Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

PTH2009

crottys lake wrote: »

Final score in Holycross . Limerick 1-30 Waterford 3-17.

Limerick had one of their final workouts before their upcoming Championship match against Clare in a few weeks time when at near full strength they beat Waterford by the above score. Waterford rallied well after being some way behind to finish within 7 points. The Shannonsiders were prolific from long range with most of their marquee names contributing. They looked well up to Championship pace ,as one would expect and they are going to give Clare some rattle when they meet. I cannot call that game yet.

Shane Roche [Shamrocks] looked very solid at full back.Michael Harney scored an excellent goal [our third, D J Foran and Donie Breathnach got the others ] when he came on and this lad has a future. He is very strong and has a great attitude. Gavin O'Brien stuck over some fine scores as did Shane O'Sullivan amongst others. Stephen Daniels had a fine game. Eddie Barrett is slowly regaining his undoubted ability and will relish a few more of these matches to get back to his best. Waterford played almost everybody that travelled and when you consider that none of the starting 15 from last Sunday saw game time we have to be happy [S O'S and Brian O' did come on v Tipp].

Good to see Stephen Daniels back. Munster is going to very strong this year but I think Clare will win it and will also win the all Ireland imo

stumblingblock

PTH2009 wrote: »

Good to see Stephen Daniels back. Munster is going to very strong this year but I think Clare will win it and will also win the all Ireland imo

You could well be right PTH, but Galvin is a huge loss to them if he goes to the States. He has been their best player along with Kelly imo the past couple years. Considering theyve lost Podge Collins aswell its a setback.

I honestly think anyone of 8 teams could win it this year. It will the most wide open championship in years. I do feel that both Tipp and KK will end up at the business end again if they avoid each other, but ourselves, dublin, galway and cork are all pretty close behind. I wouldnt be sure about Limerick I think they missed a big opportunity last year, and I dont think TJ Ryan is the manager hes being made out to be. Donal O'Grady and Allen have done most of the good work with that team.

It will be the team who hits the right form at the right time will win it. My fear for us is that we could be peaking too early. Were young and fresh now and on the crest of a wave which is good, but other counties will be targeting later in the summer to hit top gear.

PTH2009

stumblingblock wrote: »

You could well be right PTH, but Galvin is a huge loss to them if he goes to the States. He has been their best player along with Kelly imo the past couple years. Considering theyve lost Podge Collins aswell its a setback.

I honestly think anyone of 8 teams could win it this year. It will the most wide open championship in years. I do feel that both Tipp and KK will end up at the business end again if they avoid each other, but ourselves, dublin, galway and cork are all pretty close behind. I wouldnt be sure about Limerick I think they missed a big opportunity last year, and I dont think TJ Ryan is the manager hes being made out to be. Donal O'Grady and Allen have done most of the good work with that team.

It will be the team who hits the right form at the right time will win it. My fear for us is that we could be peaking too early. Were young and fresh now and on the crest of a wave which is good, but other counties will be targeting later in the summer to hit top gear.

You could be right we could be peaking too early . It would be a shame to lose the Munster semi and then get knocked out in the first round of the qualifiers by galway or wexford. It would not surprise me if we had a short summer look at derry in the football last year they made the division 1 final last year and got knocked out in the first round of the qualifiers. For us when we ever got too a league final we always had a long summer afterwards hopefully this years no different

thinkstoomuch1

stumblingblock wrote: »

You could well be right PTH, but Galvin is a huge loss to them if he goes to the States. He has been their best player along with Kelly imo the past couple years. Considering theyve lost Podge Collins aswell its a setback.

I honestly think anyone of 8 teams could win it this year. It will the most wide open championship in years. I do feel that both Tipp and KK will end up at the business end again if they avoid each other, but ourselves, dublin, galway and cork are all pretty close behind. I wouldnt be sure about Limerick I think they missed a big opportunity last year, and I dont think TJ Ryan is the manager hes being made out to be. Donal O'Grady and Allen have done most of the good work with that team.

It will be the team who hits the right form at the right time will win it. My fear for us is that we could be peaking too early. Were young and fresh now and on the crest of a wave which is good, but other counties will be targeting later in the summer to hit top gear.

