Time to change my life around for the better minus drink.

marienbad · 07-11-2014 12:27am

Abcxyz12345 wrote: »

Thank you Amazingfun. She is someone who I do think I want what she has - her views on life & her actual lifestyle too. I identify with her previous drinking experience too. I suppose my worry was will I be able over the next while without counselling - but perhaps that's the unfamiliarity of AA etc. I've been in counselling before & I still ended up in a bad way. Maybe it's time to try something new... It's something for me to think about before I make a decision about which route I'll take next. Thanks again

My twopence worth would be to speak with her again , I have never heard of a sponsor seeing a conflict of interest with a counselling service , and I have sponsored a few and been sponsored by a few in my time.

It sounds great if you have met someone that you have clicked with and identify with and it would be a pity to let her go . The best sponsor ( alas no longer with us) I ever had never told me to do anything but just guided me towards where I needed to go . If she is not ready to be your sponsor bind her close as a good friend - can be just as useful.

But as I say to each his/her own , we are all just trying to muddle through a day at a time. The main thing is keep on coming.

Amazingfun · 07-11-2014 12:51am

Abcxyz12345 wrote: »

Thank you Amazingfun. She is someone who I do think I want what she has - her views on life & her actual lifestyle too. I identify with her previous drinking experience too. I suppose my worry was will I be able over the next while without counselling - but perhaps that's the unfamiliarity of AA etc. I've been in counselling before & I still ended up in a bad way. Maybe it's time to try something new... It's something for me to think about before I make a decision about which route I'll take next. Thanks again

Excellent insight there. I'd encourage you to go for it with this person who really seems to walk her talk. She sounds great.

Also: the counselling is still there for you at the end of the Steps-experience if you want it-- just as your potential sponsor pointed out. Consider Marienbad's often asked question " what have you got to lose"?

For me-going through the steps and having my own experience with the process is the number one best thing I've ever done. The second best is what I experience in taking others through it now. I just got in from visiting a sponsee in prison in fact.....the good news is this stuff works and it works no matter where drink has taken us.

Sounds like you are doing great btw...:)

Carpet diem · 07-11-2014 8:26am

Amazingfun wrote: »

Excellent insight there. I'd encourage you to go for it with this person who really seems to walk her talk. She sounds great.

Also: the counselling is still there for you at the end of the Steps-experience if you want it-- just as your potential sponsor pointed out. Consider Marienbad's often asked question " what have you got to lose"?

For me-going through the steps and having my own experience with the process is the number one best thing I've ever done. The second best is what I experience in taking others through it now. I just got in from visiting a sponsee in prison in fact.....the good news is this stuff works and it works no matter where drink has taken us.

Sounds like you are doing great btw...:)

Can feel like a prison no matter where you are Amazingfun unfortunately!

KeefF · 07-11-2014 10:31am

Carpet diem wrote: »

On the plus side I went to toastmasters which I have been meaning to do for a long time.

It was very good really and even more than I thought it would be. Need to become a member and start cracking at it now and looking forward to developing myself.

Wow - that's amazing - I plan to go to one next week myself :-)

Amazingfun · 07-11-2014 2:24pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

Can feel like a prison no matter where you are Amazingfun unfortunately!

Yes...we can indeed be in our own little self-created prisons but I can assure you it's absolutely nothing like what it's like to wake up out of a blackout and find yourself in a REAL prison with a years long stretch ahead

Any blackout drinkers who have managed to avoid being arrested/imprisoned for various acts whilst under the influence have a lot to be grateful for. Most of the people I see in there are in there for acts they did drunk (and sometimes high).

The gratitude I feel when I leave prison visits is always immense as I know it easily could have been me in there.

Carpet diem · 07-11-2014 3:27pm

Amazingfun wrote: »

Yes...we can indeed be in our own little self-created prisons but I can assure you it's absolutely nothing like what it's like to wake up out of a blackout and find yourself in a REAL prison with a years long stretch ahead

Any blackout drinkers who have managed to avoid being arrested/imprisoned for various acts whilst under the influence have a lot to be grateful for. Most of the people I see in there are in there for acts they did drunk (and sometimes high).

