Dublin Bus Network Review

starviewadams · 14-01-2011 6:48pm

They are the only political party in the area(that I've heard from anyway)who are making any noise about the proposed changes.

liger · 14-01-2011 7:34pm

BenShermin wrote: »

Is he going to illigally block the 68 and 69 from terminating at Red Cow after the ND changes like his party done in Dun Laoghaire:rolleyes:.

Sorry, but I can't stand those People Before Profit wasters.

Bringing the right driver along if he is going to block buses!!!! ha ha. \Been away for a while, when did DB let him back????

http://www.socialistparty.net/workplace/39-general/398-sacked-by-dublin-bus-reinstate-eugene-mcdonagh

SparkyTech · 15-01-2011 12:55pm

Has anyone heard of possible alterations to the 15b or 44? Nothing has been mentioned on the quiet about these routes (as yet!)

liger · 15-01-2011 1:07pm

SparkyTech wrote: »

Has anyone heard of possible alterations to the 15b or 44? Nothing has been mentioned on the quiet about these routes (as yet!)

Dont know about the 15b but the 44 changed not so long ago where the 44C was scrapped and the 44b reduced but cant recall any further changed planned for the ND. However with the luas offering a frequent alernative up to ballyogan i wouldnt be shocked to see the 44 cut as passenger number drop ala 48a.

ardmacha · 15-01-2011 4:04pm

My point to him was that significant gains were possible for quite small infrastructure alterations at specific locations on the route...(Goatstown/Taney Road-Bird Avenue-Beaver Row)

In general, this type of labour intensive small scale moving of kerbs and the like is exactly the type of work that should proceed in the current environment when larger projects may have been cancelled.

There are many pinch points for both buses and general traffic that could be alleviated by widening the roads by a metre for a short distance.

CIE · 15-01-2011 7:06pm

ardmacha wrote: »

In general, this type of labour intensive small scale moving of kerbs and the like is exactly the type of work that should proceed in the current environment when larger projects may have been cancelled.

There are many pinch points for both buses and general traffic that could be alleviated by widening the roads by a metre for a short distance.

...You mean how the roads used to be? A lot of streets and roads were deliberately narrowed (biggest example is O'Connell Street, but you also have Talbot Street) while other streets got widened (Cork Street plus its newer Coombe bypass, New Street South/Clanbrassil Street, Charlotte Way which replaced Charlotte Street). Could have uses some consistency, I think...?

antoinolachtnai · 15-01-2011 7:26pm

Well, a lot of places (like O'Connell St) needed more pavement space simply because there were so many pedestrians.

BenShermin · 15-01-2011 8:00pm

starviewadams wrote: »

They are the only political party in the area(that I've heard from anyway)who are making any noise about the proposed changes.

They were the only party in my area to make noise about the changes aswell. It's a pity they only gave people half the truth:rolleyes:.

AlekSmart · 16-01-2011 2:40am

Antoinolaochtnai Well, a lot of places (like O'Connell St) needed more pavement space simply because there were so many pedestrians.

Quite true,however O Connell St (thanks in no small part to the role played by Ivor Callely when junior Transport Minister) stands today as mute testimony to yet another half-done job.

Thanks to the remarkable level of support shown to the Taxi fraternity by Junior Minister Callely the City Council managed to superimpose the pre-existing Taxi Rank back into what is a singularly inappropriate location on the central median.

This act alone,represented a philistine like inability to comprehend what the entire O Connell St Integrated Area Plan was meant to achieve.

The result is a largely unnecessary Taxi Rank which now acts as a form of timed obstruction to Traffic Flow on the street.

The cretinous nature of this act can be even more underlined when one realizes that the Old Taxi rank had seats and a shelter where the new one has zippo...some good value for money reportage there methinks.

However this Rank remains but one of the issues which the "NEW-IMPROVED" O Connell St has to deal with.

The architects of the multi-million euro refurbishment of the street were apparently unaware that there was a pre-existing Bus Routing along it.

