Changes in the GAA - super thread

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 1:28pm

It's great to see this topic get far more publicity in recent times. It's finally getting discussed. Of course, the Dubs are trying to batten down the hatches but the genie is out of the bottle. There's now no one in doubt about how they have come into a position of dominance in football. The ludicrous amount of funding they have received has turned them into an unstoppable force. Many haven't realised that the improvements in hurling, underage, Ladies games and the club scene have been just as staggering. The senior footballers claim the headlines though and they are the reason this is gaining so much coverage. I think at this stage, some Dubs are hoping they lose!
Although this is now being discussed all across the country, the GAA won't take notice while the current president is in charge. We've seen this already with some of his insulting comments. This doesn't mean we shouldn't go to our representatives to push this topic to the forefront. Make noise now and when our next president comes in we can hope to make change.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 1:44pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So it’s ok for Cork to receive 50m between the GAA and taxpayers handouts? The GDO is a different argument, I agree every club should be afforded the same opportunity, county boards fund 50% and club the other. Not all clubs in dublin can afford that either. The money Dublin received went directly into grassroots development and not on the Snr county footballers
As some like to pedal. From 2005, what has been the gross spend in % of cash into the GAA coffers per county? Do you agree then, going forward that it should be funded per head of playing capita? I would hope that a balanced approach would be the order, unlike the lad who wants Dublin to keep finding sponsors and put the GAA money to use in every other county. Every county has dedicated volunteers, to say Dublin’s success is not on s big way down to that is doing each of us a disservice.

It's time to end the nonsense that this money has had no impact on the senior set up. The money is funding player development, this includes the elite players at underage level. We can see this has produced a huge amount of talent in both football and hurling. Having this funding from our pockets, of course, frees up money to be spent elsewhere. It's not some seperate thing, they are all linked together. It's one whole system.
The increased success off the back of the increased funding has led to a huge increase in sponsorship. More money for Dublin to spend and they spend it on their senior set ups. Dublin's backroom teams consist of expensive, highly rated coaches and other personnel. There are other areas where money assists Dublin which I won't get into now but you can see how far Dublin are removed from the rest in their professional structures. These structures cost millions.

doc_17 · 25-06-2019 2:20pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

ArielAtom wrote: »

So it’s ok for Cork to receive 50m between the GAA and taxpayers handouts? The GDO is a different argument, I agree every club should be afforded the same opportunity, county boards fund 50% and club the other. Not all clubs in dublin can afford that either. The money Dublin received went directly into grassroots development and not on the Snr county footballers
As some like to pedal. From 2005, what has been the gross spend in % of cash into the GAA coffers per county? Do you agree then, going forward that it should be funded per head of playing capita? I would hope that a balanced approach would be the order, unlike the lad who wants Dublin to keep finding sponsors and put the GAA money to use in every other county. Every county has dedicated volunteers, to say Dublin’s success is not on s big way down to that is doing each of us a disservice.

It's time to end the nonsense that this money has had no impact on the senior set up. The money is funding player development, this includes the elite players at underage level. We can see this has produced a huge amount of talent in both football and hurling. Having this funding from our pockets, of course, frees up money to be spent elsewhere. It's not some seperate thing, they are all linked together. It's one whole system.
The increased success off the back of the increased funding has led to a huge increase in sponsorship. More money for Dublin to spend and they spend it on their senior set ups. Dublin's backroom teams consist of expensive, highly rated coaches and other personnel. There are other areas where money assists Dublin which I won't get into now but you can see how far Dublin are removed from the rest in their professional structures. These structures cost millions.

The nonsense has ended in the other 31 counties. The only ones who defend it now are Dublin.

Dots1982 · 25-06-2019 2:36pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

It's time to end the nonsense that this money has had no impact on the senior set up. .

I think you’ll finally convince all the Dublin fans that you are right with this statement.

I know I said you could be here till the year 3000 saying it and you would get the same reply from Dublin fans but now I think you’ll finally convince them.

Seriously why do you bother? Dublin fans protect their own patch. Israelites protect their right to occupy the West Bank. Why bother going on and on trying to convince them.

