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Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

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    #3392
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Felexicon wrote: »
    Well I know of one that will pay for the duration of works undertaken. That includes travel.

    Cool. I knew of one for sure too and I heard of others but that was only anecdotal proof, I have none that they will pay for the labour too.

    It kinda refutes what this poster stated :
    Risteard81 wrote: »
    The manufacturer will only replace the faulty goods. They absolutely won't pay for the time involved in removing and replacing it. This is allowed for with markup.


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    #3393
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Looking for some help re home charger. I am moving from a plug in hybrid to a full electric and have used a basic rolec charger, I am installing a new charger which has dynamic load management(blackout protection) and i need a current transformer for it.I have no idea what blackout protection is or type of transformer to source.charger is a basic 7.4 kw.Apologies in advance for my lack of knowledge.


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    #3394
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Looking for some help re home charger. I am moving from a plug in hybrid to a full electric and have used a basic rolec charger, I am installing a new charger which has dynamic load management(blackout protection) and i need a current transformer for it.I have no idea what blackout protection is or type of transformer to source.charger is a basic 7.4 kw.Apologies in advance for my lack of knowledge.

    Have you had an electrician take a look?
    What Rolec charger are you coming from?
    What chargers are you replacing it with?

    So you need the dynamic load balancing?


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    #3395
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Gumbo wrote: »
    Have you had an electrician take a look?
    What Rolec charger are you coming from?
    What chargers are you replacing it with?

    So you need the dynamic load balancing?

    Hi Gumbo ROLEC 32 AMP single phase,bought the ELLI charger i read about on boards it has dynamic loading but dont know until i speak to electrician if i need it.Moving from a porsche panamera hybrid to the new rear wheel drive porsche Taycan with the smaller battery.


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    #3396
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,838 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Hi Gumbo ROLEC 32 AMP single phase,bought the ELLI charger i read about on boards it has dynamic loading but dont know until i speak to electrician if i need it.Moving from a porsche panamera hybrid to the new rear wheel drive porsche Taycan with the smaller battery.

    I would of just stuck with the 32A Rolec, they're not the greatest in the world, but you didn't really need to upgrade that charger for the new car, after all "if it ain't broke, don't fix it!"


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    #3397
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Looking for some help re home charger. I am moving from a plug in hybrid to a full electric and have used a basic rolec charger, I am installing a new charger which has dynamic load management(blackout protection) and i need a current transformer for it.I have no idea what blackout protection is or type of transformer to source.charger is a basic 7.4 kw.Apologies in advance for my lack of knowledge.
    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Hi Gumbo ROLEC 32 AMP single phase,bought the ELLI charger i read about on boards it has dynamic loading but dont know until i speak to electrician if i need it.Moving from a porsche panamera hybrid to the new rear wheel drive porsche Taycan with the smaller battery.

    Ok, but why the reason to change the charger?

    You cannot draw any more than 32a with the new charger.
    Now, if you need load balancing for some reason (shower/heat pump) etc that’s fair enough but then you would have needed it for the Rolec too.


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    #3398
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Gumbo wrote: »
    Ok, but why the reason to change the charger?

    You cannot draw any more than 32a with the new charger.
    Now, if you need load balancing for some reason (shower/heat pump) etc that’s fair enough but then you would have needed it for the Rolec too.
    The Rolec is working fine but i have it 3 years and thought with the much bigger battery which will take nine to ten hours to charge overnight it might be better to change it.Not a clue if i need load balancing but have 4 electric showers in my home.


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    #3399
    graememk
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,901 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    The Rolec is working fine but i have it 3 years and thought with the much bigger battery which will take nine to ten hours to charge overnight it might be better to change it.Not a clue if i need load balancing but have 4 electric showers in my home.

    Unless you have three phase power in your house (which is very uncommon)

    The fastest you can charge at is 32amps, or 7kW

    Changing the charge point will not speed up the charging.

    You don't need to change your charge point.


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    #3400
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    graememk wrote: »
    Unless you have three phase power in your house (which is very uncommon)

    The fastest you can charge at is 32amps, or 7kW

    Changing the charge point will not speed up the charging.

    You don't need to change your charge point.

    Thank you, single phase, yes i know it will not charge any faster,my hybrid with a
    14 kw battery charged in roughly two hours,i will now charge for 10 hours overnight so thought it might be better to get new charger.Was really wondering about the dynamic loading aspect.


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    #3401
    KCross
    Registered Users Posts: 12,094 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Thank you, single phase, yes i know it will not charge any faster,my hybrid with a
    14 kw battery charged in roughly two hours,i will now charge for 10 hours overnight so thought it might be better to get new charger.Was really wondering about the dynamic loading aspect.

    Based on what you’ve described earlier, the working assumption has to be that your 32A Rolec is installed with your existing showers already designed in.

    Switching it out for another 32A charge point will make no difference to you regardless of whether the new one has load management or not.

