DCM 2014: Mentored Novices Thread

frash

RedRunner wrote: »

They are important insofar as later in the plan you will be doing your long runs on tireder legs and this is great preparation for marathon. I would try get them in as much as possible as you will reap the benefits on marathon day with fresh legs after the taper

Does the order of the days matter at all do you think?
Plan has it as 5, 10, 5 but if I was to do 5, 5, 10 would it matter?

(sorry is this is a daft question )

adrian522

I would have thought so, running 5 miles the day after running 10 miles teaches you to run on tired legs. It also gives you an easy day (5m) and a rest day before getting into the long run.

I'd say if at all possible stick to the days in the plan but better switch the days around than missing sessions altogether.

Ososlo

frash wrote: »

Does the order of the days matter at all do you think?
Plan has it as 5, 10, 5 but if I was to do 5, 5, 10 would it matter?

(sorry is this is a daft question )

Personally I'd say that'd be fine as long as the 10 wasn't too close to the long run at the weekend. You'd want at least 2 days between those longer runs and maybe more depending on how you find your body adapts in training. You won't really know until the time. It's very important to recover between runs. It's normal to be a little bit tired but if you're very achey and very tired from the longer runs, the more days between the medium run and the long run the better.

Ososlo

frash wrote: »

Does the order of the days matter at all do you think?
Plan has it as 5, 10, 5 but if I was to do 5, 5, 10 would it matter?

(sorry is this is a daft question )

and no such thing as daft questions either;) That's what we're here for!

So what running has everyone planned for the weekend?

adrian522

Well yesterday I use due to do an easy run with a threshold run today and long run on Sunday but due to a physio appointment and subsequent soreness I was unable to run yesterday so will do the easy run today, not sure what on Saturday but will stick to trying to do the long run on Sunday.

Hopefully get 13 miles done, the last time I did 13 miles I had cramps towards the end of it and found it a bit of a struggle. That was 2 weeks ago so hopefully I will handle it a bit better this time out.

rainbow kirby

Firedance wrote: »

has anyone used anything other than gels to get through long runs and the marathon? I've tried the high 5 and wasn't overly fond of how I felt. Is it possible to eat ordinary stuff like chopped up apple/sultanas and drink a high energy drink instead?

It's easier to handle real food on a long cycle than it is on a long run, the stomach gets annoyed a bit more quickly. I've brought a banana and peanut butter sandwich in the back pocket of my bike jersey but couldn't look at that on a long run!

I've seen people bringing Jaffa Cakes or a packet of wine gums on a long run. I've tried the Nakd bars in the past too - which are all natural and relatively dense, but quite small and easy to carry, and found them good. Barcelona marathon gives out orange segments and nuts after 30km, loved that.

Gels-wise - I always preferred the thicker textured ones, particularly the Gu fruit flavours. Preferably not caffeinated because in the later stages of a long race I got a bit jittery with caffeine. Not a huge fan of them in general though, and am thankful that my longest race this year is a triathlon so I can eat something semi-real on the bike!

john mayo 10

Thurs 8th may
5 k jog
Ran 3 loops of a local country estate. Very flat route with a good running surface. Felt very little pain throughout. First run in 10 days that i didnt have to stop with the pain and could have easily ran more but have to take it easy.

Ososlo

adrian522 wrote: »

Well yesterday I use due to do an easy run with a threshold run today and long run on Sunday but due to a physio appointment and subsequent soreness I was unable to run yesterday so will do the easy run today, not sure what on Saturday but will stick to trying to do the long run on Sunday.

Hopefully get 13 miles done, the last time I did 13 miles I had cramps towards the end of it and found it a bit of a struggle. That was 2 weeks ago so hopefully I will handle it a bit better this time out.

Good luck with it if you're able to do it Sunday. Great thing is, you're so far ahead of the plan already that missing some runs now is no big deal.

Sorry to hear about the cramping. Do you hydrate well before the run (day before and in general)?

adrian522

Ososlo wrote: »

Good luck with it if you're able to do it Sunday. Great thing is, you're so far ahead of the plan already that missing some runs now is no big deal.

Sorry to hear about the cramping. Do you hydrate well before the run (day before and in general)?

Yeah, hydration was fine, more a case of going too fast on that one I think, it was faster than what my normal easy pace had been which I think led to the problems. nothing major to be honest, I was still able to complete the run but it wasn't as comfortable as I would have liked.

slingerz

What is the difference between an Easy Run and a Recovery Run in the 2014 Boards plan?

Ososlo

adrian522 wrote: »

Yeah, hydration was fine, more a case of going too fast on that one I think, it was faster than what my normal easy pace had been which I think led to the problems. nothing major to be honest, I was still able to complete the run but it wasn't as comfortable as I would have liked.

