A treatise on Mick Wallace

CramCycle

lanos wrote: »

so he's paying it back
fair play to him

Indeed, better than getting nothing, although I suspect his deal was more to do with the fact that revenue would rather something than nothing, which is the right choice for them and Mick will pay as little as he can get away with with as the other option forces him to lose his seat and salary.

I wonder how long Sean Quinn will take to pay back IBRC
how about never ? - (I realise hes not a TD but loads of people still lick his arse)

I seen the rallies for him in my local communities, it made myself and several friends (who worked for him) cry at the mob mentality. They should scrap jobsbridge and the like and have the likes of Sean providing free labour over the course of his deserved jail time providing free labour to struggling businesses.

well done mick on a very good effort
after terrible bad luck in business

It wasn't bad luck, it was poorly run, you would be a fool to think otherwise.

joe swanson

lanos wrote: »

so he's paying it back
fair play to him

and when his business is back trading profitably he will pay back fully.

I wonder how long Sean Quinn will take to pay back IBRC
how about never ? - (I realise hes not a TD but loads of people still lick his arse)

well done mick on a very good effort
after terrible bad luck in business

Bad luck? It was deceit. Deceit of his employees and the taxpayer. Any other country and he would be inside. People have short memories.

He was one of the people who drove this country into the ground as a developer. Was useless at it, owes me and you and every other tax payer, and people elect him. The mind boggles...

Muahahaha

Peter Robinson has now threatened Mick Wallace with legal action over revealing him as the politician who was set to gain from a £7m bribe involving the sale of NAMA assets. But it seems like Wallace was correct in his allegation as it has also been uttered under parliamentary privilege. I wonder what this might mean up North if we have the First Minister caught with his fingers in the till of the southern State.

Dob74

Muahahaha wrote:

Peter Robinson has now threatened Mick Wallace with legal action over revealing him as the politician who was set to gain from a £7m bribe involving the sale of NAMA assets. But it seems like Wallace was correct in his allegation as it has also been uttered under parliamentary privilege. I wonder what this might mean up North if we have the First Minister caught with his fingers in the till of the southern State.

Conservative politicians both sides of the boarder United in me Feinism. We may have a united country yet

Muahahaha

Wallace has now gone further than the initial claim about a £7m bribe saying that it was only for "openers". He has alleged today under Dail privledge that before NAMA did the deal with Cerbrus they went around property developers touting their properties back for 50 pence in the pound. Naturally the developers jumped at the chance to buy the properties back at half price. Cerebrus had paid 27 pence in the pound from NAMA and quickly split and sold the portfolio back to developers for 50p in the pound, representing a quick profit for Cerbrus off the backs of the Irish taxpayer. In order to get on this deal developers had to pay bribes of £45m and this was duly done.

So Wallace has now uncovered £52m worth of bribery within NAMA and is calling for an independent inquiry into how it conducts its business. Joan Burton is following the line that there is nothing to see here, move along now. The First Minister of Northern Ireland, Peter robinson, is connected to this bribery as well as senior business figuers in the north. This whole thing stinks to high hell and it is the Irish taxpayer who is funding the cost of all these brown envelopes.

Just to make matters worse Cerbrus are currently involved purchasing another NAMA loan portfolio here in the south. Our government are refusing to put a stop to this deal despite all the evidence we have of bribery in the north. You couldn't make this stuff up.

Good loser

If they were consultants would it still be bribery?

One Man's meat is another Man's poison?

Jim2007

Muahahaha wrote: »

Our government are refusing to put a stop to this deal despite all the evidence we have of bribery in the north. You couldn't make this stuff up.

If Mike Wallace has discovered all this, then where is his evidence??? If he had this evidence all he need do is bring it to the Garda or newspaper if he wishes to avoid the Garda and that would bring this little game to an end. But he has not and the fact that he has not should tell you that he is just another political blowing hot air trying to make himself relevant!

Dob74

Jim2007 wrote:

If Mike Wallace has discovered all this, then where is his evidence??? If he had this evidence all he need do is bring it to the Garda or newspaper if he wishes to avoid the Garda and that would bring this little game to an end. But he has not and the fact that he has not should tell you that he is just another political blowing hot air trying to make himself relevant!

