Schools and Covid 19 (part 5) Mod warnings in OP

Sammy2012 · 02-07-2021 9:16pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What absolute arrogant tosh. “You wouldn’t know man, you weren’t there”. I hope this thread is not representative of the opinion of teachers on the parents and communities involved in the schools where you are employed. Remember when ye are long retired, us, our kids and our grandkids will still be invested in the success of the schools in our communities.

Off ye go for the next two months trying to close the schools for the Autumn in spite of all the evidence everywhere, not just Ireland, that it has been safe to open schools

I am a teacher and we did not have one case of covid all year. Not one. Actually I've never had my class as well attended since I started teaching over 13 years ago. Yes it was cold at times during the winter but we wore coats *myself and the kids* and we will do it again next winter if needed. Schools will reopen in September as planned. Why wouldn't they? Yes the numbers are rising all over Europe but hospitalisations and deaths are not.

My kids have been attending GAA, dancing and swimming at various times during the year and have never come into contact with Covid. They are now saying the symptoms of the Delta variant are a sore throat, runny nose and a headache. 18 months ago this was known as a cold and I know I would not be running to my doctor to give them 60e so they could tell me that. We have to move on with life.

JTMan · 02-07-2021 9:17pm

Excellent FT article on why we need to vaccinate those aged 12+

https://twitter.com/FinancialTimes/status/1411052092714856463

Independent Sage group of science advisers, notes that herd immunity requires about 85 per cent of the population to be immune, and children make up 21 per cent of the UK population. In short, the UK’s “vaccine wall” has a large, teen-shaped hole in it. That, in turn, means either ongoing transmission, with all its risks (the vaccines are great but not perfect) or continued interventions like social distancing. This capricious virus has the capacity to evolve further. Leaving older children unjabbed risks creating viral reservoirs capable of cooking up future variants, some of which might not be as benign to the young.

khalessi · 02-07-2021 9:43pm

Deleted User wrote: »

What absolute arrogant tosh. “You wouldn’t know man, you weren’t there”. I hope this thread is not representative of the opinion of teachers on the parents and communities involved in the schools where you are employed. Remember when ye are long retired, us, our kids and our grandkids will still be invested in the success of the schools in our communities.

Off ye go for the next two months trying to close the schools for the Autumn in spite of all the evidence everywhere, not just Ireland, that it has been safe to open schools

Arrogant you spend your time putting down any view that is not yours. But anyway, back to the topic at hand.

330,000 kids are isolating in UK at the moment due to Covid, there is a difference between being open and being safe.

What do you think of Norma issuing Covid Dioxide monitors, I am presuming you are aware being on PA.

khalessi · 02-07-2021 9:45pm

Sammy2012 wrote: »

I am a teacher and we did not have one case of covid all year. Not one. Actually I've never had my class as well attended since I started teaching over 13 years ago. Yes it was cold at times during the winter but we wore coats *myself and the kids* and we will do it again next winter if needed. Schools will reopen in September as planned. Why wouldn't they? Yes the numbers are rising all over Europe but hospitalisations and deaths are not.

My kids have been attending GAA, dancing and swimming at various times during the year and have never come into contact with Covid. They are now saying the symptoms of the Delta variant are a sore throat, runny nose and a headache. 18 months ago this was known as a cold and I know I would not be running to my doctor to give them 60e so they could tell me that. We have to move on with life.

Lucky for you Sammy not every school was that lucky, we had numerous classes sent home to isolate.

I didnt think the common cold 18 months ago put people in the hospital but sure what would I know

02-07-2021 9:53pm

khalessi wrote: »

Lucky for you Sammy not every school was that lucky, we had numerous classes sent home to isolate.

I didnt think the common cold 18 months ago put people in the hospital but sure what would I know

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10913403/

I am sure at this stage you must know loads of kids not able to live a normal life due to long Covid?

02-07-2021 9:54pm

khalessi wrote: »

Arrogant you spend your time putting down any view that is not yours. But anyway, back to the topic at hand.

330,000 kids are isolating in UK at the moment due to Covid, there is a difference between being open and being safe.

What do you think of Norma issuing Covid Dioxide monitors, I am presuming you are aware being on PA.

Isolating =/= suffering from long covid

Sammy2012 · 02-07-2021 9:59pm

khalessi wrote: »

Lucky for you Sammy not every school was that lucky, we had numerous classes sent home to isolate.

