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Abortion Discussion

134689201

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,886 ✭✭✭_rebelkid


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    I won't. They love placing rally signs outside the CUH maternity buildings :(. I was disgusted when I saw them. I hope they lose their charitable status though. But for now I hope they would just f*ck off.

    Although I'm delighted all their "Keep Ireland abortion free" and "abortion free zone" signs would be incorrect if displayed now.

    A friend of mine was in CUH when they were putting them up. Once they had them on, and had stepped back to look at their handy work, the security guards took them down, right in front of them. And they couldn't do anything about it. Oh, to see them squirm would have been glorious :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,537 ✭✭✭joseph brand


    Does anyone know if Youth Defence are being supported through brown envelopes from abortion clinics in the UK?
    "Keep abortions in England, cha cha cha!" Youth Defence

    I'm in the middle of another episode of Vincent Browne (Weds and Thurs eps) and the anti-choice debaters annoy the f*%k out of me. If I hear another politician talk about 'soul searching', in regards to anti-choice/ anti-women supporters/ TD's I'm going to eat 2 babies for supper.

    Did anyone watch VB, Dana Scallion was on. She has to be one of the most simple minded and terrified people I've ever seen. Was she always this scared? She strikes me as one of those people who never get jokes. They still have that puzzled look on their face even after you've dissected the quip.

    As if she wasn't irrelevant enough, there was a retired priest on the show. 'Oh yess, let's hear what this celibate man who wore a dress to work and believes in magic, has to say'.

    Priests are only useful if you have questions about fairies, unicorns and ghosts. That's it!

    Oh yeah, Cora Sherlock was on VB the other night too. :mad:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Does anyone know if Youth Defence are being supported through brown envelopes from abortion clinics in the UK?
    "Keep abortions in England, cha cha cha!" Youth Defence

    This is something I have wondered. When told woman can go to england they say let them go there just dont let them have abortions here. You would think if they really cared they would want to stop women traveling to England.

    The main aim is to keep abortion out of ireland, not protect life. Even then that ship sailed long ago.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭HurtLocker


    _rebelkid wrote: »
    A friend of mine was in CUH when they were putting them up. Once they had them on, and had stepped back to look at their handy work, the security guards took them down, right in front of them. And they couldn't do anything about it. Oh, to see them squirm would have been glorious :)

    That brought a smile to my face. Brilliant :). Hopefully they'll remove the ones from the bus stop outside and across outside the Wilton car park.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,674 ✭✭✭Mardy Bum


    This is something I have wondered. When told woman can go to england they say let them go there just dont let them have abortions here. You would think if they really cared they would want to stop women traveling to England.

    The main aim is to keep abortion out of ireland, not protect life. Even then that ship sailed long ago.

    Its a lobby group. The people in charged get paid a pretty penny to tell lies nothing more nothing less.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,917 ✭✭✭✭iguana


    It's just dawned on me that as we are about to start calculating our annual rate of maternal death the same way that most other countries do, the pro-life campaigners are going to start saying; 'look Ireland was the safest place to give birth in and now that we've introduced abortion our maternal death rate has sky-rocketed.' :(


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Yep, YD's next poster.


    MATERNAL DEATH IN IRELAND SKYROCKETS AFTER PASSING KILL BILL!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,090 ✭✭✭jill_valentine


    iguana wrote: »
    It's just dawned on me that as we are about to start calculating our annual rate of maternal death the same way that most other countries do, the pro-life campaigners are going to start saying; 'look Ireland was the safest place to give birth in and now that we've introduced abortion our maternal death rate has sky-rocketed.' :(

    Ah, arse. Yes, good point.


  • Moderators Posts: 51,893 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    Jernal wrote: »
    Yep, YD's next poster.


    MATERNAL DEATH IN IRELAND SKYROCKETS AFTER PASSING KILL BILL!

    Damn you, Tarantino!! Damn you to hell!!! :mad::mad::P:pac:

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,232 ✭✭✭Brian Shanahan


    ethical wrote: »
    Give Lucinda credit,she decided from day one what way she was going to vote and stuck by it whether you agree with her or not.....whereas TD O'Mahony and Mulherin put the pay packet before their beliefs!.

