Another black teenager shot by police in St Louis

crockholm

Egginacup wrote: »

Just think about that. The guy allegedly points a gun at a cop. So this guy is pointing a gun at a cop and the cop then pulls out his gun and fires several shots at the guy. Was the guy in a trance or was the cop some kind of "Sundance Kid quickdraw"?
The victim didn't get a single shot off between the time he was "pointing his weapon" at the cop until the cop reached, drew, undid the safety, aimed and fired multiple shots?

(I await the analysis of the gun nuts on here who will brag about how they can draw, aim, discharge a few rounds from their glocks into a paper target or beer can or some such sh1t in a matter of seconds)

If you wish to see how it is indeed quite possible, google "deonta mackay robbery footage"-it arose out of an incident earlier this year when an off-duty cop was buying petrol at a pump when 16 yo deonta and 2 accomplices attempt to rob him at gunpoint in the Pullman area of Chicago.

Dan_Solo

Bacchus wrote: »

or reform the police force to better tackle the problems (& criminals) they are facing.

I saw some mention of a camera on every officer (by their badge I think) so that there is full accountability for their actions. Sounded like a good place to start.

They seem to keep breaking or running out of batteries whenever a kid is shot dead or a disabled man beaten to death.

Highflyer13

From my viewpoint it looks like the US is on a serious downward spiral. Social and income inequality seems to be getting worse.

irish coldplayer

Dan_Solo wrote: »

All those things you describe as "obvious" aren't even mentioned in the text. Obvious to those determined to blindly agree regardless of what was actually said perhaps?

Ah here, Where did I say I agreed with all the sentiments expressed?

You seem to have a problem with the word "obvious" and enjoy shifting of the goalposts.
I used obviously twice in the post

1. I substituted "hardened criminals" for "Bad guys" hardly an unrealistic synonym.

2. And since you have read the article yourself and then chose to cherry pick the quotes to suit your agenda while ignoring aspects of it that dont.
I and I think many other people would think that it shows an obvious bias.

Lastly why would my criticisms of your posts be contained in the text of a NYPD officers blog?

Surely you can make a better argument than that.

Dan_Solo

irish coldplayer wrote: »

Ah here, Where did I say I agreed with all the sentiments expressed?

You seem to have a problem with the word "obvious" and enjoy shifting of the goalposts.
I used obviously twice in the post

1. I substituted "hardened criminals" for "Bad guys" hardly an unrealistic synonym.

2. And since you have read the article yourself and then chose to cherry pick the quotes to suit your agenda while ignoring aspects of it that dont.
I and I think many other people would think that it shows an obvious bias.

Lastly why would my criticisms of your posts be contained in the text of a NYPD officers blog?

Surely you can make a better argument than that.

And you choose to ignore those bits, so pot kettle black Mr Bias.
If a NYPD tale is irrelevant, funny how you didn't jump down the throat of the guy who posted it, huh? Biased much?
"I and many other..." you mean the EMS, cop and military guys here? No bias there either, oh no!

Egginacup

BattleCorp wrote: »

If the guy pulled a gun on the cop, then fair enough, what else was the cop supposed to do?

This race sh1t is really bugging me. Who gives a fcuk what colour someone is, if they pull a gun on a cop then they should expect them to respond.

Is society so fcuked up that you are a racist if you shoot back at a black man because he pulled a gun on you?

The media need a kick in the hole too. They are whipping everything up, trying to aggravate every situation. It's almost as if they wanted to create a race war.

Bottom line, no matter what colour you are, pull a gun on a cop and they are going to do their very best to put you down, fast.

Bullshit! Period.

Crazed white guy at the University of Illinois waving a gun is calmed and disarmed without a shot being fired:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-police-shootings-tamir-rice-college-airsoft-perspec-1130-20141128-story.html

12 year old black Tamir Rice is riddled to death without even pointing his fake pistol at anyone.

suicide_circus

Highflyer13 wrote: »

From my viewpoint it looks like the US is on a serious downward spiral. Social and income inequality seems to be getting worse.

they just need more guns

Grand Moff Tarkin

Egginacup wrote: »

And he'll get away with it too.

If this country had a police force even one tenth as good as in the USA the hacks in the red tops would have no scuts to make up tough guy names for.

darced

This post has been deleted.

Egginacup

Bacchus wrote: »

The current station that has evolved over the last year has moved beyond gun law. Gun law is obviously a huge divisive issue in America but this has become a PR war between the police that are supposed to protect and the people who are outraged over a handful of isolated incidents (with the media pouring fuel on the fire). Not that I'm trying to diminish the impact of those shootings but a police force that is taking such a hammering over every action they take is a police force that won't work. Even in reform, with such scrutiny you risk the reforming removing good with the bad.