I didnt think the common cold 18 months ago put people in the hospital but sure what would I know

No khalessi not every school was but lots were. Very few schools around us had cases. There were some cases in schools in our local town but not very many. There would be schools of over 300 kids. No child was hospitalised from any of these outbreaks.

I know of cases where children were refused to be seen by their doctor without the parents getting a covid test. Upon receiving the results the child was clear but the parents were not. However the parent had no symptoms at all.

I was apprehensive of going back to school in March but quickly got back into the swing of things. We temperature checked every morning but for the most part went about our business as normal. And I will do the same in September. There is risk associated with everything in life and noone knows what tomorrow will bring. I lost a family member in tragic circumstances in March and it made me realise life is for living.

JTMan · 03-07-2021 6:34am

Leo seems to be hinting that 12-17 year olds may be vaccinated in September.

“We can still have an outdoor summer, holiday and look forward to schools and colleges going back safely in September when all adults are vaccinated. And we may be vaccinating teenagers at that point too.”

Now to take this a step further and plan secondary school reopenings around the completion of the 12-17 year old vaccination plan.

Van.Bosch · 03-07-2021 8:50am

JTMan wrote: »

Leo seems to be hinting that 12-17 year olds may be vaccinated in September.

Now to take this a step further and plan secondary school reopenings around the completion of the 12-17 year old vaccination plan.

So don’t reopen until they are fully vaccinated?

JTMan · 03-07-2021 10:03am

Van.Bosch wrote: »

So don’t reopen until they are fully vaccinated?

Absolutely if we are dealing with a matter of small number of days/weeks but no if we are dealing with a long length of time but we should not have to deal with a long length of time. As others have said here, ideally secondary school children would be fully vaccinated before September but if full vaccination is not going to occur till a bit into September then the school calendar should be adjusted accordingly to avoid Delta spread.

hesaidshesaid · 03-07-2021 11:29am

Deleted User wrote: »

What absolute arrogant tosh. “You wouldn’t know man, you weren’t there”. I hope this thread is not representative of the opinion of teachers on the parents and communities involved in the schools where you are employed. Remember when ye are long retired, us, our kids and our grandkids will still be invested in the success of the schools in our communities.

Off ye go for the next two months trying to close the schools for the Autumn in spite of all the evidence everywhere, not just Ireland, that it has been safe to open schools

There is no appetite among teachers to close schools. ‘Homeschooling’ or whatever you like to call it, is clearly not anywhere near as effective. Our digital divide also heightens the inequality of access to education.

Teachers would like schools to be safer, for the benefit of all. They would also very much like to see an end to the bull**** narrative from the DE and in large swathes of media that things are just as they were in schools before Covid.

It is fair to say that the people working in school buildings daily have greater insight into what is going on. I wouldn’t claim to know what it’s been like working in hospitals despite having multiple family members and friends who work in them. That would be arrogance.

SusanC10 · 03-07-2021 12:29pm

Interesting article below on Vaccination of kids Ages 12+ in Israel.

https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/covid-did-israel-screw-up-not-vaccinating-children-ages-12-15-right-away-672203

Lumen · 03-07-2021 4:51pm

SusanC10 wrote: »

Interesting article below on Vaccination of kids Ages 12+ in Israel.

https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/covid-did-israel-screw-up-not-vaccinating-children-ages-12-15-right-away-672203

IPS HEAD Prof. Tzachi Grossman, along with the organization’s colleagues, wrote that the risk for a child to develop a severe form of COVID if infected – which stands at 1:3,000 – outweighs that of developing a myocarditis – which according to US data for ages 12-17 is more than five times less likely at 1:16,000 (according to Israeli data for the age group 16-19, the occurrence was half as likely at 1:6,000).

This is oddly/wrongly worded, but if those odds are correct:

1:3,000 risk for a child to develop a severe form of COVID if infected
1:6,000 risk for a child to develop a myocarditis if vaccinated

...then I can't see NIAC approving them based on their recent decisions, because they can argue that 50% of kids won't get infected if infection control measures (ventilation, masks, distancing, test and trace) are used.

