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Saorview Connect

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    #182
    Tony
    Registered Users Posts: 11,327 ✭✭✭✭Tony


    Indeed and since they broadcast ROI versions they are clearly targeting their advertising

    Desktop PC Boards discount code on https://www.satellite.ie/ is boards.ie



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    #183
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    It has always been this way. In fact, before the early 1990s, you had to buy the RTE Guide, Radio Times and TV Times for RTE, BBC and ITV/C4 respectively, because the guides weren't allowed to publish the listings for other channels.


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    #184
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,453 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Karsini wrote: »
    It has always been this way. In fact, before the early 1990s, you had to buy the RTE Guide, Radio Times and TV Times for RTE, BBC and ITV/C4 respectively, because the guides weren't allowed to publish the listings for other channels.

    But that was to protect the in-house publications.


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    #185
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users Posts: 14,002 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    So besides "It has always been this way." has anyone got a reasonable, current, explanation as to why the channel EPG data should not be available to everyone, without fees and maybe a simple licence to ensure the full data is used if any is to be used?

    Would it not benefit the channels themselves to have it so?


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    #186
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Where's my amiko Alien2 running spark getting the 7-day epg from? Why can't all sat receivers get the same info?


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    #187
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users Posts: 14,002 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Where's my amiko Alien2 running spark getting the 7-day epg from? Why can't all sat receivers get the same info?

    Scraped from websites?


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    #188
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Where's my amiko Alien2 running spark getting the 7-day epg from? Why can't all sat receivers get the same info?
    CrossEPG? I think it uses the Freesat or OpenTV/Sky data, albeit unofficially.


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    #189
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,453 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    One of the pluses if Saorview get the EPG info independantly, they will be able to order the channels anyway they like. Because all the kit will be HD, they can forget about SD versions of channels that are available in HD. They can also number the channels in a logical order, not on a first come first ordered.


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    #190
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Johnboy1951 I think you are spot on with your questions above.

    There really isn't any reason why channels wouldn't want to make their TV channel guides as widely available as possible. Obviously Eir, Vodafone and Virgin are all licensing this channel data for their own EPG's for their TV services.

    As you say we can totally understand why Sky/Freesat want to protect their own EPG design. Which is the issue Sat4Free fell foul of as they were unofficially using the Freesat EPG. But I don't see anything stopping Saorview from licensing the data from the channels and creating their own EPG, just like Eir/Vodafone/Virgin.

    The one wrinkle is that BBC/ITV own Freesat, so they might want to limit access to the channel data, so that others can't bypass Freesat in this way and create an Irish "Freesat".

    However I think they have loosened up about that now. C4 would probably be delighted to have more exposure in Ireland, as they have had Irish adverts on their channels for years now. ITV having now purchased UTV are likely to be much more involved and interested in the Irish market and like C4 may also launch Irish TV advert versions of their other channels, so likely to be happy to see Saorview do better too.


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    #191
    Johnboy1951
    Registered Users Posts: 14,002 ✭✭✭✭Johnboy1951


    bk wrote:
    There really isn't any reason why channels wouldn't want to make their TV channel guides as widely available as possible. Obviously Eir, Vodafone and Virgin are all licensing this channel data for their own EPG's for their TV services.

    Have you any idea of the terms of such licencing?

    I can well understand that any broadcaster might want acknowledgement that it is their data, and set terms around how it should be displayed .... such as in full and not edited etc. ...... but I have questions about fees they might be inclined to charge.

    For instance, if they want their channel promoted properly then it is in their interest to have a full (official?) EPG available in as many places as possible.

    Essentially, although a licence would be available, it could be without cost, IMO.

    Which makes me wonder about the present situation ...... when people refer to licence of such data are they also referring to a cost and if so does anyone have any figures for such licences?

    Thanks.


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    #192
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,597 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Stuff like channel metadata is copyrighted by the producers of the data (the TV networks) and as such anyone who wants to use that data (for TV guides, EPG's, etc.) have to get a license from the copyright owner to use it.

    The TV networks might either charge a fee for the license or simply give a free license, but they will often have a number of conditions attached on how the data is used, etc.

    I've no idea if the various channels charge or how much they might charge. I'm of the opinion that for ad supported TV channels it is in their interest to be as widely displayed as possible and thus in their interest to make this data widely available as it helps promote their service.

    Having said all that, I am not a lawyer, so you should take the above with a pinch of salt.


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    #193
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,966 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Where's my amiko Alien2 running spark getting the 7-day epg from? Why can't all sat receivers get the same info?
    For non UK channels the EPG is generally free and open.