But they AREN'T isolated incidents. A black male is killed every 28 hours by cops or vigilantes in the US.

The same shabby "couple of bad apples" argument was used to piss away the Lyndie England Abu Ghraib torture photos but it's clear to anyone with half a brain that torture was and is systemic.

Take a look at this wanker in the photo:

http://sfbayview.com/2014/12/outed-undercover-cop-pulls-gun-on-oakland-protesters/

This prick and dozens of his buddies who were in on the act tried to infiltrate peaceful protesters and even smashed windows to try and make it look like the protesters were some mob of knuckleheaded anarchists.

US troops in Iraq routinely planted AK-47s next to the corpses of civilians they killed in order to paint them as legitimate targets. US cops in their moral bankruptcy are no different. You can talk about isolated incidents all you want and wring your hands about how these thugs are "doing a tough job" as if that gives them the license to be assholes. But the facts show differently.

Bacchus

Dan_Solo wrote: »

They seem to keep breaking or running out of batteries whenever a kid is shot dead or a disabled man beaten to death.

Has it even rolled out yet? Don't see how they are "breaking or running out of batteries" if they haven't even started using them yet. Do you have anything to back up that statement?

Egginacup

RacoonQueen wrote: »

White policeman shoots white teenager wouldn't have quite the se ring to it.

Have the black people not realised yet that if they stop waving guns around the police will stop shooting them?

And this gem of wisdom from a moderator!

Bacchus

Egginacup wrote: »

But the AREN'T isolated incidents. A black male is killed every 28 hours by cops or vigilantes in the US.

The same shabby "couple of bad apples" argument was used to piss away the Lyndie England Abu Ghraib torture photos but it's clear to anyone with half a brain that torture was and is systemic.

Take a look at this wanker in the photo:

http://sfbayview.com/2014/12/outed-undercover-cop-pulls-gun-on-oakland-protesters/

This prick and dozens of his buddies who were in on the act tried to infiltrate peaceful protesters and even smashed windows to try and make it look like the protesters were some mob of knuckleheaded anarchists.

US troops in Iraq routinely planted AK-47s next to the corpses of civilians they killed in order to paint them as legitimate targets. US cops in their moral bankruptcy are no different. You can talk about isolated incidents all you want and wring your hands about how these thugs are "doing a tough job" as if that gives them the license to be assholes. But the facts show differently.

I've already said that reform is needed and I won't argue that there not more incidents, they just go less noticed. On the bit you quoted me, I said the "outrage" was over a couple of isolated incidents. The focus of the protests is very much on a few select shootings. I'm not saying or implying that there are no other incidents.

Grand Moff Tarkin

darced wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I hate to bust the bubble but the average American citizen is a lot sharper than the average Irish person.

Americans are correct in thinking that their nation counts on the world scale while us Irish are happy to delude ourselves that we are more that an international drinking joke.

Grand Moff Tarkin

Egginacup wrote: »

And this gem of wisdom from a moderator!

Sounds like someone who has lived over in America to me.

h2005

Grand Moff Tarkin wrote: »

I hate to bust the bubble but the average American citizen is a lot sharper than the average Irish person.

Americans are correct in thinking that their nation counts on the world scale while us Irish are happy to delude ourselves that we are more that an international drinking joke.

Have you anything to back up what you're saying? Having lived in the states for 5 years I can't say I noticed the average American was "sharper" than the average Irish person.

Dan_Solo

Egginacup wrote: »

And this gem of wisdom from a moderator!

yeah, "the blacks". If only they'd learn!
I'm not racist but... actually I am!

Egginacup

Bacchus wrote: »

If something more foul comes of the investigation then I'll reassess my thinking on what happened but I'm not going to get drawn in on hypotheticals. I'm sure cops are well trained to draw their guns and fire quickly. Assuming that the man did pull a gun on the cop, I don't think there is much argument saying the cop was wrong to open fire. Would we all have preferred he take a moment first and ask the man what he intended to do now that he was pointing a gun at him?

You know, the time for assessing each specific case of police violence on its own individual merits has come and gone, since even the most egregious instances of blatant abuse of power and flagrant unwarranted brutality are simply ignored, excused or casually swept under the rug.

What happened to that cunt, Tony Bologna who pepper-sprayed two defenseless girls at an Occupy protest? Nothing.
What happened to his colleague and fellow cunt, John Cardona, who just smashed a guy in the face for no reason? Nothing.

I don't know what your broken record excuse and justification for the daily if not hourly instances of police abuse and violence will be but this case will hardly be any different.

