39 people found dead in trailer in UK

LeBash · 22-01-2021 5:11pm

They should start sticking C02 stats on every container to stop this from happening. Horrible even hearing how they died.

take everything · 22-01-2021 7:17pm

Watching it on the news there.
Awful case.

At least there has been some retribution.

yosser hughes · 22-01-2021 7:25pm

Calypso Realm wrote: »

Apparently it's extremely difficult to get a visitor's visa hence the need to turn to people smugglers.

All this sadly reminds me of a nail bar in a town near me where on every occasion I passed the premises, the manager was always standing at the door. I always thought it was strange at the time but looking back now, I reckon most of the Vietnamese workers were illegals and he was on the look out for a possible raid from Border Force.

There is slavery going on up and down this country in plain view. Money laundering, prostitution, and drugs.
People don't know the half of what's going on.
Very little enforcement or inspection going on .

pinkyeye · 22-01-2021 8:13pm

Calypso Realm wrote: »

Apparently it's extremely difficult to get a visitor's visa hence the need to turn to people smugglers.

All this sadly reminds me of a nail bar in a town near me where on every occasion I passed the premises, the manager was always standing at the door. I always thought it was strange at the time but looking back now, I reckon most of the Vietnamese workers were illegals and he was on the look out for a possible raid from Border Force.

And stopping the girls from running too. Slave traders is all they are. :mad:

MrMusician18 · 22-01-2021 9:21pm

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Hopefully that sentencing acts as a deterrent.

Perhaps I am naive but what I just can't get my head around is that each of the victims paid £13k to the people smugglers to get them to the UK, would it not have been far easier with that kind of outlay to fly in as a legitimate 'tourist' for 2 weeks and just stay there?

Summer of them had tried that but couldn't get visas or were stopped at the border.

What I dont understand about this story is why they didn't put vents in the trailer. They'd have gotten away with this but for their pure greed and inhumanity.

LuasSimon · 22-01-2021 9:26pm

fergiesfolly wrote: »

I cannot for the life of me understand how these are not full life sentences.
39 people are dead. Horrific, excruciating deaths.
Some of these men will be walking the streets in a decade or less.
None of them deserve to see the light of day ever again.

If they were sentenced in this country ie Ireland they wouldn’t have got half those sentences , as a rule of thumb you get half the sentence here for aggravated burglary- Assault- man slaughter etc than you would get in the UK and probably a quarter of what you’d get in the states .

Irish travellers in the UK get proper sentences for aggravated burglary unlike this country where they get treated with kid gloves until their 100th time been caught

Glen Immal · 22-01-2021 9:52pm

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Hopefully that sentencing acts as a deterrent.

Perhaps I am naive but what I just can't get my head around is that each of the victims paid £13k to the people smugglers to get them to the UK, would it not have been far easier with that kind of outlay to fly in as a legitimate 'tourist' for 2 weeks and just stay there?

I was thinking the same until it occurred to me that they may not have paid it up front...in the normal manner of these situations....this money may have been owed, these people would have become indentured slaves...

Galwayguy35 · 22-01-2021 9:58pm

Mo should have got longer.

Meeoow · 22-01-2021 10:20pm

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Mo should have got longer.

I thought he would have gotten at least 20 years. But I'd say he sang like a canary, and handed over a few names.
Any word of the flashy Irish couple in Warrington? Big House, big cars, she had a hair dressers. Apparently, they supplied the shipping container. They were arrested, but no word whether they were charged.

FrancieBrady · 22-01-2021 10:21pm

Glen Immal wrote: »

I was thinking the same until it occurred to me that they may not have paid it up front...in the normal manner of these situations....this money may have been owed, these people would have become indentured slaves...

Not just them. Their families back home invariably borrow to get them out. They'll pay too because it's not banks they are borrowing from.

Shelga · 22-01-2021 10:23pm

Maybe I sound awfully naive but is Vietnam really that bad that you’d go to these desperate lengths? Growing economy, no wars etc? Or does communism just make you extremely limited in what you can do there/ social mobility nonexistent? I just don’t really get it, in the way that I get people doing anything to try flee Syria.

Harry Palmr · 22-01-2021 11:32pm

Shelga wrote: »

Maybe I sound awfully naive but is Vietnam really that bad that you’d go to these desperate lengths? Growing economy, no wars etc? Or does communism just make you extremely limited in what you can do there/ social mobility nonexistent? I just don’t really get it, in the way that I get people doing anything to try flee Syria.

Not read the detail but if you're sold a dream of far greater wealth with which you can enich your whole family and you have little other than family to keep you from going you might choose to risk it. Many won't but enough to fill a container will and do.

The_Kew_Tour · 22-01-2021 11:44pm

The key should have been thrown away.

