To Mask or not to two - Mask Megathread cont.

xhomelezz · 26-06-2021 6:37pm

Diabhalta wrote: »

Makes no sense, people look like idiots when they wear them when there is no one around. I guess people wear them in cork city centre because they go from shop to a shop but still.. what are you doing people? Pls stop.

The covid numbers are so low, you're outside... there is no need.

And people alone driving in cars with masks on? Really?

Pls stop

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000 · 26-06-2021 7:21pm

fun loving criminal wrote: »

With Delta being more transmissible, should we be moving to N95 masks?

Turn.off.your.tv.

xhomelezz · 26-06-2021 7:38pm

I'm a bit curious how poster's question connects with all the dots in TV post.

Edit: of course we can sort anything by.turning.off.tv.

Seanergy · 26-06-2021 8:15pm

Diabhalta wrote: »

Makes no sense, people look like idiots when they wear them when there is no one around.

Your right, that makes no sense, how can you see someone if there is no one around?

Seanergy · 26-06-2021 8:17pm

Diabhalta wrote: »

I guess people wear them in cork city centre because they go from shop to a shop but still.. what are you doing people?

Shopping?

Tenger · 26-06-2021 10:12pm

Diabhalta wrote: »

Makes no sense, people look like idiots when they wear them when there is no one around. I guess people wear them in cork city centre because they go from shop to a shop but still.. what are you doing people? Pls stop.

And people alone driving in cars with masks on? Really?

Delivery drivers with products in the car?
People who are visiting someone and won't get a chance to wash hands after getting out of the car?
People who maybe are picking up/dropping off someone?

General advice is to try not to constantly take your mask on/off. As the more you handle it the less clean it is.
EG. My bus stop is a 2 min walk from the supermarket. So I usually just walk from one to the other with my mask on.

As for N95s. I would agree with the above. N95s need to be worn correctly to work. EG. No beards.
Easier for the public to stick to the simpler washable or disposal masks.
After all no-one is claiming that mask wearing is 100% prevention (except in the minds of the anti-mask crowd)

I don't get why people wearing mask outside upsets you. How exactly does that affect you?
Let other act as they want as long as it doesn't interfere with other members of the public.

Unicorn Milk Latte · 26-06-2021 10:37pm

fun loving criminal wrote: »

What do people think of wearing masks outdoors?

Aerosols accumulate quickly indoors, and disperse very quickly outdoors. Like cigarette smoke.

This is why there is an indoor mask mandate, but no outdoor mask mandate.

Wearing masks outdoors is not only ineffective, it's counterproductive: masks become inefficient when they get wet, so if someone wears a mask for an hour outdoors, and then enters a shop, the mask is less efficient where it counts.

IIRC, over 95% of infections occur indoors.

Seanergy · 27-06-2021 12:07am

'Counting to 10 is important in leadership': Micheál Martin marks a year as Taoiseach

“Look, there were issues around masks for example. I would have thought masks would have been brought in much earlier. I had discussions with Tony and Ronan [Glynn, deputy chief medical officer] about this and they would have argued, culturally, it was more of an Asian thing,” he says.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40322387.html

odyssey06 · 27-06-2021 9:38am

fun loving criminal wrote: »

What do people think of wearing masks outdoors? I know the advice is mask outdoors in crowded areas.

I avoid huge crowds anyways. But with Delta variant more transmissible what about outdoors in less crowded areas?

This was a summary pre Delta of outdoors transmission concerns... focus on crowded places like venues or bus stops. Places where people are static and could be downwind of an infected person for a period.
https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-comments-about-outdoor-transmission-of-sars-cov-2-and-use-of-facemasks-outdoors/?cli_action=1624176774.918

Less crowded areas even with Delta variant I havent heard flagged as risky unless they are so sheltered as to almost be indoors.
Its rare to get a dead calm day here... maybe in hotter countries inland you could have very little wind to disperse droplets.

fun loving criminal · 27-06-2021 1:33pm

Unicorn Milk Latte wrote: »

Aerosols accumulate quickly indoors, and disperse very quickly outdoors. Like cigarette smoke.

This is why there is an indoor mask mandate, but no outdoor mask mandate.

Wearing masks outdoors is not only ineffective, it's counterproductive: masks become inefficient when they get wet, so if someone wears a mask for an hour outdoors, and then enters a shop, the mask is less efficient where it counts.

