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will we ever see a 32 county republic

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    #122
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    junder wrote: »
    it was to raise the issues of victems in Northern Ireland, it was also to show that we protestants do not have two heads and that our culture was nothing to be a afraid of

    ......it would have to be said that were that the purpose, and regardless of the reaction of others, Mr Frazer would be the wrong man to have involved in it.


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    #123
    Can'tseeme
    Registered Users Posts: 611 ✭✭✭Can'tseeme


    junder wrote: »
    it was to raise the issues of victems in Northern Ireland, it was also to show that we protestants do not have two heads and that our culture was nothing to be a afraid of

    Gotcha. As you say it's gonna take a while to breakdown these attitudes towards culture, etc.


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    #124
    junder
    Registered Users Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭junder


    Nodin wrote: »
    ......it would have to be said that were that the purpose, and regardless of the reaction of others, Mr Frazer would be the wrong man to have involved in it.

    perhaps, personnly not a big fan of frazer


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    #125
    Erin Go Brath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,708 ✭✭✭Erin Go Brath


    We will see a United Ireland. It will happen in approx 2023. The GFA has ensured that a sectarian headcount will be the deciding factor in whether unfication is a runner or not. A referendum will decide it. The nationalist percentage of the population in the 6 counties is growing steadily and will become the dominant philosophy in a decade or so. All age groups under 30 are majority Catholic, while in the over 65s Protestants outnumber Catholics 2 to 1.


    With more Catholics been born every year, and more Protestants dying of old age every year it is certain to pan out in this way. The only question is when can a referedum be won? Certainly not now, in 10 years maybe, in 15 years definitely.


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    #126
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Erin Go Brath wrote: »
    We will see a United Ireland. It will happen in approx 2023. The GFA has ensured that a sectarian headcount will be the deciding factor in whether unfication is a runner or not. A referendum will decide it. The nationalist percentage of the population in the 6 counties is growing steadily and will become the dominant philosophy in a decade or so. All age groups under 30 are majority Catholic, while in the over 65s Protestants outnumber Catholics 2 to 1.


    With more Catholics been born every year, and more Protestants dying of old age every year it is certain to pan out in this way. The only question is when can a referedum be won? Certainly not now, in 10 years maybe, in 15 years definitely.

    That's assuming a huge majority of Catholics want it?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #127
    Erin Go Brath
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,708 ✭✭✭Erin Go Brath


    K-9 wrote: »
    That's assuming a huge majority of Catholics want it?

    They do.


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    #128
    dublincelt
    Registered Users Posts: 409 ✭✭dublincelt


    junder wrote: »
    it was to raise the issues of victems in Northern Ireland, it was also to show that we protestants do not have two heads and that our culture was nothing to be a afraid of

    Come on be honest, It was to raise the issues of one group of victims in the north and one group only. You know that as well as I do.

    In relation to a United Ireland. I am more that happy to find cheaper baby food and nappies accross the border due to the cheaper VAT rate. So to be totally honest, a United Ireland would be bad news for me!


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    #129
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Erin Go Brath wrote: »
    They do.

    They support political parties that do.

    That does not mean that each voter in a single issue Referendum would agree with an immediate United Ireland.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #130
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Erin Go Brath wrote: »
    They do.

    They support political parties that do.

    That does not mean that each voter in a single issue Referendum would agree with an immediate United Ireland.

    Surveys that specifically ask about reunification, show a substantial Catholic minority do not want it.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #131
    Dannyboy83
    Registered Users Posts: 4,236 ✭✭✭Dannyboy83


    I firmly believe, it will all be comparitive

    What will our tax rate be,
    what will our cost of living be,
    Will it be a good offer for Ulster

    If yes, they'll join
    If not, they won't

    Some will relocate back to Britain inevitably as happened in Hong Kong.


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    #132
    shqipshume
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,193 ✭✭✭shqipshume


    Not gonna happen Ireland is separated and not just by border in one place.
    No one cares anymore.


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    #133
    RiverWilde
    Closed Accounts Posts: 419 ✭✭RiverWilde


    Why are there so many of these threads?

    The govt. in Dublin has sucessfully run the Republic into the ground.

    Why on earth would anyone want to join us?

    The money from the celtic tiger years not spent as it should have been -schools, roads, rail, healthcare etc - the govt. in Dublin had a party. Now they want the rest of us to pay the bill.

    To add insult to injury there are those here who expect Germany and the rest of Europe to give us a large bail out. Why the hell should they?

    Why the hell would residents of Northern Ireland give up UK membership to be part of a country that blatantly favours the wealthy boys club that runs it?