I do with agree with some points but imo eight contenders for the all Ireland no way
Tipp if they have KK beaten by some one else
Tipp have win it this year as there imo in for bleak future with appointment Michael Ryan there far too long as selector and then manager too stale imo set up
Galway have one performance in them but outgrown cunningham as Cyril farell said last year and certainly won't win this year
Clsre serious contenders as two KK games proved
Yea have few issues but do do others but they have a serious coach and team
Limerick have no chance absolutely nome and I agree totally tj over rated absolutely way over rated
O grady done good, Allen was good in ways but an awful tactical manager as time cork and limerick in big games proved
What saved him both cases was came in cork and limerick after o grady imo
Dublin are going to be a serious team and are adding real pace and I expect them to do well but all Ireland this year no in too early
Waterford are coming talent wise but to compare them to be like clare imo is far fetched in clare had won under twenty one and got to point to KK minor final and had proven manager at senior so Waterford if management up to it down the line yes win all Ireland but this year no
Cork could imo beat KK in jbm teams always like KK in championship, cork don't really ever belive inferior complex there and always under dog these games cork v KK do well but problem is full back and unless it's solved won't beat KK
KK imo are ahead of the pack as despite their problems cosy has always had ruthless approach in no soft minded approach to cull panel when needed and make good players senior elite level and this insane ability to know when former greats are in decline and have ruthless bold courage to leave emotions aside and drop them all for the evolution and betterment KK hurling

Actually when KK are in transition it's imo quite scary in a new breed of young hungry KK hurler is born that then could dominate for years
Wexford are good bet for good run in the qualifying series but won't win an all Ireland
You would have to think also no team won all Ireland since wexford in twenty years almost from division two so unlikely limerick or Waterford or wexford will bridge the gap now
There's imo only four teams clsre KK tipp and cork but cork probably weakest of the four in no full back
The rest outside of the top four imo have a full back but then have way too many other problems outside that position

Fireball07

crottys lake wrote: »

Final score in Holycross . Limerick 1-30 Waterford 3-17.

Limerick had one of their final workouts before their upcoming Championship match against Clare in a few weeks time when at near full strength they beat Waterford by the above score. Waterford rallied well after being some way behind to finish within 7 points. The Shannonsiders were prolific from long range with most of their marquee names contributing. They looked well up to Championship pace ,as one would expect and they are going to give Clare some rattle when they meet. I cannot call that game yet.

Shane Roche [Shamrocks] looked very solid at full back.Michael Harney scored an excellent goal [our third, D J Foran and Donie Breathnach got the others ] when he came on and this lad has a future. He is very strong and has a great attitude. Gavin O'Brien stuck over some fine scores as did Shane O'Sullivan amongst others. Stephen Daniels had a fine game. Eddie Barrett is slowly regaining his undoubted ability and will relish a few more of these matches to get back to his best. Waterford played almost everybody that travelled and when you consider that none of the starting 15 from last Sunday saw game time we have to be happy [S O'S and Brian O' did come on v Tipp].

Did we (Limerick) bring on many subs? Any unusual tactical experiments?

3ships

Thanks for the report Crottys Lake. Limerick only really missing a keeper, Hickey and one or two others. There is really a good panel in Waterford now and this should sustain us during the summer. Great to see Daniels in there. Was there any sign of Daragh Fives at all, cheers

crottys lake

Darragh is on the verge of a return. Just needs the next couple of weeks to go as planned and if it goes as expected then happy days. I have said here before how highly I rate him as a centre back.

3ships

I don't know why you would rule out a team on the basis of being 'Division 2'. It might effect your early championship but shouldn't deter after.

Over the last 20 years division one, for a lot of the time, has comprised of 12 teams split evenly. Division 2 winners over the period have been Meath, Laois, Westmeath, Down and even Wicklow got to a final. Unlikely All Ireland winners there. The division was re engineered a couple of times, it had 8 for a couple of years generally led by Wexford Offaly Clare and Limerick while at low ebbs.

The latest incarnation (titled 1B) has been won by Clare 2012 (AI winners within 15 months), Dublin 2013 provincial champions after and AI contenders that August, the same for Cork in 2014. Waterford have already made up any deficit associated with playing at a lower level in the last month.

Munster Champions also hardly have a good record over the period. You could dismiss a team on the basis of not being Kilkenny.

It's a 9 team race but probably as ever 8 teams will think there is one team to beat.

crottys lake

Fireball07 wrote: »

Did we (Limerick) bring on many subs? Any unusual tactical experiments?

Limerick used their bench also, Green was flying. Richie McCarthy was very solid. Waterford were not as rigid as during the League so that meant Limerick were able to impose themselves upon us with a bit more freedom and they went about their business well. Whilst you should never have allowed your messiah [ Donal] to leave only a fool would write your team off v Clare, especially with the major unrest that is still pertaining in that camp.

crottys lake

That was a typo, Breen not Green.