At least thats the charitable view I`m ascribing to them,as they completely forgot any of the oft-repeated oul hype about Disabled Access by failing to install a single metre of Kassel Kerbing at any of the Bus Stops along the Street...oh and I almost forgot...they did`nt bother reinstating the very desirable safety barriers at the major Stops either.....Safety...yea...My Ass...:mad:

The Street we now have is yet another mish-mash which does not know whats expected of it...a vast generally empty central median traversed by a busy and undesirably dangerous Pedestrian Crossing at the Spire with perimeter footpaths which are now TOO wide and serve little real purpose...Its a Street without a focus...unless you look up I suppose ??? :P

AlekSmart · 16-01-2011 3:09pm

In relation to the ongoing Network Direct implimentation programme it`s perhaps significant and worth noting that the Public Consultation phase time-limit has been Extended to Feb 11th for the Ballymun/Clondalkin/ and malahide Road corridors.

This might indicate a somewhat greater level of Customer Interest than during the earlier phases with perhaps a less compliant response than envisaged ?

For those who may be affected the relevant address is:

networkdirect@dublinbus.ie

or by telephone at the central contact number 8734222 and ask for the Network Direct Project Office.

With the already completed improvements now visible to all on the N1,Blanchardstown and Lucan Road corridors it is imperative that customers become involved to a far greater level than heretofore.

It may be worth re-reading some posts from thew Route 25A thread re contacting the relevant managerial personages:

Riverston (post #412) Alek, I have to agree with you that the only thing for commuters to do is to contact Dublin Bus direct. On a personal level I did have a meeting with their strategic planning manager, a Derry O'Leary, who left me with a very unpleasant feeling after our discussions about moving a terminus. I am convinced that the only reason we were graced with his presence in Lucan was because of the constant phone calls and badgering I personally made. If I as a single individual can have this effect without even being a bus user, imagine what all you could do if you consistently and constantly were to make direct contact with

the Dublin Bus complaints line (01.8734222, option 3),
Terry Fitzgerald the Conyingham Road manager (01.7032172 / 01.7032176) where the west Dublin fleet come from
Gareth Quinn in Phibsboro, the district manager (01.7033284 / 01.7033462), who would be Mr. Fitzgeralds superior
Derry O'Leary in O'Connell St (01.7033002) who is the strategic planner (love to be able to give his personal mobile, but thats a step too far on here I think)

And also....Councillor William Lavelle also of that parish.....

Bcirl03 (Post 413)...I have been copied on a very large number of emails sent by Lucan commuters to Dublin Bus. Amazingly Dublin Bus management have told my colleague Senator Frances Fitzgerald that they are not getting significant complaints! It is therefore vitally important that we get as many local residents as possible to send strongly-worded personal emails to Dublin Bus management directly at the following addresses: ray.coyne@dublinbus.ie, networkdirect@dublinbus.ie

In support of his campaign, my colleague Frances Fitzgerald has now launched an online campaign at http://www.reversedublinbuschanges.com. *Please visit this site and sign the online petition. A Facebook campaign page has also been established. Please ‘like’.

Dublin Bus had promised a ‘review’ after 6 weeks and on foot of a recent emergency motion proposed by me at the Lucan area committee, Dublin Bus have confirmed to me that this review will take place but have given no details yet. I will circulate details when available.

Wishing you a Merry Christmas,

Councillor William Lavelle

Either way the only option now available is to make strong and repeated contact to both the Company itself and one`s local representatives.....The option of complaining after-the-event no longer exists.

med1 · 16-01-2011 3:19pm

still no sign of roadshows
i have seen an advance copy of the new 40 timetable and if it works as shown it will be an improvement

AlekSmart · 16-01-2011 3:28pm

med1 wrote: »

still no sign of roadshows
i have seen an advance copy of the new 40 timetable and if it works as shown it will be an improvement

That is understandable,but the problem is that the advance viewings of the already implimented Network Direct changes on the other sectors were equally impressive with much mention of 8 - 10 minute frequencies which simply failed to materialize.

Bazzer2 · 16-01-2011 6:19pm

med1 wrote: »

still no sign of roadshows
i have seen an advance copy of the new 40 timetable and if it works as shown it will be an improvement

That's what they said about the 145. Welcome to 40-minute gaps in service. :mad:

starviewadams · 16-01-2011 6:26pm

Fired off an email to the DB Network Direct team,not expecting a response but at least I had a chance to vent my spleen!

Cookie_Monster · 16-01-2011 6:34pm

Bazzer2 wrote: »

That's what they said about the 145. Welcome to 40-minute gaps in service. :mad:

ah now, come on. the 145 maintains an average 10 min gap, just cos there's 3 within 6 mins and then a 24 min gap
:pac::pac::pac:

AlekSmart · 16-01-2011 8:59pm

starviewadams wrote: »

Fired off an email to the DB Network Direct team,not expecting a response but at least I had a chance to vent my spleen!