    I’d guess you already have a priority switch and that will continue to operate as it is with the new charge point.

    Having said that, you could get a new charge point with load management and remove the priority switch and it would be a better solution but the point is that you don’t need to. The Rolec will do fine.


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    #3402
    Felexicon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Thank you, single phase, yes i know it will not charge any faster,my hybrid with a
    14 kw battery charged in roughly two hours,i will now charge for 10 hours overnight so thought it might be better to get new charger.Was really wondering about the dynamic loading aspect.

    Again, there are specific CTs that work with the Elli charger and the type you use will dictate the configuration of the dip switches. The compatible CTs are listed in the manual if you already have the charger.


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    #3403
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Thank you, single phase, yes i know it will not charge any faster,my hybrid with a
    14 kw battery charged in roughly two hours,i will now charge for 10 hours overnight so thought it might be better to get new charger.Was really wondering about the dynamic loading aspect.

    There’s no need to do anything here. If your 14 kWh PHEV charges in 2 hours then it was pulling 7kw. What PHEV was it?


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    #3404
    Felexicon
    Registered Users Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭Felexicon


    Gumbo wrote: »
    There’s no need to do anything here. If your 14 kWh PHEV charges in 2 hours then it was pulling 7kw. What PHEV was it?

    Porsche Panamera

    Mentioned in an earlier post


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    #3405
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Felexicon wrote: »
    Porsche Panamera

    Mentioned in an earlier post

    Yes Panamera 4E Hybrid,moving to a Taycan with the smaller 79 kw battery.


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    #3406
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    Yes Panamera 4E Hybrid,moving to a Taycan with the smaller 79 kw battery.

    Enjoy.

    79 kWh ;)


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    #3407
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Gumbo wrote: »
    Enjoy.

    79 kWh ;)
    Thank you,considering i only have 29000 kilometres on the Panamera in 37 months,and the smaller battery on the Taycan should average 320 kilometres
    over the summer months when most of my driving is done it should be ok.


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    #3408
    Risteard81
    Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    Gumbo wrote: »
    Fair enough point but another poster/installer stated categorically that no EVSE suppliers will pay for warranty repairs.
    Firstly, I wasn't referring to EVSE suppliers but one of the reasons for markups in general. I did not categorically state that no-one pays anything towards the replacement - quite obviously my point was that the only legal obligation on the supplier is to repair or replace the faulty part. There is no obligation on them to cover the labour cost, and the overwhelming majority don't. As pointed out, those that do don't actually cover the cost of labour. You have a strange concept of what labour costs if you think that this would come close to covering it.


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    #3409
    Risteard81
    Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    Sam W wrote: »
    There’s also a tax obligation to report service charge and material charge separately. It’s absolutely not fine to inflate the material charges as that part of VAT is not liable to the service provider. In essence this is tax evasion.

    Plus I would definitely be pissed if I see a simple equipment being inflated for 10 times the charges.
    The Revenue Commissioners don't agree with you.

    In fact you don't have to list them separately either. What you must do is ensure that if the parts cost exceeds two-thirds of the total parts and labour costs then the Standard rate of VAT (23%) is applied to the entire sale, otherwise the Reduced rate for Services (13.5%) applies to the lot. I'm not sure what you're on about it going to the service provider either - all VAT liabilities go to Revenue.


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    #3410
    slave1
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,798 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Risteard81 wrote: »
    The manufacturer will only replace the faulty goods. They absolutely won't pay for the time involved in removing and replacing it...
    Risteard81 wrote: »
    .... There is no obligation on them to cover the labour cost, and the overwhelming majority don't. As pointed out, those that do don't actually cover the cost of labour. You have a strange concept of what labour costs if you think that this would come close to covering it.

    I think you are missing the point being raised.
    The first quote is that a manufacturer “absolutely won’t pay for the time involved”.
    MyEnergi do pay, so that first post is incorrect.

    Your further posts surmise that those companies that do pay for labour costs e.g. MyEnergi, don’t cover the entire labour costs.
    No one said they that they do, all that was being pointed out is that the first post is incorrect.

    BTW, I had a faulty EDDI unit replaced, straight swap and labour time was just over 10 minutes, £75 for 10 minutes

    My stuff for sale on Adverts inc. outdoor furniture, roof box and EDDI

    My Active Ads (adverts.ie)



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    #3411
    Risteard81
    Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    slave1 wrote: »
    I think you are missing the point being raised.
    The first quote is that a manufacturer “absolutely won’t pay for the time involved”.
    MyEnergi do pay, so that first post is incorrect.

    Your further posts surmise that those companies that do pay for labour costs e.g. MyEnergi, don’t cover the entire labour costs.
    No one said they that they do, all that was being pointed out is that the first post is incorrect.