IIRC, over 95% of infections occur indoors.

Someone posted in the Delta variant thread that her son caught covid, the Delta variant and he was outdoors.

So I'm worried about outdoor transmission now.

Tenger · 27-06-2021 1:42pm

fun loving criminal wrote: »

Someone posted in the Delta variant thread that her son caught covid, the Delta variant and he was outdoors.

So I'm worried about outdoor transmission now.

Why does everyone think it is black/white situation?

It’s a sliding scale of risk.
Indoors is more risky due to close proximity and less air dispersion.
The time limits aren’t set in stone either, they are to try to reduce time spent in proximity to others. It doesn’t mean you can’t get infected in 14 mins but 16 mins will automatically mean infected.

But that doesn’t mean that you can catch it by bad luck when outdoors.
Walking past a asymptomatic person who happens to cough 3-4 seconds before you walk though their cloud of droplets.

Seanergy · 27-06-2021 10:06pm

fun loving criminal wrote: »

Not allowed that mask brace gadget or ear savers or extenders in work. I'll see if I can get the mask policy next week.

Not sure I'd agree that the fixthemask brace is a gadget. Would you consider the eraser ontop of the pencil to be a gadget?

I made the DIY version that they promote and I have to say I found the experience to be boom. Breathing in a mask when you manage to get a tight seal to your face is next level breathing. Non of us are near it, most people have never experienced it.

This morning, I ripped the core out of some exhausted P2 masks that I was using during the week, they are my new braces for SMs. Added a little colour for my own jazz and fresh elastics for maximum seal. Maybe people should have their own frames, to suit the shape of their face. not sure I will be using the ear loops or nose brace that came with the SM, will test out during the week.

Please do look over the mask policy at work.

Also made some pouches out of NWPP, using a heat sealer on the edges = no stitch holes

Unicorn Milk Latte · 28-06-2021 3:21pm

...and, about outdoor masking - in addition to the really good points made by @Tenger above:

While getting infected outdoors is much less likely than getting infected indoors, of course it can happen - see the outdoor mass gatherings, without masks or distancing, in India that preceded the last spike.

When someone says he/she was infected while being outdoors, it also makes sense to consider the 'human factor' - being able to tell reliably if and where you were indoors with other people 10 days ago. With 'indoors' meaning being in a car with a vaccinated person (who can, of course, still transmit), for example.

For people who have symptomatic Covid, the time when they are most infectious is from 2 days before symptoms start, till 1 day after symptoms start.

Hector Savage · 30-06-2021 5:22pm

Tenger wrote: »

Why does everyone think it is black/white situation?

It’s a sliding scale of risk.
Indoors is more risky due to close proximity and less air dispersion.
The time limits aren’t set in stone either, they are to try to reduce time spent in proximity to others. It doesn’t mean you can’t get infected in 14 mins but 16 mins will automatically mean infected.

But that doesn’t mean that you can catch it by bad luck when outdoors.
Walking past a asymptomatic person who happens to cough 3-4 seconds before you walk though their cloud of droplets.

There hasn't been one documented case of casual outdoor transmission - none.

Check out this video, the mental illness of these people is staggering

Hector Savage · 30-06-2021 5:25pm

fun loving criminal wrote: »

What do people think of wearing masks outdoors? I know the advice is mask outdoors in crowded areas.

I avoid huge crowds anyways. But with Delta variant more transmissible what about outdoors in less crowded areas?

https://www.mentalhealthireland.ie/

Ficheall · 30-06-2021 5:33pm

Hector Savage wrote: »

There hasn't been one documented case of casual outdoor transmission - none.

How would you document such a case? Tricky thing to prove, no? For a documented study, you'd have to follow someone everywhere for a couple of weeks and ensure they interacted with no one indoors, right? It is universally acknowledged that outdoor transmission is lower, so you'd need several people in this trial.. If you were running the field experiment - how would you do it conclusively?

Hector Savage wrote: »

Check out this video, the mental illness of these people is staggering

It's wearing a piece of cloth on your face, which has a tiny chance of preventing you getting sick. Expected benefit? Very small. Inconvenience? Minimal. Mental illness? Hardly.

Tenger · 30-06-2021 6:32pm

Hector Savage wrote: »

There hasn't been one documented case of casual outdoor transmission - none.

That a brave claim, "not one documented case" across the entire globe in 15 months!!!!