Whilst spleen venting can be satisfying to the venter,I would caution against it in this phase of tyhe Network Direct consultations.

The benefit for those DB customers who remain as yet un-Network Directed is that the ND concept is now actuality as opposed to an unproven entity.

This means that customers now have very real actual deficiencies which can be used to secure changes in what were thought top be fool-proof plans going forward.

One of the area`s however where the Company has absolute domination is the area of Statistics,which of course are largely generated by their own infrastructure.

The original Network Direct introduction to Staff Reprersentatives laid heavy emphasis on a shed-full of highly detailed statistics covering each route down to intervals of seconds.

Whilst the very act of producing such an amount of detailed figures was enough to shut-off most initial scepticism,the actual operational results of what those Statistics enabled has been little short of a disaster.

There may be hope this time around,for customers to gather somewhat more solid responses with which to challenge the raft of PR centred stuff which will be put on the table.

And remember,please do try and keep it civil....;)

kthnxbai · 16-01-2011 10:28pm

Bazzer2 wrote: »

That's what they said about the 145. Welcome to 40-minute gaps in service. :mad:

In all fairness, it's not like that doesn't happen anyway...

I'd like to know when we're gonna actually get to see the timetable though...
I emailed DB about something else wrt ND a while back and they said mid January for timetables...

I just can't see how putting the 40 down Tolka Valley Road is going to work... Well, I mean it's much quicker for me during off-peak times but in my experience, it adds about 5 mins onto the journey when compared to the 40A in rush hour...

Chuffed it's gonna go cross city though... that terminus at Parnell street was nasty...

starviewadams · 16-01-2011 10:42pm

AlekSmart wrote: »

Whilst spleen venting can be satisfying to the venter,I would caution against it in this phase of tyhe Network Direct consultations.

The benefit for those DB customers who remain as yet un-Network Directed is that the ND concept is now actuality as opposed to an unproven entity.

This means that customers now have very real actual deficiencies which can be used to secure changes in what were thought top be fool-proof plans going forward.

One of the area`s however where the Company has absolute domination is the area of Statistics,which of course are largely generated by their own infrastructure.

The original Network Direct introduction to Staff Reprersentatives laid heavy emphasis on a shed-full of highly detailed statistics covering each route down to intervals of seconds.

Whilst the very act of producing such an amount of detailed figures was enough to shut-off most initial scepticism,the actual operational results of what those Statistics enabled has been little short of a disaster.

There may be hope this time around,for customers to gather somewhat more solid responses with which to challenge the raft of PR centred stuff which will be put on the table.

And remember,please do try and keep it civil....;)

Ah I kept it very civil,just layed out my thoughts and concerns about the proposed changes and the flaws that I can see in them,you'll get no effin and blinding from me!

starviewadams · 18-01-2011 6:03pm

Reply from DB:

Thank you for your views on the proposed service changes for the Clondalkin area. The services levels provided for by the revised route 13 will be adjusted to cater for the demand while providing a simplified network and increased cross city penetration for customers in Clondalkin and the Naas Road areas. Please be assured that your views will be considered as part of our consultation programme.

Cool Mo D · 18-01-2011 6:17pm

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

ah now, come on. the 145 maintains an average 10 min gap, just cos there's 3 within 6 mins and then a 24 min gap
:pac::pac::pac:

To be fair, that used to happen pre Network Direct too, especially leaving town in the evenings.

markpb · 18-01-2011 6:18pm

Cool Mo D wrote: »

To be fair, that used to happen pre Network Direct too, especially leaving town in the evenings.

Except now people closer to the city are relying on the 145 to get them to/from Heuston to make connections. Previously, they were able to do this with the 92 but now they can't. Even if the level of service has remained the same, it's value to existing customers has dropped. I know at least one person who now has to get an earlier commuter train because the 145 no longer brings her to work on time (in Wilton Terrace). She regularly misses her normal train home in the evening because the 145 isn't reliable any more.

Alex has mentioned this countless times. DB are trying to mash together a long haul city route with a feeder bus service and making a mess of both. The 145 is busy leaving Heuston because it's full of people making short hops at the expense of people who want to travel the full length. Then in the evenings, it's unreliable for people making short hops to Heuston because it's a long haul route. Joining together two long haul routes (like the 69 and 27b) might work (although I have my doubts about that too) but not long haul and feeder. More ineptitude from DB.

liger · 18-01-2011 6:20pm

starviewadams wrote: »

Reply from DB:

Please be assured that your views will be considered as part of our consultation programme.