If you communicated your dissatisfaction to the GAA instead of on here and stop attending games you might get something done.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 3:05pm

Dots1982 wrote: »

I think you’ll finally convince all the Dublin fans that you are right with this statement.

I know I said you could be here till the year 3000 saying it and you would get the same reply from Dublin fans but now I think you’ll finally convince them.

Seriously why do you bother? Dublin fans protect their own patch. Israelites protect their right to occupy the West Bank. Why bother going on and on trying to convince them.

If you communicated your dissatisfaction to the GAA instead of on here and stop attending games you might get something done.

Oh, I'm not trying to convince Dublin fans. I'm just showing up the excuses, deflection and attempts to downplay the funding as absolute nonsense. This is in the hope that people from other counties are sprung into action over this. It's long past the point where we can expect honesty and a sense of fair play from Dublin supporters. It's just not going to happen. They have a strong presence in the media and the president is a Dub so they have a large voice. It's important to counter their claims and expose the truth of what's really happening. I am in contact with the GAA and I'm not the only one. We need more on board though, it's the only way that things will change. Strength in numbers. Some of our county boards are in a difficult position. They need funds from Croke Park and going against them has a strong possibility of backfiring. We've seen this happen already. I'm really encouraged about the extra exposure this has gotten recently, I think more are copping on to it and the push for change has begun. Not going to games and hitting them where it hurts is one tactic but I think some organised protests to highlight this further are called for. Maybe outside a super 8 game in Croke Park or something.

ToBeFrank123 · 25-06-2019 3:22pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So it’s ok for Cork to receive 50m between the GAA and taxpayers handouts? The GDO is a different argument, I agree every club should be afforded the same opportunity, county boards fund 50% and club the other. Not all clubs in dublin can afford that either. The money Dublin received went directly into grassroots development and not on the Snr county footballers
As some like to pedal. From 2005, what has been the gross spend in % of cash into the GAA coffers per county? Do you agree then, going forward that it should be funded per head of playing capita? I would hope that a balanced approach would be the order, unlike the lad who wants Dublin to keep finding sponsors and put the GAA money to use in every other county. Every county has dedicated volunteers, to say Dublin’s success is not on s big way down to that is doing each of us a disservice.

How much did Dublin receive for Croke Park? Or rather it was handed to them free of charge. A stadium worth 500 million at least which they use as their home ground. Cork on the otherhand are lumbered with a huge debt. We can argue the pros and cons of Cork Ui Chaoimh, but historically its an important stadium that was badly in need of an upgrade. It wasn't handed over free of charge though to Cork, they had to put up significant funds themselves.

Dublin is in the superwealthy class of Gaelic football. It does not need more handouts from the GAA. If Dublin admins were truly the great administrators we are told they are, they should be well able to fundraise themselves, as every other county has to do.
But no, fundraising is one less thing Dublin have to worry about. One less thing of many they have to worry about.
Most people have lost count of the number of advantages handed to Dublin by the GAA.
I can't see it changing though. The GAA and Dublin are very closely intertwined at this stage.

ToBeFrank123 · 25-06-2019 3:27pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

Oh, I'm not trying to convince Dublin fans. I'm just showing up the excuses, deflection and attempts to downplay the funding as absolute nonsense. This is in the hope that people from other counties are sprung into action over this. It's long past the point where we can expect honesty and a sense of fair play from Dublin supporters. It's just not going to happen. They have a strong presence in the media and the president is a Dub so they have a large voice. It's important to counter their claims and expose the truth of what's really happening. I am in contact with the GAA and I'm not the only one. We need more on board though, it's the only way that things will change. Strength in numbers. Some of our county boards are in a difficult position. They need funds from Croke Park and going against them has a strong possibility of backfiring. We've seen this happen already. I'm really encouraged about the extra exposure this has gotten recently, I think more are copping on to it and the push for change has begun. Not going to games and hitting them where it hurts is one tactic but I think some organised protests to highlight this further are called for. Maybe outside a super 8 game in Croke Park or something.