    For UK channels on Astra all you have is now and next unless your box can decrypt SKY or Freesat EPGs. BTW If you have certain old SKY boxes then the EPG data trickles out of the serial port. It's another place to scrape data from but not really worth the effort because the web is easier. http://tvbrowser.org/ scrapes data from the interweb , handy if you've an old Humax box with a painfully slow EPG (the Humax is slow , currently on day 3 of converting recordings to streaming format). It also highlights favourites and I've set it up to hide soaps.

    But said Humax can have non-Freesat channels added. Unless saorview anywhere offers some special magic then I might just get a Ka LNB and add the channels manually. PITA that there'd be no proper series link but most saorview stuff is on freesat too and I'd have the option of a timed recording. Or perhaps look at some Humax Fox2 box and share the files back to the other box.

    If Saorview Anywhere doesn't have UK EPG then I'll continue to watch UK ads because my Freesat box has most of the programs I watch and I can stream to tablets.


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    #194
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,966 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    bk wrote: »
    It might be challenged by Sky, but they wouldn't have a leg to stand on. The EU has made it very clear that overspill is completely ok.
    No to to mention that the rights holders have already been paid for the overspill.


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    #195
    ftakeith
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,251 ✭✭✭ftakeith


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    No to to mention that the rights holders have already been paid for the overspill.
    any news when saorview connect receivers are on sale


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    #196
    Hibrasil
    Registered Users Posts: 392 ✭✭Hibrasil


    ftakeith wrote: »
    any news when saorview connect receivers are on sale
    My best guess (for what it's worth) is end of April at the earliest....if I'm wrong...then its "humble pie" etc:o


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    #197
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,516 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    ftakeith wrote: »
    any news when saorview connect receivers are on sale

    This is the most up to date information we have from Saorview via Tony last week
    Tony wrote: »
    Latest from Saorview

    "Development of the Connect box is at an advanced stage, and we expect to be able to let you know more about the specification of the first boxes to come to market in the next few weeks. Boxes will be competitively priced at a level that will be appealing to consumers who want to upgrade or make the switch to Saorview."


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    #198
    mackersdublin
    Registered Users Posts: 1,433 ✭✭✭mackersdublin


    Will new TVs have the Saorview Connected service or just STBs?


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    #199
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,516 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    mackersdublin wrote: »
    Will new TVs have the Saorview Connected service or just STBs?

    This is the information we're waiting for from saorview.


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    #200
    Tony
    Registered Users Posts: 11,327 ✭✭✭✭Tony


    It will certainly be open to Tv manufacturers to incorporate this into Tv's but I'm not aware of any who plan to at this point.

    Desktop PC Boards discount code on https://www.satellite.ie/ is boards.ie



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    #201
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,516 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    This from 2 RTÉ tenders relating to Saorview Connect retailing which closed at the end of Feb

    https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase_frameset.asp?PID=96364&B=ETENDERS_SIMPLE&PS=1&PP=ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders

    - RTÉ invites submissions, from suitably qualified Tenderers to provide Point of Sale Display Merchandise for use by to Saorview retailers across the Republic of Ireland, comprising a mix of Saorview branded POS materials as specified.
    As part of ongoing platform development, Saorview intends to launch a new service called Saorview Connect that will be supported by a new type of Saorview Approved receiver to be sold in its retail network. The receiver type at launch will be a Set-Top Box (STB) that connects to the user’s TV set.

    There are approximately 480 retail outlets that stock Saorview Approved receivers in Ireland. These comprise a mix of independents, retail multiples and buying group members.

    With the launch of Saorview Connect, it will be necessary to develop and produce an appropriate range of new Saorview branded POS display merchandise materials. It is envisaged that these materials will be required for delivery to stores commencing during Q2 2016 and there will be an ongoing requirement for POS display merchandise as new products are rolled out during the remainder of 2016 and into 2017.

    Saorview is seeking suitably qualified, equipped and experienced applicants for the supply of POS display merchandising materials to support Saorview Connect. Saorview will provide the designs, branding artwork and logos, but there may be a requirement for separate design of specific items. The cost of design services should therefore form part of the tender response

    The Saorview POS items to be provided will comprise a mix of Saorview branded POS display merchandising material including posters, strut cards, FSDUs, shelf stands, product displays and other similar POS.

    https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase_frameset.asp?PID=96358&B=ETENDERS_SIMPLE&PS=1&PP=ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders

    - RTÉ invites submissions, from suitably qualified Tenderers to provide merchandising services to Saorview retailers across the Republic of Ireland, comprising in-store placement of Saorview branded POS materials and conducting Saorview in-store presentations on behalf of the brand.
    With the launch of Saorview Connect, it will be necessary to merchandise the retailers in our network with a range of new POS materials, and to arrange a series of in-store theatre events that will be announced as the Saorview Connect Roadshow [20x1 day roadshows]. It is envisaged that this work will commence in Q2 2016 and will be an ongoing requirement as new products are rolled out during the remainder of 2016 and into 2017.