    The same wan was not too long ago looking for abortion on demand similar to the UK, but thought she'd get more votes making a fuss here.

    The look on her face last night on the RTÉ headlines said it all, she was a person who had dug so deep she didn't know how to get back out. I'm fully convinced that Loose Lips expected that Edna would roll back on the suicide clause in the hopes she'd bash her eyelids in his direction. And then she'd be able to stand to "the people" as the woman "who defied the tyranny of Edna."


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,232 ✭✭✭Brian Shanahan


    Corkfeen wrote: »
    It's still only 5am in America so nobody would be at work yet. :D Their new website is utterly headache inducing,even more so than before.......
    http://www.youthdefence.ie/

    According to Flagfox it is running of a US server, with IP of 74.205.120.103 (whois info).

    Some highlights of the other hosted sites include:
    AbramsForestVetClinic.com
    AfshinZiaFat.com
    AlomaBaptist.com

    If anyone is pro there I'd like to see full stats on that server.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,953 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Does anyone know if Youth Defence are being supported through brown envelopes from abortion clinics in the UK?

    Guaranteed Irish abortions ;)

    In Cavan there was a great fire / Judge McCarthy was sent to inquire / It would be a shame / If the nuns were to blame / So it had to be caused by a wire.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,953 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    I'm fully convinced that Loose Lips expected that Edna would roll back on the suicide clause in the hopes she'd bash her eyelids in his direction.

    If he had, there would have been rocks through the windows of Leinster House. You cannot defy the will of the people.

    In Cavan there was a great fire / Judge McCarthy was sent to inquire / It would be a shame / If the nuns were to blame / So it had to be caused by a wire.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    That brought a smile to my face. Brilliant :). Hopefully they'll remove the ones from the bus stop outside and across outside the Wilton car park.

    Where exactly?... I know somebody who enjoys a bit of drunken poster salvage, I wouldn't dream of encouraging them of course...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,296 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    The same wan was not too long ago looking for abortion on demand similar to the UK, but thought she'd get more votes making a fuss here.


    Seriously???? Even with this in the 1967 UK Abortion Act: (a little-known section of the 1967 abortion legislation means that the upper limit of 24 weeks can be set aside and the baby can be terminated "up to birth" if tests indicate the child will have a disability when born).

    I'd have thought she might have read/researched that act, re her stated position. If she did, then one might assume that she may have wanted the boat/plane traffic to continue, so the "abortion option" would stay abroad. That implication would be revealing :-')


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,296 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    Pretty ballsy woman in Texas.


    I regret there was a second round in the Texas Senate: (we'll vote and vote until we get it right, OK?)

    http://www.independent.ie/world-news/senate-passes-abortion-restrictions-29417409.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,218 ✭✭✭✭Bannasidhe



    Hmmmm...some of those 'arguments' seem familiar, now where could I have encountered them before??

    *scrolls back a few pages* - Ah - there they are!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭HurtLocker


    TheChizler wrote: »
    Where exactly?... I know somebody who enjoys a bit of drunken poster salvage, I wouldn't dream of encouraging them of course...

    Outside Wilton Shopping Center car park straight across from the CUH maternity building and just outside CUH gates next to the bus shelter have old rally signs around it as of 2 days ago(since i was last there) and outside the Elision near the big Garda barracks has those kill the bill not the baby yokes on the junction as of 6pm yesterday.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,886 ✭✭✭_rebelkid




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,551 ✭✭✭swiftblade


    Perhaps some of you knowledgeable people could help me with this one.

    The fact that women will face a jail sentence for gaining an abortion now, seems to me like something that would be hard to prove. Lets say for instance, that a women has a misscarrige. What's to stop them from saying she obtained an illegal abortion? Was the misscarrige "natural"? etc.

    I assume they would need some harder evidence though?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,582 ✭✭✭swampgas


    swiftblade wrote: »
    Perhaps some of you knowledgeable people could help me with this one.

    The fact that women will face a jail sentence for gaining an abortion now, seems to me like something that would be hard to prove. Lets say for instance, that a women has a misscarrige. What's to stop them from saying she obtained an illegal abortion? Was the misscarrige "natural"? etc.

    I assume they would need some harder evidence though?