Did you miss the entire breakdown of the outdoors event in the USA last year when Trump had nominated a new Supreme Court Judge. The media had maps showing where each person who was infected had been seated. Trump himself was admitted to hospital 3-4 days later.

Seanergy · 30-06-2021 6:40pm

Hector Savage wrote: »

There hasn't been one documented case of casual outdoor transmission - none.

Check out this video, the mental illness of these people is staggering

I see he is also offering 20% on his FAUCI THE CLOWN SHIRTS....Not selling so well? Who's the clown now?

This lad is filling his pockets off yee, quoting NY's Fleccas is dangerous.

Outdoor transmission accounts for approx .1% of cases here in the Relublic of Ireland.

xhomelezz · 30-06-2021 7:49pm

Hector Savage wrote: »

There hasn't been one documented case of casual outdoor transmission - none.

Check out this video, the mental illness of these people is staggering

So you are basically repeating bs from the YouTube video, not one documented outdoor transmission. And after that you say participants in the video are mentally ill. After being questioned by the guy who is not able to wear any mask, because of the size of his beard. Well I hope you have some t-shirts for sale and you'll do better business than him.

Not questioning your ability to recognise mental illness

Hector Savage · 30-06-2021 8:39pm

Seanergy wrote: »

I see he is also offering 20% on his FAUCI THE CLOWN SHIRTS....Not selling so well? Who's the clown now?

This lad is filling his pockets off yee, quoting NY's Fleccas is dangerous.

Outdoor transmission accounts for approx .1% of cases here in the Relublic of Ireland.

casual outdoor transmission - none.

yeah Fleccas is dangerous, having different opinions, so dangerous...

xhomelezz · 30-06-2021 9:00pm

Who is Fleccas anyway?

pjohnson · 30-06-2021 9:01pm

xhomelezz wrote: »

Who is Fleccas anyway?

The latest grifter of the month.

Buy his t-shirts now.

They'll be left in storage/dump by next month when a new flavour of the month comes up.

xhomelezz · 30-06-2021 9:11pm

Was suspicious, but thought Hector knows him better, so he could give a bit more background.

fun loving criminal · 01-07-2021 12:32am

Hector Savage wrote: »

masked up outdoors whilst fully vaccinated - yes mentally ill.

Being worried about the new delta variant isn't a mental illness. If it's more transmissible it can probably spread more easily in large groups outdoors.

Unicorn Milk Latte · 01-07-2021 1:32am

Hector Savage wrote: »

masked up outdoors whilst fully vaccinated - yes mentally ill.

Being scared of an entirely new global pandemic is human. Being overly cautious out of fear it also human. Nothing to do with mental illness.

If there was any validity to your argument, it would mean all the anti-maskers would be mentally ill, because they also don't understand how and where masks work and what they do.

When a person wears a mask outdoors, no harm is done to anyone. When the anti maskers refuse to wear masks indoors, they are actively doing harm.

Ficheall · 01-07-2021 8:30am

Hector Savage wrote: »

masked up outdoors whilst fully vaccinated - yes mentally ill.

Whereas, taking umbrage at what someone else is wearing to make themselves feel safer...

Hector Savage · 01-07-2021 10:02am

pjohnson wrote: »

The latest grifter of the month.

Buy his t-shirts now.

They'll be left in storage/dump by next month when a new flavour of the month comes up.

Yes exactly, he has dubious politicial opinions on other things so he is totally off the mark here aswell.

Points totally negated.

Hector Savage · 01-07-2021 10:04am

Unicorn Milk Latte wrote: »

Being scared of an entirely new global pandemic is human. Being overly cautious out of fear it also human. Nothing to do with mental illness.

If there was any validity to your argument, it would mean all the anti-maskers would be mentally ill, because they also don't understand how and where masks work and what they do.

When a person wears a mask outdoors, no harm is done to anyone. When the anti maskers refuse to wear masks indoors, they are actively doing harm.

They really aren't.

I think you should look into wearing a motorcycle helmet walking down the street, I mean you never know, a flowepot could fall from a balcony and hit you on the head, or some randomer could just start chucking rocks at your head.

robinph · 01-07-2021 10:28am

Hector Savage wrote: »

They really aren't.

Did you miss the last year and a half where it's been quite clear to anyone that masks are worn for the purpose of reducing the mask wearer from infecting others, not to protect the mask wearer themselves.

