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Minister Shatter and Commissioner Callinan should both resign in disgrace

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    #2102
    fr3d12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 293 ✭✭fr3d12


    sopretty wrote: »
    That's a fair point. That said, do they think the public are thick?

    Yup:D


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    #2103
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    fr3d12 wrote: »
    Yup:D

    Unfortunately, I have to concede, that the general public is generally.......thick.

    God bless us and save us! :D


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    #2104
    fr3d12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 293 ✭✭fr3d12


    sopretty wrote: »
    Unfortunately, I have to concede, that the general public is generally.......thick.

    God bless us and save us! :D

    I've been called worse I suppose and prayers and holy water are no good to you now:p


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    #2105
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    fr3d12 wrote: »
    I've been called worse I suppose and prayers and holy water are no good to you now:p

    Ah, I just tell myself that I'm not typical of the 'general' public and I can happily get away with all sorts of generalisations. :pac:


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    #2106
    Hootanany
    Registered Users Posts: 5,477 ✭✭✭Hootanany


    Mr.Micro wrote: »
    I think it's more to do with, the sacking of Shatter would appear to the public that the Government were at fault. By not sacking him, the Government can pretend nothing is wrong. It's a constant when it comes to those in office.

    Well the longer he is there the more damage is done to FG


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    #2107
    fr3d12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 293 ✭✭fr3d12


    sopretty wrote: »
    Ah, I just tell myself that I'm not typical of the 'general' public and I can happily get away with all sorts of generalisations. :pac:

    Jaysus you sound like a politician:)


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    #2108
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    fr3d12 wrote: »
    Jaysus you sound like a politician:)

    Good God above. Don't be insulting me!!


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    #2109
    fr3d12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 293 ✭✭fr3d12


    sopretty wrote: »
    Good God above. Don't be insulting me!!

    Who knows you might be good at it


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    #2110
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    fr3d12 wrote: »
    Who knows you might be good at it

    Better at tearing them apart, thank you very much!


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    #2111
    fr3d12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 293 ✭✭fr3d12


    sopretty wrote: »
    Better at tearing them apart, thank you very much!

    No harm in that anyway


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    #2112
    Mr.Micro
    Registered Users Posts: 5,336 ✭✭✭Mr.Micro


    Hootanany wrote: »
    Well the longer he is there the more damage is done to FG

    Not so sure about that. Not admitting wrong doing means, that much of the electorate will take it as that.. Nothing to see here folks.


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    #2113
    Hootanany
    Registered Users Posts: 5,477 ✭✭✭Hootanany


    Mr.Micro wrote: »
    Not so sure about that. Not admitting wrong doing means, that much of the electorate will take it as that.. Nothing to see here folks.

    Wait for the locals:cool:


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    #2114
    Mr.Micro
    Registered Users Posts: 5,336 ✭✭✭Mr.Micro


    Hootanany wrote: »
    Wait for the locals:cool:

    You well be right. This week we have the ESRI painting a rosy picture for the economy, a projection of 50000 jobs in 2014. The live register down last week. New car sales up. A lot of positive news. I am not sure how much of this will translate into local elections, or a protest vote against the government due to the Shatter business?




    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0115/497912-hogan-irish-water/
    http://www.businessandleadership.com/business/item/45424-ibec-ups-growth-forecast-to/


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    #2115
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    Mr.Micro wrote: »
    You well be right. This week we have the ESRI painting a rosy picture for the economy, a projection of 50000 jobs in 2014. The live register down last week. New car sales up. A lot of positive news. I am not sure how much of this will translate into local elections, or a protest vote against the government due to the Shatter business?




    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0115/497912-hogan-irish-water/
    http://www.businessandleadership.com/business/item/45424-ibec-ups-growth-forecast-to/

    Had a Fine Gael candidate here campaigning yesterday and I mentioned Shatter and she said 'he has to go, he just has to'.
    ETA: While she was a potentially good candidate, I will not vote FG until Shatter is gone.