Deise189

Random question but does anyone know where Jamie Barron went to school before Fintan O Connor brought him to blackwater to play Harty? Trying to settle a discussion!

archieknox

Deise189 wrote: »

Random question but does anyone know where Jamie Barron went to school before Fintan O Connor brought him to blackwater to play Harty? Trying to settle a discussion!

Dungarvan CBS

Cornerstoner

archieknox wrote: »

Dungarvan CBS

Left Dungarvan under the illusion Blackwater were going to win the Harty with him on board. Ironically, they didn't even make it out if the group and the Dungarvan colleges combination team he left won it. Justice for the poaching that Blackwater were at under Denis Ring

Giveitfong

crottys lake wrote: »

That was a typo, Breen not Green.

Thanks for the report, Crotty's Lake. Could you give us the full Waterford lineout and the subs who played?

crottys lake

Giveitfong wrote: »

Thanks for the report, Crotty's Lake. Could you give us the full Waterford lineout and the subs who played?

This is how they actually lined out.

1.Iggy
2. Shane McNulty
3. Shane Roche was very impressive v Shane Dowling
4. Pa Walsh
5. Mark O' Brien
6. Paudi Prendegast [ scored sideline cut from 40 yards]
7. Stephen Daniels was very impressive v Declan Hannon
8. Eddie Barrett
9. Shane O'Sullivan
10. Martin O'Neill
11. Tom Devine
12. Gavin O'Brien
13. Donie Breathnach [goal]
14. D J Foran [goal]
15. Brian O'Halloran.

Subs used : Tommy Waring, Cormac Curran, Michael Harney [goal and impressive] Tommy Connors and Conor Murray.

I apologise to any player I have left out but I think that was it. Daniels is seriously on way back. Shane Roche is a prospect as is Michael Harney.

thinkstoomuch1

crottys lake wrote: »

This is how they actually lined out.

1.Iggy
2. Shane McNulty
3. Shane Roche was very impressive v Shane Dowling
4. Pa Walsh
5. Mark O' Brien
6. Paudi Prendegast [ scored sideline cut from 40 yards]
7. Stephen Daniels was very impressive v Declan Hannon
8. Eddie Barrett
9. Shane O'Sullivan
10. Martin O'Neill
11. Tom Devine
12. Gavin O'Brien
13. Donie Breathnach [goal]
14. D J Foran [goal]
15. Brian O'Halloran.

Subs used : Tommy Waring, Cormac Curran, Michael Harney [goal and impressive] Tommy Connors and Conor Murray.

I apologise to any player I have left out but I think that was it. Daniels is seriously on way back. Shane Roche is a prospect as is Michael Harney.

Great report
Did limerick play a sweeper or orthodox

crottys lake

They did not play a sweeper, but when we moved out they followed us which would be suicidal for them to do against Clare but if Limerick get their tactics correct then they can beat Clare.

thinkstoomuch1

crottys lake wrote: »

They did not play a sweeper, but when we moved out they followed us which would be suicidal for them to do against Clare but if Limerick get their tactics correct then they can beat Clare.

That's what I thought there unfortunately as night follow day so predictable under Ryan
They won't change for clare in Ryan too old school old habits die hard
Thanks for that appreciate it

Dara Mac Donnell

This was published in the Irish Times last Saturday the 18th of april prior to the win over Tipp.


Derek McGrath’s plan for Waterford is coming together

Manager is maturing in his roll along with his youthful team who are proving their worth

Malachy Clerkin

On the day before St Patrick’s Day 2014, Derek McGrath’s Waterford side arrived in Ennis with their step light and their smile easy. With three games gone in the league, they were second only on points difference and had just beaten Dublin and Galway, the two sides most likely to be in their neighbourhood when relegation visited. They weren’t yet safe but they felt secure.

Not that it was worth a whole pile to them. McGrath decided against changing up the gameplan that had just brought two victories in a row and didn’t drop anyone back in front of his full-back line. Davy Fitz’s All-Ireland champions made merry at their expense.

Podge Collins wandered out the pitch, leaving Shane O’Donnell and Conor McGrath inside on their own to plunder and pillage at will. O’Donnell scored 1-2 and set up another 3-3 in the first-half alone. Clare led by 22 points at half-time and end up with 5-20 on the board.