Of course that assumes equivalent harm between "a severe form of COVID" and "a myocarditis".

edit: it would probably make sense to investigate the characteristics of those who suffer either effect, and administer the vaccines selectively. I'm sure there are smart people on it.

lucernarian · 03-07-2021 4:55pm

Sammy2012 wrote: »

I am a teacher and we did not have one case of covid all year. Not one. Actually I've never had my class as well attended since I started teaching over 13 years ago. Yes it was cold at times during the winter but we wore coats *myself and the kids* and we will do it again next winter if needed. Schools will reopen in September as planned. Why wouldn't they? Yes the numbers are rising all over Europe but hospitalisations and deaths are not.

My kids have been attending GAA, dancing and swimming at various times during the year and have never come into contact with Covid. They are now saying the symptoms of the Delta variant are a sore throat, runny nose and a headache. 18 months ago this was known as a cold and I know I would not be running to my doctor to give them 60e so they could tell me that. We have to move on with life.

(Side note) Can anyone tell me why middle-aged women are more likely than any other group to be vaccine-skeptical?

As for covid itself, did we fake all the people in ICU back in February? Or is it because they're old and/or frail patients so it's all fine?

I do agree that schools should reopen though.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 03-07-2021 5:01pm

Van.Bosch wrote: »

So don’t reopen until they are fully vaccinated?

I'd guess they'll vaccinate thro the schools if they're gonna do it at all, only way to get as many as you'd want done and quickly.

Same as hpv done at school.

Lumen · 03-07-2021 5:01pm

lucernarian wrote: »

(Side note) Can anyone tell me why middle-aged women are more likely than any other group to be vaccine-skeptical?

https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=name+karen :pac:

lucernarian · 03-07-2021 5:55pm

Lumen wrote: »

https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=name+karen :pac:

Thanks for taking me up on the joke offer hahaha

JTMan · 04-07-2021 7:16am

The vaccination of those aged 12-17 is likely to begin in August according to Independent.ie here.

Vaccination of children as young as 12 against Covid-19 could begin as early as next month.

It comes as the State races to beat an expected surge in the Delta variant in the coming weeks as the return of schools in late August approaches.

The HSE’s Schools Immunisation Programme is expected to be used alongside the existing Covid-19 vaccination infrastructure to begin vaccinating children as soon as clinical advice allows.

Separately, a senior Government source this weekend said if the National Immunisation Advisory Committee (Niac) “advise on kids being vaccinated the school vaccination programme will be utilised. The HSE is on top of all scenarios”.

wirelessdude01 · 04-07-2021 10:22am

JTMan wrote: »

The vaccination of those aged 12-17 is likely to begin in August according to Independent.ie here.

The quote that The HSE is in top of all scenarios gave me a right good chuckle. Like fcuk they are. Much like education, the top brass are a disgrace with regards to planning.

is_that_so · 04-07-2021 10:26am

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

The quote that The HSE is in top of all scenarios gave me a right good chuckle. Like fcuk they are. Much like education, the top brass are a disgrace with regards to planning.

So, 4.5m doses done is a mirage? Or the 350K last week was organised by people on the ground? It's a speculative piece by the Indo from a source.

Sammy2012 · 04-07-2021 3:04pm

lucernarian wrote: »

(Side note) Can anyone tell me why middle-aged women are more likely than any other group to be vaccine-skeptical?

As for covid itself, did we fake all the people in ICU back in February? Or is it because they're old and/or frail patients so it's all fine?

I do agree that schools should reopen though.

I never said I was vaccine skeptical. Im getting my second dose next Thurs. Happy to take the vaccine. I'm pro vaccine. My kids have all their vaccines and I've gotten them the Men B vaccine extra.

And I never said anything about faking people in ICU. There are approx 260 beds in use today in ICU. 14/16 of these are covid related. A lot of the problems is our lack of capacity in ICU. But have they done much to increase this since last March??? They'd rather pay massive wages to many in the HSE than put any services in on the ground.

JTMan · 04-07-2021 6:18pm

‘No way’ to end cycle of transmission without vaccinating children, Irish Times reports here.

Noting children and young people accounted for 20-25 per cent of the population she said: “The more people who are vaccinated the better chance we have of achieving population-wide herd immunity”.

Prof Kingston Mills, director of Trinity College’s Biomedical Sciences Institute, said vaccinating children “makes complete sense.

“If you look at the numbers of cases in children . . . it is among 12- to 18-year-olds that the virus is circulating now.”