Unfortunately the legal scheme prohibits him from saying anything thing in public. What newspaper would run it the indo? Newstalk and rte are part of the establishment and would probably turn the wistle blower in.
There has been no proper explanation as to why nama is in such a rush to sale it's portfolio so fast. Wasn't the whole idea of Nama to hold onto the property til the prices recovered. Now that the taxpayer can actually recoup more money it's selling to foreign investor's.
Fg are as bad as FF

rain_soaked

Jim2007 wrote: »

If Mike Wallace has discovered all this, then where is his evidence??? If he had this evidence all he need do is bring it to the Garda or newspaper if he wishes to avoid the Garda and that would bring this little game to an end. But he has not and the fact that he has not should tell you that he is just another political blowing hot air trying to make himself relevant!

the guards have a grudge against wallace for his hand in exposing the penalty points scandal , he knows he would get little reply were he to approach them with this information

yes , guards are that petty

mynamejeff

rain_soaked wrote: »

the guards have a grudge against wallace for his hand in exposing the penalty points scandal , he knows he would get little reply were he to approach them with this information

yes , guards are that petty

considering the penalty points issue had nothing what so ever to do with the garda or sgt or even inspector rank and was brought to the surface by a garda and sgt why do you think the gardai in general would be at all concerned about wallace?

its the usual from politicians like him , loads of nonsense allegations and veiled comments to the press without producing any actual facts or evidence in an effort to make themselves relevant in the face of an upcoming election which should see them thrown out on his tax dodging ass .

unfortunately Irish voters really are that stupid

Muahahaha

mynamejeff wrote: »

considering the penalty points issue had nothing what so ever to do with the garda or sgt or even inspector rank and was brought to the surface by a garda and sgt why do you think the gardai in general would be at all concerned about wallace?

its the usual from politicians like him , loads of nonsense allegations and veiled comments to the press without producing any actual facts or evidence in an effort to make themselves relevant in the face of an upcoming election which should see them thrown out on his tax dodging ass .

unfortunately Irish voters really are that stupid

How are they nonsense? The National Crime Agency in the UK and the Securities Exchange Commission in the US have launched investigations into the allegations. Are you saying that the NCA and SEC can't discern when allegations are credible or not?

mynamejeff

Muahahaha wrote: »

How are they nonsense? The National Crime Agency in the UK and the Securities Exchange Commission in the US have launched investigations into the allegations. Are you saying that the NCA and SEC can't discern when allegations are credible or not?

when a politician makes public allegations that they have to investigate or be accused of being part of a conspiracy themselves (even if the allegations come from a convicted criminal)

rain_soaked

mynamejeff wrote: »

considering the penalty points issue had nothing what so ever to do with the garda or sgt or even inspector rank and was brought to the surface by a garda and sgt why do you think the gardai in general would be at all concerned about wallace?

its the usual from politicians like him , loads of nonsense allegations and veiled comments to the press without producing any actual facts or evidence in an effort to make themselves relevant in the face of an upcoming election which should see them thrown out on his tax dodging ass .

unfortunately Irish voters really are that stupid

not sure how you ( definitively ) know who within AGS had a lot or nothing to do with the penalty points scandal ? , either way , wilson and mc cabe ( the whistleblowers ) claim to have taken heat from more than the top brass , they were ostracised by many of their colleagues which is often the case when you dont look the other way when it comes to corruption within the force , the wagons quickly circle

mynamejeff

rain_soaked wrote: »

not sure how you ( definitively ) know who within AGS had a lot or nothing to do with the penalty points scandal ? , either way , wilson and mc cabe ( the whistleblowers ) claim to have taken heat from more than the top brass , they were ostracised by many of their colleagues which is often the case when you dont look the other way when it comes to corruption within the force , the wagons quickly circle

the issue was removing penalty points. that could only be done by a superintendent rank or above.
That's a fact, despite this widely known and easily discover able fact, irresponsible media and irresponsible people in public office ranted and raved about how the corrupt garda cancelling points for their mates.

god forbid people did a bit of fact checking before opening their mouths

Muahahaha

mynamejeff wrote: »

when a politician makes public allegations that they have to investigate or be accused of being part of a conspiracy themselves (even if the allegations come from a convicted criminal)

You still haven't explained how these allegations are nonsense. Do you know something that we don't? You seem very sure that there is nothing in the allegations but you don't seem able to back it up.

All the while the NCA and SEC have opened investigations, which is presumably based on them believing that Wallaces and others claims are credible and there is something to be investigated here. The investigations have been ongoing for around 5 weeks now so I think I'll take the expertise of the NCA and SEC's opinion that there is something to be investigated here rather than your assertion that the allegations are nonsense, especially as you don't seem able to back up that claim.

If the allegations were nonsense and Wallace was literally making stuff up as you seem to be claiming then I don't think the NCA and SEC would have taken long to find that out. We're five weeks in so my guess is there is questions to be answered here, especially by Peter Robinson, who now seems so desperate that he is flinging around legal threats like confetti but isn't actually suing anyone for the allegations made against him. If Robinson wasn't part of the bribe then he should sue Wallace instead of just threatening it.