The gratitude I feel when I leave prison visits is always immense as I know it easily could have been me in there.

Not unmining your previous comment btw !

Amazingfun · 07-11-2014 3:39pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

Not unmining your previous comment btw !

No no..I didn't take it as such Carpe. And it's a good point you make about how active alkies are indeed in "prisons" of our own making (even sober sometimes which is another part to the story lol).

I am just reminding those of us who imagine ourselves under difficulty in our various sober journeys that "but for the Grace of God" things could be a hell of a lot worse

It helps my reality check and gratitude meter to think upon those who are just like me in prisons all over-and how easily we could be in each others shoes.

Carpet diem · 08-11-2014 3:59pm

I was listening to newstalk sport yesterday and basically a sport physiologist was saying that the mind was made up of the rational part of the brain and the irrational part of the brain called the beast.

The beast will do anything for short term survival even when it conflicts with long term gains.

Few examples :
- A cyclist wants to mate a break and try win the race from a bit out but the beast wants to stay tucked in in order just to survive.

- Making a speech when the beast constantly says to you that you can't do it.

- For a drinker , the beast will always come out and try persuade you to have a drink even thou it conflicts with what will happen in long run of depression, hurt, absenteeism, liver damage, failed rekationships. The beast is just thinking of the NOW and not the consequences.

- Another example is you intend on eating healthy to loose weight. You go to the restaurant with the best of intentions to carry out your plans. Once you are their the beast will persusade you that you will be good at the weekend, you eat less tomorrow, you will start the diet later and once again the beast has taken over and lived in the now but it does not see the consequences

I think this theory is very interesting and very well worth knowing how the mind works.

auldgranny · 08-11-2014 4:11pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

I was listening to newstalk sport yesterday and basically a sport physiologist was saying that the mind was made up of the rational part of the brain and the irrational part of the brain called the beast.

The beast will do anything for short term survival even when it conflicts with long term gains.

Few examples :
- A cyclist wants to mate a break and try win the race from a bit out but the beast wants to stay tucked in in order just to survive.

- Making a speech when the beast constantly says to you that you can't do it.

- For a drinker , the beast will always come out and try persuade you to have a drink even thou it conflicts with what will happen in long run of depression, hurt, absenteeism, liver damage, failed rekationships. The beast is just thinking of the NOW and not the consequences.

- Another example is you intend on eating healthy to loose weight. You go to the restaurant with the best of intentions to carry out your plans. Once you are their the beast will persusade you that you will be good at the weekend, you eat less tomorrow, you will start the diet later and once again the beast has taken over and lived in the now but it does not see the consequences

I think this theory is very interesting and very well worth knowing how the mind works.

This is so true of my life. Did it say how to tame the beast?

Carpet diem · 08-11-2014 4:19pm

auldgranny wrote: »

This is so true of my life. Did it say how to tame the beast?

The simple knowing of what is happening to your mind is the biggest step to taming the beast of after that it's up to you and having discipline. Like in AA they say not going near the first drink.....

Amazingfun · 08-11-2014 5:09pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

The simple knowing of what is happening to your mind is the biggest step to taming the beast of after that it's up to you and having discipline. Like in AA they say not going near the first drink.....

AA says that when it comes to drink we are "strangely insane". The first 43 pages of the Big Book go to great lengths to explain and show what that looks likes in people who drink like us. It really doesn't say not going near the first drink....it says we WILL drink despite our best efforts at will-powering and and 'positive thinking' our way out of it.

"Our behavior is as absurd and incomprehensible with respect to the first drink as that of an individual with a passion, say, for jay-walking. He gets a thrill out of skipping in front of fast- moving vehicles. He enjoys himself a few years in spite of friendly warnings. Up to this point you would label him as a foolish chap, having queer ideas of fun. Luck then deserts him and he is slightly injured several times in succession. You would expect him, if he were normal, to cut it out. Presently he is hit again and this time has a fractured skull. Within a week after leaving the hospital, a fast-moving trolley car breaks his arm. He tells you he has decided to stop jay- walking for good, but in a few weeks he breaks both legs.