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    #2116
    renegademaster
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,670 ✭✭✭renegademaster


    sopretty wrote: »
    That's a fair point. That said, do they think the public are thick?

    no they don't, they know for a fact we're thick
    Mr.Micro wrote: »
    You well be right. This week we have the ESRI painting a rosy picture for the economy, a projection of 50000 jobs in 2014. The live register down last week. New car sales up. A lot of positive news. I am not sure how much of this will translate into local elections, or a protest vote against the government due to the Shatter business?




    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0115/497912-hogan-irish-water/
    http://www.businessandleadership.com/business/item/45424-ibec-ups-growth-forecast-to/

    and this is why there's food banks being setup across the country to feed the 600,000+ in food poverty

    I hate to say it but wait til you see how wrong the esri got their predictions by the end of the year


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    #2117
    fr3d12
    Closed Accounts Posts: 293 ✭✭fr3d12


    renegademaster wrote: »
    no they don't, they know for a fact we're thick



    and this is why there's food banks being setup across the country to feed the 600,000+ in food poverty

    I hate to say it but wait til you see how wrong the esri got their predictions by the end of the year

    That's the same ESRI who predicted a soft landing back in '07.
    They consistently get it wrong and will alter the numbers again in a few months.


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    #2118
    Busted Flat.
    Registered Users Posts: 4,003 ✭✭✭Busted Flat.


    fr3d12 wrote: »
    That's the same ESRI who predicted a soft landing back in '07.
    They consistently get it wrong and will alter the numbers again in a few months.

    Government agency, their job is, to distract people with bull$hit.


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    #2119
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Busted Flat. wrote: »
    Government agency, their job is, to distract people with bull$hit.

    Exactly. I started a thread on that yesterday.


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    #2120
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,732 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Tip of the iceberg it seems (not that this is any surprise to most of us)..
    GARDA WHISTEBLOWER JOHN Wilson has revealed that a number of serving members of An Garda Síochána have come forward with fresh claims of malpractice.
    Speaking to Newstalk Breakfast, Wilson outlined that a plan is now being formulated as to how these concerns can now be voiced and dealt with “in a professional manner”.

    As I said on another thread this morning, the Gardai have lost all credibility in my opinion and should be disbanded and replaced with a professional, competent and accountable police force - 3 things that you couldn't apply to the current Keystone Cops brigade we're saddled with.


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    #2121
    Shady Tady
    Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    Kaiser2000 wrote: »
    Tip of the iceberg it seems (not that this is any surprise to most of us)..



    As I said on another thread this morning, the Gardai have lost all credibility in my opinion and should be disbanded and replaced with a professional, competent and accountable police force - 3 things that you couldn't apply to the current Keystone Cops brigade we're saddled with.

    Why then do nearly 80% of the public consistently say in polls that they have confidence in the gardai. Maybe real people can actually have good experiences of dealing with gardai. Be careful what you wish for, a new force would also have to deal with the same problems police face, being under resourced, and having to deal with unreasonable people full of drink and drugs, sex offenders, criminals etc who can go online the day after they are arrested anonymously and slate gardai. A police force is never going to be popular, how can it be, the satisfaction ratings with the police force in Ireland are the envy of forces worldwide. They police largely unarmed and by consent. It's the political handprint that causes problems in gardai, that's the political gombeens that both you and me and the rest of us elected on parish pump politics because it's the only way anyone can get anything done in this country and they want to keep it that way!


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    #2122
    creedp
    Registered Users Posts: 5,644 ✭✭✭creedp


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    It's the political handprint that causes problems in gardai, that's the political gombeens that both you and me and the rest of us elected on parish pump politics because it's the only way anyone can get anything done in this country and they want to keep it that way!


    You can argue though that the some Garda operate in a very similar manner to the parish pump politics model. Obviously anecdotal but I know of plenty cases where summons' for a range of road traffic offences were quoshed simply by getting onto a friend/relative in the force. In the same manner as pot hole fixers get elected/re-elected, gardai that sort out summons' are the good guys. So long as this happens, its not possible to completely deflect current criticisms of the force by claiming its gombeen political interference that is the source of all evil.