Larsso30 · 23-01-2021 1:35am

Mo only getting 13 year would lead me to believe he done a fair bit of talking!

Calypso Realm · 23-01-2021 2:47am

Glen Immal wrote: »

I was thinking the same until it occurred to me that they may not have paid it up front...in the normal manner of these situations....this money may have been owed, these people would have become indentured slaves...

On the news today it mentioned that the Vietnamese ringleader they're still trying to track down had a flat in London, where the migrants were housed until their families at home paid up. One of the others who was sentenced today (Nico) was responsible for ferrying them there in a fleet of taxis when they landed in UK.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 23-01-2021 3:31pm

Shelga wrote: »

Maybe I sound awfully naive but is Vietnam really that bad that you’d go to these desperate lengths? Growing economy, no wars etc? Or does communism just make you extremely limited in what you can do there/ social mobility nonexistent? I just don’t really get it, in the way that I get people doing anything to try flee Syria.

I gotta say me too, Shelga. Is it a really a country that people will hand over huge sums of money to flee illegally? I guess so.

23-01-2021 3:54pm

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

I gotta say me too, Shelga. Is it a really a country that people will hand over huge sums of money to flee illegally? I guess so.

It's a massive country and the numbers leaving like this are comparatively low. Nghe An and Ha Tinh, where the bulk of the dead were from, are famously poor areas of the country.

Nghe An in particular speaks a completely different type of Vietnamese that people from the rest of the country can't understand. My students with their extended family there can't speak it even though they visit multiple times a year. So I suppose if you're from Nghe An, are poor, and don't have the common Northern or Southern dialects through lack of education and exposure, you can't make the move to the big cities. There's discrimination as well for these "country folk". Ironic that Ho Chi Minh was from Nghe An, yet it's bottom of the ladder.

Fact is paying money for good jobs is commonplace. It ranges from the highest to the lowest. For poorly educated families with some land, remortgaging and sending a child to the UK is a legitimate option worth considering. Then I imagine there are families in debt to loan sharks. It's a far bigger thing here than in the West and the idea that someone would gamble their home away is completely normal. There's also the family thing where people pool together to make a part of it succeed. My ex's family got burnt terribly doing this for an aunt.

It's a bizarre country in that big money gets spent by poor people on furthering a family member's success, in a way that the west nowadays cannot possibly understand. Unfortunately, growing weed in the UK is the best many families from poor areas can hope for.

23-01-2021 3:58pm

Shelga wrote: »

Maybe I sound awfully naive but is Vietnam really that bad that you’d go to these desperate lengths? Growing economy, no wars etc? Or does communism just make you extremely limited in what you can do there/ social mobility nonexistent? I just don’t really get it, in the way that I get people doing anything to try flee Syria.

I would imagine that the money you could earn in one month in the UK, would be sent home and worth a lot more in Vietnam then England.

mick987 · 23-01-2021 5:17pm

Meeoow wrote: »

I thought he would have gotten at least 20 years. But I'd say he sang like a canary, and handed over a few names.
Any word of the flashy Irish couple in Warrington? Big House, big cars, she had a hair dressers. Apparently, they supplied the shipping container. They were arrested, but no word whether they were charged.

www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/trucking-boss-who-led-double-19498368

Muahahaha · 23-01-2021 10:13pm

Glen Immal wrote: »

I was thinking the same until it occurred to me that they may not have paid it up front...in the normal manner of these situations....this money may have been owed, these people would have become indentured slaves...

Yeah I think they are sold a dream and when they get here they are basically modern slaves. Huge problem with it in the UK where they end up working in nail bars working in plain sight. You see these nail bars popping up here even in rural towns and it just doesnt add up for me that they are getting visas to work here. Some of them also are put straight into cannibis grow houses and forced to grow weed, they can never leave the houses and when Gardai raid them they often havent a clue what country they are even in.

Heres a case from 2019, Vietnamese woman caught in a mansion on the shores of Lough Derg with 500 cannabis plants.

At Ennis Circuit Court, counsel for the State, Lorcan Connolly BL told Judge Gerald Keys that there has been an early plea in the case by the accused, Thuy Thi Nguyen.

Thi Nguyen is to formally enter her plea next Tuesday and Judge Keys said that Nguyen “should be entitled to priority as she is in a strange country”.Connolly agreed: “She is entitled to priority in having her case dealt early due to the early plea and she is in custody on this alone.”

Counsel for Nyugen, Pat Whyms BL stated solicitor for Ms Thi Nyugen, John Casey required technology to be able to translate her instructions before court after an interpreter was not available. Casey has already told the district court that there may be an element of people trafficking in the case.
Mr Casey said that the estimated value of the drugs by the State is close to €1 million.