For the young Waterford manager, it was a cold and broken hallelujah. Not so much a lesson learned as one beaten into him the old fashioned way. Hands out, eyes closed, ruler across the knuckles. It wasn’t about tactics or hurling acumen, as might have appeared to those watching on. It was more about deciding what sort of manager he wanted to be.

“I blame myself completely for that,” he says. “I should have changed it for that game and gone more defensive. The two previous weekends, we had had good wins over Dublin and Galway. I think in a way, it meant that we came down to Clare reasonably confident in the game we were playing. And that game was fairly attack-minded at the time.

“But we were just probably a bit afraid to go away from what we’d been doing to win the two games beforehand. We just got gutted by following our men out the field. Clare were just delighted that we did that and left space inside.

Clean sheet
“After that, we played Kilkenny and confidence was low and we got another hiding. Everything is questioned then, everything is put in the spotlight. So psychologically, that Clare game probably had an effect alright.”

No kidding. Their record for the rest of the year went on to read: Played 6 Won 1 Lost 4 Drew 1 For 6-103 Against 13-114. Their only win came against Laois in a qualifier, their only clean sheet in the replay against Cork where JBM’s side popped over 28 points without breaking sweat.

As a young manager in his debut season, McGrath was afforded a certain measure of grace, albeit hardly enough to be getting squiffy on. By instinct, he sees a hurling pitch as a space to be protected first and exploited later. This is a not a world view that gets a lot of takers in a county that’s just had a decade and more of Mullane, Dan, Kelly, Ken, Flynn and Tony Browne.

“I won’t say that Waterford people are slow to accept change. But the GAA is a traditional organisation and Waterford is a traditional county. It has been known for traditional hurling, purist’s hurling. Last year, as a first-year manager, I would have been a bit intimidated by outside perceptions, in terms of how a Waterford team is expected to play. Just a small bit now. I wouldn’t call myself naive but I just think I maybe wasn’t my own man enough.

“I learned the importance of being yourself and staying true to yourself. I learned to deal with the scrutiny. It’s trusting yourself that you know the game and not coming across as boastful about it. I was probably a little bit paranoid. Well, maybe not paranoid but a bit introspective about it and over-analytical. I wasn’t really able to enjoy it for a while because it felt like every small thing became an issue.”

Going into 2015 he decided on two major changes, both of which had been coming, neither of which would be popular. To begin, he cleaned house. Though players like Liam Lawlor, Jamie Nagle and Richie Foley still had plenty to give, he cut them loose and said he was going with youth instead. There is general acceptance in the county too that not all of Stephen Molumphy, Séamus Prendergast and Shane Walsh were exactly itching to retire and that there was probably an element of jumping before they felt a hand at their back.

Immediate resistance
There was immediate resistance. Division 1B hurling can be ding-dong stuff at the best of times but now with Limerick and Wexford surging and Laois and Offaly finding a rhythm too, there wasn’t a huge appetite for throwing a gaggle of kids at the league and hoping for the best. McGrath didn’t recognise himself in that characterisation though and happily presented himself at county board meetings to explain his thinking.

“I suppose the simple question is were the county board really on the same wavelength as me when it came to playing the young lads and the answer is not really. That’s without being disparaging to the county board. I can understand completely their viewpoint. But I just felt the thing needed a shake-up and needed a change.

“Fellas who were of huge importance to the panel over a number of years were being omitted and the perception was . . . not that we didn’t know what we were doing exactly but it was a big risk, definitely. But I just felt that was the way to go.”

What were those meetings like?

“Well, what you got from the board were reasonable questions as regards the direction that the panel was going in. Were they too young? Would it not be worth keeping a bit more experience around? Given the away fixtures in the league where we’d be having to go to Limerick, Wexford and Offaly, would we not be needing some of the more established fellas who knew their way around those kind of games?

“I didn’t mind that. It was never a case of us taking offence or saying that we were going to go out now and prove the board wrong. The board are doing their job to the best of their ability – there are constraints there and there’s nothing anyone can do about them.

“But while we might be looking at 1B and saying that it’s good for team-building, the financial implications of being in 1A are the reality of it for the board. At the end of the day, I’m trying to balance the board’s expectations of me with realism and pragmatism.”

Allied to the new broom, he vowed never to walk off after a game again with regrets over leaving his team so ripe for the picking. By the middle of the championship last year, he was already playing with seven and eight in defence at times but now he wanted to dial in a system that would make them secure in every game.

Waterford line up for most games now in what is probably best described as a 3-5-4-1-1 formation. It changes and shape-shifts depending on the situation but in terms of first principles, that’s what McGrath has gone for. He has moved his most promising young forward Austin Gleeson to centre-back and shifted three-time All Star defender Brick Walsh to centre-forward.

