Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

Alf Tupper

Deise189 wrote: »

I think one player who rarely gets a mention but deserves it is Shane Fives. He was absolutely incredible yesterday and took his scores superbly! One of the most underrated players in the country and undoubtedly one of the best corner backs in the country at the minute. Delighted to see him playing so well this year after being used as a scapegoat at times last year when our defence was being scrutinised.

True indeed.

Shane is an example to any young lad trying to make the breakthrough. This lad has been on the panel since 2008 and has been f*cked around by every manager since, including the present one. For the lad to be dropped last year for the first round against Cork was unforgivable, especially after being one of our best players in the league.

For Shane to prove the doubters wrong this year, including the selection committee showed unbelievable resolve. He is now undroppable!

If only ever player had to work as hard for selection, our chances would be even more greatly enhanced.

Deise_2012

skaface wrote: »

I'd love to see him in midfield the next day, some man to grab a ball out of the sky,
and well able to run past a tackle and take a score.. Well worth a go there

Midfield? We have Jamie Barron and Kevin Moran there, leave Shane in the corner where he's having a super year. Lads TTM is a gas man, like we're all saying...not a peep out of him here since the Cork game, after the loss yesterday look who's here all of a sudden haha.

thinkstoomuch1

Alf Tupper wrote: »

True indeed.

Shane is an example to any young lad trying to make the breakthrough. This lad has been on the panel since 2008 and has been f*cked around by every manager since, including the present one. For the lad to be dropped last year for the first round against Cork was unforgivable, especially after being one of our best players in the league.

For Shane to prove the doubters wrong this year, including the selection committee showed unbelievable resolve. He is now undroppable!

If only ever player had to work as hard for selection, our chances would be even more greatly enhanced.

I'd agree he's been sustained excellent and is with out any shadow of a doubt one of the best corner backs around

Himself and Barrett of tippeary are the best in the game

thinkstoomuch1

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Midfield? We have Jamie Barron and Kevin Moran there, leave Shane in the corner where he's having a super year. Lads TTM is a gas man, like we're all saying...not a peep out of him here since the Cork game, after the loss yesterday look who's here all of a sudden haha.

Moran was outstanding with elven plays two superb point and one assist


Barron I had doubts at the start of the year but he was superb

Nothing really should change in the defence bar Gleasson worth a try as a forward as he has all the skills for it and to become a better team ye must score more
Out of all the teams left ye with Dublin are probably the ones with least scoring threat from play
Dublin is and ideal chance to work on this

Giveitfong

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Midfield? We have Jamie Barron and Kevin Moran there, leave Shane in the corner where he's having a super year.

Playing Shane Fives in midfield is not as far-fetched as it may at first seem. Jamie Barron doesn't really play in midfield, but in the hole between the wing backs created by Tadhg de Búrca's withdrawn positioning as sweeper. Fives's combination of drive & energy, mobility, ability in the air and good ball skills may not be most effectively used in the corner back position and could be more effectively used in conjunction with Moran in midfield. Stephen Daniels has shown in the past that he can be a very effective corner back.

Darragh Fives should have been brought on last Sunday instead of Shane Bennett to replace Eddie Barrett, as he is much more suited to the kind of role that Barrett was trying to play (but not very successfully). We cannot afford to have a player as good as Darragh Fives on the sideline. Long-term he should take Austin Gleeson's place in the half back line. Gleeson lacks defensive technique (for example, he can't tackle), gives away stupid frees (he could easily have got a red card last Sunday for his swipe at Bonner Maher), wastes good possession with his ridiculous long-distance shooting and rarely gives good ball into the forwards. He showed with his late run which nearly produced a goal his ability to run at defences and should be moved up to the forwards where he could greatly enhance our scoring potential.

paddy13

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

I'm giving an opinion about the match nothing more nothing less
I simply didn't post after the cork match as we had reached cross roads where views were different

We have moved on from the cork game and Cork have thankfully as the last two games showed and were now a fully fit squad for the ist time all year

The game we're taking about is yesterday game and all I'm doing is giving an opinion
That's the only game I'm here to debate and waterford future games
I respect your right to one please respect mine

Back to the topic on hand waterford will be huge favourite and justified so should beat Dublin

Would you change anything for the Dublin game

I would put Glasson up at half forward the next day and see how it works

I agree with you there i would move Gleeson forward and would want more scores from Stephen Bennett or else I'd start Shane or Patrick Curran.
Look I would say we all think we will not win an All Ireland this year, what are looking for is continuous improvement which I believe we seen again Sun even though we lost as the opposition was much more tactical and of better quality.

blueflame

Have read a lot of alternatives such as pulling out the half forwards into midfield, the aim I assume being to crowd the midfield area and leave space in front of the full forward line. In my opinion there is nothing new in this tactic as most counties will allow there center back to sit back and cover the area in from of the full back line to prevent ball being played into the space created The congested area of midfield where our entire half forward line are now operating will result in our extra man (our center forward) being swallowed up amongst the masses. The congestion also results in little time and space to play good quality ball in, which is what is needed to bypass the deep lying center back. Tipp in that past caused us problems using a tactic on Brick by withdrawing Noel McGrath into the center of the field and pushing on their wing forwards. This left Brick with the option of staying at home and covering the space, thereby giving Noel McGrath freedom in midfield with time and space to hurt us with good quality ball or to follow him out and leave a gaping hole in front of our full back line. This type of tactic gave rise to the sweeper system.