    Saorview is seeking suitably qualified, equipped and experienced applicants for the provision of merchandising and in-store theatre services to support Saorview Connect.

    The Saorview merchandising services to be provided are as follows:

    1. Distribution and placement of a mix of Saorview branded POS material including posters, strut cards, FSDUs, shelf stands, product displays and other similar POS.

    1(a) Optional – assembly of POS kits prior to their distribution and placement in stores.

    2. Planning, organizing and staging of in-store presentations events (Saorview Roadshow) to support new product announcements and PR activity. The estimated cost creation of such displays as will be used in these events will be included in the tender reply.

    3. Provision of comprehensive reporting on all merchandising and in-store theatre activities, to include images, retailer feedback, and detailed reports on retailer refusal of POS. In addition, in-store theatre event reporting is to include consumer and retailer feedback as appropriate and metrics on footfall and consumer engagement.


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    #202
    Atlantic Dawn
    Registered Users Posts: 81,820 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    It seems a little crazy to be going to this level of promotion which looks up there with Sky Q, how will Saorview get this money back will there be a levy on each box sold?


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    #203
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,453 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Atlantic Dawn wrote: »
    It seems a little crazy to be going to this level of promotion which looks up there with Sky Q, how will Saorview get this money back will there be a levy on each box sold?

    They will be charging OTV €500k per year. :)


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    #204
    Hibrasil
    Registered Users Posts: 392 ✭✭Hibrasil


    The Cush wrote: »
    This from 2 RTÉ tenders relating to Saorview Connect retailing which closed at the end of Feb

    https://irl.eu-supply.com/app/rfq/publicpurchase_frameset.asp?PID=96364&B=ETENDERS_SIMPLE&PS=1&PP=ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders

    The date for awarding of tender is today (24/3/2016) - according to timeline setout.


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    #205
    Tony
    Registered Users Posts: 11,327 ✭✭✭✭Tony


    I don't think any levy is planned and would probably be illegal in any case.
    Atlantic Dawn wrote: »
    It seems a little crazy to be going to this level of promotion which looks up there with Sky Q, how will Saorview get this money back will there be a levy on each box sold?

    Desktop PC Boards discount code on https://www.satellite.ie/ is boards.ie



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    #206
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,516 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    They will be charging OTV €500k per year. :)

    Most likely half that amount, €250,000.


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    #207
    Atlantic Dawn
    Registered Users Posts: 81,820 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    I wonder will it be available before Euro 2016, that will be the next big event where people will assess their viewing TV setup.


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    #208
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,516 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Atlantic Dawn wrote: »
    I wonder will it be available before Euro 2016, that will be the next big event where people will assess their viewing TV setup.

    The basic Saorview Connected box will most likely be available by then but the Saorview sat receiver may not. According to the tender info above, "as new products are rolled out during the remainder of 2016 and into 2017", not all products in the range will be available initially and could run into 2017.


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    #209
    Tony
    Registered Users Posts: 11,327 ✭✭✭✭Tony


    Its unlikely unfortunately.

    Atlantic Dawn wrote: »
    I wonder will it be available before Euro 2016, that will be the next big event where people will assess their viewing TV setup.

    Desktop PC Boards discount code on https://www.satellite.ie/ is boards.ie



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    #210
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,516 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Tony wrote: »
    Its unlikely unfortunately.

    I'll go with your better knowledge of this. The tender above states the POS material delivery to stores will begin during Q2, does this mean it will be stored until required or setup on delivery?


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    #211
    Tony
    Registered Users Posts: 11,327 ✭✭✭✭Tony


    Not sure to be honest but given the amount of stores involved it might take a while so I'm guessing the want to have all the marketing material in place before the end of Q2.
    I think it will probably be the continuation of the awareness campaign and maybe the android/iphone app might be released to raise awareness too.

    The Cush wrote: »
    I'll go with your better knowledge of this. The tender above states the POS material delivery to stores will begin during Q2, does this mean it will be stored until required or setup on delivery?

    Desktop PC Boards discount code on https://www.satellite.ie/ is boards.ie



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