Jim2007

Dob74 wrote: »

Unfortunately the legal scheme prohibits him from saying anything thing in public.

No this is not the case! If he has material evidence the then he has a valid defence in taking to the Garda. But at this point I doubt that he has anything beyond hearsay.

Going Forward

mynamejeff wrote: »

the issue was removing penalty points. that could only be done by a superintendent rank or above.
That's a fact, despite this widely known and easily discover able fact, irresponsible media and irresponsible people in public office ranted and raved about how the corrupt garda cancelling points for their mates.

god forbid people did a bit of fact checking before opening their mouths

The point is that superintendents acted at the behest of members who acted at the behest of their mates who wanted their points quashed.

We are in a society which is policed by a group of people that no one would believe has family members or friends who had reason to be subjected to taking penalty points if they didn't want them.

The public perception is that this was a perk of the job.

The fault for that does not lay at the public's feet.

jonnny68

Wallace is a scuff who seriously needs some fashion advice and go to a decent barber, he might be no saint but on the grand scheme of things id take him any day of the week over gangsters like Enda Kenny, Alan Kelly and Joan Burton.

CramCycle

rain_soaked wrote: »

people like you would still claim that deputy clare daly ( whos politics are light years away from my own by the way ) was drunk that night the guards tried to stitch her up

Maybe my memory is hazy but did she not admit to having a drink, her excuse was that she didn't think the house measures would put her over the limit.

I could probably take a drink or two and not hit the limit. I still would not touch a drop if I was going to be driving. It was irresponsible in the extreme.

She also took an illegal turn. If I was a Garda, seen an illegal turn and then got a hint of whiskey from the driver. I too would have hauled her in.

mynamejeff

Going Forward wrote: »

The point is that superintendents acted at the behest of members who acted at the behest of their mates who wanted their points quashed.

We are in a society which is policed by a group of people that no one would believe has family members or friends who had reason to be subjected to taking penalty points if they didn't want them.

The public perception is that this was a perk of the job.

The fault for that does not lay at the public's feet.

So the boss is doing what the employee tells him/her to do at huge risk and no recourse to themselves.

Wasn't there an rather large and expensive public enquirey that found the allegations were almost totally unfounded and not the huge public scandal Wallace insisted it was.

Dont you find it strange that wallace made all these allegations and was later found to have benefited from the very same alleged wrong doing ?

CramCycle

rain_soaked wrote: »

provided you are not over the legal limit , there is no problem with taking a drink before driving , you might prefer a zero tollerance approach but the law is the law for now , it transpired that she was 60% below the legal limit , your attitude suggests the AGS attempt to slime her worked regardless of the fact that she was proved innocent of any wrongdoing

Not really, the fact that a politician would think that it's OK to have a drink and drive means I cannot trust their judgement. There are several politicians who fit this bill. I actually have alot of time for Deputy Daly and many of her views but it does not mean I respect her day to day judgement.

She had no idea how far below the limit she was. She just felt she was. Great judgement alright.

How is the Gardas fault. Did they force the whiskey down her throat, did they force her to make an illegal turn?

I suppose Mick was just doing investigative work when he got his PPs quashed or was it he broke the law and like every other crook tried to fiddle the system.

It's hard to find a politician I do have respect for in this country.At this point it's come down to the ones I can stomach. I can stomach Deputy Daly in the Dail but my stomach turns at the thought of Mick being thought of as fit to represent anyone bar himself.

Going Forward

mynamejeff wrote: »

So the boss is doing what the employee tells him/her to do at huge risk and no recourse to themselves.

Wasn't there an rather large and expensive public enquirey that found the allegations were almost totally unfounded and not the huge public scandal Wallace insisted it was.

Dont you find it strange that wallace made all these allegations and was later found to have benefited from the very same alleged wrong doing ?

He had points wiped?

News to me.

He didn't and you're suggesting that Garda discretion is ok to be applied retrospectively.

Whether you agree with my interpretation of garda discretion or not is not something I'll argue.

My own interpretation of the correct and expected use of it is that discretion is invoked at the time of making the decision to charge or dispense a warning at the roadside.

No point getting bogged down in WHY discretion is permitted IMO.

Going Forward

CramCycle wrote: »

Not really, the fact that a politician would think that it's OK to have a drink and drive means I cannot trust their judgement. There are several politicians who fit this bill. I actually have alot of time for Deputy Daly and many of her views but it does not mean I respect her day to day judgement.

She had no idea how far below the limit she was. She just felt she was. Great judgement alright.

How is the Gardas fault. Did they force the whiskey down her throat, did they force her to make an illegal turn?

I suppose Mick was just doing investigative work when he got his PPs quashed or was it he broke the law and like every other crook tried to fiddle the system.