I'd agree protests are required. A start would be the Leinster championship. Supporters there should boycott games in a co-ordinated way until the GAA wake up and see sense. There's evidence it has already started in games against Dublin. Supporters are speaking with their feet and long may it continue. All people are asking for is a fair and even distribution of funds. Financial doping of Dublin has to end if the sport and particularly the Leinster championship is to be saved.

Pogue eile · 25-06-2019 3:38pm

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

I'd agree protests are required. A start would be the Leinster championship. Supporters there should boycott games in a co-ordinated way until the GAA wake up and see sense. There's evidence it has already started in games against Dublin. Supporters are speaking with their feet and long may it continue. All people are asking for is a fair and even distribution of funds. Financial doping of Dublin has to end if the sport and particularly the Leinster championship is to be saved.

Supporters are supporting their team and their players not the Leinster Championship, do you really advocate 'supporters' showing that level of disrespect and contempt to their fellow county men? This would have the exact opposite of the desired affect, there are ways and means of leting your feelings be known, turning your back on your own is not one of them.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 3:49pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

It's time to end the nonsense that this money has had no impact on the senior set up. The money is funding player development, this includes the elite players at underage level. We can see this has produced a huge amount of talent in both football and hurling. Having this funding from our pockets, of course, frees up money to be spent elsewhere. It's not some seperate thing, they are all linked together. It's one whole system.
The increased success off the back of the increased funding has led to a huge increase in sponsorship. More money for Dublin to spend and they spend it on their senior set ups. Dublin's backroom teams consist of expensive, highly rated coaches and other personnel. There are other areas where money assists Dublin which I won't get into now but you can see how far Dublin are removed from the rest in their professional structures. These structures cost millions.

Yet Mayo spend more on their preparation. Dublin also have a Snr hurling team competing at the highest level. I tell you what, let’s leave sponsorship alone and balance the books in every county. Detailed development plans to be submitted to support funding. Limerick went to Dublin COunty board and asked for advice, look what’s happened. Money is not the answer in a lot of counties. I am an active member of my club, and guess what, none of the other volunteers get paid either.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 3:52pm

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

How much did Dublin receive for Croke Park? Or rather it was handed to them free of charge. A stadium worth 500 million at least which they use as their home ground. Cork on the otherhand are lumbered with a huge debt. We can argue the pros and cons of Cork Ui Chaoimh, but historically its an important stadium that was badly in need of an upgrade. It wasn't handed over free of charge though to Cork, they had to put up significant funds themselves.

Dublin is in the superwealthy class of Gaelic football. It does not need more handouts from the GAA. If Dublin admins were truly the great administrators we are told they are, they should be well able to fundraise themselves, as every other county has to do.
But no, fundraising is one less thing Dublin have to worry about. One less thing of many they have to worry about.
Most people have lost count of the number of advantages handed to Dublin by the GAA.
I can't see it changing though. The GAA and Dublin are very closely intertwined at this stage.

If Dublin were tasked with running Croke Park
and not guests at the request of the Leinster council you would seea lot more money for everyone. The argument that CP is Dublin’s is tiresome at this stage. It is owned by the association.

Dots1982 · 25-06-2019 3:52pm

Pogue eile wrote: »

Supporters are supporting their team and their players not the Leinster Championship, do you really advocate 'supporters' showing that level of disrespect and contempt to their fellow county men? This would have the exact opposite of the desired affect, there are ways and means of leting your feelings be known, turning your back on your own is not one of them.

People are free to protest as they see fit. Mass Boycotting of a championship that’s being dead for 5 years is in my opinion a very effective way of doing that.

You are protesting as a member of the GAA against the decisions taken by GAA HQ. You are not abandoning your own county.