Probably a pace thing then alright. You should always feel you have another few miles in you (another bit to give) at the end of a long run and not be dead on your feet. Same goes for any run really, except for a race:D

Ososlo

slingerz wrote: »

What is the difference between an Easy Run and a Recovery Run in the 2014 Boards plan?

It's broken down in detail my second post on this thread but 'Easy' is done at a comfortable pace. You should be able to chat and your breathing is only slightly quicker than normal.
'Recovery' running is like a walk really. It's normally done instead of a complete rest day after a harder workout (long run etc). It should take very little out of you and generally helps rejuvenate the legs and make them feel fresher. Doing it on grass or some softer surface is even better as it places even less stress on the body. I always feel better after a very slow recovery run. I do them about a minute slower than my 'easy' pace or sometimes even slower. I never look at the watch when doing them.

slingerz

Ososlo wrote: »

It's broken down in detail my second post on this thread but 'Easy' is done at a comfortable pace. You should be able to chat and your breathing is only slightly quicker than normal.
'Recovery' running is like a walk really. It's normally done instead of a complete rest day after a harder workout (long run etc). It should take very little out of you and generally helps rejuvenate the legs and make them feel fresher. Doing it on grass or some softer surface is even better as it places even less stress on the body. I always feel better after a very slow recovery run. I do them about a minute slower than my 'easy' pace or sometimes even slower. I never look at the watch when doing them.

Ok so recovery is pretty much crawling along and easy is still slow but a bit quicker than a recovery

Ososlo

slingerz wrote: »

Ok so recovery is pretty much crawling along and easy is still slow but a bit quicker than a recovery

yes you got it! Crawling!
I think we'll have weekly competitions to see who can run recovery runs the slowest:D Bet I'll win:D:D I can do 13 min/miles no problem:cool: But of course it's all relative;)

nerraw1111

Forgot to add, fair play to Ososlo for taking on the role.

Re gels. If you don't like one, try another. Loads of flavours and types around. Or go down the road of not using them at all.

adrian522

What races are people planning in the buildup to the marathon if any?

I was thinking of doing the following:

May 18th Terenure 5 Mile
June 28th Irish Runner 5 Mile
August 4th DLR Bay 10K
August 23rd Frank Duffy 10 Mile
September 21st Race Series Half Marathon

Thoughts on this? Too much racing or not?

crisco10

Nice one Ososlo! Some effort put into those first posts...

Okay, this is my second time doing this, having signed up last year....Damn injury.


Have you raced before?If so what are your PBs? Did a few races recently, most recent was Parkrun in 20:10. Longest race was last summer, where I did the Frank Duffy 10 miler in 70minutes even.

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? No.

How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.
Currently doing about 40km a week, with a LSR of 20km. (Pace is 5:15/km) I try to get one other run of about 8km in that has some sort of pace work. Then the balance of the mileage spread across 2 or 3 easy/recovery runs. Try and stretch every day, pilates once a week.
This might change a bit in June/Early July as I am playing Tag Rugby on Thursdays, but that will be finished on 17th July so I can refocus training then.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time? Firstly, I just want to be in the starting pen on the 27th having had injury free summer. Then I will see where it takes me. Wouldn't dare put a time down now, recipe for injury as I try to chase the goal time.

How many days a week can you train? 4-5 days.

Why are you running this marathon? 2 words. Unfinished Business.

Ososlo

adrian522 wrote: »

What races are people planning in the buildup to the marathon if any?

I was thinking of doing the following:

May 18th Terenure 5 Mile
June 28th Irish Runner 5 Mile
August 4th DLR Bay 10K
August 23rd Frank Duffy 10 Mile
September 21st Race Series Half Marathon

Thoughts on this? Too much racing or not?

To me that sounds absolutely perfect and well spaced out. Pretty much what I did last year. The Race Series is designed to fit in with marathon training. Those last 2 will be invaluable for practicing gels, fluid, gear etc. Nice to get a race in soon also before things start getting serious!

adrian522

Thanks, I wouldn't mind finding a 5k, maybe just a parkrun at some point to see if I'm in shape to beat my 23:46 from last year!

HelenAnne

Ososlo wrote: »

Some people can work the gel belt thing. I just couldn't. I found it impossible to find any running shorts in the shops with more than one pocket but these were recommended to me and I wore them on every long slow run and the race itself and carried 6 gels (i think) on the day. Can't recommend them highly enough. Great if you have to take a key or other small items too.

For DCM 2013 my mother-in-law sewed an extra pocket into my club shorts (thanks, Sylvia!). Also, if you don't need them in a specific club colour, I really love these shorts -- they have three pockets, 2 with zips:

http://www.oiselle.com/shop/running-bottoms/running-shorts-and-skirts/distance-short

vitani

adrian522 wrote: »

What races are people planning in the buildup to the marathon if any?