Do you believe them???

starviewadams · 18-01-2011 7:04pm

liger wrote: »

Do you believe them???

Not in the slightest!!

AlekSmart · 18-01-2011 10:11pm

Worth noting in one`s diary methinks......

http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/

It involves changes to services in Ballyfermot, Ballymun, Clondalkin and the Malahide Road and we would like to invite customers in those areas to meet us to discuss these proposed changes on the following dates:

* Clondalkin – Clondalkin Library, Wednesday February 2nd, 2.00pm - 8.00pm

* Ballymun – Ballymun Civic Centre, Thursday February 3rd, 12.00pm - 6.00pm

* Coolock- Northside Shopping Centre, Friday February 4th, 2.00pm - 8.00pm

Aint no point in givin out when you`re AT the stop for 40 minutes.....get on down and give out to the Men in Tinfoil hats BEFORE they get to throw your switch too !!!

Devilman40k · 18-01-2011 10:59pm

Wait a second there....the Malahide changes include a change in Tallaght do they not?.. So where is the Tallaght consultation? Do the users of the 77 not count in this process? If not then DB will have to change their mantra....serving the entire community??...serving who they feel like methinks!

markpb · 19-01-2011 11:19am

Devilman40k wrote: »

Wait a second there....the Malahide changes include a change in Tallaght do they not?.. So where is the Tallaght consultation? Do the users of the 77 not count in this process? If not then DB will have to change their mantra....serving the entire community??...serving who they feel like methinks!

Presumably this is something like when the 4 timetable was decimated but there were no public meetings in Phibsboro or Ballymun because DB said it was an N11 change.

ArmaniJeanss · 19-01-2011 2:13pm

I was waiting at Pembroke Rd at 18.25 yesterday for the 38A scheduled to leave Baggot Street at 18.30. 18.30 came and a scheduled 70 and 37 came at that time but no sign of the 38A.

So I decided to take a stroll down to Baggot St to see what the actual setup is down there. In my head it was going to be something like old Hawkins St setup where there was 4 or so buses waiting to pull out and you could pick the one which suited you best. And expecting to see a controller or something who I could ask what happened to my 38A. Is it cancelled, or is it just a bit late and one of those parked buses is shortly about to become the 38A etc?

But its actually a bit of a mess down there, no central controller that I could see, and the various termini of the buses are on different side streets. You are not actually allowed get on at the terminus either, you have to stroll around to the first stop on Baggot Street and wait there to see which buses the system has deigned to throw at you.

Are the 38As disappearing in sub space?
I've a cousin from England staying with me the last 2 weeks and he travels into town at a different time to me. So between us we have got 16 different 38As in the morning, not one of which has done the the full journey. They all say 'Baggot Street' when we get on, but some discard everyone in Parnell Sq, other O'Connell St, and twice the driver has announced in O'Connell Street the rather wonderful "I'll bring you to College Green but can't go any further" when people have questioned it.

So is it just me being a bit thick then, waiting for a 38A near Baggot St on the way home? - if they aren't travelling over as far as Baggot St in the first place then how the hell are they meant to do the return trip?

med1 · 19-01-2011 4:44pm

markpb wrote: »

Presumably this is something like when the 4 timetable was decimated but there were no public meetings in Phibsboro or Ballymun because DB said it was an N11 change.

like the 40 change a roadshow in ballyfermot but not finglas originally and the 17a 220 change a roadshow in blanchardstown but none in finglas ballymun or coolock santry

angel01 · 19-01-2011 4:54pm

med1 wrote: »

like the 40 change a roadshow in ballyfermot but not finglas originally and the 17a 220 change a roadshow in blanchardstown but none in finglas ballymun or coolock santry

40D runs from Tyrrelstown but TT residents didn't get a say as the roadshow was held in Finglas :mad: so yet all the changes favour Finglas people ... surprise surprise :rolleyes: (roadshow was held during working hours - so was unable to attend)

LXFlyer · 19-01-2011 5:32pm

angel01 wrote: »

40D runs from Tyrrelstown but TT residents didn't get a say as the roadshow was held in Finglas :mad: so yet all the changes favour Finglas people ... surprise surprise :rolleyes: (roadshow was held during working hours - so was unable to attend)

Surely routing the 40D via Mellowes Road and the N2 rather than taking the current routing around Finglas south and west will be an improvement for Tyrellstown residents?