JTMan · 05-07-2021 6:19am

https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1411820173464461312

CruelSummer · 05-07-2021 9:20am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What absolute arrogant tosh. “You wouldn’t know man, you weren’t there”. I hope this thread is not representative of the opinion of teachers on the parents and communities involved in the schools where you are employed. Remember when ye are long retired, us, our kids and our grandkids will still be invested in the success of the schools in our communities.

Off ye go for the next two months trying to close the schools for the Autumn in spite of all the evidence everywhere, not just Ireland, that it has been safe to open schools

This poster doesn’t represent teachers. I would go so far as to say I haven’t met one teacher sharing their views in the ‘real world setting’. Many times reading their posts over the last year, I’ve wondered why they entered the profession if all they’re going to contribute to the Covid crisis is trying to get the schools closed down.
Thankfully most if not all teachers just want to get on with things and aren’t filling up the Covid schools thread with scaremongering during the holidays.

CruelSummer · 05-07-2021 9:21am

khalessi wrote: »

Arrogant you spend your time putting down any view that is not yours. But anyway, back to the topic at hand.

330,000 kids are isolating in UK at the moment due to Covid, there is a difference between being open and being safe.

What do you think of Norma issuing Covid Dioxide monitors, I am presuming you are aware being on PA.

Soon the U.K. Government will tell them they don’t need to isolate for Covid (Common Cold symptoms). The hospital system is quiet in the U.K. - the vaccines have worked.

lucernarian · 05-07-2021 1:18pm

Sammy2012 wrote: »

I never said I was vaccine skeptical. Im getting my second dose next Thurs. Happy to take the vaccine. I'm pro vaccine. My kids have all their vaccines and I've gotten them the Men B vaccine extra.

And I never said anything about faking people in ICU. There are approx 260 beds in use today in ICU. 14/16 of these are covid related. A lot of the problems is our lack of capacity in ICU. But have they done much to increase this since last March??? They'd rather pay massive wages to many in the HSE than put any services in on the ground.

Nor did I, I added something as a side note explicitly because it wasn't aimed at you, but go ahead and react to it anyway by all means.

khalessi · 05-07-2021 6:30pm

CruelSummer wrote: »

This poster doesn’t represent teachers. I would go so far as to say I haven’t met one teacher sharing their views in the ‘real world setting’. Many times reading their posts over the last year, I’ve wondered why they entered the profession if all they’re going to contribute to the Covid crisis is trying to get the schools closed down.
Thankfully most if not all teachers just want to get on with things and aren’t filling up the Covid schools thread with scaremongering during the holidays.

You are funny but completely incorrect but it does not suit your mindset that I have been calling for schools to be open. If you had bothered to read correctly I have fought and continue to fight for safe schools, masks, carbon monitors, hepa air purifiers/filters, school staff vaccination, social distancing, antigen testing, basically anything to keep schools open safely.

There are those on here who ridicule teachers either directly by making facile comments often incorrect, or by liking the posts of those who ridicule, for wanting these things in schools. Bizarre the attitude to keeping children and school staff safe. Yet I bet they are to first to complain about the lack of indoor dining and have no problem with hospitality getting vaccinated so they can have a pint

Meanwhile, the Taoiseach has twice now said teachers were correct not to reopen in January due to the high cases but have any of the people here slagging off teachers apologised, no because they cannot bear to be wrong.

The Dept of Ed has said same mitigations in August when schools return, bubbles pods, handwashing, some carbon monitors but no mention of hepa air filters which is more or less same approach taken for B117.

Sorry if it bursts your bubble but schools will not have changed from 3 weeks ago when they reopen, in order to keep your children safe.

CruelSummer wrote: »

Soon the U.K. Government will tell them they don’t need to isolate for Covid (Common Cold symptoms). The hospital system is quiet in the U.K. - the vaccines have worked.

The UK gov being Bojo axing laws on 19 July despite having less vaccinations then Israel who are seeing a rise in cases due to Depta varient and Pfizer being only 64% efficacy against Delta variant and the people on the ground ie Doctors and Nurses are calling out saying it is too soon to drop safety mitigations. Good luck to them hope it works out.

05-07-2021 7:19pm

khalessi wrote: »

You are funny but completely incorrect but it does not suit your mindset that I have been calling for schools to be open. If you had bothered to read correctly I have fought and continue to fight for safe schools, masks, carbon monitors, hepa air purifiers/filters, school staff vaccination, social distancing, antigen testing, basically anything to keep schools open safely.