Declaration of intent
The numbers tell their own story. In six league games in 2014, Waterford conceded 17-89. In six so far in 2015, that total is down to 3-80. Even allowing for the step down in quality of opposition, that’s a declaration of intent. Three goals is the fewest conceded by any team in the top two divisions and two of those have come from penalties. Call it a blanket, call it whatever.

“You’re backing young lads and you’re putting your trust in them and you’re leaving yourself on a parapet to be absolutely shot and criticised hugely. But that’s what has to be done I think. I pointed this out to the board the other night – I just felt that even if Division 1B hadn’t gone as well as it did and we weren’t in a Division One semi-final, we still made the right decision. I think we’ve gradually established that it was the way to go. I was willing to ride the storm, if you like.

“There were a couple of pundits in Waterford who were giving out that Waterford weren’t playing traditional hurling. And then the same pundits are texting me this year, saying we’re doing great and playing great stuff. And I’m going, ‘Well hang on, we’re playing completely the same way. Am I the short-sighted one here or are you?’”

The notices have been kind in places, not so in others. Everyone loves an underdog story until they look like becoming a nuisance to the big boys. There has even been some throwing around of the ultimate insult – that McGrath’s system is stolen from football. Wait till they hear that he spent every day of secondary school in a classroom with Jason Ryan, not to mention going to UCC with Éamonn Fitzmaurice.

“I see where people will make comparisons with the football or with Donegal, etc. But I think people would probably need to have a good look at a game like Limerick v Kilkenny last year. And I mean a four-hour look at that game. Or even Kilkenny v Tipp.

“If they come back to me after looking at those games and tell me it was conventional hurling all the way, then they’re looking at something completely different to what I’m looking at. If people think that Galway’s 2012 march to the final and Clare’s subsequent win in 2013 were conventional, I’d challenge them on that.

“At the core of everything we do and central to what we’re about is the fact that we’re proud to play for our county. We’re proud to build our team on old-fashioned values like honesty and integrity and respect for hard work. But that’s what all good teams are based on.

“It’s just that when you see Colin Fennelly getting back to pull off a hook inside his own 21 on a Limerick player, it’s put down as hard work. When you see a Waterford player getting back to hook a player in his own 21, it’s the feckin’ Donegal of hurling.

“Kilkenny are brilliant at putting out this image of playing simple hurling. You see when any of them are interviewed, they portray a very simple game. But I think that’s very far from the truth to be honest.”

One way or another, they are who they are and he is who he is. Tipperary in Nowlan Park will be the greatest test yet. McGrath still sees them as the fifth of five horses in Munster and all he wants is for them to start getting the trip with the rest of them.

‘Humble kids’
“We think we’re trying to do something and we might not get the victories but it still might be the right way for us to do it. I love it. I absolutely love it. I love the fact that there are 10 or 11 guys there who were in school with me as kids and now they’re intercounty players. I love that I have a group of humble kids, nice lads that are looking to improve.

“From Brick all the way down to the youngest of them, these fellas are only interested in the team. There’s absolutely no egos in the team. I love that part of it. I love the fact that we’re together and every time I go training, I’m able to park any negativity that was there last year. I’m stronger because of it.”


© 2015 THE IRISH TIMES

PTH2009

Dara Mac Donnell wrote: »

This was published in the Irish Times last Saturday the 18th of april prior to the win over Tipp.


Derek McGrath’s plan for Waterford is coming together

Manager is maturing in his roll along with his youthful team who are proving their worth

Malachy Clerkin

On the day before St Patrick’s Day 2014, Derek McGrath’s Waterford side arrived in Ennis with their step light and their smile easy. With three games gone in the league, they were second only on points difference and had just beaten Dublin and Galway, the two sides most likely to be in their neighbourhood when relegation visited. They weren’t yet safe but they felt secure.

Not that it was worth a whole pile to them. McGrath decided against changing up the gameplan that had just brought two victories in a row and didn’t drop anyone back in front of his full-back line. Davy Fitz’s All-Ireland champions made merry at their expense.

Podge Collins wandered out the pitch, leaving Shane O’Donnell and Conor McGrath inside on their own to plunder and pillage at will. O’Donnell scored 1-2 and set up another 3-3 in the first-half alone. Clare led by 22 points at half-time and end up with 5-20 on the board.