On through the years this conduct continues, accompanied by his continual promises to be careful or to keep off the streets altogether. Finally, he can no longer work, his wife gets a divorce, he is held up to ridicule. He tries every known means to get the jay-walking idea out of his head. He shuts himself up in an asylum, hoping to mend his ways. But the day he comes out he races in front of a fire engine, which breaks his back. Such a man would be crazy, wouldn't he?

You may think our illustration is too ridiculous. But is it? We, who have been through the wringer, have to admit if we substituted alcoholism for jay-walking, the illustration would fit us exactly. However intelligent we may have been in other respects, where alcohol has been involved, we have been strangely insane. It's strong language - but isn't it true?"

marienbad · 08-11-2014 5:42pm

I must say at this stage I don't really care why I can't drink . I know for an absolute certainty that I can't ,and as that is not going to change - ever , the why of it become very secondary compared to keeping my focus on the 'how of the here and now'

In fact just like any other illness , for example heart disease , which I also have , the why of how I got it is interesting to a point but as it is irrevocable my efforts are concentrated what I have to do now to live with it , which I do quite happily like 1000's of others if we follow certain steps .

I like to keep things simple , If I don't take my heart medicine I will die , If I drink I will die . I accept those facts with every fibre of my being , I never question it and if mind even begins to hint at a grumble I ruthlessly slap it down . It is as pointless questioning it as it would be to ask why I can't jump off the Cliffs of Moher and live .

That is just me though - accept it is over, keep it simple and stay focused .

Amazingfun · 08-11-2014 7:15pm

Well.....I do care why I can't drink. The AA message was one of "depth and weight" and was carried to me as such. "Just don't drink" didn't work for me. The first 43 pages made clear to me what kind of illness I have and explained why so many people with this "thing" return to drinking time and time again despite them having very good reasons not to and despite "knowing" they can't drink.

I like to keep things simple as well and is why I put excerpts from the Big Book of AA on here from time to time. For me there is nothing more simple than what the first 100 members of our fellowship put into book form for the rest of us in years to come.

marienbad · 08-11-2014 8:11pm

Amazingfun wrote: »

Well.....I do care why I can't drink. The AA message was one of "depth and weight" and was carried to me as such. "Just don't drink" didn't work for me. The first 43 pages made clear to me what kind of illness I have and explained why so many people with this "thing" return to drinking time and time again despite them having very good reasons not to and despite "knowing" they can't drink.

I like to keep things simple as well and is why I put excerpts from the Big Book of AA on here from time to time. For me there is nothing more simple than what the first 100 members of our fellowship put into book form for the rest of us in years to come.

I care in the sense of understanding the type of personality that I am that makes me alcoholic but I just don't allow myself to second guess that acceptance

Carpet diem · 09-11-2014 2:45pm

Very interesting to hear everyone deals with the problem and end of the day everyone is different.

Up relatively early this morning getting my work done and will be able to relax for the day now and maybe do bit of shopping.

No chance I be up at this stage if I was out drinking last night. I can only thank God for keeping sober. ( well I'll give myself some credit too :-) )

auldgranny · 09-11-2014 2:50pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

Very interesting to hear everyone deals with the problem and end of the day everyone is different.

Up relatively early this morning getting my work done and will be able to relax for the day now and maybe do bit of shopping.

No chance I be up at this stage if I was out drinking last night. I can only thank God for keeping sober. ( well I'll give myself some credit too :-) )

Well done. As usual I am starting again tomorrow.

Carpet diem · 09-11-2014 3:10pm

auldgranny wrote: »

Well done. As usual I am starting again tomorrow.

Keep the head up, dust yourself down, make a simple plan for the next few days and go easy on yourself. Just think about week ahead and go from there.

auldgranny · 09-11-2014 3:25pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

Keep the head up, dust yourself down, make a simple plan for the next few days and go easy on yourself. Just think about week ahead and go from there.

