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Covid 19 Part XXXIV-249,437 ROI(4,906 deaths) 120,195 NI (2,145 deaths)(01/05)Read OP

13567…197

Comments

  • #102
    stephenjmcd
    Registered Users Posts: 15,302 ✭✭✭✭stephenjmcd


    Continued progress in Israel

    https://twitter.com/segal_eran/status/1374995928428515328?s=20


  • #103
    Banana Republic 1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    Wolf359f wrote: »
    Going by our own reports, I think you're science maybe wrong:
    Symptoms.png

    And you pulled that from were exactly, it could be anything


  • #104
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    irishguy1983 wrote: »
    Just 310 in hospital - seems like a good drop in numbers at hospitals? Yet no one talking about it? Am I missing something maybe??

    All about cases. Cases = deaths to a lot of people.


  • #105
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    irishguy1983 wrote: »
    Just 310 in hospital - seems like a good drop in numbers at hospitals? Yet no one talking about it? Am I missing something maybe??
    Stubborn levels of cases is what is distracting people along with an R0 around 1 that could easily see cases jump and maybe produce a rise in hospital cases. Falling hospital numbers are good just as long as it continues on that trajectory.


  • #106
    lawred2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,457 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    PowerToWait wrote: »
    Hysterical.

    It's not. Wife works in cancer treatment and screening is way down. That's a fact. Dismiss it as hysterical all you like.


  • #107
    lawred2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,457 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    irishguy1983 wrote: »
    Just 310 in hospital - seems like a good drop in numbers at hospitals? Yet no one talking about it? Am I missing something maybe??

    Those that shout the loudest have little interest in good news stories.


  • #108
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Genuine question, considering the age profile of yesterday’s cases, how many of those will end up in hospital typically?


  • #109
    wadacrack
    Registered Users Posts: 4,172 ✭✭✭wadacrack


    stephenjmcd wrote: »
    Continued progress in Israel

    https://twitter.com/segal_eran/status/1374995928428515328?s=20

    We probably should have went the one dose route.


  • #110
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users Posts: 5,914 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Banana Republic 1 wrote: »
    And you pulled that from were exactly, it could be anything

    From Ireland's Epi Reports:
    https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/surveillance/covid-1914-dayepidemiologyreports/COVID-19_14_day_epidemiology_WEB%20report_20210323_v1.0.pdf


  • #111
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Leftwaffe wrote: »
    Genuine question, considering the age profile of yesterday’s cases, how many of those will end up in hospital typically?
    In comparison with older age groups very few but the fear is these cases may n time seed disease in older groups who could end up in hospital. Positivity rates of over 20% in close contacts suggest that concern is justified.


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  • #112
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    wadacrack wrote: »
    We probably should have went the one dose route.
    Very few countries have. Israel is a special case and are providing data for the rest of the world.


  • #113
    kilns
    Registered Users Posts: 3,525 ✭✭✭kilns


    At least some seem to think that Ireland are doing a good job.

    Here in Switzerland as of last night Ireland has been taken off the mandatory quarantine list, so if you enter from Ireland with a negative test you can freely move about as normal


  • #114
    irishguy1983
    Registered Users Posts: 1,389 ✭✭✭irishguy1983


    lawred2 wrote: »
    Those that shout the loudest have little interest in good news stories.

    Maybe...I just remember it being about 380 a week or so ago - seems like a big drop....Also I think someone said in the news ‘hospital cases remain stagnant’.....Yet now it appears we have a big drop and I’m not hearing anything on this!!


  • #115
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    Yeah maybe more focus on the younger age groups who don't have immunity. If it evolves further in this direction could end up having to suppress it anyway.



    I'm loving the revisionist history going on here of late.

    I remember when we all locked down and reduced interaction so that schools could open and hospital services could get back to normality.

    This was effectively achieved. Then came along Christmas and we really needed a meaningful Christmas so we kinda went back to normal at the worst possible time of year for respiratory diseases.
    • Hospitals nearly got overrun.
    • Schools closed for the longest period in the history of the state
    • Routine and screening services were suspended.
    • Prolonged closure of business and unemployed.

    In case it's not obvious cancer screening wouldn't have occurred if there was no public health measures. Someone who can't breath is higher when getting triaged unfortunately. The numbers in hospital in January were not sustainable and the exponential increase would have continued.