For the young Waterford manager, it was a cold and broken hallelujah. Not so much a lesson learned as one beaten into him the old fashioned way. Hands out, eyes closed, ruler across the knuckles. It wasn’t about tactics or hurling acumen, as might have appeared to those watching on. It was more about deciding what sort of manager he wanted to be.

“I blame myself completely for that,” he says. “I should have changed it for that game and gone more defensive. The two previous weekends, we had had good wins over Dublin and Galway. I think in a way, it meant that we came down to Clare reasonably confident in the game we were playing. And that game was fairly attack-minded at the time.

“But we were just probably a bit afraid to go away from what we’d been doing to win the two games beforehand. We just got gutted by following our men out the field. Clare were just delighted that we did that and left space inside.

Clean sheet
“After that, we played Kilkenny and confidence was low and we got another hiding. Everything is questioned then, everything is put in the spotlight. So psychologically, that Clare game probably had an effect alright.”

No kidding. Their record for the rest of the year went on to read: Played 6 Won 1 Lost 4 Drew 1 For 6-103 Against 13-114. Their only win came against Laois in a qualifier, their only clean sheet in the replay against Cork where JBM’s side popped over 28 points without breaking sweat.

As a young manager in his debut season, McGrath was afforded a certain measure of grace, albeit hardly enough to be getting squiffy on. By instinct, he sees a hurling pitch as a space to be protected first and exploited later. This is a not a world view that gets a lot of takers in a county that’s just had a decade and more of Mullane, Dan, Kelly, Ken, Flynn and Tony Browne.

“I won’t say that Waterford people are slow to accept change. But the GAA is a traditional organisation and Waterford is a traditional county. It has been known for traditional hurling, purist’s hurling. Last year, as a first-year manager, I would have been a bit intimidated by outside perceptions, in terms of how a Waterford team is expected to play. Just a small bit now. I wouldn’t call myself naive but I just think I maybe wasn’t my own man enough.

“I learned the importance of being yourself and staying true to yourself. I learned to deal with the scrutiny. It’s trusting yourself that you know the game and not coming across as boastful about it. I was probably a little bit paranoid. Well, maybe not paranoid but a bit introspective about it and over-analytical. I wasn’t really able to enjoy it for a while because it felt like every small thing became an issue.”

Going into 2015 he decided on two major changes, both of which had been coming, neither of which would be popular. To begin, he cleaned house. Though players like Liam Lawlor, Jamie Nagle and Richie Foley still had plenty to give, he cut them loose and said he was going with youth instead. There is general acceptance in the county too that not all of Stephen Molumphy, Séamus Prendergast and Shane Walsh were exactly itching to retire and that there was probably an element of jumping before they felt a hand at their back.

Immediate resistance
There was immediate resistance. Division 1B hurling can be ding-dong stuff at the best of times but now with Limerick and Wexford surging and Laois and Offaly finding a rhythm too, there wasn’t a huge appetite for throwing a gaggle of kids at the league and hoping for the best. McGrath didn’t recognise himself in that characterisation though and happily presented himself at county board meetings to explain his thinking.

“I suppose the simple question is were the county board really on the same wavelength as me when it came to playing the young lads and the answer is not really. That’s without being disparaging to the county board. I can understand completely their viewpoint. But I just felt the thing needed a shake-up and needed a change.

“Fellas who were of huge importance to the panel over a number of years were being omitted and the perception was . . . not that we didn’t know what we were doing exactly but it was a big risk, definitely. But I just felt that was the way to go.”

What were those meetings like?

“Well, what you got from the board were reasonable questions as regards the direction that the panel was going in. Were they too young? Would it not be worth keeping a bit more experience around? Given the away fixtures in the league where we’d be having to go to Limerick, Wexford and Offaly, would we not be needing some of the more established fellas who knew their way around those kind of games?

“I didn’t mind that. It was never a case of us taking offence or saying that we were going to go out now and prove the board wrong. The board are doing their job to the best of their ability – there are constraints there and there’s nothing anyone can do about them.

“But while we might be looking at 1B and saying that it’s good for team-building, the financial implications of being in 1A are the reality of it for the board. At the end of the day, I’m trying to balance the board’s expectations of me with realism and pragmatism.”

Allied to the new broom, he vowed never to walk off after a game again with regrets over leaving his team so ripe for the picking. By the middle of the championship last year, he was already playing with seven and eight in defence at times but now he wanted to dial in a system that would make them secure in every game.