    I was wondering what position a doctor would find themselves in if a patient came along experiencing problems after using pills obtained on the internet to cause an abortion. Is the doctor obliged to report it, or does doctor-patient confidentiality take precedence?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,674 ✭✭✭Mardy Bum


    swampgas wrote: »
    I was wondering what position a doctor would find themselves in if a patient came along experiencing problems after using pills obtained on the internet to cause an abortion. Is the doctor obliged to report it, or does doctor-patient confidentiality take precedence?

    If the person said they took the pilll across the border they should be ok though?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,582 ✭✭✭swampgas


    Mardy Bum wrote: »
    If the person said they took the pilll across the border they should be ok though?

    Interesting point. Stand on one side of an imaginary line and take a pill, and you are a criminal liable to up 15 years in prison. Stand the other side of the line, and you have a legally protected right to do exactly the same thing with no consequences.

    The root of the problem, as everyone knows but few in government are prepared to acknowledge, is article 40.3.3 of the constitution. I really hope this is a major issue at the next election.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,296 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    HurtLocker wrote: »
    Outside Wilton Shopping Center car park straight across from the CUH maternity building and just outside CUH gates next to the bus shelter have old rally signs around it as of 2 days ago(since i was last there) and outside the Elision near the big Garda barracks has those kill the bill not the baby yokes on the junction as of 6pm yesterday.

    I don't think anyone would object to you keeping a poster of a recent campaign (for purely national historical record reasons, of course) so that kids can see and learn what some of their respected betters did in their name.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    aloyisious wrote: »
    I don't think anyone would object to you keeping a poster of a recent campaign (for purely national historical record reasons, of course) so that kids can see and learn what some of their respected betters did in their name.

    While I wouldn't use the words 'respected betters' I agree with the sentiment!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,011 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    I think #TerminateThe8th would be a decent starting point for a Twitter-based campaign.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,232 ✭✭✭Brian Shanahan


    ninja900 wrote: »
    If he had, there would have been rocks through the windows of Leinster House. You cannot defy the will of the people.

    Yeah but Loose Lips is the kind of right wing wing nut who thinks "what I think"="the will of the people".


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,232 ✭✭✭Brian Shanahan


    aloyisious wrote: »
    Seriously???? Even with this in the 1967 UK Abortion Act: (a little-known section of the 1967 abortion legislation means that the upper limit of 24 weeks can be set aside and the baby can be terminated "up to birth" if tests indicate the child will have a disability when born).

    I'd have thought she might have read/researched that act, re her stated position. If she did, then one might assume that she may have wanted the boat/plane traffic to continue, so the "abortion option" would stay abroad. That implication would be revealing :-')

    In her student days Ms. Creighton was strongly pro-choice. It was only after she entered the Dáil that she started "thinking of the babys".


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,011 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    In her student days Ms. Creighton was strongly pro-choice. It was only after she entered the Dáil that she started "thinking of the babys".

    Linky? :pac:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,582 ✭✭✭swampgas


    It didn't take long for the obvious implications of the new bill to be questioned:

    Clarity sought on jailtime over use of abortion pills


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭HurtLocker


    swampgas wrote: »
    It didn't take long for the obvious implications of the new bill to be questioned:

    Clarity sought on jailtime over use of abortion pills

    *sigh*
    The Irish Medicines Board seized 487 abortion pills last year. The pills remain illegal in Ireland despite being licensed in the UK and other parts of Europe for more than 20 years.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,442 ✭✭✭Sulla Felix


    How is it the IMB siezing them, surely it's Revenue/Customs doing the legwork?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,953 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    I can't figure out why the IMB even exists. It seems to me their main function is to ban herbal remedies accepted throughout the rest of the EU, and ensure our drug prices remain through the roof.

    If a generic drug is available at 2 euro a month in Spain it should be legal to import and sell it here, rather than force the public to buy the IMB approved version at 30 euro/month.

    Abolish the IMB and allow any drug approved in an EU country to be sold here. Save waste of taxes and slash costs to the consumer with zero effect on safety.

    In Cavan there was a great fire / Judge McCarthy was sent to inquire / It would be a shame / If the nuns were to blame / So it had to be caused by a wire.



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 655 ✭✭✭HurtLocker


    I think #TerminateThe8th would be a decent starting point for a Twitter-based campaign.