Grand Moff Tarkin

h2005 wrote: »

Have you anything to back up what you're saying? Having lived in the states for 5 years I can't say I noticed the average American was "sharper" than the average Irish person.

A few years living on the East Coast before we moved home. A great place in so many respect with intelligent hard working people who do not suffer fools gladly. But the gun laws and racial undertones were enough to make us come home when the first was born.

pmasterson95

Grand Moff Tarkin wrote: »

I hate to bust the bubble but the average American citizen is a lot sharper than the average Irish person.

Americans are correct in thinking that their nation counts on the world scale while us Irish are happy to delude ourselves that we are more that an international drinking joke.

???? No.....Americans are rather thick....they count because they have massive army/population/resources......

irelandrover

Egginacup wrote: »

But the AREN'T isolated incidents. A black male is killed every 28 hours by cops or vigilantes in the US.

Can you provide any links or backups of this number? Does it include justified killings? How many people of other races are killed by police. Who are the vigilantes and why are they included in this?

Egginacup

Bacchus wrote: »

or reform the police force to better tackle the problems (& criminals) they are facing.

I saw some mention of a camera on every officer (by their badge I think) so that there is full accountability for their actions. Sounded like a good place to start.

Please, like a camera on each cop is going to curb their desire to beat and shoot people at will? When a cop is caught on camera killing someone or beating the shit out of someone he's excused anyway.

The answer is not amassing evidence against police officers since that evidence is routinely "lost", tampered with, destroyed or just plain ignored. The answer is to weed out the countless assholes who were allowed to become cops. The answer is to screen candidates so that the schoolyard prick, who's only suited to being an unskilled labourer in an abattoir, never even gets a chance to fill in the application form. The answer is to punish any dick cop who punches a woman in the head at a traffic stop because she got all pissy over a ticket, so that every other cop would think twice about spunking away his job and pension just because he wanted to act the heavy. The answer is to train cops to rise above personal ego and pettiness and ignore a kid who says "fuck you cop" instead of pulling out the night-stick and beating someone senseless 'cos they didn't show respect and fear to "the man". The answer is to shitcan any cop who thinks it's hilarious to wear one of these:

http://www.coloradoindependent.com/9276/denver-police-beat-the-crowds-t-shirt-no-laughing-matter-protesters-charge

Filming these wackos isn't the answer.

They need to keep guns out of the reach of kids and Police and America will be fine.

Tugboats

PS4s and giant tvs are being looted in his honour

Egginacup

Grand Moff Tarkin wrote: »

I hate to bust the bubble but the average American citizen is a lot sharper than the average Irish person.

Americans are correct in thinking that their nation counts on the world scale while us Irish are happy to delude ourselves that we are more that an international drinking joke.

This is a blatant lie. 80% of Americans believe in miracles. That would put the average American in the braindead category. While a few Irish oul ones might believe in moving statues and such crap the vast majority of Irish people are not so thick.

AndonHandon

The U.S. is a horrible society to live in unless you have relative financial comfort. It is an 'every man for himself' political situation too so I understand the protestors' grief. However, it is completely misguided so they are coming across as idiotic products of the system. Black men are statistically more likely than another race in the U.S. to perpetuate their own stereotype and the officers who have unfortunately killed a few of them have been tried before grand juries and acquitted so there is no conspiracy.

Egginacup

irelandrover wrote: »

Can you provide any links or backups of this number? Does it include justified killings? How many people of other races are killed by police. Who are the vigilantes and why are they included in this?

The vigilantes are people like the racist, sexist, wifebeating thug and "neighbourhood watch" gobshite George Zimmerman who was told by cops not to go near Trayvon Martin but followed and shot and killed him anyway.

Bobeagleburger

The heavily divided Land of the Free...

irelandrover

Egginacup wrote: »

The vigilantes are people like the racist, sexist, wifebeating thug and "neighbourhood watch" gobshite George Zimmerman who was told by cops not to go near Trayvon Martin but followed and shot and killed him anyway.

So why do you include them?

SPDUB

Manic Moran wrote: »

Got a link for that? Because I don't see it on this thread, and certainly not in that open letter on the previous page.

I presume this is what the poster is referring to

http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/nypd-union-wartime-dept/2014/12/20/id/614270/

The mayor’s hands are literally dripping with our blood because of his words actions and policies and we have, for the first time in a number of years, become a ‘wartime’ police department. We will act accordingly.

though the Union denied later denied issuing such a memo

http://www.capitalnewyork.com/article/city-hall/2014/12/8558990/pba-condemns-mayor-denies-inflammatory-memo

A spokesman for the Patrolmen’s Benevolent Association has denied that the group issued a now-widely circulated memo reacting to today's killing of two police officers