    The main talking point on here is that NPHET are to blame for cancer screening being postponed. This is just wrong. I agree that this is a massive issue and needs to be resolved extremely quickly but let's not misremember why it came about. Let's also not forget the fateful decisions that led to the sequence of events. There were many on here who were blue in the face saying that Jan / Feb would be horrific but were dismissed as negative nigels. A meaningful Christmas for a disaster quarter year.

    You reap what you sow. You can't advocate for something in December then bemoan the consequences of said decisions 3 months later. Cake and eat it stuff as always. But yeah blame an advisory group while the government hold a climate chat on same day UK asked questions about mistakes made. No answers forthcoming but at least there was conversation. I'd prefer to not have made the mistake. Failing that I'd prefer that we acknowledge the mistake. Doing neither is a recipe for repetition.


    https://twitter.com/Dr2NisreenAlwan/status/1374780949372805125?s=20

    While you’re not wrong about some of you say, I think you are fundamentally wrong to not recognise that the balance between protecting us from COVID and burning the economy to the ground is changing. Serious illness WILL be lower as the vulnerable are vaccinated.....the UK experience this year clearly shows that. While the virus may have a different effect on younger people now (not borne out in the UK incidentally), the equation that supports lockdown had changed

    The UK have removed case numbers in isolation from their tests to relax restrictions. Whitty said that case numbers will rise substantially but that he does not see that affecting the roadmap to normality. The data points informing our own lockdown decisions need to change at some point. But all the narrative suggests that we are stuck with this. There do not seem to be any dissenting voices

    We are continuing to burn our economy to the ground, and impacting the lives, to a devastating degree, of large segments of our population

    It’s a balance, and the balance is shifting. We need to start moving toward living with this in our society


  • #116
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    prunudo wrote: »
    No need for the ffs! I'm not saying there aren't any asymptomatic cases. Just that the 60% is very high, did all these people really not have a tickle in their throat, a random cough, a sleepness night, a slightly higher temp than normal. As I said I find hard to believe that that many are truly asymptomatic.

    Shame just suposing.. if 60% are truly asymtomatic with the vaste majority of them having no long term sequale then why couldnt send them out to get covid and then they and the over 70s etc with the injection would give us herd community immunity.
    The number is lower but still I like to imagine.. what if its say 30% asymtomatic and 30% sniffles. Good morning all...today is a new day... and I'm feeling good...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5Y11hwjMNs


  • #117
    Happydays2020
    Registered Users Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭Happydays2020


    irishguy1983 wrote: »
    Maybe...I just remember it being about 380 a week or so ago - seems like a big drop....Also I think someone said in the news ‘hospital cases remain stagnant’.....Yet now it appears we have a big drop and I’m not hearing anything on this!!

    The drop does not suit the narrative of a 4th wave.

    Have we the virus largely under control? Yes - but some areas are stubbornly high.

    Are there still risks? Yes, but the risks will drop significantly over the next 6 - 8 weeks as the most vulnerable are vaccinated?

    Do we still need restrictions? Yes, but there needs to be a reopening plan linked to targets being met.

    Will normality return soon? Yes. But gradually. And some sectors such as indoor hospitality, pubs and nightclubs etc will probably have restrictions until late summer and Autumn.


  • #118
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,378 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    fits wrote: »
    It’s impossible to keep out with high levels in community. With aggressive suppression and contact tracing it might be a different story.

    Yeah, I'm talking in the past tense. There should have been one hospital in the country for Covid-19 patients this time last year.


  • #119
    Banana Republic 1
    Registered Users Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭Banana Republic 1


    Leftwaffe wrote: »
    Genuine question, considering the age profile of yesterday’s cases, how many of those will end up in hospital typically?

    I don’t know the stats but The B117 variant effects younger people more that’s the problem


  • #120
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    Wolf359f wrote: »
    From Ireland's Epi Reports:
    https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/coronavirus/novelcoronavirus/surveillance/covid-1914-dayepidemiologyreports/COVID-19_14_day_epidemiology_WEB%20report_20210323_v1.0.pdf

    I think what we are missing though is a breakdown of postive cases per symtoms in each age group. There is already a chart showing the different levels of severitymaybe the cases should be shown by this. eg there are three levels within mild moderate and severe...maybe someone could post it here.