Someone not wearing a mask indoors, doesn't know if they are infectious so they are potentially causing harm to the other people around them. It's really quite simple.

fun loving criminal · 01-07-2021 10:29am

robinph wrote: »

Did you miss the last year and a half where it's been quite clear to anyone that masks are worn for the purpose of reducing the mask wearer from infecting others, not to protect the mask wearer themselves.

Someone not wearing a mask indoors, doesn't know if they are infectious so they are potentially causing harm to the other people around them. It's really quite simple.

It's simple but some people do not understand. Or care.

EyesClosed · 01-07-2021 10:32am

Hector Savage wrote: »

Yes exactly, he has dubious politicial opinions on other things so he is totally off the mark here aswell.

Points totally negated.

Everything else he says is bull... But this time he's right...makes sense

fun loving criminal · 01-07-2021 11:11am

Hector Savage wrote: »

There hasn't been one documented case of casual outdoor transmission - none.

Check out this video, the mental illness of these people is staggering

Going around outdoors interviewing people with masks. I'd like to see an element of risk for this guy, go indoors and ask people without masks are they vaccinated. I bet he doesn't have the same size testicles as his fat belly.

Seanergy · 01-07-2021 11:20am

Italians have released commemorative €2 coin to say “Grazie” to its doctors and nurses during the pandemic.

funnydoggy · 01-07-2021 11:21am

Seanergy wrote: »

Italians have released commemorative €2 coin to say “Grazie” to its doctors and nurses during the pandemic.

That's actually lovely

Irish Stones · 01-07-2021 1:07pm

Seanergy wrote: »

Italians have released commemorative €2 coin to say “Grazie” to its doctors and nurses during the pandemic.

WOW, a 2 euro coin, face value 2 euro, sold at 10 euro, amazing. Italians are always good at ripping others, aren't they

Seanergy · 01-07-2021 1:42pm

Irish Stones wrote: »

WOW, a 2 euro coin, face value 2 euro, sold at 10 euro, amazing. Italians are always good at ripping others, aren't they

LOL, 10 euro's already...sure? I think someone was trying to coin you.

Clearly you know very little about commemorative coins.

Sconsey · 01-07-2021 2:39pm

Hector Savage wrote: »

They really aren't.

I think you should look into wearing a motorcycle helmet walking down the street, I mean you never know, a flowepot could fall from a balcony and hit you on the head, or some randomer could just start chucking rocks at your head.

Good lad, you seem to know more than the vast majoity of the scientific community. Their opinion based on years of training, expertise and experimentation...yours based on some bizzare flower pot falling on someones head.

Luckily your opinion counts for frig-all.

Irish Stones · 01-07-2021 2:47pm

Seanergy wrote: »

LOL, 10 euro's already...sure? I think someone was trying to coin you.

Clearly you know very little about commemorative coins.

It's a 2 euro coin, with a face value of 2 euro, just like other hundreds of commemorative euro coins that are currently used to shop. Whether it is commemorative or not, its value is 2 euro.

https://www.shop.ipzs.it/2021-2euro-professioni-sanitarie48-2ms10-21f004.html

EyesClosed · 01-07-2021 2:55pm

Irish Stones wrote: »

It's a 2 euro coin, with a face value of 2 euro, just like other hundreds of commemorative euro coins that are currently used to shop. Whether it is commemorative or not, its value is 2 euro.

https://www.shop.ipzs.it/2021-2euro-professioni-sanitarie48-2ms10-21f004.html

Well no.
It's value like anything is what someone will pay for it.
If you buy it now, it may increase in value over time, it also may not. Nobody uses commemorative coins as currency.
Its like say comic books, you buy one for say 5 euro, the cover price will always be 5 euro, but if it is a special issue then the resale value will be whatever someone will pay for.

Irish Stones · 01-07-2021 3:04pm

EyesClosed wrote: »

Well no.
It's value like anything is what someone will pay for it.
If you buy it now, it may increase in value over time, it also may not. Nobody uses commemorative coins as currency.
Its like say comic books, you buy one for say 5 euro, the cover price will always be 5 euro, but if it is a special issue then the resale value will be whatever someone will pay for.

I've been given commemorative coins as a change at shops several times, I have plenty of them at home.
According to wikipedia, commemorative coins can be normally used as currency with their face value, unless they are made with more precious metals (so they are collectible), which is not the case of this coin.
Anyway, this is OT, sorry.

