I did not mention oil. You are a spoofer.

Didn't mention oil eh?

Baggy Trousers wrote: »

Nearly there.

Problem Statement: Islamic jihadists are bombing civilian targets in Europe.
Why #1 Answer = Because they hate us
Why?
Why #2 Answer = Because they think we are evil.
Why?
Why #3 Answer = Because we bombed the shít out of them
Why?
Why #4 Answer = Because we want their oil
Why?

Your root cause analysis failed miserably! Deal with it.

Next you will be asking us to hug a terrorist!

TheHillOfDoom · 24-03-2016 05:11PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Not everyone thinks alike and that includes terrorists. One guy will act because he doesn't like that we are "taking their oil". Another because of drone strikes in Pakistan. Another will act because he doesn't like the music in the local concert venue.

These nutters will always find reasons. Its more about making a statement than any specific cause. IS generally carries out acts like this in desperation to draw attention to its cause.

What we don't need is western apologists like some around here trying to justify their actions. I think we will be waiting for outright condemnation from such people.

I resent the implication that I am a terrorist apologist! Trying to find the cause of something does not equal condoning the action.

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 05:13PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Didn't mention oil eh?

Your root cause analysis failed miserably! Deal with it.

Next you will be asking us to hug a terrorist!

You muppet, I was repeating Doom's answers to hit the 5 WHYs and you bloody well know it. Grow up.

Baggy Trousers · 24-03-2016 05:13PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

I resent the implication that I am a terrorist apologist! Trying to find the cause of something does not equal condoning the action.

He is a coward.

Shurimgreat · 24-03-2016 05:16PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

I resent the implication that I am a terrorist apologist! Trying to find the cause of something does not equal condoning the action.

Do you think its right that everyone with a gripe etc should go into a railway station and blow themselves and others up, just so the rest of us can try to understand why they did it?

Here's a better idea, everyone in the middle east calm down and stop killing each other in the name of "religion".

TheHillOfDoom · 24-03-2016 05:21PM

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Here's a better idea, everyone in the middle east calm down and stop killing each other in the name of "religion".

Jaysis, that's a great idea. Good work Einstein.

WORLD PEACE. Brought to you by Shurimgreat.......

JustShon · 24-03-2016 05:23PM

TheHillOfDoom wrote: »

Jaysis, that's a great idea. Good work Einstein.

WORLD PEACE. Brought to you by Shurimgreat.......

Shur he's great isn't he?

KERSPLAT! · 24-03-2016 05:24PM

Mod

Shurimgreat and baggy trousers, don't post in this thread again.

Poochie05 · 24-03-2016 05:44PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Anyone have trips to Brussels booked and plan on still going? Personally, going at the end of April and will still go. If you don't, ISIS gets a mark in the win column I think.

Had a work meeting next week and was prepared to go but it has been cancelled. Probably wouldn't go for holidays though as things may not be open or running properly.

Just heard the airport is closed until Sunday at least.

Nodin · 24-03-2016 05:49PM

Alexis Sanchez wrote: »

The same reasons why every Irish male in Northern Ireland didn't join the IRA. Most of them support a United Ireland, they're just not motivated enough to take up arms and kill people for it.

You're the only one offering a simplistic view to this. The poster is just pointing the motive behind ISIS.

Well if he's citing mohammed as the reason, that makes little sense.