    Edit..and how long is the average stay in hospital for each age group eg is it one overnight in the under 50s ? And what percentage of total cases eg under 50 end up in ICU here in Ireland.


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  • #121
    Leftwaffe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,549 ✭✭✭Leftwaffe


    Banana Republic 1 wrote: »
    I don’t know the stats but The B117 variant effects younger people more that’s the problem

    Does it? I don’t see much talk about this UK variant in the UK. We’re more afraid of it than they are


  • #122
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users Posts: 5,914 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    speckle wrote: »
    I think what we are missing though is a breakdown of postive cases per symtoms in each age group. There is already a chart showing the different levels of severitymaybe the cases should be shown by this. eg there are three levels of mild moderate and severe...maybe someone could post it here.

    I only posted it to show the OP his science around 60% being asymptomatic was flawed. Then again he never provided the science!


  • #123
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Very few countries have. Israel is a special case and are providing data for the rest of the world.

    Would you know if they have an equivalent of VAERS or the yellow flag EU system of reporting adverse reactions... I cant seem to find one? thanks


  • #124
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Deleted User wrote: »
    One of the dumbest things Ireland did was use all hospitals as Covid-19 hospitals. There is absolutely no sense to it.
    Given that COVID didn't just roll up in say Blanchardstown only your own suggestion is ill-thought out. Apart from ambulances criss-crossing the country you'd be screwed when that one hospital filled up. As a brilliant idea it has obviously been implemented worldwide.


  • #125
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    speckle wrote: »
    Would you know if they have an equivalent of VAERS or the yellow flag EU system of reporting adverse reactions... I cant seem to find one? thanks

    According to this, they engage in "active surveillance" of side effects. Some stats on them there.

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/post-covid-vaccine-under-0-3-of-israelis-reported-side-effects-to-doctor/


  • #126
    caveat emptor
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,134 ✭✭✭caveat emptor


    Deleted User wrote: »
    While you’re not wrong about some of you say, I think you are fundamentally wrong to not recognise that the balance between protecting us from COVID and burning the economy to the ground is changing. Serious illness WILL be lower as the vulnerable are vaccinated.....the UK experience this year clearly shows that. While the virus may have a different effect on younger people now (not borne out in the UK incidentally), the equation that supports lockdown had changed

    The UK have removed case numbers in isolation from their tests to relax restrictions. Whitty said that case numbers will rise substantially but that he does not see that affecting the roadmap to normality. The data points informing our own lockdown decisions need to change at some point. But all the narrative suggests that we are stuck with this. There do not seem to be any dissenting voices

    We are continuing to burn our economy to the ground, and impacting the lives, to a devastating degree, of large segments of our population

    It’s a balance, and the balance is shifting. We need to start moving toward living with this in our society

    Thanks for the reply. To your point on the economy , I agree it is a balancing act. I'm sure the retail sector was happy with the pre Christmas splurge but isn't so happy with the 3 month shut down. The population certainly isn't.

    Serious illness will indeed be lower once older and at risk groups vaccinated but we are not the UK on this front but going back to normal thinking that infection won't spread will still be a problem.

    The number of serious cases in the younger groups has been a small percentage. A small percentage of a big number is still a big number. So if we throw caution to the wind and say that it only effects older people we forget the context of that statement. We have only been testing children who were symptomatic for a large part of this and even then the criteria was based on available capacity.

    It should read, "It was only affecting old people with relatively low levels of infection on a national level and with wild type that didn't infect as many young people"

    Opening up while necessary as we have seen increases the total number of infections which will by extension increase number of infections in that group.

    The age of the serious cases / deaths is definitely skewed towards very old people but the sample is biased due to effect of care homes.

    Vaccines for everyone really is the way out. Not all bad news. Amazing news. :)
    Babies born to vaccinated mothers have COVID-fighting antibodies

    https://twitter.com/rencontrejfm/status/1375008058473123840?s=20


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  • #127
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,378 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Given that COVID didn't just roll up in say Blanchardstown only your own suggestion is ill-thought out. Apart from ambulances criss-crossing the country you'd be screwed when that one hospital filled up. As a brilliant idea it has obviously been implemented worldwide.