Bazzer2 · 19-01-2011 5:33pm

angel01 wrote: »

40D runs from Tyrrelstown but TT residents didn't get a say as the roadshow was held in Finglas :mad: so yet all the changes favour Finglas people ... surprise surprise :rolleyes: (roadshow was held during working hours - so was unable to attend)

Similar to North Clondalkin/Neilstown. Ballyfermot gets three city services, while Neilstown gets the runt of the snails-pace 40. Barely two weeks public consultation (announced on the 13th of October, closed on the 31st).

AlekSmart · 19-01-2011 9:16pm

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

So I decided to take a stroll down to Baggot St to see what the actual setup is down there. In my head it was going to be something like old Hawkins St setup where there was 4 or so buses waiting to pull out and you could pick the one which suited you best. And expecting to see a controller or something who I could ask what happened to my 38A.

But its actually a bit of a mess down there, no central controller that I could see, and the various termini of the buses are on different side streets.

Are the 38As disappearing in sub space?
I've a cousin from England staying with me the last 2 weeks and he travels into town at a different time to me. So between us we have got 16 different 38As in the morning, not one of which has done the the full journey. They all say 'Baggot Street' when we get on, but some discard everyone in Parnell Sq, other O'Connell St, and twice the driver has announced in O'Connell Street the rather wonderful "I'll bring you to College Green but can't go any further" when people have questioned it.

So is it just me being a bit thick then, waiting for a 38A near Baggot St on the way home? - if they aren't travelling over as far as Baggot St in the first place then how the hell are they meant to do the return trip?

Without being familiar with the 38 route situation in a hands-on manner I`d venture that ArmaniJeans is merely experiencing the exact same issues which the original N11 Corridor customers have being living with since Sept 17th- Lack of sufficient running-time.

This is by far the greatest shortcoming of the Network Direct Teams interpretation of Deloitte`s recommendations and stems from a desire to achieve efficiency gains by getting more journeys out of fewer vehicular and human resources.

The Irish Times journalist Fintan O Toole writing before the inception of Network Direct did pose the question as to just how much "Less is More" could Dublin Bus manage to pass off as an "improvement" before the basic fallacy of the principle became apparent.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/newsfeatures/2010/0424/1224269025738.html

More QBCs will have to be developed. Above all, the idea behind Dublin Bus’s current plans that “less is more” will have to be replaced by a realisation that, in the longer term, more really has to mean more.

Mr O`Toole`s article written back in April 2010 has proven to be somewhat more prescient than much of what has been offered as planning,but as yet we see no real attempt to admit any degree of corporate mea-culpa towards those who questioned the issue to begin with.

It is also worth noting that the other elements of Network Direct involve the automation of much of the control functions formerly carried out by the Stance Inspectors.

The Company for it`s part has withdrawn many of the City Centre Stance Inspectors and instead adopted a hi-tech Central Control facility which when fully operational will utilize this technology to satisfy the various needs of the waiting customer.

However,for the present it has led to the dearth of on-street supervision which ArmaniJeans has experienced.

Whether this has proven to be a sensible decision from a realistic customer-care perspective remains open to conjecture.

The Baggot Street terminus area has also had some degree of difficulty in terms of objections and assorted problems on site which has not helped the situation at all.

it is difficult to avoid the reality that Dublin Bus has been chased all over Dublin City Centre in recent years by a City Council which has a somewhat different appreciation of the spatial requirements of a fleet of 900 large capacity road vehicles than reality demands.

The Baggot Street compromise is just that,somewhere to stable Buses out of sight where they don`t offend the sensitivities of the City`s gentry.

Integrated Public Transport it is not and it`s roots lie far back in dublin`s political administrative past.

I do hope ArmainJeans will get onto NetworkDirect direct so to speak,as this issue is all about customer service,which we were all told was the overriding imperative of Network Direct and Deloitte in the first place.

kthnxbai · 19-01-2011 9:38pm

angel01 wrote: »

40D runs from Tyrrelstown but TT residents didn't get a say as the roadshow was held in Finglas :mad: so yet all the changes favour Finglas people ... surprise surprise :rolleyes: (roadshow was held during working hours - so was unable to attend)

That's not necessarily true... whilst I agree with you that Tyrellstown residents had every right to be consulted about the changes, there isn't really any change on the Tyrellstown end of the route

And the changes don't benefit all of Finglas... in fact I will no longer be served by the 40D, or the 220. If I wanted to get to Blanchardstown I used to have 2 options and now don't...