Eamon Callaghan who played for Kildare up until last year said the following on Sunday:

Probably at the stage now where teams should boycott the Leinster championship. It’s a joke. County boards are as much to blame as @officialgaa for allowing this to happen.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 3:54pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

It's time to end the nonsense that this money has had no impact on the senior set up. The money is funding player development, this includes the elite players at underage level. We can see this has produced a huge amount of talent in both football and hurling. Having this funding from our pockets, of course, frees up money to be spent elsewhere. It's not some seperate thing, they are all linked together. It's one whole system.
The increased success off the back of the increased funding has led to a huge increase in sponsorship. More money for Dublin to spend and they spend it on their senior set ups. Dublin's backroom teams consist of expensive, highly rated coaches and other personnel. There are other areas where money assists Dublin which I won't get into now but you can see how far Dublin are removed from the rest in their professional structures. These structures cost millions.

Then how do they spend less in team preparation than Mayo??? Millions you say😂😂😂😂

ToBeFrank123 · 25-06-2019 3:56pm

Pogue eile wrote: »

Supporters are supporting their team and their players not the Leinster Championship, do you really advocate 'supporters' showing that level of disrespect and contempt to their fellow county men? This would have the exact opposite of the desired affect, there are ways and means of leting your feelings be known, turning your back on your own is not one of them.

The situation currently is pathetic. It goes beyond county affiliation, whether you are from Kerry, Dublin, Meath, Carlow or Kildare. And something radical has to be done to reverse the situation.

By large crowds attending and supporting games, people are giving two thumbs up to the GAA to continue with their current disastrous policies. Its only when people withdraw their support for a number of years that the GAA might change their minds, not in the interests of balance and fairness, they've already shown they couldn't care less about that, but purely in the interests of their own finances.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:05pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Yet Mayo spend more on their preparation. Dublin also have a Snr hurling team competing at the highest level. I tell you what, let’s leave sponsorship alone and balance the books in every county. Detailed development plans to be submitted to support funding. Limerick went to Dublin COunty board and asked for advice, look what’s happened. Money is not the answer in a lot of counties. I am an active member of my club, and guess what, none of the other volunteers get paid either.

Mayo spent money on travel expenses which was slightly above Dublin for 1 year! The huge increase in sponsorship money Dublin have received is off the back of the huge increase in funding!
Then you use Limerick as an example in an attempt to back up your "Money is not the answer in a lot of counties" claim, are you having a laugh there? You do know that every single county has volunteers? You're not any more special than them.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:07pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Then how do they spend less in team preparation than Mayo??? Millions you say😂😂😂😂

Already busted that point.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:09pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

It's great to see this topic get far more publicity in recent times. It's finally getting discussed. Of course, the Dubs are trying to batten down the hatches but the genie is out of the bottle. There's now no one in doubt about how they have come into a position of dominance in football. The ludicrous amount of funding they have received has turned them into an unstoppable force. Many haven't realised that the improvements in hurling, underage, Ladies games and the club scene have been just as staggering. The senior footballers claim the headlines though and they are the reason this is gaining so much coverage. I think at this stage, some Dubs are hoping they lose!
Although this is now being discussed all across the country, the GAA won't take notice while the current president is in charge. We've seen this already with some of his insulting comments. This doesn't mean we shouldn't go to our representatives to push this topic to the forefront. Make noise now and when our next president comes in we can hope to make change.

When is the last minor AI that Dublin won??? Staggering improvements!!!!

Pogue eile · 25-06-2019 4:09pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Yet Mayo spend more on their preparation. Dublin also have a Snr hurling team competing at the highest level. I tell you what, let’s leave sponsorship alone and balance the books in every county. Detailed development plans to be submitted to support funding. Limerick went to Dublin COunty board and asked for advice, look what’s happened. Money is not the answer in a lot of counties. I am an active member of my club, and guess what, none of the other volunteers get paid either.

Using Limerick as an example of money not being the answer........thats comedy gold right there

:D:D

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:10pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

Already busted that point.

Where I must have missed that. Even your overlord in Brazil can’t counter that fact.

joebloggs32 · 25-06-2019 4:11pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Then how do they spend less in team preparation than Mayo??? Millions you sayðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚ðŸ˜‚

Travel expenses for players account for a huge amount of expenditure for teams particularly along the west coast. Never even mind players who work outside of their own country, the huge geographic size of those counties mean a hefty lump of cash is needed for the expenses of home based players.
On the other hand, Dublin I believe gave all home based players in a very small geographic area.