Waterford line up for most games now in what is probably best described as a 3-5-4-1-1 formation. It changes and shape-shifts depending on the situation but in terms of first principles, that’s what McGrath has gone for. He has moved his most promising young forward Austin Gleeson to centre-back and shifted three-time All Star defender Brick Walsh to centre-forward.

Declaration of intent
The numbers tell their own story. In six league games in 2014, Waterford conceded 17-89. In six so far in 2015, that total is down to 3-80. Even allowing for the step down in quality of opposition, that’s a declaration of intent. Three goals is the fewest conceded by any team in the top two divisions and two of those have come from penalties. Call it a blanket, call it whatever.

“You’re backing young lads and you’re putting your trust in them and you’re leaving yourself on a parapet to be absolutely shot and criticised hugely. But that’s what has to be done I think. I pointed this out to the board the other night – I just felt that even if Division 1B hadn’t gone as well as it did and we weren’t in a Division One semi-final, we still made the right decision. I think we’ve gradually established that it was the way to go. I was willing to ride the storm, if you like.

“There were a couple of pundits in Waterford who were giving out that Waterford weren’t playing traditional hurling. And then the same pundits are texting me this year, saying we’re doing great and playing great stuff. And I’m going, ‘Well hang on, we’re playing completely the same way. Am I the short-sighted one here or are you?’”

The notices have been kind in places, not so in others. Everyone loves an underdog story until they look like becoming a nuisance to the big boys. There has even been some throwing around of the ultimate insult – that McGrath’s system is stolen from football. Wait till they hear that he spent every day of secondary school in a classroom with Jason Ryan, not to mention going to UCC with Éamonn Fitzmaurice.

“I see where people will make comparisons with the football or with Donegal, etc. But I think people would probably need to have a good look at a game like Limerick v Kilkenny last year. And I mean a four-hour look at that game. Or even Kilkenny v Tipp.

“If they come back to me after looking at those games and tell me it was conventional hurling all the way, then they’re looking at something completely different to what I’m looking at. If people think that Galway’s 2012 march to the final and Clare’s subsequent win in 2013 were conventional, I’d challenge them on that.

“At the core of everything we do and central to what we’re about is the fact that we’re proud to play for our county. We’re proud to build our team on old-fashioned values like honesty and integrity and respect for hard work. But that’s what all good teams are based on.

“It’s just that when you see Colin Fennelly getting back to pull off a hook inside his own 21 on a Limerick player, it’s put down as hard work. When you see a Waterford player getting back to hook a player in his own 21, it’s the feckin’ Donegal of hurling.

“Kilkenny are brilliant at putting out this image of playing simple hurling. You see when any of them are interviewed, they portray a very simple game. But I think that’s very far from the truth to be honest.”

One way or another, they are who they are and he is who he is. Tipperary in Nowlan Park will be the greatest test yet. McGrath still sees them as the fifth of five horses in Munster and all he wants is for them to start getting the trip with the rest of them.

‘Humble kids’
“We think we’re trying to do something and we might not get the victories but it still might be the right way for us to do it. I love it. I absolutely love it. I love the fact that there are 10 or 11 guys there who were in school with me as kids and now they’re intercounty players. I love that I have a group of humble kids, nice lads that are looking to improve.

“From Brick all the way down to the youngest of them, these fellas are only interested in the team. There’s absolutely no egos in the team. I love that part of it. I love the fact that we’re together and every time I go training, I’m able to park any negativity that was there last year. I’m stronger because of it.”


© 2015 THE IRISH TIMES

We deff are a much better set up this year than last year. So far bringing in youth has worked but if we were not relegated last year would we have survived 1a this year ??.

Mountainlad

I dunno about the whole youth thing being churned out. Ok, so a few more of the minors from 2013 were drafted into the Senior team and some of them played during the league but this is nothing new.

If you look at last weekend's starting 15, every single one of them was on the panel last year. The big difference for me is injuries, Maurice, Barron, O'Halloran, Bennett, Philip Mahony missed basically all of last year and Jake Dillon was struggling with fitness for a lot of it.

They look fitter, Tadhg Bourke and Gleeson are a year older, they've improved the system and I think changes in the backroom have far from been a hindrance and those players mentioned are available. I think that's pretty much why there has been a marked improvement in a nutshell.

HatchetMan7

If you were picking the team where would you play Austin Gleeson?

I'm thinking if we are going to play a 2 man full forward line then having Maurice and Gleeson up there they could win their fair share of high ball and be difficult to stop with ball in hand.

crottys lake

HatchetMan7 wrote: »

If you were picking the team where would you play Austin Gleeson?

