Albert Quay - New Development

lisasimpson

anyone know what the story is with parking for the new Aldi. they will have a nice number of customers at their door step once the Albert Quay is up and running and not too far from the college of commerce. depending on parking arrangements they would get custom from employees on Monahan rd

Pro Hoc Vice

lisasimpson wrote: »

anyone know what the story is with parking for the new Aldi. they will have a nice number of customers at their door step once the Albert Quay is up and running and not too far from the college of commerce. depending on parking arrangements they would get custom from employees on Monahan rd

There is at least 200 public spaces in the Elysian, Euromedic gives free parking I think, I wonder will the new shop.

sozbox

Aldi provide free parking for one hour

Rhys Essien

Latest news.

http://www.eveningecho.ie/news/cork-news/2015/01/19/14400-tonnes-of-concrete-poured-into-one-albert-quay/

blindsider

2000 people - 135 car spaces....?

How's that going to work? And please don't suggest public transport - we don't have a bus service worthy of the name!

D'Agger

blindsider wrote: »

2000 people - 135 car spaces....?

How's that going to work? And please don't suggest public transport - we don't have a bus service worthy of the name!

Bike Scheme? :pac:

namloc1980

blindsider wrote: »

2000 people - 135 car spaces....?

How's that going to work? And please don't suggest public transport - we don't have a bus service worthy of the name!

I work in a building housing a couple of hundred people in the city centre with precisely zero car spaces and we all seem to make our way in every day. It just wouldn't be feasible to provide car spaces for every single worker...imagine the additional traffic chaos for a start.

Michael..

blindsider wrote: »

2000 people - 135 car spaces....?

How's that going to work? And please don't suggest public transport - we don't have a bus service worthy of the name!

The Park & Ride service is pretty reliable and it's only out the road.

cgcsb

More car parking = more traffic. More people on buses = greater demand for public transport services

KCAccidental

Michael.. wrote: »

The Park & Ride service is pretty reliable and it's only out the road.

yup, it's pretty much the most reliable public transport service in Cork.

Pablo Escobar

cgcsb wrote: »

More car parking = more traffic. More people on buses = greater demand for public transport services

Stop talking sense.

mire

blindsider wrote: »

2000 people - 135 car spaces....?

How's that going to work? And please don't suggest public transport - we don't have a bus service worthy of the name!

900 people work in Half Moon Street on upper floors in Apple. How many spaces are there. Circa zero. No problem. This is a city.

ongarboy

blindsider wrote: »

2000 people - 135 car spaces....?

How's that going to work? And please don't suggest public transport - we don't have a bus service worthy of the name!

Most city centre work places don't offer parking for employees (apart from maybe to senior managers if a few minimal spaces are available). Only suburban or industrial estate employments generally have the space to provide general parking facilities for all staff.

the beer revolu

Planning wouldn't allow them to put in loads of parking spaces. It would draw too much traffic.

clerk

ongarboy wrote: »

Most city centre work places don't offer parking for employees (apart from maybe to senior managers if a few minimal spaces are available). Only suburban or industrial estate employments generally have the space to provide general parking facilities for all staff.

Yeah - I worked in the City before. Only business owners, which is a lot of people relative to the number of spaces ( parking permits ) and Managers/Directors have parking spaces. Obviously full time parking spaces in the City centre are very expensive.

At the end of the Day parking for all is not feasible.

But I also know a lot of people that have to get into the City centre that park in the surburbs in wherever they can get a parking spot.

Down by the docks, various housing estates around the edge of the City ( always plenty of skin and hair flying with that option), Centre park road etc. etc. But with this volume of people coming in it's going to make the competition for spaces pretty intense up that side of the City.

All this stuff about buses is a non-runner. In my office literally about half the people are computing from various parts of Cork County, buses (plural) are a non-runner for all of them. Park and ride for them ? ( maybe to some extent).