I would also be surprised if Dublin CB need to pay gym memberships for their players (presuming they get sponsored) whereas many other CB's would.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:12pm

Pogue eile wrote: »

Using Limerick as an example of money not being the answer........thats comedy gold right there :D:D

So are you saying they are financially doped?

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:13pm

joebloggs32 wrote: »

Travel expenses for players account for a huge amount of expenditure for teams particularly along the west coast. Never even mind players who work outside of their own country, the huge geographic size of those counties mean a hefty lump of cash is needed for the expenses of home based players.
On the other hand, Dublin I believe gave all home based players in a very small geographic area.

I would also be surprised if Dublin CB need to pay gym memberships for their players (presuming they get sponsored) whereas many other CB's would.

So other counties are spending more in team preparation then. Thanks for confirming that

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:14pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

When is the last minor AI that Dublin won??? Staggering improvements!!!!

They won one in 2012, their first since 1984! They've won 4 u21 All Ireland's since the funding began, they only won one in their entire history before that! That is staggering.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:15pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Where I must have missed that. Even your overlord in Brazil can’t counter that fact.

..

Farawayhome wrote: »

Mayo spent money on travel expenses which was slightly above Dublin for 1 year! The huge increase in sponsorship money Dublin have received is off the back of the huge increase in funding!
Then you use Limerick as an example in an attempt to back up your "Money is not the answer in a lot of counties" claim, are you having a laugh there? You do know that every single county has volunteers? You're not any more special than them.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:17pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So other counties are spending more in team preparation then. Thanks for confirming that

No, one county spent more on travel expenses for one year. Team preparation involves paying coaches and other backroom staff. Dublin are way out in front on this. Former World champion boxers don't come cheap.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:20pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

Mayo spent money on travel expenses which was slightly above Dublin for 1 year! The huge increase in sponsorship money Dublin have received is off the back of the huge increase in funding!
Then you use Limerick as an example in an attempt to back up your "Money is not the answer in a lot of counties" claim, are you having a laugh there? You do know that every single county has volunteers? You're not any more special than them.

If you bothered to read my 1st post is acknowledged the work of volunteers, I then went on to say that Dublin’s success was partly down to them. The association is built on volunteerism l.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:21pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

No, one county spent more on travel expenses for one year. Team preparation involves paying coaches and other backroom staff. Dublin are way out in front on this. Former World champion boxers don't come cheap.

Could you post the breakdown on travel? Very interested in that v spend on other aspects of team prep.

ToBeFrank123 · 25-06-2019 4:23pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

If Dublin were tasked with running Croke Park
and not guests at the request of the Leinster council you would seea lot more money for everyone. The argument that CP is Dublin’s is tiresome at this stage. It is owned by the association.

I didn't say it was owned by them. I said it is handed over to them to play their games at. No other county has that advantage with little or no debt overhang.
And that's not even mentioning two home Super 8 games which is totally taking the p*ss.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:24pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

If you bothered to read my 1st post is acknowledged the work of volunteers, I then went on to say that Dublin’s success was partly down to them. The association is built on volunteerism l.

Every county has volunteers. Not every county gets millions of euros out of our pockets every year.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:24pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Could you post the breakdown on travel? Very interested in that v spend on other aspects of team prep.

You'll have to contact the Mayo county board.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:29pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

Every county has volunteers. Not every county gets millions of euros out of our pockets every year.

Agreed, if funding was fair it would be based on playing numbers. Kilkenny got funded for a football team for years and never fielded. I’m really enjoying watching this Dublin team, years of not winning had taken its toll. I feel for you.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 4:32pm

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

I didn't say it was owned by them. I said it is handed over to them to play their games at. No other county has that advantage with little or no debt overhang.
And that's not even mentioning two home Super 8 games which is totally taking the p*ss.

I think you might find they are playing games there to generate money for the association. They play their nominated home game in CP and their CP games as Detroit in the Super 8 fixtures.