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    #2123
    Shady Tady
    Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    creedp wrote: »
    You can argue though that the some Garda operate in a very similar manner to the parish pump politics model. Obviously anecdotal but I know of plenty cases where summons' for a range of road traffic offences were quoshed simply by getting onto a friend/relative in the force. In the same manner as pot hole fixers get elected/re-elected, gardai that sort out summons' are the good guys. So long as this happens, its not possible to completely deflect current criticisms of the force by claiming its gombeen political interference that is the source of all evil.

    I agree they reflect Irish society, they were recruited from the public and so would a new force


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    #2124
    Godge
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,727 ✭✭✭✭Godge


    renegademaster wrote: »
    no they don't, they know for a fact we're thick



    and this is why there's food banks being setup across the country to feed the 600,000+ in food poverty

    I hate to say it but wait til you see how wrong the esri got their predictions by the end of the year


    Food banks for 600,000 people, that would be some logistical operation. I am sure that there must be a masterplan for it somewhere. Can you provide a link to your ludicrous claim?


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    #2125
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    I agree they reflect Irish society, they were recruited from the public and so would a new force

    If you're recruited into a corrupt organisation, then you either comply, or get out. No matter how good and moral the intentions of gardai entering the force are, if they are faced with a culture such as has been suggested by recent events, then they have to conform to that culture. It's a sink or swim situation.


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    #2126
    My name is URL
    Registered Users Posts: 25,067 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    Godge wrote: »
    Food banks for 600,000 people, that would be some logistical operation. I am sure that there must be a masterplan for it somewhere. Can you provide a link to your ludicrous claim?

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/archives/2014/0404/ireland/food-banks-to-tackle-poverty-crisis-264290.html


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    #2127
    Shady Tady
    Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    sopretty wrote: »
    If you're recruited into a corrupt organisation, then you either comply, or get out. No matter how good and moral the intentions of gardai entering the force are, if they are faced with a culture such as has been suggested by recent events, then they have to conform to that culture. It's a sink or swim situation.

    All gardai immediately become corrupt when they join, great arguement, talk about kicking a group of people when they are down and painting with a large brush. How can you possibly speak for 13,000 gardai. No workplace is perfect especially when it's undermined by political infulence. Many gardai choose to try and change it from within and by highlighting issues through the GRA. Maybe if people had listened to them down through the years they might have heard a lot of what is complained about now. But keep painting everyone with the same brush its easy and sure will solve the real problem!


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    #2128
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    All gardai immediately become corrupt when they join, great arguement, talk about kicking a group of people when they are down and painting with a large brush. How can you possibly speak for 13,000 gardai. No workplace is perfect especially when it's undermined by political infulence. Many gardai choose to try and change it from within and by highlighting issues through the GRA. Maybe if people had listened to them down through the years they might have heard a lot of what is complained about now. But keep painting everyone with the same brush its easy and sure will solve the real problem!

    If I hear the 'painting with a large brush' argument one more time in relation to AGS, well I'll........ I dunno...... I'll do something!!!! :D (nothing criminal mind you).


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    #2129
    Shady Tady
    Registered Users Posts: 543 ✭✭✭Shady Tady


    sopretty wrote: »
    If I hear the 'painting with a large brush' argument one more time in relation to AGS, well I'll........ I dunno...... I'll do something!!!! :D (nothing criminal mind you).

    Just put the brush away!


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    #2130
    sopretty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,009 ✭✭✭sopretty


    Shady Tady wrote: »
    Just put the brush away!

    But the reality is, that the force has a bad reputation. A few bad apples. Bad impression. You dudes need to cop on to that. 'cop' gettit? :pac:


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    #2131
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users Posts: 16,686 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    sopretty wrote: »
    A few bad apples.

    The point of the phrase "a few bad apples" is that just a few bad apples in a barrel is enough to ruin the whole thing.


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