Donald Trump discussion Thread IX (threadbanned users listed in OP)

Not directly related to Trump but certainly is an interesting story about one of his supporters.

Remember all the claims about Biden being compromised because of Hunter connections in Russia?

This is a sitting Republican representative who went to Russia, supposedly met someone and fell in love and got married within 8 months.

(Could well be another example of the conservative hypocrisy around accusing others of that which you are guilty)

Reference the viability of Trump's chance to have an effect on the next election, the outcome of his planned media event at Mar-Al-Lago on the 6th [the 1st anniversary of the insurrection bid by his supporters on various fronts] should be telling when what he says is given a rigorous post-mortem for truth and fact, if in fact it does go ahead and not cancelled on or before the date.

Until he renounces the lies of his claims to still be president and throws in the towel publicly on his and others efforts to promote his viability for another term, I'll decline to accept that we must take it for granted he will not run for it again. IMO, it's simply not safe to do so given the public claims from persons still high in US national affairs that they see him, and not Biden, as their legitimate president.

If he does throw in the towel, it must not be accepted as a quid-pro-quo for his not being prosecuted on charges of instigating the 2021 insurrection bid by his deluded followers and leave them to be the sole bearers of responsibility of his efforts to overthrown the established US Republic.

Not sure id even see it as a concession to sense, in that it’s still self serving after all - he sees himself as the chief reason there are vaccinations, thanks to his project Warp Speed (which was a good program in fairness), and has always wanted to soak up as much credit for that as possible.

The problem on the avid Trump supporters side is that it’s a bit too much doublethink to process… there’s no covid, it’s just a cold, it’s a trick, masks are an affront to freedom, Trumps vaccines to lower the virus risk are great. In fairness, it’s a particularly hard circle to square.

I'm not sure many American voters care all that much about a documentary on RTE, they're more concerned with domestic terrorists having another go at it.

Got you. I expect the mid terms will only make things worse, regardless of the result. Maybe a large terrorist incident is on the cards. But the 6th is almost over in the USA and all is calm.

Do you think that the insurrection was a stand alone incident, without any contributory factors and not been driven by any particular narrative?

Because that is what you are implying. That ist failed, therefore the people are losers, and it can be filed away as just one of those things.

Have you read Peril? Do you know the legal advice memo that they attempted to use on Mike Pence to get him to throw out the votes?

Have you really not joined the dots that the insurrection wasn't actually part of the plan? It was meant to be a show of strength, a way to pressurise any swaying GOP senator, like Pence, so row in behind Trump. But it clearly got out of hand. They got further, and some of them were far more violent, than they had planned for. And they also thought BLM or others would turn up in counter protest which would muddy the waters more.

It is obvious is you spend any time actually researching the events before, during and after the 6th what actually happened and how close the US really did come to their democracy being destoyed.

Also, you seem to be equating hyperbole to an insurrection. In your mind are both of them (if we play along with you that hyperbole is real) are similar? That you place the violence and insurrection in the same league as a few over excited commentators getting a bit carried away (again, I am, for the sake of argument, allowing that hyperbole is real in this case)

The people who went their have been have been arrested and plenty are going to end up in jail which we can all agree is correct.

It was obviously very bad what happened and yes Trump, and those who organised it and the rubes who were larping that day deserve punishment, but the hyperbole has been a little over the top.

Their is a reason bar outside the MSNBC echo chambers that this won't resonate with many is because the world and most certainly democracy did not end that day.

People have moved on for better or worse.

If you could point to one 'attempted murderer' in the myriad of footage available I would eat my own hat.

I've never seen a more overblown and over-exaggerated event in my life. There have been Black Friday sales more deadly than the Jan 6th 'Insurrection!'

Black Friday sales event? Lol.

I'm not sure the people saying 'it#s an attack on "our" democracy' are Irish.

For sure, nobody smashed the windows of any of our government buildings or beat any of the Gardai outside to death. I just can't see something like that happening here right now. But the US political climate does have knock-on effects on the rest of the world. Trump losing the election would have been felt by the Tories in the UK, for instance.