In the case, Ms Thi Nguyen of no fixed abode is charged in connection with the discovery of an industrial-sized cannabis grow house at the Victorian mansion, Tinarana House on the shores of Lough Derg near Killaloe in east Clare in May.
More than 500 cannabis plants at various growth stages were found at the 16-bedroomed property on 31 May last year.

Thi Nguyen has been remanded in custody at the female unit of Limerick prison since her first appearance in court on 2 June. The operation which resulted in the arrest of Thi Nguyen and the discovery of the drugs involved members of the Clare Divisional Drugs Unit, local uniform and plainclothes Gardaí, the Western Region Armed Support Unit and the Cork Garda Dog Unit including the unit’s dog, Laser.

At Nguyen’s first court in June, Det Garda Seamus Doyle of Kildare Garda Station told that when Nguyen was charged with the offence, she replied: “I feel upset and scared because they forced me to do it.”

https://www.thejournal.ie/trafficking-vietnamese-cannabis-limerick-4872737-Oct2019/

Theres several other Vietnamese caught growing weed here over the last few years but its likely only the tip of the ice berg. Says a lot about the viciousness of drug gangs that they already can make huge profits growing weed but they dont even do it themselves, instead putting modern slaves to work. When the Gardai bust the operation of course the ringleaders are nowhere to be found and the Vietnamese do the jail time.

Cosmo Kramer · 23-01-2021 11:47pm

Larsso30 wrote: »

Mo only getting 13 year would lead me to believe he done a fair bit of talking!

Mo will be out in 5 years if he keeps the head down, but I'd say he'd be well advised to get himself far away from Northern Ireland for the rest of his days once he's out of prison.

volchitsa · 24-01-2021 10:35am

Muahahaha wrote: »

Yeah I think they are sold a dream and when they get here they are basically modern slaves. Huge problem with it in the UK where they end up working in nail bars working in plain sight. You see these nail bars popping up here even in rural towns and it just doesnt add up for me that they are getting visas to work here. Some of them also are put straight into cannibis grow houses and forced to grow weed, they can never leave the houses and when Gardai raid them they often havent a clue what country they are even in.

Heres a case from 2019, Vietnamese woman caught in a mansion on the shores of Lough Derg with 500 cannabis plants.

https://www.thejournal.ie/trafficking-vietnamese-cannabis-limerick-4872737-Oct2019/

Theres several other Vietnamese caught growing weed here over the last few years but its likely only the tip of the ice berg. Says a lot about the viciousness of drug gangs that they already can make huge profits growing weed but they dont even do it themselves, instead putting modern slaves to work. When the Gardai bust the operation of course the ringleaders are nowhere to be found and the Vietnamese do the jail time.

Right, but they aren't living in a vacuum - they even called their families on mobile phones during the journey.

So all this talk about the families thinking they were going to be travelling on a coach, or they believed they were getting a good job, doesn't really hold up for me when you consider that this is a regular occurrrence for people from the same areas. They must know what the neighbour's son, or their cousin, found when they got to Europe.

I don't believe they didn't know the basic reality, namely that they were going as illegal immigrants, possibly to grow illegal drugs or whatever, and they were grand with that. Because they were going to make a (relative) fortune. A bit like Mo Robinson really.

biko · 24-01-2021 2:28pm

goat2 wrote: »

On one of the news channels last night, it said that the driver was getting one thousand pounds per passenger on those trailers, , so a few hours run earned these people a fair bit of money

Traffickers do it for all kinds of reasons, all for personal gain.

ArmaniJeanss · 24-01-2021 3:16pm

volchitsa wrote: »

So all this talk about the families thinking they were going to be travelling on a coach, or they believed they were getting a good job, doesn't really hold up for me when you consider that this is a regular occurrrence for people from the same areas. They must know what the neighbour's son, or their cousin, found when they got to Europe.

I don't believe they didn't know the basic reality, namely that they were going as illegal immigrants, possibly to grow illegal drugs or whatever, and they were grand with that. Because they were going to make a (relative) fortune. A bit like Mo Robinson really.

Probably also a lot of stepped exaggeration on how well things are going.

So the truth might be that the daughter is working in a dinghy pop-up nail bar as an effective slave.
But so as not to worry her mam she tells her it's a secure position in one of the best salon franchises in England.
The Mam tells the rest of the family that the daughter is the manager.
By the time it goes round the village she's one step off setting up her own nail-bar empire.
The other people in the village want to follow in her footsteps.

Might sound unlikely but I had similar in my family.
To listen to my Mam you'd swear her brother was running one of the biggest manufacturing companies in the UK.
In the early 90s my big sis got sent over on the boat with 'Martin will set you up with an office job'.
Turned out he was the warehouse nightwatchman.