Thanks carpet. I have taken bit of your advice from few days ago and am making healthy lunch for tomorrow home made soup, salad and lots of fruit.

Carpet diem · 11-11-2014 7:52pm

Having stopped drinking, life is so much better.

I just enjoy every day and try not to worry about tomorruw. Do my bit today and Hopefully it's add up to what I want.

Life is so much more organised now. Eating a lot healthier, doing some gym work and thinking things through now. Less rash and irrational decisions like before.

I've started going to toastmasters. I need to actually join it and start participating. I'm actually looking forward to that.

Just happy with my lot for now.

Onwards and upwards

Carpet diem · 13-11-2014 1:15pm

I have an awful discontent about me now and it's pretty dangerous path to thread.

Before I used to go out and drink to blank it but now I can't. I really don't know what it is - feeling of unfullfillment with my career, am I doing the wrong career?,Should I change? To what? Maybe I'm acting bit spoiled?

GF reckons I should be happy with I have..Might be true but hardly an attitude that will get you far in life.

I don't know

KeefF · 13-11-2014 1:20pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

I have an awful discontent about me now and it's pretty dangerous path to thread.

Before I used to go out and drink to blank it but now I can't. I really don't know what it is - feeling of unfullfillment with my career, am I doing the wrong career?,Should I change? To what? Maybe I'm acting bit spoiled?

GF reckons I should be happy with I have..Might be true but hardly an attitude that will get you far in life.

I don't know

I think the key here is to accept and be grateful for what you have today. This is not resignation but recognition and acceptance.
This will allow you identify areas where you are not satisfied.
The key then is Action - take action to improve the areas where you are not satisfied.

Kunkka · 13-11-2014 1:32pm

KeefF wrote: »

I think the key here is to accept and be grateful for what you have today. This is not resignation but recognition and acceptance.
This will allow you identify areas where you are not satisfied.
The key then is Action - take action to improve the areas where you are not satisfied.

Indeed, it's a hard thing to master which can take time but once you are grateful for what you have now other things fall in to place from my experience. It's when you're focusing on what you don't have that you lose what you have. Be grateful, be humble and change your way of thinking. Recovery isn't easy, if it was everyone with a drink problem wouldn't need a way to stay sober.

Abcxyz12345 · 13-11-2014 2:27pm

It was just over 4 weeks ago that I first posted on here & I was in such a dark place. I want to thank everyone who contributes to these threads & to those who replied to my posts.

I'm feeling a lot better in myself. I've had a couple of days without crying which is progress! That anxiety in the first 7/10 days without alcohol was absolutely unreal. I'm tryin hard to keep things in the day with a plan in place. I go to a few meetings too & I'm really trying to listen to others. It's actually easier now that I'm not working hard to stop myself from bawling!

A lot of past behaviours are coming back to my mind now. Ones that I thought weren't even problematic back then... They were so dangerous. Also, I've realized a lot re past relationships too - how I've either gone for the 'good guy' who doesn't really drink & who I think will calm my behaviour... Or I go for the addict directly & chaos ensues. My head is racin but I'm doing ok today & thank you all.

Amazingfun · 13-11-2014 2:37pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

I have an awful discontent about me now and it's pretty dangerous path to thread.

Before I used to go out and drink to blank it but now I can't. I really don't know what it is - feeling of unfullfillment with my career, am I doing the wrong career?,Should I change? To what? Maybe I'm acting bit spoiled?

GF reckons I should be happy with I have..Might be true but hardly an attitude that will get you far in life.

I don't know

"restless-irritable-discontent"........why not get to a meeting and see if you can help welcome a newcomer or something? Get out of yourself- it always works

marienbad · 13-11-2014 3:47pm

Amazingfun wrote: »

"restless-irritable-discontent"........why not get to a meeting and see if you can help welcome a newcomer or something? Get out of yourself- it always works

+1 Give a little to get a little .