And I agree that the roadshow being held during working hours was absolutely ridiculous... If my memory serves me correctly, some of the previous roadshows for other areas were held at reasonable hours in the evenings...

Trampas · 19-01-2011 10:11pm

I walk from ballsbridge to merrion sq the majority of times without been passed out by a bus. this would be around 4pm. that is around 15-20 min walk

lucernarian · 19-01-2011 10:19pm

Trampas wrote: »

I walk from ballsbridge to merrion sq the majority of times without been passed out by a bus. this would be around 4pm. that is around 15-20 min walk

This does indeed often happen in my experience. And the amount of people packed onto the buses at peak times makes a mockery of the inadequate number of buses serving the Merrion Road route. Not all of the 7's route is a couple of minutes away from a DART station...

The timetables suggest a bus there every 10 minutes roughly at peak times, but I've waited 25 minutes to go northbound on more than a few occasions between 4 and 7pm.

dfx- · 20-01-2011 1:46am

Access from Pearse St was cut off this evening to College Green, sending all buses around onto the Quays from Tara St, then D'Olier St and round to College Green and stopping at the now 66/26/67 stop, 'CW' instead of 'CV'. Some people did not cop a yellow laminated sign on the stop and were left waiting as they turned around from D'Olier St, missing buses. I only copped it through spotting my bus turn off Pearse St in the distance. This note on stop 'CV' about the roadworks blocking access read as follows:

"Route 50, 56A and 77/A will not stop at this stop from 1800 due to roadworks on Wednesday 19th September 2011. Nearest stop, 'CW' on College Street"

Dublin Bus Information strikes again. :pac:

thomasj · 20-01-2011 3:34am

There was a notice about this on the website earlier.

47 was terminating on Hawkins street

Devilman40k · 20-01-2011 7:39am

thomasj wrote: »

There was a notice about this on the website earlier.

47 was terminating on Hawkins street

Not everyone has internet access in work though. Is it too much to ask DB to use Twitter at all or maybe even set up a mobile version of the website? As part of the review of services.maybe its time to review the most important aspect of the service they provide...timely,accurate and relevant information

trellheim · 20-01-2011 12:58pm

Or alternatively the controller, or who looked like a controller who used to hang out on college green, instead of scratching his nads, could walk around and tell people not to use the stop from time to time

med1 · 20-01-2011 1:35pm

kthnxbai wrote: »

That's not necessarily true... whilst I agree with you that Tyrellstown residents had every right to be consulted about the changes, there isn't really any change on the Tyrellstown end of the route

And the changes don't benefit all of Finglas... in fact I will no longer be served by the 40D, or the 220. If I wanted to get to Blanchardstown I used to have 2 options and now don't...

And I agree that the roadshow being held during working hours was absolutely ridiculous... If my memory serves me correctly, some of the previous roadshows for other areas were held at reasonable hours in the evenings...

the 40d will no longer serve finglas at all all its route through the residential section of finglas has been removed to allow it to use the dual carraigeway instead

AlekSmart · 20-01-2011 2:29pm

The 40d will no longer serve finglas at all all its route through the residential section of finglas has been removed to allow it to use the dual carraigeway instead

Med1`s observation on the route 40 alignment is worth expanding upon as it raises another issue which should have been an integral part of Network Direct but most certainly was not.

As we have seen from the Phase 1 implimenation plan the focus is now on attempting to funnell more passengers on to a more efficiently run series of Trunk routes.

The Deloitte report sees this as the only way to maximise efficiency in a company which they found to be operating at or near the Europen norms for the sector.

Most,if not all of the alterations implimentated by the Company have been based upon large amounts of Statistical Data presented by the company as covering every possible permutation of events.

However some highly relevant aspects appear to have been either ignored or misrepresented by the company in the hasty attempt to get Network Direct up and running.

Two elements in particular stand out,the first is the introduction of the "Door Brake" to the companys fleet.

This feature,introduced under the guise of Safety has considerably lengthened Bus Stop Dwell speeds.

An additional delay of 10 seconds per stop on a route such as the 46A or 145 could contribute up to 8 minutes extra per journey,a figure which would immediately eliminate the gains made by alterations such as the elimination of Monkstown Farm,Stillorgan Village or any other direct operations proposed.