    It was implemented in Vietnam, to great success. Normal hospitals continued as normal.


  • #128
    namloc1980
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,329 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    theballz wrote: »
    Numbers going up, very concerning - wave 4 coming anyone?

    Hospital and ICU numbers are down. The hysteria of only focusing on the raw case numbers needs to end.


  • #129
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    is_that_so wrote: »
    According to this, they engage in "active surveillance" of side effects. Some stats on them there.

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/post-covid-vaccine-under-0-3-of-israelis-reported-side-effects-to-doctor/

    Thanks for that so they have a system but maybe not as detailed or openly accessable as vaers or the yellow flag system in the EU ...which I will say are not perfect either.


  • #130
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Deleted User wrote: »
    It was implemented in Vietnam, to great success. Normal hospitals continued as normal.
    A country with under 3000 cases is not a model for the rest of the world.


  • #131
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    speckle wrote: »
    Thanks for that so they have a system but maybe not as detailed or openly accessable as vaers or the yellow flag system in the EU ...which I will say are not perfect either.
    It's probably being fed back to Pfizer in the data recorded anyway. It is after all a sort of clinical trial.


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  • #132
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    caveat emptor wrote: »
    Not all bad news. Amazing news. :)



    https://twitter.com/rencontrejfm/status/1375008058473123840?s=20

    As somebody with innate immunity to TB... due to my mother being ill with it while pregnant.. I have been hoping for this good news. As a family we have some understanding the fears that pregnant women with covid have been going through. Thanks Caveat made my day and not shamed to say getting teary here.


  • #133
    Icyseanfitz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,411 ✭✭✭Icyseanfitz


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    Hospital and ICU numbers are down. The hysteria of only focusing on the raw case numbers needs to end.

    the issue is the raw case/swab numbers lead to increased hospitalizations weeks after the fact.


  • #134
    timmyntc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,114 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Icyseanfitz wrote: »
    the issue is the raw case/swab numbers lead to increased hospitalizations weeks after the fact.

    As more vulnerable groups are vaccinated, they will make up a lower share of cases and those that do test positive are incredibly unlikely to need hospitalisation.

    The rate of cases needing hospitalised down the road is dropping all the time, so case numbers should not dictate anymore (or at least have massively reduced significance)


  • #135
    namloc1980
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,329 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    Icyseanfitz wrote: »
    the issue is the raw case/swab numbers lead to increased hospitalizations weeks after the fact.

    700k of the most vulnerable who would end up in hospital have had at least 1 shot at this stage. Why would we continue to see increased hospitalisations?

    The focus only on the case numbers needs to come to an end asap.


  • #136
    Russman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,914 ✭✭✭Russman


    Leftwaffe wrote: »
    Does it? I don’t see much talk about this UK variant in the UK. We’re more afraid of it than they are

    Could it be that over there in the UK, its not the UK variant, its just COVID ?


  • #137
    Wolf359f
    Registered Users Posts: 5,914 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Icyseanfitz wrote: »
    the issue is the raw case/swab numbers lead to increased hospitalizations weeks after the fact.

    Hospital figures seem to increase before case numbers do. So hospital admissions are more valuable metric to see what's happening in the community. Hospital admissions show were going up **** Creek, the cases tell us how far!

    That could change this time around if younger people require hospital care later than elderly patients (most cases now are in under 65's and the highest at risk are getting vaccinated)
    I'm just assuming elderly people would be hit faster with symptoms that require hospitalization.


  • #138
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,599 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    namloc1980 wrote: »
    700k of the most vulnerable who would end up in hospital have had at least 1 shot at this stage. Why would we continue to see increased hospitalisations?

    The focus only on the case numbers needs to come to an end asap.

    OK.

    In January Leo said that non covid full health care wouldn't resume until icu numbers are below 50. Therefore we can't consider any relaxation of resteictions until we have less than 50 in icu.

    We're at 75 in icu now. Do you feel that they can consider opening society if they can't reopen non covid care.

    Cases are seen as a predictor of future icu and hospital rather than their own item. I believe nolan has changed the formula he uses to estimate icu in 2 weeks time based on the vaccinated cohort.