15-11-2014 9:50pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

I have an awful discontent about me now and it's pretty dangerous path to thread.

Before I used to go out and drink to blank it but now I can't. I really don't know what it is - feeling of unfullfillment with my career, am I doing the wrong career?,Should I change? To what? Maybe I'm acting bit spoiled?

I can relate fully to this, especially the career part even though on paper my permanent job looks good. It's as if time is going slower now that I don't drown out my doubts with booze everyday. I now have too much time to be philosophical about my life and how short it is. It's possible that I'm also aware of some newfound career potential to do better now that the drink is knocked on the head.

I'm also battling my weight (20kg lost; 22kg to go), and that struggle for me is identical in the extreme "all or nothing" thought process I have to fight. I've no comfort booze, no comfort foods. I know what I can't have and I fight the urges every day but I still don't know where I'm going, what I can create and what I can become. Sort of limbo land, at the moment. I know I need a project, I know I need to get more exercise but at the moment I'm just knackered from fighting these two fronts each day. It's asceticism without the spiritual fulfillment.

Carpet diem · 20-11-2014 12:03am

What meetings do people go to in AA?

Big book, steps, normal meetings ? Just wondering how they approach them, do they read up before so to get most from them at meetings?

Sunnyisland · 20-11-2014 12:35am

Carpet diem wrote: »

What meetings do people go to in AA?

Big book, steps, normal meetings ? Just wondering how they approach them, do they read up before so to get most from them at meetings?

I only started going back to meetings the last few months,actually it's not AA its CA meeting as in Cocaine Anonymous, Simlar steps to AA.

I just went to be a round like minded people with there only desire to stop drinking or taking drugs,sometimes I share sometimes I dont,for me it's good to be around folks with same goals as myself.

Amazingfun · 20-11-2014 2:09am

As I am sure you won't find surprising I like Big Book meetings the most

Of course if there is nothing else on any old meeting will do.

Best thing to do is find somewhere you like and feel good in and become a regular there. Let people get to know you a bit and in time you'll make friends with those you click with. Most groups offer a variety of meetings- a mix of big Book/12 n 12 and discussion meetings etc.
My home group is a bit mad haha.....but I like it that way as most places I drank were a bit mad as well. It's not for everyone though and that's the way it was in pubs too

Just keep close to the fellowship as the holiday season kicks into gear because it can be a very slippery time for some--even some members with long term sobriety stay closer to meetings and the like during the next couple of months.

Carpet diem · 20-11-2014 8:42am

Amazingfun wrote: »

As I am sure you won't find surprising I like Big Book meetings the most
Of course if there is nothing else on any old meeting will do.

Best thing to do is find somewhere you like and feel good in and become a regular there. Let people get to know you a bit and in time you'll make friends with those you click with. Most groups offer a variety of meetings- a mix of big Book/12 n 12 and discussion meetings etc.
My home group is a bit mad haha.....but I like it that way as most places I drank were a bit mad as well. It's not for everyone though and that's the way it was in pubs too Just keep close to the fellowship as the holiday season kicks into gear because it can be a very slippery time for some--even some members with long term sobriety stay closer to meetings and the like during the next couple of months.

Thanks for the insight AF, what is the difference between 12 steps and BB?

Amazingfun · 20-11-2014 9:12am

The first publication re: the actual AA program was The Big Book in 1939. It was based on contributions from many of the early AA members although much of the content was written by Bill Wilson.

The Twelve n Twelve (12 steps and 12 Traditions) was published much later (1965)and was written solely by Bill Wilson. It's more of a reflection on the steps. It's a great read after one has actually done the steps as opposed to looking to it for directions on how to do them.
The Big Book makes for great meetings as it has that spirit of action and urgency imo (and experience).

Carpet diem · 20-11-2014 9:24am

Amazingfun wrote: »

The first publication re: the actual AA program was The Big Book in 1939. It was based on contributions from many of the early AA members although much of the content was written by Bill Wilson.