Added to this is the essentially inefficient nature of a 50% Cash Fare Transaction figure which has only been worsened by the insane decision to make Pre-Paid Tickets such as the Travel 90 more expensive than the cash equivalent.

IE: Increasing the T-90 to €18.50 thus making it more expensive per journey than the €1.80 cash fare simply cannot be justified as if even 10 persons per peak-time journey revert to cash it will impose an added delay on the journey as a whole.

I still believe that Network Direct is essentially a viable and sensible plan,but only if it is seen to encopmpass the Bus Service in it`s entirety rather than the Bit`s n Pieces manner that it currently attempts.

Thus,if the company intends to fill individual journeys to a level greater than heretofore,then it follows that the company must seek to reduce dwell time and increase passenger throughput on those journeys.

With the introduction of contactless Smart-Card technology the Company had a ready made test-bed to broaden the spectrum of the technology perhaps by offering a far greater level of discount for regular peak-time use.

It seems,however,that little if any thought was put into the non-timetable area of the Network Direct plan with the result that now some 4 months after it`s introduction we are still attempting a sticking plaster and twine approach with much hope for "tweaking" as a viable method of addressing the issues which have arisen.

Reasssessing the entire "Door Brake" scenario and putting some marketing effort into pre-paid ticket sales might offer some greater gains than all the "tweaking" in China.....so how long,we wonder,will it take for the penny to drop ? :rolleyes:

dfx- · 20-01-2011 4:29pm

thomasj wrote: »

There was a notice about this on the website earlier.

47 was terminating on Hawkins street

Did it also say September?:pac:

kthnxbai · 20-01-2011 7:37pm

med1 wrote: »

the 40d will no longer serve finglas at all all its route through the residential section of finglas has been removed to allow it to use the dual carraigeway instead

It still does serve Finglas... It will go down Mellows road and the dual carriageway past the village, right? Or at least that's what I can see from the diagram on DB website...

That's still serving Finglas... maybe not to the extent it did before, but you can hardly say it doesn't serve Finglas at all

Mellows Rd and the village would still have a fair number of people getting the bus... Besides, what with the 40 starting in the village, then going all through the west and south, I can't see anyone who usually get the bus from there wanting to take the 40, as it would add 15mins to their journey.

Surely most passengers getting the bus at the village would take either the 140 or the 40D

med1 · 20-01-2011 9:07pm

kthnxbai wrote: »

It still does serve Finglas... It will go down Mellows road and the dual carriageway past the village, right? Or at least that's what I can see from the diagram on DB website...

That's still serving Finglas... maybe not to the extent it did before, but you can hardly say it doesn't serve Finglas at all

Mellows Rd and the village would still have a fair number of people getting the bus... Besides, what with the 40 starting in the village, then going all through the west and south, I can't see anyone who usually get the bus from there wanting to take the 40, as it would add 15mins to their journey.

Surely most passengers getting the bus at the village would take either the 140 or the 40D

this is where confusion works well
niether the 140 or 40d serve finglas village like the current 40a they stop on the dual carraigeway at the bottom of the village or on mellowes road at the labour exchange so people going tom the village dont use them rather use the 40 or 83 220 which do serve the village.
there are very few houses on mellowes road only 1 estate plus the park council offices fire station and labour exchange most people on the right side of the road ie barry avenue area will use the 40 into town.
what i do see happening in the near future with the changing of the 40d route is a loss of passengers so leading dublin bus to eventually cut the 40d back again in the near future like other routes on the n11 corridor as it misses a lot of current passengers that use it in the south

qerty · 20-01-2011 9:37pm

Cabra Changes are now up on the Dublin Bus website.
http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/Cabra/

Cress · 20-01-2011 10:01pm

Saw this on FB:

devnull · 20-01-2011 10:14pm

It's wheel re-invention time folks!!!

Route 120 will continue to operate to Parnell Street with some morning peak trips extended to Ballsbridge

Did I read somewhere that the whole point of network direct was to make the network easier to understand. Surely that goes totally against that.

No doubt it is to sort the problems out with overcrowding on the 4 in the mornings to Ballsbridge. But surely the most sensible option would be to increase the frequency on the 4, back to what it was pre-network direct, terminate all the 120 services at current terminus still and then the network is much simpler and there would be less people asking the drivers on the 120 "Does this bus go to Ballsbridge?"