I'm thinking if we are going to play a 2 man full forward line then having Maurice and Gleeson up there they could win their fair share of high ball and be difficult to stop with ball in hand.

Darragh Fives should be moving into centre back therefore allowing Tadgh to go wing back and thus releasing Austin Gleeson to wing forward.

tomwaterford

crottys lake wrote: »

Darragh Fives should be moving into centre back therefore allowing Tadgh to go wing back and thus releasing Austin Gleeson to wing forward.

Would it not wrong Tadhg be burca by moving him outta centre back??

deisedude

tomwaterford wrote: »

Would it not wrong Tadhg be burca by moving him outta centre back??

And catapulting Daragh Fives who has injured for quite a while into the most pivotal position on the field would be major risk

crottys lake

tomwaterford wrote: »

Would it not wrong Tadhg be burca by moving him outta centre back??

I would not be worried at all about moving Darragh straight in there. I think he is our best option. He reads the game so well and his quick thinking decisions are a major plus. He is very quick also and has vision. Tadhg has been brilliant and has been doing a lot of sweeping, therefore he is on the ball a lot. Darragh is more of a natural centre back whereas Tadhg can play the wing back position brilliantly. The move would also make us a bit more attack minded allowing both those boys to run and perhaps get a few long range scores and our gameplan is predicated on that.

Austin Gleeson ,as brilliant as he is would be much more effective in the wing forward position. His failure to pinpoint Dunford with obvious ball the last day instead of going for the' hail Mary' score and his ability to run at defenders from the forward/midfield area would see him to much better advantage. In fact Gleeson could be an unstoppable force there and create a new dynamic to the team.

Daniels was superb the other night and basically just needs his speed training upped now and when that happens he will push for his place bigtime.

tomwaterford

Think myself it would be a questionable move to parachute fives in at centre back for a league final/championship match....when at the moment that half back line is playing very well

I'm not doubting he's good....but I've not seen de burca put a foot wrong....even last year when wat.were being hammered he was one of the few who emerged with some sort of respectability for keeping playing until the end??

HatchetMan7

If Waterford can get goals whilst still protecting our full back line we'll be hard to beat. If we are playing a 2 man full forward line with a half forward line pushed closer to midfield then the two players inside need to be mobile, good in the air, strong and be able to take on 2/3 defenders to create goal chances. Both Gleeson and Maurice have these attributes and IMO would cause Cork some serious trouble next week.

redlead

HatchetMan7 wrote: »

If Waterford can get goals whilst still protecting our full back line we'll be hard to beat. If we are playing a 2 man full forward line with a half forward line pushed closer to midfield then the two players inside need to be mobile, good in the air, strong and be able to take on 2/3 defenders to create goal chances. Both Gleeson and Maurice have these attributes and IMO would cause Cork some serious trouble next week.

The problem is you might as well say if we had 17 players whilst still protecting our full back line we would be hard to beat. The way we are set up we just aren't going to score that many goals because a one man full forward line is going to struggle no matter what personnel we have.

What happened against Tipp was exactly what my fear was - someone would get a couple of goals against us, our gameplan would go out the window and we'd lose because we don't have the firepower to outpoint the top teams after they score goals against us. The only difference is that this happened and we still won. While the system is working we might as well keep at it. We won't be scoring goals though. Teams really seem to be struggling with it this year so God knows how far we might go. It could be far ....

HatchetMan7

redlead wrote: »

The problem is you might as well say if we had 17 players whilst still protecting our full back line we would be hard to beat. The way we are set up we just aren't going to score that many goals because a one man full forward line is going to struggle no matter what personnel we have.

What happened against Tipp was exactly what my fear was - someone would get a couple of goals against us, our gameplan would go out the window and we'd lose because we don't have the firepower to outpoint the top teams after they score goals against us. The only difference is that this happened and we still won. While the system is working we might as well keep at it. We won't be scoring goals though. Teams really seem to be struggling with it this year so God knows how far we might go. It could be far ....

We do create goal chances just not many of them. We probably created about 3 goal chances on average in our last few games unfortunately we only scored one against tipp. Devine was unlucky not to get one against tipp. Gleeson last year against Cork won the ball and had about 4/5 defenders close to him and still got a goal, i think if he wins a few balls within 30/40 yards from goal, he might be hard to stop, Maurice the same. I'm not saying we should be playing as defensively as we are but if we are then we need ball winners closer to goal. With the way we are playing 1/2 goals per game is enough IMO.