    Think of the children!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭mbiking123


    swampgas wrote: »
    Interesting point. Stand on one side of an imaginary line and take a pill, and you are a criminal liable to up 15 years in prison. Stand the other side of the line, and you have a legally protected right to do exactly the same thing with no consequences.

    The root of the problem, as everyone knows but few in government are prepared to acknowledge, is article 40.3.3 of the constitution. I really hope this is a major issue at the next election.

    Go to Holland you can do drugs legally - pot etc, back in Ireland its illegal

    Same for prostitution etc


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    ninja900 wrote: »
    I can't figure out why the IMB even exists. It seems to me their main function is to ban herbal remedies accepted throughout the rest of the EU, and ensure our drug prices remain through the roof.

    If a generic drug is available at 2 euro a month in Spain it should be legal to import and sell it here, rather than force the public to buy the IMB approved version at 30 euro/month.

    Abolish the IMB and allow any drug approved in an EU country to be sold here. Save waste of taxes and slash costs to the consumer with zero effect on safety.

    They're trying to change the rules for generics here. Long overdue imo. That said I don't think herbal remedies should be available because they just happen to be available in europe. If anything I think greater scrutiny needs to be shown to herbal stuff. Lots of people in Ireland seem to be under the impression that herbal stuff, natural remedies and non prescription medicine is less harmful than prescribed medicine.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Was pondering the other day, how doesn't this inadvertently make the MAP illegal?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    ninja900 wrote: »
    I can't figure out why the IMB even exists. It seems to me their main function is to ban herbal remedies accepted throughout the rest of the EU, and ensure our drug prices remain through the roof.

    If a generic drug is available at 2 euro a month in Spain it should be legal to import and sell it here, rather than force the public to buy the IMB approved version at 30 euro/month.

    Abolish the IMB and allow any drug approved in an EU country to be sold here. Save waste of taxes and slash costs to the consumer with zero effect on safety.

    We didn't join Europe to part of no free market, no one said you would be able to shop around and it would be like living in one big country with no borders....oh wait.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,448 ✭✭✭Garseys


    ninja900 wrote: »
    I can't figure out why the IMB even exists. It seems to me their main function is to ban herbal remedies accepted throughout the rest of the EU, and ensure our drug prices remain through the roof.

    If a generic drug is available at 2 euro a month in Spain it should be legal to import and sell it here, rather than force the public to buy the IMB approved version at 30 euro/month.

    Abolish the IMB and allow any drug approved in an EU country to be sold here. Save waste of taxes and slash costs to the consumer with zero effect on safety.

    IMB only recently got remit over herbal remedies (and personal health devices). It does stop a lot of the herbal that comes from Europe (Inconsistent, Deceiving products with little to no regulation or QC).

    The Generic one I partly agree with you on. Cheaper alternatives should be available even ones currently on the UK Marketplace (e.g. 20p paracetamol which is near identical to the 1.50 box on a shelf in boots)

    I don't agree with the Abolishment of the IMB however. They do a lot of work in cracking down on the Counterfeit drug trade and stopping potentially dangerous substances being sold to people unknowingly (One case I heard of was a man who bought a drug online to help his body accept his new Kidney, paid thousands for it and turned out the drug was a rejection drug.) IMB are the guys who monitor all that stuff.

    They also do a brilliant job of keeping the Pharma industry in this country to a very high standard. IMB Audits are known to be more thorough and tough than FDA audits of Irish companies. (Hence why the FDA do not Audit companies that have an IMB audit in the same year)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,296 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    How is it the IMB siezing them, surely it's Revenue/Customs doing the legwork?

    Not sure, but I think it's because the IMB would be the one to determine and declare what the pills are, and if they are dangerous to health. That is part of the IMB portfolio. Due to the posts on this,
    I was curious as to the difference between the morning-after pill and the abortion pill, so here's two addresses.