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:32pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Agreed, if funding was fair it would be based on playing numbers. Kilkenny got funded for a football team for years and never fielded. I’m really enjoying watching this Dublin team, years of not winning had taken its toll. I feel for you.

Dublin are far out of line with everyone else based on playing numbers, population, any measure you want to use. That you've resorted to deflection when battered with facts is no surprise.

ThunbergsAreGo · 25-06-2019 4:35pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

They won one in 2012, their first since 1984! They've won 4 u21 All Ireland's since the funding began, they only won one in their entire history before that! That is staggering.

And what phenomenal teams those 21s were!

Farawayhome · 25-06-2019 4:48pm

naughtb4 wrote: »

And what phenomenal teams those 21s were!

2010: O'Carroll, Cooper, McCarthy, Rock.
2012: McCaffrey, Byrne, Kilkenny, Mannion.
2014: Byrne, Small, McCaffery, Fenton, Scully, Manion, Costello.
2017: Murchan, Howard, O'Callaghan.

Some were there 12 and 14 but you can see the level of player you can produce when you have the highly financed development machine in operation.

ToBeFrank123 · 25-06-2019 4:54pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

I think you might find they are playing games there to generate money for the association. They play their nominated home game in CP and their CP games as Detroit in the Super 8 fixtures.

But they are no longer generating money for the association.
Teams like Galway hurlers generate significant crowds and funds for the GAA and Leinster.

A Leinster football final between two non Dublin teams would have attracted far more of an attendance than 47,000, especially Kildare v Meath. Other games in Leinster also would attract bigger crowds.

Dublin are no longer a cashcow, in fact at this stage, Croke Park are probably only covering the cost of opening the stadium for some Dublin championship games. In a few years they will be making a loss on Dublin games. Maybe then they will wake up, although it will be too late to turn the ship around by then.

Competitions with no competitive edge equals low crowds.

The GAA would do anything for full houses in Croke Park like happened during the Meath Dublin rivalry of the 1980s. But those days seem to be over now, thanks to the very same GAA.

bruschi · 25-06-2019 5:51pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

Could you post the breakdown on travel? Very interested in that v spend on other aspects of team prep.

this here should give you a bit of an insight.

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/dublin-reign-supreme-but-where-does-your-county-rank-on-the-2018-gaa-rich-list-36922874.html

1 Dublin

Commercial: €1,462,529
Fundraising: €54,997
Central Media: €175,000
Competitions: €213,892
Expenses: €251,854
Provincial: €29,250

TOTAL: €2,187,522

TEAM COSTS: €1,604,353

2 Mayo

Commercial: €549,705
Fundraising: €921,249
Central Media: €175,000
Competitions: €143,805
Expenses: €370,284
Provincial: €8,600

TOTAL: €2,168,643

TEAM COSTS: €1,542,547

this was for 2017.

These figures here:
https://www.the42.ie/mayo-gaa-3-3115597-Dec2016/

are for Mayos expenditure in 2016 , which is somewhat similar to their €1.5m spend in 2017. Of their approx €1.6m expenditure in 2016, €580k, or 36% of it, is on travel expenses. Also note, in 2017, Dublins overall expenditure was higher than Mayos.

the different ways in receiving revenue are quite contrasting too. Not having to worry about fundraising is a huge bonus and is great for Dublin to be able to command such commercial revenue.

doc_17 · 25-06-2019 6:18pm

Some people are referring to the costs of preparing the Mayo team compared to Dublin.

Those people that hold it up as an example of Mayo having as much to spend as Dublin don’t seem to get that Mayo are probably paying a huge amount in travel expenses compared to Dublin.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 7:24pm

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

But they are no longer generating money for the association.
Teams like Galway hurlers generate significant crowds and funds for the GAA and Leinster.

A Leinster football final between two non Dublin teams would have attracted far more of an attendance than 47,000, especially Kildare v Meath. Other games in Leinster also would attract bigger crowds.