EyesClosed · 01-07-2021 3:07pm

Irish Stones wrote: »

I've been given commemorative coins as a change at shops several times, I have plenty of them at home.
According to wikipedia, commemorative coins can be normally used as currency with their face value, unless they are made with more precious metals (so they are collectible), which is not the case of this coin.
Anyway, this is OT, sorry.

Anything is collectable, thanks for missing my point

Seanergy · 03-07-2021 12:11am

Efficacy of Portable Air Cleaners and Masking for Reducing Indoor Exposure to Simulated Exhaled SARS-CoV-2 Aerosols — United States, 2021

A simulated infected meeting participant who was exhaling aerosols was placed in a room with two simulated uninfected participants and a simulated uninfected speaker. Using two HEPA air cleaners close to the aerosol source reduced the aerosol exposure of the uninfected participants and speaker by up to 65%. A combination of HEPA air cleaners and universal masking reduced exposure by up to 90%.

The face masks used on the headforms were three-ply cotton cloth face masks with ear loops (Defender, HanesBrands Inc.). Experiments were conducted either with all simulators unmasked or all simulators masked (universal masking).

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7027e1.htm

Seanergy · 03-07-2021 1:59pm

NSW not messing around when it comes to masking, with approx 50 mask fines being issued daily in the past week, not to mention that all HCW's must now don P2/N95 as a precaution.

Gael23 · 03-07-2021 3:10pm

When can we expect to see an end to mandatory mask wearing?

odyssey06 · 03-07-2021 4:24pm

Gael23 wrote: »

When can we expect to see an end to mandatory mask wearing?

Nothing's going to happen with it until every adult who wants to be fully vaccinated is done.
Then it'll come down to case count and what variants of concern there are.
Israel lifted their indoor mask mandates and then restored them cos of the delta variant.
They might be with us in shops and public transport until next spring.

VG31 · 03-07-2021 5:27pm

odyssey06 wrote: »

Nothing's going to happen with it until every adult who wants to be fully vaccinated is done.
Then it'll come down to case count and what variants of concern there are.
Israel lifted their indoor mask mandates and then restored them cos of the delta variant.
They might be with us in shops and public transport until next spring.

What's going to change next spring?

odyssey06 · 03-07-2021 5:31pm

VG31 wrote: »

What's going to change next spring?

We'll be through the typical season for respiratory viruses, and we hopefully will have enough people vaccinated & boosted and no breakthrough variants will have emerged... to be at herd immunity.

Acosta · 03-07-2021 6:10pm

What's with kids not having to wear masks in shops? I was just in a centra where there was 5 other adults plus 3 staff working all wearing masks. There was 9 unsupervised maskless kids running around the place running into people. I know they're not obliged to wear them, I just don't get the logic behind it.

VG31 · 03-07-2021 6:25pm

odyssey06 wrote: »

We'll be through the typical season for respiratory viruses, and we hopefully will have enough people vaccinated & boosted and no breakthrough variants will have emerged... to be at herd immunity.

Everyone here who wants a vaccine should be fully vaccinated by the end of September. There's no evidence to suggest that boosters are needed any time soon. Other European countries have started phasing out masks or have removed them completely (Iceland). They will be probably be no longer mandatory in the UK soon.

Waiting until next spring just seems pointless to me. By September or October we should be removing masks and social distancing rules. We do seem to be making a habit of being the last in Europe lately though...

odyssey06 · 03-07-2021 6:34pm

VG31 wrote: »

Everyone here who wants a vaccine should be fully vaccinated by the end of September. There's no evidence to suggest that boosters are needed any time soon. Other European countries have started phasing out masks or have removed them completely (Iceland). They will be probably be no longer mandatory in the UK soon.

Waiting until next spring just seems pointless to me. By September or October we should be removing masks and social distancing rules. We do seem to be making a habit of being the last in Europe lately though...

Yes, well when we are out of line with our EU peers - whether that's in slow adoption of masks, or travel certs - it raises doubts for me.

I mentioned those as the two 'stage gates' I could see mask mandates being reviewed.

It's a fluid situation and a lot will depend on the state of play with cases, variants, vaccines, hospitalisations and the response of other countries at those stage gates.

To Mask or not to two - Mask Megathread cont.

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