    The first is that of a Christian Life group and gives the definitions of the pills and what each does, plus the side-effects without any of the fuss one might expect.
    https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CEAQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.christianliferesources.com%2Farticle%2Fthe-abortion-pill-and-the-morning-after-pill-are-they-the-same-1023&ei=ZGDiUd6TDo-EhQf6-YDIDw&usg=AFQjCNHVuGiBchm25ziD5QBpg6hlx84Hlg&bvm=bv.48705608,d.ZG4

    The second is that of a private NY Medical practice serving women. It's release is called "What is the difference between emergency contraception and the abortion pill?"
    https://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&ved=0CEUQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.choiceandhealth.com%2Fwhatisthedifference.htm&ei=ZGDiUd6TDo-EhQf6-YDIDw&usg=AFQjCNHHW3S2fkoRydkX-ZiJXiPI1Fv6kw&bvm=bv.48705608,d.ZG4


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    ninja900 wrote: »
    I can't figure out why the IMB even exists. It seems to me their main function is to ban herbal remedies accepted throughout the rest of the EU, and ensure our drug prices remain through the roof.

    If a generic drug is available at 2 euro a month in Spain it should be legal to import and sell it here, rather than force the public to buy the IMB approved version at 30 euro/month.

    Abolish the IMB and allow any drug approved in an EU country to be sold here. Save waste of taxes and slash costs to the consumer with zero effect on safety.
    Totally agree. I couldn't believe the difference in price for even the most basic medicines on the continent; we even pay through the nose for Zovirax.
    TheChizler wrote: »
    Was pondering the other day, how doesn't this inadvertently make the MAP illegal?

    I was wondering the same myself. I think the MAP prevents implantation whereas the other ones slough the lining and anything implanted in it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    _rebelkid wrote: »

    Seems to be what they're into. This forum seem quite keen to find out names and work addresses of pro-choice activists.
    I would advise anybody who was demonstrating on behalf of the pro-choice campaign to have a look at the pictures in that thread to see if they are there. Might be a good idea to keep your wits about you if you do.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,578 ✭✭✭✭Turtwig


    Jesus Christ!:eek:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,371 ✭✭✭Obliq


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Seems to be what they're into. This forum seem quite keen to find out names and work addresses of pro-choice activists.
    I would advise anybody who was demonstrating on behalf of the pro-choice campaign to have a look at the pictures in that thread to see if they are there. Might be a good idea to keep your wits about you if you do.

    For sure. Check in with the Gardai too, maybe....

    This has "pro-life" written all over it eh? Threatening violence against people with an opinion, but non-violent methods. Pro-choice have unintrusive protests too - there are no pro-choicers picketing outside people's homes.

    Time for the pro-life side to own this. Whatever side you're on, there can be no distancing yourself from people who want to enforce that opinion by trying to make people shut-up.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Seems to be what they're into. This forum seem quite keen to find out names and work addresses of pro-choice activists.
    I would advise anybody who was demonstrating on behalf of the pro-choice campaign to have a look at the pictures in that thread to see if they are there. Might be a good idea to keep your wits about you if you do.


    .....they don't have the resources. You'll note that no names are actually mentioned.

    Its an attempt at one up-manship, because this lot have had their number for years.
    http://afaireland.yolasite.com/

    "shitheap gallery"


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,296 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    So any-one who had a free vote, or decided freely to vote for the bill in the Dail, is now a Left-Wing scum. I winder if the Independents will think "****, we've been outflanked by FG and FF"

    There's a comment in today's edition of the Examiner by Senator John Crown that there are moves by opponents of the bill to defeat it in the Senate over the prison-terms part in it.

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/abortion-legislation-could-face-seanad-obstacles-600472.html

    Herself at the front of Pics 2 & 3 will be "morto"


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Just shows how little the pro-life squad really care about women if they can be so willy-nilly about a potential 14 year sentence. Proof that they really don't give a f#ck about them.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    Galvasean wrote: »
    Just shows how little the pro-life squad really care about women if they can be so willy-nilly about a potential 14 year sentence. Proof that they really don't give a f#ck about them.

    Woman who has had an abortion has had sex. Sex = wrongness, therefore 'Dirty cow deserves it'.

    Joined up thinking, pro-life style.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 31,967 ✭✭✭✭Sarky


    In Ronan Mullen's case I'd suggest there's some bitterness that none of the sex was had with him, but that's probably only because I despise the smarmy bastard.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 965 ✭✭✭Doctor Strange


    Jernal wrote: »
    Jesus Christ!:eek:

    You rang?


This discussion has been closed.
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