Exactly, Trumps victory enabled Johnson, Bolsanaro, Orban to name just a few and he being in power was used by Russia, North Korea, Israel to drive their own initiatives.

Any observer of current affairs can see the influence the US still has on geopolitics whether that be for good or negative means.

That Ted Cruz interview on tucker Carlson was just pathetic. People talk about the democrats getting stuck in purity tests, but it’s happening in the GOP also. If one doesn’t stick to the narrative they are called out on Fox News. Ted Cruz was right to say what he said about January 6th most recently, as he was the other over a dozen times he’s said it in the past year.

An ex-president and ex-reality-tv star. Apparently, when he was on the apprentice he would ramble on for hours and it would be edited down to fit the show. He doesn't understand that live tv doesn't want to cover him going off on a tangent. Even his supporters don't want to listen to that.

For inclusion when reading the above post, the Rachel Maddow Show has added that there are now 5 states where the state GOP parties held their own meetings at which faked presidential vote results were concocted (after the actual vote was over) to rival the genuine meetings in the 5 states where the genuine vote result were collated and the real certificates were composed and forwarded to Washington for the certification procedure which Mike Pence oversaw at the Capitol on the 06 Jan 2021, certifying that Joe Biden was the winner of the presidential election and not Don Trump.

The incidences whereby members of the state GOP parties produced and forwarded faked certifications to Washington in an attempt to have Don Trump falsely named as the winner of the election are under investigation by police agencies in the individual states. These may involve interstate agency cooperation as the faked documents produced by the individual GOP seem to show similarities in text and style. Photo images of the reported faked GOP certifications from the 5 states were shown on the R.M. Show. I don't know what means were used to get the faked documents to Washington, reference the possibility of it meaning offences against federal or state laws could have occurred, outside any federal and/or state laws being broken by the individual state GOP parties and members who signed the faked documents as being true certifications of the vote results in an attempt to subvert the election result.

It's worth keeping in mind that these GOP production of faked documents meetings took place long before the 06th Jan 2021 and the events at the Capitol building on that date.

I had thoughts along that line after reading of cases where people in the US were charged after using the mail system for unlawful benefit.

In the meantime, the DOJ may be trying to persuade people of interest to turn states evidence as 11 people [ten of whom are members of the Oath Keepers previously charged with other offences] have been charged today with seditious conspiracy, according to CNN which has the charges rated higher than insurrection in terms of awardable prison sentence time [edit] on conviction.

I can only imagine what might have happened had this been signed. Other than the obvious troll, is anyone defending this guy anymore with a straight face?

Thought it was interesting that Pence came out with those comments now.

Apparently, he had spoken with Dan Qualye enquiring if he could overturn the election like Trump wanted him to. Looking at commentary online, it seems that he is still angling for a run himself in 2024. If so, then I would expect him to lose to Trump but he may still have the capacity to inflict significant damage on him if he is in the race for any significant period.

Bannon has stepped forward to broadcast that Mike Pence will have to take his speech with him to his grave. One of CNN's pundits has mooted that Bannon's words can be understood to be a threat to Pence. I disagree with that opinion as Bannon is clever enough not to want USSS agents at his door with the belief that he is a direct threat to Pence. I see Bannon's comment as continuing to further Trumps agenda through the media, something Trump cant.

Actually as Pence's COS has given evidence to the committee, the next logical step for Pence, if he has left the political stage and wants posterity to be kind to him, would be for him to attend at the committee hearings and tell its members what was said to him by Trump and Trumps re-election agents on the day and days close to that date about turning the election result on its head. I can see that the mere presence of Pence in the area of the committee hearing room/s would get to Trumps agents ears fast, causing chaos there.

Bannon's behaviour is not what I expected from a person allegedly behind the spinning of conspiracy stories, like the Trump line of Democrat party machinations intent on ending democracy in the US. Given how he started out doing the spinning, it looks like he's swallowed his alternative reality line.

It'd be good to see how much truth there is in the Trump party line about the current amount of cash there is in his election war-chest and how much the GOP believes the reported total is, given how Trump himself is a source of that line. If its real and not just promised, it must be banked somewhere and logged with the Feds for tax-avoidance purposes, supposedly an expertise of his.