The whole situation with buses to Ballsbridge is getting hilarious now though!
- They cut back the 4 during peak badly
- They then introduced the 47 which did not add enough capacity to Balls bridge in the mornings
- They now are going to cut the 47 back when the timetable gets revised
- Now some morning 120 trips will run via Ballsbridge.

For goodness sake, I stopped commuting to this area recently because of how bad the service now is, how many times do they have to mess with this corridor and how many times do they need to try and reinvent before they realise IT WAS NOT BROKEN IN THE FIRST PLACE now it seems every few weeks we have a new fix, for something that was not broken pre network direct.

kthnxbai · 20-01-2011 11:21pm

med1 wrote: »

this is where confusion works well
niether the 140 or 40d serve finglas village like the current 40a they stop on the dual carraigeway at the bottom of the village or on mellowes road at the labour exchange so people going tom the village dont use them rather use the 40 or 83 220 which do serve the village.
there are very few houses on mellowes road only 1 estate plus the park council offices fire station and labour exchange most people on the right side of the road ie barry avenue area will use the 40 into town.
what i do see happening in the near future with the changing of the 40d route is a loss of passengers so leading dublin bus to eventually cut the 40d back again in the near future like other routes on the n11 corridor as it misses a lot of current passengers that use it in the south

In fairness, the stop at the bottom of the hill is 2 minutes from the 40 stop outside the church... As someone who gets these buses all the time, I honestly would say that the bottom of the hill counts as the village...

I just would have thought that anyone who'd usually get the bus from the bottom of the hill or even parts of the west would rather get the 40D because it would be a much faster service... I get the 40A from Cardiffsbridge Rd most of the time, and occasionally I'll get something from the village, but once the changes happen I wouldn't dream of getting a 40 from the village and going all up the west and south before going into town...

Now obviously I don't know any of the statistics or anything, but, from my experience in the mornings, the 40D is fairly full by the time it even gets to Finglas... I would have thought that the majority of the passengers on the 40D would be coming from or going to Tyrellstown...

I am interested though to see the timetable... It said on the DB website that the new 40 would have a frequency of 10 mins or better. Maybe I'm wrong, but I remember reading somewhere on their website that a frequency of 10 mins actually corresponded to an average wait time of 10 mins, which would mean that the 40 would only go every 20 minutes. Now, combined the 40/A go every 7 minutes during rush hour. And maybe the 40 is a different case, but the 40A is usually pretty packed in the morning, so I don't see how they can justify a cut like this

med1 · 21-01-2011 12:06am

kthnxbai wrote: »

In fairness, the stop at the bottom of the hill is 2 minutes from the 40 stop outside the church... As someone who gets these buses all the time, I honestly would say that the bottom of the hill counts as the village...

I just would have thought that anyone who'd usually get the bus from the bottom of the hill or even parts of the west would rather get the 40D because it would be a much faster service... I get the 40A from Cardiffsbridge Rd most of the time, and occasionally I'll get something from the village, but once the changes happen I wouldn't dream of getting a 40 from the village and going all up the west and south before going into town...

Now obviously I don't know any of the statistics or anything, but, from my experience in the mornings, the 40D is fairly full by the time it even gets to Finglas... I would have thought that the majority of the passengers on the 40D would be coming from or going to Tyrellstown...

I am interested though to see the timetable... It said on the DB website that the new 40 would have a frequency of 10 mins or better. Maybe I'm wrong, but I remember reading somewhere on their website that a frequency of 10 mins actually corresponded to an average wait time of 10 mins, which would mean that the 40 would only go every 20 minutes. Now, combined the 40/A go every 7 minutes during rush hour. And maybe the 40 is a different case, but the 40A is usually pretty packed in the morning, so I don't see how they can justify a cut like this

i use the buses in finglas a bit i live on st helenas road and would catch the 40d rather than the 40a as it is quicker to town than the 40a i use the 220 or walk to the village as the 40a is unreliable .the other problem with the village stop coming out of town is it is on the opposite side of the dual carraigeway and a good walk if you are elderly .the copy of the timetable i seen for the 40 says a bus every 2 to 15 minutes peak i really doubt this though

med1 · 21-01-2011 12:16am

qerty wrote: »

Cabra Changes are now up on the Dublin Bus website.
http://www.dublinbus.ie/en/Network-Direct/Network-Direct-Phase-1/Cabra/

so the 121 gets cancelled no more buses on meath street then or kildare road /clogher road

Dublin Bus Network Review

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