The Twelve n Twelve (12 steps and 12 Traditions) was published much later (1965)and was written solely by Bill Wilson. It's more of a reflection on the steps. It's a great read after one has actually done the steps as opposed to looking to it for directions on how to do them.
The Big Book makes for great meetings as it has that spirit of action and urgency imo (and experience).

Thanks for that. The book I have is called Alcoholics Anonymous. Presume that is the former so.

On side note, It's definitely a disease that runs in family. Few of my relations are out and out Alkies but never got help ( that I know off) and another one actually got help recently and has been off it for a while and doing very well apparently. Little do they know about me. Guess it's my issue and I'm entitled to my privacy.

Amazingfun · 20-11-2014 9:27am

I'm entitled to my privacy.

Damn right you are! In fact if you are a big reader you can locate some excellent writings about the place (mostly by Bill Wilson) on Anonymity and how precious and valuable it is to our fellowship.

Have a good day Carpe....you're doing great

Carpet diem · 20-11-2014 11:59pm

Got a meeting in today. It was new venue - all sort of things going through my head, people I knew who lived nearby, where is the place etc..

Eventually found the place, found the room. Once I was in the room, I felt at peace, at ease, immediately felt immersed in the stories, in the facial expression.

I'm going to try a different venue tomorrow night. Not that I didn't like the one tonight. I want to see what out there and go for what I feel is best.

Carpet diem · 21-11-2014 9:34am

I'll Get another meeting in this evening. I think Once I find one near me where I can slip in and out of and retain my privacy I'm happy with that.

Looking forward to a weekend where I can forward if you get me.

Abcxyz12345 · 21-11-2014 7:19pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

What meetings do people go to in AA?

Big book, steps, normal meetings ? Just wondering how they approach them, do they read up before so to get most from them at meetings?

Hi Carpet,

I go to Step & Big Book mtgs mostly. I seek those ones out tbh. I'm find it tough at the moment to listen to some other peoples experiences of their drinking. I think it cause I still feel quite vulnerable & shaky sometimes. The more extreme experiences upset me sometimes & tbh scare me a bit. It's not that I'm judging people it's genuinely I feel rattled when I hear things sometimes. I don't know why. I'm a bit like that with tv programmes at the mo tho too... I steer clear of the Love/Hate type of thing too!!

I've found that the Step/BB mtgs are focused on recovery a lot more than the general mtgs. I like that - even tho I haven't done the Steps etc! They give me hope.

I know I will return to the general mtgs tho. Good luck with it all Carpet. It's always nice to read your posts & others too

Carpet diem · 21-11-2014 8:03pm

Abcxyz12345 wrote: »

Hi Carpet,

I go to Step & Big Book mtgs mostly. I seek those ones out tbh. I'm find it tough at the moment to listen to some other peoples experiences of their drinking. I think it cause I still feel quite vulnerable & shaky sometimes. The more extreme experiences upset me sometimes & tbh scare me a bit. It's not that I'm judging people it's genuinely I feel rattled when I hear things sometimes. I don't know why. I'm a bit like that with tv programmes at the mo tho too... I steer clear of the Love/Hate type of thing too!!

I've found that the Step/BB mtgs are focused on recovery a lot more than the general mtgs. I like that - even tho I haven't done the Steps etc! They give me hope.

I know I will return to the general mtgs tho. Good luck with it all Carpet. It's always nice to read your posts & others too

I'm definitely with you on that. BB and steps I think are the most progressive way forward if you want to be real progress.

Carpet diem · 22-11-2014 2:52pm

Can someone tell me the difference between a "steps" meeting and a "BB" meeting?

Sunnyisland · 22-11-2014 9:35pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

Can someone tell me the difference between a "steps" meeting and a "BB" meeting?

Don't really know, so going by some expearence,

A step meeting is one where each week the steps are discussed and people give there own opinions on how the steps are working for them and they working with the steps.