    In general cases increase before hospitals so they are a leading metric that will allow us to predict hospitals in a few weeks time.


  • #139
    lawred2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,457 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Leftwaffe wrote: »
    Does it? I don’t see much talk about this UK variant in the UK. We’re more afraid of it than they are

    Variants dubbed as new viruses supports the lockdown narrative


  • #140
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,378 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    is_that_so wrote: »
    A country with under 3000 cases is not a model for the rest of the world.

    And yet the rest of the world have done or is doing all the same things, bit by bit. Masks, contact tracing, flight restrictions, closing schools, mandatory quarantines. Why not go the whole way and have one or two hospitals dedicated to Covid-19, and have positive cases isolated in hotels instead of going home to infect their families and communities.

    Every successful country is a model in some way.


  • #141
    TheDoctor
    Registered Users Posts: 4,977 ✭✭✭TheDoctor


    Russman wrote: »
    Could it be that over there in the UK, its not the UK variant, its just COVID ?

    Well thats just very confusing.

    Calling the "new virus" the same name as the old virus.

    Silly Brits.


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  • #142
    MerlinSouthDub
    Registered Users Posts: 1,615 ✭✭✭MerlinSouthDub


    Hospital numbers this morning = 313 (slight increase from 310 last night, and down from 329 yesterday morning)

    Could see this drop below 300 for the weekend. Hospital numbers are falling with static or rising case numbers, probably due to the young age profile of recent cases (median age of cases has been in the low 30s most days), which in turn is partly the result of vaccinations in the older age groups.


  • #143
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Leftwaffe wrote: »
    Genuine question, considering the age profile of yesterday’s cases, how many of those will end up in hospital typically?

    From a hospital number prospective- approx 50% of all covid cases in hospitals are under 65. And looking at the stats - that's been a fairly consistent features of hospital numbers.

    These are younger age groups who are sick enough to require specialist medical intervention

    As to the usual rejoinder about underlying conditions - I believe the point is that a proportion of all age groups have underlying conditions whether that is asthma, diabetes and other conditions.

    And as someone has already pointed out the number of serious cases in the younger groups has been a small percentage. A small percentage of a big number can still be a relatively big number.


  • #144
    Cluedo Monopoly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,595 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    The government are going to extend the 5km limit long after the majority of the population have ignored it.
    Even the Gardai see enforcing that as a complete waste of time.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • #145
    JDD
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭JDD


    gozunda wrote: »
    From a hospital number prospective- over 50% of all covid cases in hospitals are under 65. And looking at the stats - that's been a fairly consistent features of hospital numbers.

    These are younger age groups who are sick enough to require specialist medical intervention

    As to the usual rejoinder about underlying conditions - I believe the point is that a proportion of all age groups have underlying conditions whether that is asthma, diabetes and other conditions.

    And as someone has already pointed out the number of serious cases in the younger groups has been a small percentage. A small percentage of a big number can still be a relatively big number.

    That's the question really isn't it? Once you take the elderly and vulnerable out of the equation, how many of the infected will need hospital treatment? I presume the HSE have algorithms were you can punch in the numbers infected, the age of those infected and the R rate, and it will figure out how many more will be infected over the next month and how many of that cohort will need hospitalisation.

    I think we're going to be alright to be honest. Case numbers aren't going to spiral upwards like last December because hospitality is closed and its better weather now so people will meet up outside. So even if we remove the 5k limit, open construction and allow click and collect, I think we can manage the incremental increase in infections. Yes, we may end up with over 2 or 3k infections a day but if those cases are mainly under 40's, with a few at 40-65 we can probably manage the hospitalisations over April and May. Come June we *should* have massively more vaccines delivered and that cohort under 40 can be vaccinated first. So before we get to squeaky b*m territory - i.e. 5/6/7k cases a day infections should start coming down when those driving the infection rate get their first dose.


  • #146
    LameBeaver
    Registered Users Posts: 102 ✭✭LameBeaver


    Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »
    The government are going to extend the 5km limit long after the majority of the population have ignored it.
    Even the Gardai see enforcing that as a complete waste of time.

    Why do you believe that to be true chief?


  • #147
    Cluedo Monopoly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,595 ✭✭✭Cluedo Monopoly


    LameBeaver wrote: »
    Why do you believe that to be true chief?