    Riv


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    #134
    Martyr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,567 ✭✭✭Martyr


    Erin Go Brath wrote:
    They do.

    how do you know the majority of catholics want to be part of a 32 county republic? have you asked them?

    i live on the border and most of the catholics i talked to never seem to mention wanting a 32-county republic..its a nice dream to them of course, but realistically, for financial reasons, they're better off in the UK, and they know it.

    people in border counties (including myself) shop in the north because your money goes further.

    ever hear that mantra? "..difference is we're Irish.." - nobody cares..

    give me cheap consumer goods and i will give you my money.

    don't think catholics in northern ireland would want higher cost of living, just to be part of the republic.. why would they want that? its just silly.

    people are more concerned about money these days.

    catholics in north might like being part of a 32-county republic some day, but they don't want to give up some of the benefits that come being part of the UK.


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    #135
    Soldie
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 1,713 ✭✭✭Soldie


    Erin Go Brath wrote: »
    We will see a United Ireland. It will happen in approx 2023. The GFA has ensured that a sectarian headcount will be the deciding factor in whether unfication is a runner or not. A referendum will decide it. The nationalist percentage of the population in the 6 counties is growing steadily and will become the dominant philosophy in a decade or so. All age groups under 30 are majority Catholic, while in the over 65s Protestants outnumber Catholics 2 to 1.


    With more Catholics been born every year, and more Protestants dying of old age every year it is certain to pan out in this way. The only question is when can a referedum be won? Certainly not now, in 10 years maybe, in 15 years definitely.

    And now take off your rose-tinted glasses and consider that's not only up to the people in Northern Ireland to decide. From my own experiences, there are plenty of people in the Republic who don't support unification.


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    #136
    Dannyboy83
    Registered Users Posts: 4,236 ✭✭✭Dannyboy83


    Does anyone know specifically why DeValera said No to Churchill's offer in WW2?

    Was it economic?
    Or was it the fact that he thought the country would be destroyed?
    Perhaps he thought Hitler would win and hand it over regardless?

    I understand Churchill made an offer which was basically a lie, he hadn't even consulted Stormont

    Bertie Ahern is on record as saying that the 51% idea will not be accepted, it would need to be 75% at least for unification to occur


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    #137
    jimmmy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭jimmmy


    Dannyboy83 wrote: »
    Perhaps he thought Hitler would win and hand it over regardless?

    A shure Hitler was a grand lad, a Roman Catholic like all good Irish people, he meant no harm. Shure did'nt DeValera go to the German embassy in Dublin and express his condolences on the death of Hitler at the end of the war in Europe, long enough after the concentration camps had been discovered ? Hitler had plans after he won the war to use all fit English + Irish men to build an autobahn to the far east ie useful extermination....but ah shure I am sure had he won the war he would have changed his mind + let us build Irish pubs all over Germany instead.
    Cricklewood would have been in Cologne instead of London.


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    #138
    Svalbard
    Registered Users Posts: 504 ✭✭✭Svalbard


    Erin Go Brath wrote: »
    They do.

    A majority, but only 47%. So even if Catholics outnumber Protestants at some stage the people of NI might decide to remain in the UK.


    http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2007/Political_Attitudes/NIRELND2.html


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    #139
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Svalbard wrote: »
    A majority, but only 47%. So even if Catholics outnumber Protestants at some stage the people of NI might decide to remain in the UK.


    http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2007/Political_Attitudes/NIRELND2.html

    You quote a poll of 1100 odd people but yet do not quote a different poll of 1.142 million.

    That raises questions about the quality of that post.


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    #140
    Svalbard
    Registered Users Posts: 504 ✭✭✭Svalbard


    gurramok wrote: »
    You quote a poll of 1100 odd people but yet do not quote a different poll of 1.142 million.

    That raises questions about the quality of that post.

    Link or GTFO


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    #141
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    Dannyboy83 wrote: »
    Does anyone know specifically why DeValera said No to Churchill's offer in WW2?

    I understand Churchill made an offer which was basically a lie, he hadn't even consulted Stormont

    He knew Carson would never agree.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #142
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    gurramok wrote: »
    You quote a poll of 1100 odd people but yet do not quote a different poll of 1.142 million.

    That raises questions about the quality of that post.

    What poll of 1.142 million was about an United Ireland?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #143
    LordSutch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,078 ✭✭✭✭LordSutch


    You will see a 32 county republic, but only if the people of Northern Ireland agree to it, Britain has said that it has no interest in holding onto NI, and the republic has also given up its claim over the territory .............

    Northern Ireland may wish to stay within the UK (or to leave the UK), but that's their call.