The BB would be a discussion on different chapters of the book and how it's helping and effecting there journey

:-)

Doublin · 23-11-2014 1:08am

Carpet diem

I don,t know you but your posts are open, honest & you can tell they come from the heart. Hope you get where you want to get. Best Wishes on your journey, take every positive from the day & hold it, feck the rest

Amazingfun · 23-11-2014 2:11am

Carpet diem wrote: »

Can someone tell me the difference between a "steps" meeting and a "BB" meeting?

The 12 steps are in the Big Book (and were there first) so any step meeting is a Big book meeting in some sense

However, since we have two books that tend to be used in literature based meetings, one being the Big Book published in 1939, the other 'The Twelve and Twelve' published in 1965, there can be a difference in how they are described.

So from my experience a meeting listed as a "step meeting" usually uses the Twelve n Twelve as its basis and Big Book meetings use the Big Book. However the Big Book meeting could still be a "step meeting" in practice . For example, the first 43 pages of the Big Book are ALL on Step One. The chapter "We Agnostics" deals with Step 2 etc, etc.

It sounds complicated but it really isn't lol

1. Link to the 12 n 12: http://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/twelve-steps-and-twelve-traditions

2. Link to Big Book: http://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/read-the-big-book-and-twelve-steps-and-twelve-traditions

Carpet diem · 23-11-2014 9:21pm

Amazingfun wrote: »

The 12 steps are in the Big Book (and were there first) so any step meeting is a Big book meeting in some sense

However, since we have two books that tend to be used in literature based meetings, one being the Big Book published in 1939, the other 'The Twelve and Twelve' published in 1965, there can be a difference in how they are described.

So from my experience a meeting listed as a "step meeting" usually uses the Twelve n Twelve as its basis and Big Book meetings use the Big Book. However the Big Book meeting could still be a "step meeting" in practice . For example, the first 43 pages of the Big Book are ALL on Step One. The chapter "We Agnostics" deals with Step 2 etc, etc.

It sounds complicated but it really isn't lol

1. Link to the 12 n 12: http://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/twelve-steps-and-twelve-traditions

2. Link to Big Book: http://www.aa.org/pages/en_US/read-the-big-book-and-twelve-steps-and-twelve-traditions

Great thanks for clearing that up . Hopefully become more clearer to me over time.

Carpet diem · 25-11-2014 12:22am

"We stand ready to do anything which will lift the merciless obsession from us"

Carpet diem · 25-11-2014 7:56pm

I'm not great at speaking up for myself - I tend to be fairly sensitive and more just fill with anger.

I need to get better at speaking up for myself in a calm composed way.

Anyone associate with that ?

Carpet diem · 26-11-2014 12:13am

Made it to a meeting nearby. Was good because I was in a knot really.

Hope everyone is good here and remember there is help our there. Some good people out there.

Doublin · 26-11-2014 11:24am

Hate this time of year between Christmas stuff & my best mate was shot in Jan couple of years ago & I wasn't around.. and my best friend, my grandfather birthday will fall later in the month, not sure yet what to put on his grave, he never was a flower lover, have to think of something original.. Not sure of the answer yet.

The anger I get totally. When I was younger I was a placid fairly laid back type of bloke, got into the usual type of devilment we all did as teens, but yes my anger has gone up big time, am shorter, more snappy, a lot colder, lose the rag sometimes over something trivial. At the moment I am trying to be nice & reasonable talking with my daughter's mother about Christmas stuff, she wants an argument but I won't get involved in some sort of mud slinging match. The only loser would be my little girl & I won't have that happen.

Carpet diem · 26-11-2014 11:38am

Doublin wrote: »

Hate this time of year between Christmas stuff & my best mate was shot in Jan couple of years ago & I wasn't around.. and my best friend, my grandfather birthday will fall later in the month, not sure yet what to put on his grave, he never was a flower lover, have to think of something original.. Not sure of the answer yet.

The anger I get totally. When I was younger I was a placid fairly laid back type of bloke, got into the usual type of devilment we all did as teens, but yes my anger has gone up big time, am shorter, more snappy, a lot colder, lose the rag sometimes over something trivial. At the moment I am trying to be nice & reasonable talking with my daughter's mother about Christmas stuff, she wants an argument but I won't get involved in some sort of mud slinging match. The only loser would be my little girl & I won't have that happen.