There are those on here who ridicule teachers either directly by making facile comments often incorrect, or by liking the posts of those who ridicule, for wanting these things in schools. Bizarre the attitude to keeping children and school staff safe. Yet I bet they are to first to complain about the lack of indoor dining and have no problem with hospitality getting vaccinated so they can have a pint

Meanwhile, the Taoiseach has twice now said teachers were correct not to reopen in January due to the high cases but have any of the people here slagging off teachers apologised, no because they cannot bear to be wrong.

The Dept of Ed has said same mitigations in August when schools return, bubbles pods, handwashing, some carbon monitors but no mention of hepa air filters which is more or less same approach taken for B117.

Sorry if it bursts your bubble but schools will not have changed from 3 weeks ago when they reopen, in order to keep your children safe.

The UK gov being Bojo axing laws on 19 July despite having less vaccinations then Israel who are seeing a rise in cases due to Depta varient and Pfizer being only 64% efficacy against Delta variant and the people on the ground ie Doctors and Nurses are calling out saying it is too soon to drop safety mitigations. Good luck to them hope it works out.

Cherry picking negative data from studies once more. The Israeli study showed Pfizer 93% effective against serious illness. And the Israeli study is an outlier on studies of the effectiveness of the Pfizer vaccine against the delta variant.

Also Israel are at 25% of the case rate we are at currently and hospital rates have gone up by 50% while cases have gone up 1500%. This in spite of there being significant vaccine hesitancy among the orthodox and Israeli Arab communities.

khalessi · 05-07-2021 7:23pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Cherry picking negative data from studies once more. The Israeli study showed Pfizer 93% effective against serious illness. And the Israeli study is an outlier on studies of the effectiveness of the Pfizer vaccine against the delta variant.

Also Israel are at 25% of the case rate we are at currently and hospital rates have gone up by 50% while cases have gone up 1500%. This in spite of there being significant vaccine hesitancy among the orthodox and Israeli Arab communities.

I think it is sweet how you and CS follow each other around to pick on people, and yet again prove how anyone who disagrees with your posse is put down. Sending hope and optimism that you mature soon.

Interesting MM and a few others dont think this is over or should be dismissed as a flu or cold

05-07-2021 7:27pm

khalessi wrote: »

I think it is sweet how you and CS follow each other around to pick on people, and yet again prove how anyone who disagrees with your posse is put down. Sending hope and optimism that you mature soon.

That’s a good one. This is probably the only thread where CS and I have agreed, and that is only because the data posted in support of some of the thread “facts” is blatantly incorrect. Most of the time we vehemently disagree on the need for restriction which I agree with, just not that schools are a significant issue

Can you point to where what I said is incorrect rather than purely paint everyone who disagrees with the one brush?

khalessi · 05-07-2021 7:31pm

Deleted User wrote: »

That’s a good one. This is probably the only thread where CS and I have agreed, and that is only because the data posted in support of some of the thread “facts” is blatantly incorrect. Most of the time we vehemently disagree on the need for restriction which I agree with, just not that schools are a significant issue

Can you point to where what I said is incorrect rather than purely paint everyone who disagrees with the one brush?

Here pet you need to relax, have a look at this to lighten your mood

https://twitter.com/Negans_vaporub/status/1412075793203802117

I find a little bit of JDM helps everyone

JTMan · 05-07-2021 7:47pm

There's no herd immunity without vaccinating children ...

https://twitter.com/DrZoeHyde/status/1411953765695901700

Beasty · 05-07-2021 7:52pm

khalessi wrote: »

I think it is sweet how you and CS follow each other around to pick on people, and yet again prove how anyone who disagrees with your posse is put down. Sending hope and optimism that you mature soon.

Interesting MM and a few others dont think this is over or should be dismissed as a flu or cold

OK, I've had enough of this from you throughout the pandemic. As you insist on attacking/discussing the poster please find another site to do so. You are now banned from posting in this thread

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 21-07-2021 11:50am

Drifting towards student vaccination

https://twitter.com/ZaraKing/status/1417476271790043139?s=19

JTMan · 25-07-2021 7:57am

Sindo leads today on the reopening of schools

Vaccinations: Give the jab to all children aged five-plus, says expert

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/vaccinations-give-the-jabto-all-childrenaged-five-plussays-expert-40687039.html

Dr Paddy Mallon warned: “I think schools have the potential to be a problem".
Calls for children 5+ to be given the vaccine. (Only EMA approved for 12+ at the moment).
Government has sought advice from public health officials in recent days about the reopening of schools in September.
Nphet is not recommending school reopening be delayed, but senior public health officials cannot rule out this advice changing if the Covid-19 situation deteriorates significantly.
Chief medical officer Dr Tony Holohan warned the Government last month that “a high level of transmission in later summer could have a significant impact on the reopening of schools and the tertiary education sector in the autumn”.
A decision will also be taken to retain the capacity limit on school transport at 50pc, despite it increasing to 75pc for public transport from last Monday.
“The likelihood is that Covid will spread in schools,” he said. “There should be a discussion happening right now about the benefits of vaccinating children.”