Dublin are no longer a cashcow, in fact at this stage, Croke Park are probably only covering the cost of opening the stadium for some Dublin championship games. In a few years they will be making a loss on Dublin games. Maybe then they will wake up, although it will be too late to turn the ship around by then.

Competitions with no competitive edge equals low crowds.

The GAA would do anything for full houses in Croke Park like happened during the Meath Dublin rivalry of the 1980s. But those days seem to be over now, thanks to the very same GAA.

If you say so. Show me the attendance figures for Galway hurlers v Dublin footballers and prove that Dublin are no longer generating money. I await you figures.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 7:28pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

They won one in 2012, their first since 1984! They've won 4 u21 All Ireland's since the funding began, they only won one in their entire history before that! That is staggering.

So one minor AI and four u21 is staggering improvement. What metrics are you using for that summation?

Dots1982 · 25-06-2019 7:34pm

ArielAtom wrote: »

So one minor AI and four u21 is staggering improvement. What metrics are you using for that summation?

4 under 21 all ireland titles in a decade is staggering by any metric. I’d imagine it’s unprecedented in the history of Gaelic Football.

Jaden · 25-06-2019 7:45pm

Dots1982 wrote: »

4 under 21 all ireland titles in a decade is staggering by any metric. I’d imagine it’s unprecedented in the history of Gaelic Football.

Galway did four in the 00s - 2002, 2005, 2011, 2013
Cork did SIX in the 80s - 1980, 1981, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1989
Kerry Have done four in decade TWICE:
1973, 1975, 1976, 1977
and
1990, 1995, 1996, 1998

So it's been done in the 70s 80s 90s 00s and 10s, it's actually the Norm.

Dots1982 · 25-06-2019 7:52pm

Jaden wrote: »

Galway did four in the 00s - 2002, 2005, 2011, 2013
Cork did SIX in the 80s - 1980, 1981, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1989
Kerry Have done four in decade TWICE:
1973, 1975, 1976, 1977
and
1990, 1995, 1996, 1998

So it's been done in the 70s 80s 90s 00s and 10s, it's actually the Norm.

Galway done 4 in 12 years not a decade by your own numbers but fair enough. 4 in a decade is a huge achievement so it’s daft to say it’s was not anything amazing by the other poster.

Jaden · 25-06-2019 7:59pm

Dots1982 wrote: »

Galway done 4 in 12 years not a decade by your own numbers but fair enough. 4 in a decade is a huge achievement so it’s daft to say it’s was not anything amazing by the other poster.

I stand corrected on Galway. Well spotted.

But is it really amazing if it's the norm? That said, it's impressive, but Corks was at least 50% more impressive, especially given their dual status.

ArielAtom · 25-06-2019 8:03pm

Farawayhome wrote: »

2010: O'Carroll, Cooper, McCarthy, Rock.
2012: McCaffrey, Byrne, Kilkenny, Mannion.
2014: Byrne, Small, McCaffery, Fenton, Scully, Manion, Costello.
2017: Murchan, Howard, O'Callaghan.

Some were there 12 and 14 but you can see the level of player you can produce when you have the highly financed development machine in operation.

All excellent players. What a great bunch of lads.

ToBeFrank123 · 26-06-2019 9:49am

Dublin had next to no tradition at u21 level until the millions started pouring in.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAA_Football_Under-20_All-Ireland_Championship

Dublin
Winners 5
2003, 2010, 2012, 2014, 2017

It will be interesting to see how the switch to U20 plays out. So far Kildare have won a title. The Kerry minors of the last few years should in theory start cleaning up.

The fact its a year earlier may impact Dublin as the u21 seemed to be a grade they targeted funds. Give it a few years though they will be back to winning it every other year.

At least at minor level, natural footballers still reign supreme.

ShyMets · 26-06-2019 10:08am

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Dublin had next to no tradition at u21 level until the millions started pouring in.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAA_Football_Under-20_All-Ireland_Championship

Dublin
Winners 5
2003, 2010, 2012, 2014, 2017

It will be interesting to see how the switch to U20 plays out. So far Kildare have won a title. The Kerry minors of the last few years should in theory start cleaning up.