I'm going through something similiar in work trying to get by in work without causing arguments or not losing the rag with people foe insulting me. I need to be more assertive and so people won't feel they can be so liberal with their use of words towards me. Otherwise it will drive me mad literally.

To say I'm finding it tough at the moment is an understatement. This is where I used to go drinking before to hide this torment and issues I had.

Best of luck Xmas time, best complement you can pay your deceased friend is to visit the grave.

KeefF · 26-11-2014 11:49am

Carpet diem wrote: »

I'm going through something similiar in work trying to get by in work without causing arguments or not losing the rag with people foe insulting me. I need to be more assertive and so people won't feel they can be so liberal with their use of words towards me. Otherwise it will drive me mad literally.

To say I'm finding it tough at the moment is an understatement. This is where I used to go drinking before to hide this torment and issues I had.

Best of luck Xmas time, best complement you can pay your deceased friend is to visit the grave.

Hi,
If I could offer you some advice regarding people insulting you in work? I would suggest having a 1-1 with those people and clearly setting out in a very calm and clear manner that you will not tolerate any public or otherwise demaning comments/actions etc. It is very important that you do this in a very controlled manner to ensure that you don't give away your power to these people - approaching it in this way ensures that you are in control of the situation and are taking proactive constructive action. Remember you are the one in control of how you feel, how you think and your actions. If you need to take steps to address them then please do - life is too short. I have to be honest my life is in no way perfect as I keep slipping but in the last 18 months my relationships with everyone (and myself) have improved immensely by adopting these principles. Give it a try!!

Carpet diem · 26-11-2014 12:04pm

KeefF wrote: »

Hi,
If I could offer you some advice regarding people insulting you in work? I would suggest having a 1-1 with those people and clearly setting out in a very calm and clear manner that you will not tolerate any public or otherwise demaning comments/actions etc. It is very important that you do this in a very controlled manner to ensure that you don't give away your power to these people - approaching it in this way ensures that you are in control of the situation and are taking proactive constructive action. Remember you are the one in control of how you feel, how you think and your actions. If you need to take steps to address them then please do - life is too short. I have to be honest my life is in no way perfect as I keep slipping but in the last 18 months my relationships with everyone (and myself) have improved immensely by adopting these principles. Give it a try!!

Much appreciated, Great advice. Hope you are well. Being calm and controlled is probably where I lose out but I'm going to try hard now.

Hopefully I come out stronger from this whole experience but I know I need to put it into force everyday. Sometimes I feel so weak and always looking over my shoulder.

Getting a meeting in at 1 as I have today off. Looking forward to that and now have few different meeting locations so I can fit them in to suit work hours. Having few locations to go to means more security to me really. Although hopefully get a home group over time.

Amazingfun · 26-11-2014 12:07pm

Carpet diem wrote: »

I'm going through something similiar in work trying to get by in work without causing arguments or not losing the rag with people foe insulting me. I need to be more assertive and so people won't feel they can be so liberal with their use of words towards me. Otherwise it will drive me mad literally.

To say I'm finding it tough at the moment is an understatement. This is where I used to go drinking before to hide this torment and issues I had.

Best of luck Xmas time, best complement you can pay your deceased friend is to visit the grave.

Be careful with the buying the narratives the head can conjure up around drinking.

Truth is many alkies drank for any reason at all--or none at all! Happy/sad/elation/despair....there we were with drink in our hand.
It is very rare I encounter someone who only drank when feeling bad/sad. Circumstances or environment are often revealed as being irrelevant really when we go back through our lives and look at our actual drinking history.

I invariably find there really is one one absolutely honest reason for why alcoholics drank: because we feckin loved the stuff lol.

Cunning baffling and powerful is how the BB describes alcoholism. These slick and varying "narratives" around "why I drank" is in my experience one of the most deadly.

Time to change my life around for the better minus drink.

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