It's hard to find a politician I do have respect for in this country.At this point it's come down to the ones I can stomach. I can stomach Deputy Daly in the Dail but my stomach turns at the thought of Mick being thought of as fit to represent anyone bar himself.

Her judgement was great.

She was well below the limit.

If your neighbour was breathalysed and found to be under the limit would you think it a bit odd to read about it in the local paper?

No? Ok.

Muahahaha

mynamejeff wrote: »

Im not the one making allegations, he is.

Yes you are, you made the allegation that Wallaces allegations are nonsense. I asked you to back up your claim that the allegations are nonsense twice now but its obvious that you can't do so. Your logic is flawed if you think that all it takes to investigate crime like this is 5 measly weeks, this investigation in likely to roll on the deeper they get into it. We already know that they have thousands of hours of Frank Cushnahans phone calls to listen through as well as other players.

I think it is pretty obvious to most people that there is something in these allegations by Mick Wallace. The blogger Jamie Bryson is now so confident in his evidence that he has publically called on Peter Robinson and others to sue him- i.e. either put up or shut up. But as he said in a recent blog post nobody will be suing him because if they do then they'll face cross examination and the whole deck of cards will come tumbling down.

If all keeps going the way it is Wallace will have uncovered around €75m of bribery connected to NAMA sales. Which would make him one of the most effective TDs in this current Dail.

Muahahaha

CramCycle wrote: »

I suppose Mick was just doing investigative work when he got his PPs quashed or was it he broke the law and like every other crook tried to fiddle the system.

It's hard to find a politician I do have respect for in this country.At this point it's come down to the ones I can stomach. I can stomach Deputy Daly in the Dail but my stomach turns at the thought of Mick being thought of as fit to represent anyone bar himself.

I think you might be confusing Wallace with Ming Flanagan who got penalty points quashed. Wallace was seen driving whilst taking on his phone on Amiens St by two Gardai who then filtered it up the ranks to then Commissioner Callinan who told then Minister Shatter about the incident who then tried to use it against Wallace n a Prime Time interview before it backfired on him. AFAIK Wallace never got any penalty points for the offence, just a telling off.

Muahahaha

Jim2007 wrote: »

No this is not the case! If he has material evidence the then he has a valid defence in taking to the Garda. But at this point I doubt that he has anything beyond hearsay.

If it is hearsay though why are the National Crime Agency in the UK and SEC in the UK still investigating it? Surely the main thrust of the allegation, i.e. that £7m was in an Isle of Man bank account could be found out in no time at all by these two organisations. If Wallaces allegations are hearsay and the £7m in the offshore account was just "nonsense" as mynamejeff has claimed then why has the investigation lasted even this long? Surely it would have been over in under 24 hours and Wallace would be facing charges of wasting police time?

What about the thousands of hours of taped phone calls relating to NAMA deals and fixers fees? Are they also hearsay? If Peter Robinson is found on these tapes discussing how he was to be paid money into an Isle of Man bank account will that also be hearsay? Or is the Irish government going to turn a blind eye to the First Minister in the North trousering taxpayers money from the South?

Muahahaha

mynamejeff wrote: »

Dont you find it strange that wallace made all these allegations and was later found to have benefited from the very same alleged wrong doing ?

What are you talking about?

CramCycle

Going Forward wrote: »

Her judgement was great.

She was well below the limit.

If your neighbour was breathalysed and found to be under the limit would you think it a bit odd to read about it in the local paper?

No? Ok.

I would be shocked at my neighbours behaviour and would find it alarming that they thought it was OK.

Muahahaha wrote: »

I think you might be confusing Wallace with Ming Flanagan who got penalty points quashed. Wallace was seen driving whilst taking on his phone on Amiens St by two Gardai who then filtered it up the ranks to then Commissioner Callinan who told then Minister Shatter about the incident who then tried to use it against Wallace n a Prime Time interview before it backfired on him. AFAIK Wallace never got any penalty points for the offence, just a telling off.

I was taking mynameisjeff at his word, my mistake.

Going Forward

CramCycle wrote: »

I would be shocked at my neighbours behaviour and would find it alarming that they thought it was OK.

I didn't ask if you'd be shocked.

Would you expect to read about him passing a breathalyser test in the local paper?

I notice you seem to have missed that part of my question so I'm asking you that again.

Padraig Mor

Going Forward wrote: »

I didn't ask if you'd shocked.

Would you expect to read about him passing a breathalyser test in the local paper?

I notice you seem to have missed that part of my question so I'm asking you that again.

I was under the impression that Daly didn't pass the breathalyser test because the machine "didn't register a reading" (I wonder why?) but hey....