The fact its a year earlier may impact Dublin as the u21 seemed to be a grade they targeted funds. Give it a few years though they will be back to winning it every other year.

At least at minor level, natural footballers still reign supreme.

I'm far from an expert at GAA but I'd regard players like Brogan, Connolly, O'Callaghan, Fenton, McCarthy & Killkenny to be pretty damn 'natural'

ToBeFrank123 · 26-06-2019 10:16am

ShyMets wrote: »

I'm far from an expert at GAA but I'd regard players like Brogan, Connolly, O'Callaghan, Fenton, McCarthy & Killkenny to be pretty damn 'natural'

Fenton couldn't even make the Dublin minor team. Dublin, while having huge advantages, still have no record of note at minor level. You'd have to ask why is this?
Kerry on other hand have won 5 in a row at minor.

So who do you think has the more natural footballers?

Dublin's advantages appears to be in numbers as well as strength and conditioning, and training at U21 and senior level. Dublin players are near to professional sportsmen by this stage, whereas players in other counties have to deal with serious logistical problems such as being 3rd level students in a different parts of the country. That and the fact Dublin players can command and almost live off sponsorship and appearances fees, while the same opportunities aren't available to players in rural counties, and many of them the most talented hen decide to go abroad such as to Australia.

Dots1982 · 26-06-2019 10:27am

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Fenton couldn't even make the Dublin minor team. Dublin, while having huge advantages, still have no record of note at minor level. You'd have to ask why is this?
Kerry on other hand have won 5 in a row at minor.

So who do you think has the more natural footballers?

Dublin's advantages appears to be in numbers as well as strength and conditioning, and training at U21 and senior level. Dublin players are near to professional sportsmen by this stage, whereas players in other counties have to deal with serious logistical problems such as being 3rd level students in a different parts of the country. That and the fact, Dublin players can command and almost live off sponsorship and appearances fees, while the same opportunities aren't available to players in rural counties, many of who then decide to go abroad such as to Australia.

Fenton couldn’t make the Dublin minor team..so what?

Most of their present team did make their minor teams.

Dublin are still the most successful Leinster county this decade at minor level and it’s being a carve up between Kildare and Dublin really.

Kildare are producing some excellent footballers but it’s a struggle to motivate them for senior football as they are in Dublin’s shadow and not showing signs of coming out of it.

Dublin also had a lot of dual players at minor level. Kilkenny, Costello & Callaghan were prodigious at both.

Maybe they had bad managers. Maybe Dublin pick very young minor teams.

Don’t think it’s much to do with Dublin not having natural footballers.

Pogue eile · 26-06-2019 10:29am

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Fenton couldn't even make the Dublin minor team. Dublin, while having huge advantages, still have no record of note at minor level. You'd have to ask why is this?
Kerry on other hand have won 5 in a row at minor.

So who do you think has the more natural footballers?

You keep letting your arguemnt down by spouting incorrect nonsense - whqt happened in the 20 yesra before Kerry's five in a row? No AI in 20 years at minor level but yet won 7 Senior AI's in the same period.

Feck all to do with natural footballers and infact if anything U21 is a far happier hunting ground for 'natural footballers' as their is inevitably a distinct lack of tactics owing to the lack of access to players.

ShyMets · 26-06-2019 10:32am

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Fenton couldn't even make the Dublin minor team. Dublin, while having huge advantages, still have no record of note at minor level. You'd have to ask why is this?
Kerry on other hand have won 5 in a row at minor.

So who do you think has the more natural footballers?

Dublin's advantages appears to be in numbers as well as strength and conditioning, and training at U21 and senior level. Dublin players are near to professional sportsmen by this stage, whereas players in other counties have to deal with serious logistical problems such as being 3rd level students in a different parts of the country. That and the fact Dublin players can command and almost live off sponsorship and appearances fees, while the same opportunities aren't available to players in rural counties, and many of them the most talented hen decide to go abroad such as to Australia.

Any proof of this or is it just a wild assertion?

Changes in the GAA - super thread

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