But look the development is very positive and it's not feasible to have parking for all so we'll see how it pans out.

lisasimpson

Yes if u are commuting from bandon macroom etc buses arent exactly an option but from the suburbs it is more park and rides should be developed on all routes into town.a friend of mine who works in the suburbs recently had no car and took the bus from an estate from one side of the city into town and walked the rest of the way..the reaction from some of the colleagues when they heard o i got the bus wz laughable And some either live near a city service bus stop The bus snob that alan kelly spoke about months ago was clear to be seen

clerk

lisasimpson wrote: »

...The bus snob that alan kelly spoke about months ago was clear to be seen

To be honest, l'm from the City ( suburbs ) and got the bus into the City centre for Years before I got a car !! Heaven forbid. :pac:

I also cycled to UCC for 4 Years and nearly got knocked down several times ( and I used to take it handy ) but you can't legislate for a lunatic driver.

But my experience with the bus service was that
a) you could never be sure your bus would turn up on time, knock on effect for getting to work on time, so you'd have to get an earlier bus, i.e. leave home way earlier than if you had a car.
b) sometimes ( particularly if the weather was bad ) the bus would be full when it got to my stop and they would have to drive past you, this might happen 2/3 times a Month in the winter.
c) It's not a very happy place standing in the pissing rain ( with no shelter ) with a business suit. Ok you've a coat on/unbrella but it's not a pleasant place to be.
d) If the roads were frosty the buses would often be cancelled and/or be mad late.

So
a)When it turned up on time.
b) didn't drive past you
c) and d) and the weather was dry
it was a grand option.

Going home was grand because you could make your own time and hang around the City a bit or whatever.

shnaek

Got to second what clerk is saying there. Many's the time I'd be 40mins to 1hr waiting for a bus to get me to work, then a 30 minute bus journey on top of that. Once I got the car, it took 20 mins door to door. That's 20 mins vs 1hr30mins. Not to mention the times waiting in the lashing rain. Nothing worse than seeing those full buses driving past you on a wet winters morning.

blindsider

Michael.. wrote: »

The Park & Ride service is pretty reliable and it's only out the road.

But the P&R really only works for people who are southside or with good access to Black Ash.

This is a big development - does anywhere else in the city centre have 2000 employees? It's a heck of a lot of people coming to work between 08h00 - 09h00

Anyone coming from Mallow etc would find the P&R inaccessible.

In fact, I wonder if the P&R has the capacity for an extra e.g. 500 cars each day? Somehow, I doubt it - it has a total of 940 spaces.

http://www.corkcity.ie/services/roadstransportation/trafficdivision/blackashparkandride/

A P&R on the Mallow Rd would help - but surely the problem there is access - I don't see how a dedicated bus lane could be provided all the way to town. And, w/o a dedicated bus lane, a P&R is a disaster.

(I see the page above has details of a study from 1999, and a survey from 2004! Nice to see the Council is on top of things!)


I wasn't suggesting that 2000 spaces be provided - but I was questioning the lack of joined-up-thinking:

How will 2000 extra people get to work on time in the city? The shambles that is the bus network certainly won't cope - let's be honest, it can't cope with rain.


Finally, people shouldn't have to "cope" or "manage". We pay enough in taxes to expect a half decent transport system.

2000 extra jobs in town are very welcome, but if we can't provide these people with decent transport, we're creating problems. The next big prospective employer will investigate and decide to go elsewhere. It's a very competitive market - even within Ireland.

moyners

Have to agree with all your points there, especially the lack of P&R on the northside of the city.

But maybe it's a chicken and egg situation - we could be waiting till kingdom come for a transport system to be in place before all these developments are built, it's not going to happen. Whereas maybe, just maybe, with all those additional people working (and hopefully a fair amount living) in the city centre it may just provide the push that will convince local and national government to fix the situation. We all know density is important to justify putting in place things like trams and dedicated bus ways. Maybe it will take a bit of short-term pain in congestion to get these things in the long-run.

blindsider

Good post Moyners- can't argue with any of that!

namloc1980

blindsider wrote: »

But the P&R really only works for people who are southside or with good access to Black Ash.

This is a big development - does anywhere else in the city centre have 2000 employees? It's a heck of a lot of people coming to work between 08h00 - 09h00

Anyone coming from Mallow etc would find the P&R inaccessible.