Muahahaha · 24-01-2021 6:41pm

volchitsa wrote: »

Right, but they aren't living in a vacuum - they even called their families on mobile phones during the journey.

So all this talk about the families thinking they were going to be travelling on a coach, or they believed they were getting a good job, doesn't really hold up for me when you consider that this is a regular occurrrence for people from the same areas. They must know what the neighbour's son, or their cousin, found when they got to Europe.

I don't believe they didn't know the basic reality, namely that they were going as illegal immigrants, possibly to grow illegal drugs or whatever, and they were grand with that. Because they were going to make a (relative) fortune. A bit like Mo Robinson really.

I would say it is a mixed bag and it all depends on what criminal enterprise trafficks them from Vietnam in the first place. For sure there are young Vietnamese women working in nail bars who are getting paid, its not going to be minimum wage but still better than what they could earn back home. They will be living 15 or 20 to a house sleeping on floors in squalid conditions. They are still modern slaves though, the definition of which acknowledges that they can in some instances get paid. But they've no control over their destiny and are all fully aware they're illegal immigrants so going to the police isnt an option.

But if they end up growing weed in some house in a rural location I would think thats a different kettle of fish altogether. They are likely now the property of a drug cartel and they dont pay wages. It is more likely that the criminal in Vietnam who recruited them gets a retainer for their labour as part of the deal. When they arrive here its a gun to the head where they are told by their Vietnamese handler on the phone that the house is being watched 24/7 and if they try to escape their family members will be killed. They basically frighten the sh1t out of them. That then gives the drug cartel ultimate control of them, they cant attempt an escape and cant go to the police anyway. It also allows the cartel to grow millions work of weed while always being one step removed from the operation. Their only risk is when they go to pick up kilos of what is grown. Id say it is an absolute ruthless operation.

volchitsa · 24-01-2021 9:00pm

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Probably also a lot of stepped exaggeration on how well things are going.

So the truth might be that the daughter is working in a dinghy pop-up nail bar as an effective slave.
But so as not to worry her mam she tells her it's a secure position in one of the best salon franchises in England.
The Mam tells the rest of the family that the daughter is the manager.
By the time it goes round the village she's one step off setting up her own nail-bar empire.
The other people in the village want to follow in her footsteps.

Might sound unlikely but I had similar in my family.
To listen to my Mam you'd swear her brother was running one of the biggest manufacturing companies in the UK.
In the early 90s my big sis got sent over on the boat with 'Martin will set you up with an office job'.
Turned out he was the warehouse nightwatchman.

Yeah I can see that could sometimes be what happens, but this is not about social status or money in this case: the suggestion here is that people are sending their children into life threatening situations over and over and that nobody ever tells their little brother that maybe it's not a great idea after all. Not even "Hey you know that air conditioned coach they promised us? Well actually..." No I don't buy that.

And as someone said, they aren't fleeing a war situation or even massive poverty. Vietnam has a growing economy.

seenitall · 24-01-2021 10:38pm

volchitsa wrote: »

No I don't buy that.

So, what are you thinking, volchitsa? How and why do these journeys keep coming about, with these huge risks being known, etc? Genuine question.

volchitsa · 24-01-2021 10:55pm

seenitall wrote: »

So, what are you thinking, volchitsa? How and why do these journeys keep coming about, with these huge risks being known, etc? Genuine question.

For the same reason lots of Irish people went (often illegally) to the States and elsewhere back in my time: a mixture of adventure and wanting to make some money. I hung out with a bunch of Irish guys in Germany who worked every summer on industrial construction sites and we all used to laugh at how crazy the Germans were, giving them all this danger money, and the rest of us who were just in the usual jobs of canning factories and chambermaids all thought these lads had it made compared to us. The reality is that they were doing dangerous work, but we had very little thought of that. As for the ones who went to America, there was a whole business around passing Green Card numbers along to people for the following year (this was just before the J1 became a thing).

So yeah, I think Mo Robinson, and even more so the higher up people, deserved good long prison sentences, but I think the families of the people who died are mostly lying when they claim to have believed they were going by coach etc. Maybe some really did but I'd say that was a tiny minority. More importantly, I also think they mostly knew well they were going to work illegally, but they didn't really care.

Galwayhurl · 25-01-2021 1:20pm

fergiesfolly wrote: »

I cannot for the life of me understand how these are not full life sentences.
39 people are dead. Horrific, excruciating deaths.
Some of these men will be walking the streets in a decade or less.
None of them deserve to see the light of day ever again.

Totally agree. The police obviously put so much work into finding the culprits and extended culprits. That said, if it was Ireland you can bet the sentences would have been even shorter.

biko · 25-01-2021 3:30pm

RTE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddq5dreCSQI

RIP, poor people.

39 people found dead in trailer in UK

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