I agree that ground hurling has gone out of the game , but that is because the current game is so much about possession. When rucks form, which they do quite regularly, the option of pulling on the ball is gone as the first player who tires it is going to be penalized and possibly booked for dangerous play. I noticed in the recent games that KK seem to have adopted the tactic of almost stamping the ball into the ground to prevent it being moved.

Having looked again and again st last Sunday's game feel the areas we need to tweak are :

- We need a minimum of two in the full forward line and the ball into them has to be into area not right out in the corner but in the general vicinity, because the full back will think twice about abandoning his station in front of goal to support his corner back, At least then we have one on one battles. A big key in this is that when we get the balls in we must have serious support runners coming through the center, and this is where the likes of Moran, Shanahan and Gleeson, have a big part to play.

The experiment with withdrawing Colin Dunford to midfield is not working - he lacks the ability to score from distance, and two many times uses up his touch to son and ends up striking for scores off the hurley. Playing him in the corner though is a different matter entirely and no corner back will like to be isolated on him because he is direct, aggressive and has a good first touch. We should ensure that the opposition sweeper or deep lying center back as the case may be has effectively got someone close to them to ensure that they are occupied, and also give us the option of a man breaking through the center in support of the corner backs when they get the ball - fro me Stephen Bennett would be ideal in this role.

Finally agree that the experiment with Barrett did not work last Sunday, but i feel this had much to do with Match practice and being up to speed. I genuinely feel that Darragh Fives would have suffered from the same problem. Think last Sunday will have done Barrett the world of good. I have seen him in some challenge games recently and he was very effective, so would not be writing him off just yet. As regards Fives the sooner we get more game time out of him the better but do not want him breaking down again so soon. Fives to wing back and Gleeson to Center Field / Half Forward sounds very appetizing.

There is alot of hurling to be done this year yet, let's focus on Dublin and if we get past them, then we will worry about KK.

skaface

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Midfield? We have Jamie Barron and Kevin Moran there, leave Shane in the corner where he's having a super year. Lads TTM is a gas man, like we're all saying...not a peep out of him here since the Cork game, after the loss yesterday look who's here all of a sudden haha.

Fair enough, but would be an option if you wanted to push Moran up front later in the game
if you were behind like we were on Sunday, going into last 10 mins

Jjjjjjjbarry

I think pushing Aussie up in the forwards might be worth the gamble while the risk is changing a defensive line that has worked well.

We have lads who can step into half back but we need a bit of spark and fire up front and he might be the man to do it. He'd be a handful for any defense and that would free up Maurice, Bennett etc a bit more to pick off medium range points and might give Dunford more freedom to run at goals.
At present we might just be a bit too predictable in attack but the one thing with Aussie is that he's unpredictable and that's a forwards biggest weapon :cool:

suitcasepink

I dont know if this is a silly question or not but I wont be home to see the U21 game tomorrow night would anywhere in the city be showing it?

fricatus

deise_girl wrote: »

I dont know if this is a silly question or not but I wont be home to see the U21 game tomorrow night would anywhere in the city be showing it?

Good question... I would nearly just go into any of the bars that show sports, or one of the hotel bars and just ask if there's any chance they might stick it on. A lad I know does this all the time, and unless there's something being actively watched, they are often happy enough to oblige, as long as you've bought a drink.

Twiceasnice97

derek mcgrath needs to hold his nerve here.
the reason waterford lost is because they hit bad wides when tipp were in disarray.
the waterford system had tipps backs in a mess. padraic maher showed for certain that he cant play as the sweeper as his distribution was cat.

if waterford had taken the three or four points they should have gotten tipp would almost certainly have been in serious trouble mentally

hardybuck

Gavlor wrote: »

It'll be funny to see the empty seats on the 26th as the bandwagon hits a speed bump!

I've never seen/heard so many clueless "supporters" at a game as I did yesterday. As somebody else said, they obviously hadn't seen this team play before.

Munster final is a day out every year for people from all over the country. I saw a huge amount of northern cars there for example.

deisedude

hardybuck wrote: »

Munster final is a day out every year for people from all over the country. I saw a huge amount of northern cars there for example.