In fact, I wonder if the P&R has the capacity for an extra e.g. 500 cars each day? Somehow, I doubt it - it has a total of 940 spaces.

http://www.corkcity.ie/services/roadstransportation/trafficdivision/blackashparkandride/

A P&R on the Mallow Rd would help - but surely the problem there is access - I don't see how a dedicated bus lane could be provided all the way to town. And, w/o a dedicated bus lane, a P&R is a disaster.

(I see the page above has details of a study from 1999, and a survey from 2004! Nice to see the Council is on top of things!)


I wasn't suggesting that 2000 spaces be provided - but I was questioning the lack of joined-up-thinking:

How will 2000 extra people get to work on time in the city? The shambles that is the bus network certainly won't cope - let's be honest, it can't cope with rain.


Finally, people shouldn't have to "cope" or "manage". We pay enough in taxes to expect a half decent transport system.

2000 extra jobs in town are very welcome, but if we can't provide these people with decent transport, we're creating problems. The next big prospective employer will investigate and decide to go elsewhere. It's a very competitive market - even within Ireland.

Anyone coming from mallow could surely take the train. Once the new south entrance in Kent opens it will literally be a 5-6 minute walk to this development. No excuses other than laziness for not taking the train in that scenario. Some people feel they should be entitled to a car space next to their desk.

deRanged

It would be the same for anyone coming in from the east too . I was only thinking it'd be a great place to work - I'd get the Midleton train in and have a nice short stroll into the office.

clerk

namloc1980 wrote: »

Anyone coming from mallow could surely take the train. Once the new south entrance in Kent opens it will literally be a 5-6 minute walk to this development. .....

You're spot on actually.

Once they open up the entrance for the train station onto the Quays it will be a very short walk to this development and then you'd have no messing with trying to find car parking.

So the train will be a very good option ( if you're within say 10/15 minutes driving of a train stop ). I assume they will be parking available at the train stations ?

namloc1980

clerk wrote: »

You're spot on actually.

Once they open up the entrance for the train station onto the Quays it will be a very short walk to this development and then you'd have no messing with trying to find car parking.

So the train will be a very good option ( if you're within say 10/15 minutes driving of a train stop ). I assume they will be parking available at the train stations ?

Even before the new entrance opens its no more than a 10 minute walk at most. Most of the stations in East Cork have free car parks which are woefully underused at present. Mallow has c. 460 spaces.

blindsider

Perhaps I didn't make my point clearly.

These are EXTRA jobs in town = extra people trying to get to the city centre - 2000 of them.

The bus network doesn't work.

P&R is limited - and near capacity I believe.

There are 2 trains from Midleton to Kent which arrive before 0900 - I have no idea how full they are.

There are 3 trains from Mallow: 0730 0800 0830 - again, no idea about capacity.

I'd be interested to hear from rail users - how good/effective/reliable etc.

Don't get me wrong - the development and the jobs it will bring are vital - we just need to think carefully about transport infrastructure.


This is a help - but we need much much more:

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/kent-station-revamp-part-of-85m-public-transport-plan-259308.html

BUNK1982

namloc1980 wrote: »

Anyone coming from mallow could surely take the train. Once the new south entrance in Kent opens it will literally be a 5-6 minute walk to this development. No excuses other than laziness for not taking the train in that scenario. Some people feel they should be entitled to a car space next to their desk.

I wouldn't go so far as to call it laziness - there are other reasons for opting to take the car as oppose to public transport.

For example convenience, cost, experience etc.

I do agree that to go anywhere in Cork City centre is a 10 minute walk max so the train should be a more viable option for commuters, that said there must be more reasons it's not used it as much.

calnand

The city council will be bringing out a new development plan this year, I'm sure there will be lots of plans for improving those services outlined in it. What ever happened the plans for one by the dunkettle interchange?

namloc1980

calnand wrote: »

The city council will be bringing out a new development plan this year, I'm sure there will be lots of plans for improving those services outlined in it. What ever happened the plans for one by the dunkettle interchange?

NRA objected as they need the proposed P&R site for the Dunkettle interchange. That was 5 years ago, presumably it's on the long finger since.

lisasimpson

With all these developments (this one, the events center, o callaghans revised plan for his albert quay site)going on in the city it will hopefully increase the use of public transport there leading to an improved service if the demand is there. The are some many knock off positive effects for the city hopefully