I think the focus should be on trying to get as many 12+ year olds fully vaccinated before school reopens even if that means slight small adjustments to the secondary school reopening date to bring it in line with the completion of the 12+ vaccinations.

Sammy2012 · 25-07-2021 9:29am

As a mother and a teacher I will not be making my own kids take this vaccine. I am in my mid 30s and fully vaccinated as is pretty much everyone I know. But I really don't see the need for kids to be vaccinated against this. They have had all their vaccines in the childhood vaccination schedule but ill definitely be holding out on this one. I have no problem going back to school and getting on with things. It's starting to get ridiculous now.

25-07-2021 8:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117658245#Comment_117658245

Why in favour of all the other vaccines and not this one?

Vaccinated30 · 26-07-2021 9:14am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117660508#Comment_117660508

I can give my own answer for this.

I have seen children with Whooping cough, measles and meningitis (few thanks to vaccinating) and I have also seen many many Children with covid. There's one group that are very very ill and close to death. I know 2 children personally who died from meningitis.

The Covid group had nothing more than a typical viral infection at worse. Even a CF child had very little symptoms. So the risk of disease does not outweigh the risk of a vaccine. The exact same reason I don't elect to get chicken pox vaccine for my kids.

iguana · 26-07-2021 9:49am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117661828#Comment_117661828

I'm older than you so had whooping cough as a baby, measles when I was 3, rubella and mumps when I was 5. I don't remember the whooping cough but my mum says I coughed for a few days with a horrible sounding cough but was otherwise my usual happy self. Measles was crap, with hindsight I'd describe what I can remember as a days long severe migraine. Rubella and mumps were actually a great time. I felt fine, ate a lot of ice-cream and my extended family all brought me presents. I have genuinely lovely memories of those illnesses. I still got my son vaccinated against them though. Because mass vaccination of these illnesses isn't done to protect each child from an illness that in all likelihood will range from crappy few days to genuinely great for them. It's to create a herd immunity to protect the outliers who will suffer the worst consequences of usually fine, occasionally serious and rarely terminal illnesses. The odds are most vaccinations you have given your child weren't to protect your child from serious illnesses but to eliminate the disease in order to protect the outliers. They are societal not individual.

And that's why they need to be vaccinated against Covid as soon as it's deemed safe. The pandemic only ends when we achieve herd immunity and the current data suggests we need 90% of the entire population to be vaccinated in order to achieve herd immunity. That means nearly every single person above the age of 5 or the risks to society. It's not about your children as individual people. It's about every single one of us who can, doing this for society as a whole.

Vaccinated30 · 26-07-2021 10:08am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117661958#Comment_117661958

I had whooping cough at 20 so I remember it well, and i can assure you it's a lot worse than coughing for a few days. I personally gave my children vaccines that would protect them as much as possible. I don't care about society as a whole in that sense. My children come 1st. And if that makes me selfish I don't care. Your anecdotal fond memories and my anecdotal hellish experiences are both just that Ancedotal. I don't care about society as a whole when it involves my children. I will put them before your children, before cancer patients, before any other child or adult on this planet. And there is nothing anyone can say that will make me change that mindset. My children don't need a covid vaccine because worldwide there is virtually 0 risk of severe illness or death for kids. And that is not the same, worldwide, for the scheduled childhood vaccinations. I don't elect for anything I don't perceive as a risk to my children. If they change their mind at 16 thats their perogative.

iguana · 26-07-2021 10:35am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117662042#Comment_117662042

You don't get to not care about society. Every single last piece of security and luxury you and your children have comes from society. Without our society we have nothing but miserable, short lives. And while most of the time society is so secure and luxurious we actually get to not care about it and be selfish and not suffer the consequences of that. This simply can't be the case in a pandemic of one of the most contagious respiratory illness ever, which is what the Delta variant is. How much children do or don't suffer is frankly irrelevant. We can not achieve herd immunity if we don't vaccinate the vast majority of children. Life can't go back to normal if we don't vaccinate our kids. So you might think that the risk of the disease isn't much to children but the risk of the pandemic is. Constant threat of school closures, extra-curricular activities and indoor play areas never being able to reopen, Christmas never being the same as it used to be because it's slap bang in winter, living lives removed from elderly relatives that it's never going to be safe for them to be indoors with, never properly learning to interpret facial communication as well as they need to because masks have to be too prevalent for too long.