    They're already flying kites on it. The 5km will be extended from April 5.

    What are they doing in the Hyacinth House?



  • #148
    timmyntc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,114 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    gozunda wrote: »
    From a hospital number prospective- over 50% of all covid cases in hospitals are under 65. And looking at the stats - that's been a fairly consistent features of hospital numbers.

    These are younger age groups who are sick enough to require specialist medical intervention

    As to the usual rejoinder about underlying conditions - I believe the point is that a proportion of all age groups have underlying conditions whether that is asthma, diabetes and other conditions.

    And as someone has already pointed out the number of serious cases in the younger groups has been a small percentage. A small percentage of a big number can still be a relatively big number.

    Deaths and hospitalisations (deaths in particular) under 65s are overwhelmingly among those with underlying conditions.

    Relatively few healthy under 65s end up in hospital


  • #149
    Roger_007
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,886 ✭✭✭✭Roger_007


    timmyntc wrote: »
    Deaths and hospitalisations (deaths in particular) under 65s are overwhelmingly among those with underlying conditions.

    Relatively few healthy under 65s end up in hospital

    Does the DOH or the HSE release figures for the overall number of patients in hospital. My brother was in hospital last week for a non-Covid related procedure. He said that every second bed was empty. Of course, as no visitors are allowed, nobody else can see this.


  • #150
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,996 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    While you’re not wrong about some of you say, I think you are fundamentally wrong to not recognise that the balance between protecting us from COVID and burning the economy to the ground is changing. Serious illness WILL be lower as the vulnerable are vaccinated.....the UK experience this year clearly shows that. While the virus may have a different effect on younger people now (not borne out in the UK incidentally), the equation that supports lockdown had changed

    The UK have removed case numbers in isolation from their tests to relax restrictions. Whitty said that case numbers will rise substantially but that he does not see that affecting the roadmap to normality. The data points informing our own lockdown decisions need to change at some point. But all the narrative suggests that we are stuck with this. There do not seem to be any dissenting voices

    We are continuing to burn our economy to the ground, and impacting the lives, to a devastating degree, of large segments of our population

    It’s a balance, and the balance is shifting. We need to start moving toward living with this in our society

    I believe the UK approach has only been possible in that they have effectively ignored that they have had one of top 5 highest Covid death rates in the World. A death rate which only saw any real reduction when they brought in their own strict lockdown policy.

    The UK death rate as of today is 1,887 per million. Ours is approx half of that at 936 per milliin. Was their high death rate a 'balance? I doubt it tbh. .

    Much of what you say about Ireland are very real issues to the UKs economy and just as much impacting lives there to a devastating degree, and to large segments of their population. Unfortunately such are the very real impacts of managing the rate of infection in both here and the UK so that health services can cope.

    Btw I'd strongly reject the repeated generic mantra that "we've burned our economy to the ground". The news is that whilst nearly all economic sectors have been seriously impacted and er have unprecedented unemployment. Ireland’s economy actually grew by 3.4% last year despite Covid-19 restrictions and on the back of record growth in the export sector. Infact Ireland was the only EU economy to actually grow last year. And yes I believe the economy will be able to bounce back strongly once we get a critical mass of people vaccinated and are fully able to roll back restrictions.


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  • #151
    timmyntc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,114 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    gozunda wrote: »
    Btw I'd strongly reject the repeated generic mantra that "we've burned our economy to the ground". The news is that whilst nearly all economic sectors have been seriously impacted and er have unprecedented unemployment. Ireland’s economy actually grew by 3.4% last year despite Covid-19 restrictions and on the back of record growth in the export sector. Infact Ireland was the only EU economy to actually grow last year. And yes I believe the economy will be able to bounce back strongly once we get a critical mass of people vaccinated and are fully able to roll back restrictions.

    Our GDP grew by 3.4% last year - our GDP has not been an accurate measure of our economy for several years. The EU and EuroStat were raising this issue years ago. Our GDP is inflated by asset & IP transfers to this country, among other assets. As well as multinational performance - multinationals do well globally, it is reflected in our GDP (despite us seeing little to no benefit from it).

    The correct metric is adjusted GNI, which did not grow by 3.4% last year. Not even close.


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