    Not so sure about a 32 county republic, not sure that would ever work in simple terms.


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    #144
    guinnessdrinker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,469 ✭✭✭guinnessdrinker


    Dannyboy83 wrote: »
    Does anyone know specifically why DeValera said No to Churchill's offer in WW2?

    He knew Churchill was not a man of his word?
    Dannyboy83 wrote: »
    Bertie Ahern is on record as saying that the 51% idea will not be accepted, it would need to be 75% at least for unification to occur

    Are you sure he said this? As far as I'm aware the GFA, which Ahern of course has wholeheartedly endorsed allows for a 50+1 majority to be enough.


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    #145
    mrtaylor1981
    Closed Accounts Posts: 45 ✭mrtaylor1981


    junder wrote: »
    it was to raise the issues of victems in Northern Ireland, it was also to show that we protestants do not have two heads and that our culture was nothing to be a afraid of
    Yes indeed. In Northern Ireland we allow nationalists to march but obviously the Rep. of Ireland cannot, which shows it is secterian and intolerent - and then they ask why we will never join with them ?


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    #146
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    Svalbard wrote: »
    Link or GTFO
    K-9 wrote: »
    What poll of 1.142 million was about an United Ireland?

    NI elections are hell of alot better garnering opinion than a tiny useless survey. SF & SDLP support a UI.


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    #147
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,793 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    gurramok wrote: »
    NI elections are hell of alot better garnering opinion than a tiny useless survey. SF & SDLP support a UI.
    By which measure, the people of Ireland support the introduction of voting machines, the removal of medical cards from over-70s, the recent increase in the VAT rate, the provisions of the forthcoming mini-budget...


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    #148
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    oscarBravo wrote: »
    By which measure, the people of Ireland support the introduction of voting machines, the removal of medical cards from over-70s, the recent increase in the VAT rate, the provisions of the forthcoming mini-budget...

    So, whats that got to do with anything?:confused:

    1.142 million is the NI electorate, not the ROI, you're quoting the wrong region!;)


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    #149
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,793 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    gurramok wrote: »
    So, whats that got to do with anything?:confused:

    1.142 million is the NI electorate, not the ROI, you're quoting the wrong region!;)
    Ah, I see. In Northern Ireland, unlike anywhere else in the world, a vote for a political party is an unconditional and irrevocable expression of support for every single nuance of that party's policies.

    I forgot, I'm dealing with Nationalist logic.


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    #150
    The Raven.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,008 ✭✭✭The Raven.


    junder wrote: »
    Can'tseeme wrote: »
    Junder, what was the loveulster parade for? I ask that as a serious question. I was asking a few boys in work, genuinely can't remember what it was for.

    it was to raise the issues of victems in Northern Ireland, it was also to show that we protestants do not have two heads and that our culture was nothing to be a afraid of
    mrtaylor1981 wrote: »
    Yes indeed. In Northern Ireland we allow nationalists to march but obviously the Rep. of Ireland cannot, which shows it is secterian and intolerent - and then they ask why we will never join with them ?

    That is very simplistic and naïve, to say the least. The majority of people in the Republic of Ireland are generally neither sectarian nor intolerant. Nobody here expected the level of violence and bigotry that materialized at the so-called ‘Love Ulster’ march in 2006. However, it was obvious to anyone with a modicum of intelligence that a march of this nature, given the history of such marches, would without doubt be considered by some to be inappropriate, especially in the historic area of O’Connell Street.



    I don’t know whether or not the drum they were beating was the infamous Lambeg drum that has incited so much tension and hatred for many years. If not, it certainly seemed loud enough. The Lambeg drum ‘is utterly deafening, with a noise output of 115 - 120 decibels. When nearby you don't just hear it.. you *feel* the subsonics all through your chest and gut. It can be heard 5-6 miles away.’ It is hardly surprising that it is generally regarded by Catholics as a tribal instrument of intimidation.

    http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Lambeg%20drum

    The Orange marches in Northern Ireland around the 12th of July every year have caused a mass exodus of Catholics to the south, to avoid the trouble that they cause. One has to be realistic here and ask how on earth an Orange march in the centre of Dublin, with fifes and drums and provocative music, could possibly do anything to further the cause of peace and understanding.


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    #151
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,793 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    The Raven. wrote: »
    T One has to be realistic here and ask how on earth an Orange march in the centre of Dublin, with fifes and drums and provocative music, could possibly do anything to further the cause of peace and understanding.
    It could do so be being passively accepted as an interesting historical artifact, like Morris dancing or something.

    I guess we haven't grown up enough for that, yet.


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