We've been doing all of this for the last 16 months because the consequences of not doing so were worse than the consequences of doing so. But that doesn't mean there weren't serious negative consequences. And children have suffered those consequences more than most. And if we have to continue doing so on and off for the rest of their childhoods, the consequences on their social development will be far, far worse than the disease or the vaccine side effects put together. Significantly so.

But all of this is moot, tbh. A year ago boards was full of people insisting they wouldn't be taking the 'experimental' vaccine. And it was all a load of bluster. When their time came they almost all went and got it. It's pretty much inevitable that will also be true for kids. People will bluster about it now. But when the time comes, and the vaccine is being rolled out, most likely in schools through or after one more shîtty, limited winter and potentially damp squib of a Christmas. Very, very, very few parents who aren't hardcore anti-vax assholes, will be opting their kids out and risking this shît going on a minute longer than it needs to.

is_that_so · 26-07-2021 11:18am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117662179#Comment_117662179

Very few of them are hardcore anti-vax, they genuinely don't believe there is a need to get them vaccinated and no amount of moralising, simplistic labelling or abuse is likely to make them change their stance. Finally you have the hesitant, some of whom may not have opted to be vaccinated themselves. That's for the HSE to persuade them if we decide to do the 12-15 age group.

Vaccinated30 · 26-07-2021 12:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117662179#Comment_117662179

My kids will contribute to herd immunity when and if they encounter Covid authentically. I am far from anti vax, I have spent the past year arguing with anti vax people. I was first in queue to get my vax. But let me set you straight, any bit of security and luxury me and my kids have was given by me and my husband. Don't talk to me about society, the same society that failed me and my husband when we were children. I enjoyed home schooling my children. The only elderly relative I had died of covid last year. We dont have relatives to visit in winter, Christmas every year is spent in my home with me my husband and our children. I gave birth alone to all my children. I went to scans and apps alone because my husband had to either work or mind our children we already had. So don't talk to me about society. If my children get covid they get covid, I will be the one to take care of them, not society. You are barking up the wrong tree here, with all due respect.

josip · 26-07-2021 5:06pm

Does the Dept have general 'guidance' or recommendations for schools about kids returning in Sept who have been abroad during the summer ?

ie. not to return to school until X days after returning.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 26-07-2021 5:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117664346#Comment_117664346

Doubt it

SusanC10 · 26-07-2021 7:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117664346#Comment_117664346

They did last year but haven't heard this year. I did read though that some Creches have rules about not attending for a period of time after return from abroad but this seems to be individual creches.

There is supposed to be a meeting about returning to school safely tomorrow so maybe things will be clearer after that.

SusanC10 · 27-07-2021 12:26pm

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/vaccinations-set-to-be-extended-to-12-to-15-year-olds-following-niac-recommendation-1.4631669

Announcement expected today

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 27-07-2021 2:12pm

Hopefully ending the need for school closures, at 2nd level, barring another very odd varient messing things up.

Fingers crossed

SusanC10 · 28-07-2021 10:54am

I am wondering will Schools have the right to know the Vaccination status of students ?

I do NOT mean that being vaccinated will be a pre-condition for attending school - just to be clear.

But fully-vaccinated people who are Close Contacts and are asymptomatic don't need to be tested or restrict movements. So, if say a student tests positive and close contacts are identified from the Class, then how will the school know who should stay at home and be tested and who doesn't need to ?

Just wondering how it could work ?

spaceHopper · 28-07-2021 11:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117672358#Comment_117672358

They were so bad at contact tracing last year I don't think it will arise

Schools and Covid 19 (part 5) **Mod warnings in OP**

Comments

Vaccinations: Give the jab to all children aged five-plus, says expert

Schools and Covid 19 (part 5) Mod warnings in OP