I was thinking of doing the following:

May 18th Terenure 5 Mile
June 28th Irish Runner 5 Mile
August 4th DLR Bay 10K
August 23rd Frank Duffy 10 Mile
September 21st Race Series Half Marathon

Thoughts on this? Too much racing or not?

Almost the same list for me. I'm doing all of the Race Series, the Mini Marathon on June 2 and possibly the Dunboyne 5 mile on May 27.

Ososlo

crisco10 wrote: »

Nice one Ososlo! Some effort put into those first posts...

Okay, this is my second time doing this, having signed up last year....Damn injury.

Why are you running this marathon? 2 words. Unfinished Business.

that must have been awful for you last year crisco. Really hope it all goes to plan for you this time round.
Great to have you with us!

crisco10

Ososlo wrote: »

that must have been awful for you last year crisco. Really hope it all goes to plan for you this time round.
Great to have you with us!

It was! ITB flared up in September (reckon I over trained/"too much,too soon" in August tho). Raging....determined to start building miles now to prevent it happening again this year.

Ososlo

crisco10 wrote: »

It was! ITB flared up in September (reckon I over trained/"too much,too soon" in August tho). Raging....determined to start building miles now to prevent it happening again this year.

Wow. September and you had to bow out:( Soul-destroying I'd imagine to get that close.
Good sensible approach this year. What plan are you thinking of following?

HelenAnne

Finnt wrote: »

I've taken jellys on long runs with no ill effects, the only thing was can be hard to chew when your under pressure!!

I did all my long runs last year on just the occasional jelly sweet and the odd sip of water, and felt great. I never needed drinks or gels in half marathon races either, HOWEVER in the actual marathon, either the extra distance or the faster pace got to me, and I definitely ran out of steam trying to run on a few jellies and water. If I ever do another one I'm going to at least give gels a try. I like Honey Stinger sweets on runs, and I have taken actual honey before long runs with no ill effects, so I might try Honey Stinger gels.

crisco10

Ososlo wrote: »

Wow. September and you had to bow out:( Soul-destroying I'd imagine to get that close.
Good sensible approach this year. What plan are you thinking of following?

Looking at the boards one. It's quite close to what I am doing now. Although, my days will be a bit messed up. LSR on Thursday, "yellow" run on Monday.

Also as mentioned, 1st 4 weeks will be a bit patched together. But that should be fine given I should be doing that and more by then. My big question at that point will probably be what does Tag Rugby count as in a training plan?? Interval training? lol

Firedance

adrian522 wrote: »

What races are people planning in the buildup to the marathon if any?

I was thinking of doing the following:

May 18th Terenure 5 Mile
June 28th Irish Runner 5 Mile
August 4th DLR Bay 10K
August 23rd Frank Duffy 10 Mile
September 21st Race Series Half Marathon

Thoughts on this? Too much racing or not?

Very similar too but will do Maynooth 10K on May 18th and Dunboyne 5 mile at the end of may instead of the Irish Runner 5 mile.

Hoping to do about 8 or 9 miles this weekend

gl0Rob

Thanks Ososlo! Really looking forward to this.

Have you raced before?If so what are your PBs?
I have done a few races over the last 12 months.
Kinvara 10k 50:08
Waterford HM 2:08:00 ish
Limerick FM 2014 4:45:00

Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? No.

How much training do you currently do ? Distances, how many days a week, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.
30k - 40k a weeks. 4 days a week.

What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
Dream 3:59:59
Realistic 4:15:00

How many days a week can you train? 4-5 days.

Why are you running this marathon? The atmosphere and run all 26.2 miles and not the 23 I did in Limerick

SamforMayo

HelenAnne wrote: »

I did all my long runs last year on just the occasional jelly sweet and the odd sip of water, and felt great. I never needed drinks or gels in half marathon races either, HOWEVER in the actual marathon, either the extra distance or the faster pace got to me, and I definitely ran out of steam trying to run on a few jellies and water. If I ever do another one I'm going to at least give gels a try. I like Honey Stinger sweets on runs, and I have taken actual honey before long runs with no ill effects, so I might try Honey Stinger gels.

I used sweets, cereal bars etc for long runs but I tried gels as well. While I had no problem eating on Lsr s there is no way I could tolerate food during the marathon when under pressure so bear this in mind. I hate gels but found the Isogels ok.

SeanPuddin

adrian522 wrote: »

What races are people planning in the buildup to the marathon if any?

Would like to do:
June 22nd - Galway 10K or 10mile.
July 5th - Clontarf Half Marathon - Any good?
August 9th - Streets of Galway 8K
September 20th - Connemara Half Marathon.