I heard a group of Tipp lads ask a fella where is the square in Thurles. Nearly died laughing

hurler on de ditch

paddy13 wrote: »

I agree with you there i would move Gleeson forward and would want more scores from Stephen Bennett or else I'd start Shane or Patrick Curran.
Look I would say we all think we will not win an All Ireland this year, what are looking for is continuous improvement which I believe we seen again Sun even though we lost as the opposition was much more tactical and of better quality.

you will only get more from a forward when you play them as one ,,simple really ,,waiting on those lads for a couple of years now ,just to play them in midfield

O Riain

Gavlor wrote: »

It'll be funny to see the empty seats on the 26th as the bandwagon hits a speed bump!

I've never seen/heard so many clueless "supporters" at a game as I did yesterday. As somebody else said, they obviously hadn't seen this team play before.

Rather then complain about the clueless supporters would ya not just say it was great to see a good crowd there instead?

Gavlor

O Riain wrote: »

Rather then complain about the clueless supporters would ya not just say it was great to see a good crowd there instead?

It was brilliant to see such a big crowd from Waterford there, pity some of them where so critical and not too supportive.

Hopefully the same numbers will be there on 26th...

blue note

O Riain wrote: »

Rather then complain about the clueless supporters would ya not just say it was great to see a good crowd there instead?

I've said it many times - I love seeing the clueless supporters at the games. We were all new to the game at some point and some fella without a clue shouting in the stands might very well be an intelligent hurling fan in a couple of years.

Now fellas knocking hurlers is a different story altogether. There was a guy near me in the terrace giving out about Maurice at the start of the game. Sure what could he do fighting for ball outnumbered by Tipp men?! It turns out he could still score 3 points from play which was great in a way to shut him up, but it's beside the point really. Lads should be allowed to have bad games and people are entitled to criticise them, but not to get at all nasty about it.

blueflame

deise_girl wrote: »

I dont know if this is a silly question or not but I wont be home to see the U21 game tomorrow night would anywhere in the city be showing it?

Would try Nicky O'Regans (Iggy's Father's) in the Mayors Walk between Barrack Street and Ballybricken they have a few tellys and while there is nearly always racing on they normally have one on the GAA, a good pub and normally a grand place to watch a game.

deiseach

blue note wrote: »

I've said it many times - I love seeing the clueless supporters at the games. We were all new to the game at some point and some fella without a clue shouting in the stands might very well be an intelligent hurling fan in a couple of years.

Don't know about that. I've been to over a hundred Waterford matches at various levels over the years and I still feel like I know nothing about it.





It's just me, isn't it? Darn . . .

PTH2009

Why is the Limerick vs Tipperary u21 semi on Thursday and ours on Wednesday, they could of easily put the 2 on Thursday giving our senior players another days rest

If we play to our ability 2morrow we will win as this is not a really strong Clare team but they still have class such as Shane o donnell. Our senior players will be hurting since Sunday. Cusack park is also a hard place to beat Clare. Hope it's not a draw

tomwaterford

hardybuck wrote: »

Munster final is a day out every year for people from all over the country. I saw a huge amount of northern cars there for example.

A lot to do with it being the weekend of the 12th (holidays for many in North)

And people used send there teenagers in many cases away for that weekend (sometimes Leinster finals) so not to have them around getting into trouble/riots....this is one of the gaas good points for many in the north



What time is the u21 starting at

skaface

Anyone get their tickets yet for Dublin game??
Tried Queallys garage in Dungarvan earlier, but only section 212 ( over in top corner) Crap
seats available.. Will try again tomorrow.

DE DEISE

7.30 pm TG4

DE DEISE

skaface wrote: »

Anyone get their tickets yet for Dublin game??
Tried Queallys garage in Dungarvan earlier, but only section 212 ( over in top corner) Crap
seats available.. Will try again tomorrow.

Got section 118 not too bad around its around the 45 U.S. Line

Deisegodeo

skaface wrote: »

Anyone get their tickets yet for Dublin game??
Tried Queallys garage in Dungarvan earlier, but only section 212 ( over in top corner) Crap
seats available.. Will try again tomorrow.

Got my tickets today, in Super Valu in the city. Section 210 which isnt fantastic but i needed to get a good few tickets and got caught for the Munster Final, left it too late and ended up in the terrace, which was good craic but with the double header the seat is more appealing.

PTH2009

Deisegodeo wrote: »

Got my tickets today, in Super Valu in the city. Section 210 which isnt fantastic but i needed to get a good few tickets and got caught for the Munster Final, left it too late and ended up in the terrace, which was good craic but with the double header the seat is more appealing.

Got 203 row g last night

tomwaterford

Deisegodeo wrote: »

Got my tickets today, in Super Valu in the city. Section 210 which isnt fantastic but i needed to get a good few tickets and got caught for the Munster Final, left it too late and ended up in the terrace, which was good craic but with the double header the seat is more appealing.

AFAIK there's minor on at 12 (think its Limerick)

Gavlor

Clubs will get the best tickets, centra & tickets.ie tend to get the sides of the stands.

PTH2009

Have a feeling both brick and Shane o Sullivan will call it a day at the end of the season. Kevin Moran hopefully has about 3-4 years left