    BTW, I had a faulty EDDI unit replaced, straight swap and labour time was just over 10 minutes, £75 for 10 minutes

    It's not 10 minutes. I had to do a 150 mile round trip to replace a faulty cover unit where the Bluetooth wasn't working on an EVSE. In other words it took half a day plus Diesel (for free).


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    #3412
    Kramer
    Registered Users Posts: 3,224 ✭✭✭Kramer


    slave1 wrote: »
    BTW, I had a faulty EDDI unit replaced, straight swap and labour time was just over 10 minutes
    Risteard81 wrote: »
    It's not 10 minutes.

    Not sure who is more credible here, the actual person who had the unit replaced, or Risteard81.
    Now, if Risteard81 was the actual electrician who swapped out slave1's unit & slave1 says it took 10 minutes, but Risteard81 said otherwise.............:confused:

    :D.
    Risteard81 wrote: »
    I had to do a 150 mile round trip to replace a faulty cover unit where the Bluetooth wasn't working on an EVSE. In other words it took half a day plus Diesel (for free).

    So would you habitually add enough markup then to cover a half day & tank of diesel, lest a unit fail, under warranty?
    I could see how a 1000% markup could be justified then, by that logic :D.


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    #3413
    Risteard81
    Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    Kramer wrote: »
    Not sure who is more credible here, the actual person who had the unit replaced, or Risteard81.
    Now, if Risteard81 was the actual electrician who swapped out slave1's unit & slave1 says it took 10 minutes, but Risteard81 said otherwise.............:confused:

    :D.



    So would you habitually add enough markup then to cover a half day & tank of diesel, lest a unit fail, under warranty?
    I could see how a 1000% markup could be justified then, by that logic :D.

    We don't have to do warranty revisits on the overwhelming majority of jobs obviously. What was worse was that the faulty component wasn't even supplied by us but by the customer's energy provider so we really should have invoiced for it.


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    #3414
    Alkers
    Registered Users Posts: 6,819 ✭✭✭Alkers


    If you move house can you get the grant again with the same car?


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    #3415
    Gumbo
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,634 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Alkers wrote: »
    If you move house can you get the grant again with the same car?

    Yes. I’ve done it.
    The restriction is the MPRN. So leave the old charger in place as the new bone owner cannot avail of the rent in the future.


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    #3416
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,838 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Risteard81 wrote: »
    We don't have to do warranty revisits on the overwhelming majority of jobs obviously. What was worse was that the faulty component wasn't even supplied by us but by the customer's energy provider so we really should have invoiced for it.

    Sounds like you have a pretty bad deal with the manufacturer who's using you to service the warranty, seems a bit unfair for your customers to pay extra for the service to the manufacturer.

    I've seen other trades where the warranty only covers labour for the first 12 months, after 12 months the parts are covered but the labour isn't.


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    #3417
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Gumbo wrote: »
    Yes. I’ve done it.
    The restriction is the MPRN. So leave the old charger in place as the new bone owner cannot avail of the rent in the future.
    I thought you would also need the car registered in some other persons name,in other words you can not avail of grant twice irrespective of MPRN.


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    #3418
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,866 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    lukas8888 wrote: »
    I thought you would also need the car registered in some other persons name,in other words you can not avail of grant twice irrespective of MPRN.

    i dont think so, as long as the car is registered to the address of the MRPN its grand.

    BTW when you get the taycan would you start a thread on it in the ev forum? itll be that or the Etron gt for me next (currently have the etron SUV)

    cheers :)


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    #3419
    Risteard81
    Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    liamog wrote: »
    Sounds like you have a pretty bad deal with the manufacturer who's using you to service the warranty, seems a bit unfair for your customers to pay extra for the service to the manufacturer.

    I've seen other trades where the warranty only covers labour for the first 12 months, after 12 months the parts are covered but the labour isn't.

    The problem is that EVSE installations done under the OLEV grant require three years' warranty to be provided on the equipment. For this reason it's likely that we will have to refuse to fit an EVSE not supplied by us where the customer is availing of the OLEV grant.


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    #3420
    liamog
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 7,838 Mod ✭✭✭✭liamog


    Risteard81 wrote: »
    The problem is that EVSE installations done under the OLEV grant require three years' warranty to be provided on the equipment. For this reason it's likely that we will have to refuse to fit an EVSE not supplied by us where the customer is availing of the OLEV grant.

    Is that an equipment warranty or an installation warranty? Still seems like your customers are getting a bum deal because of the costs to you of providing warranty labour services. Would be interesting to see how it differs in the 26.


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    #3421
    lukas8888
    Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭lukas8888


    Cyrus wrote: »
    i dont think so, as long as the car is registered to the address of the MRPN its grand.

    BTW when you get the taycan would you start a thread on it in the ev forum? itll be that or the Etron gt for me next (currently have the etron SUV)

    cheers :)
    Will do,
    Ordered two weeks ago,will probably not arrive until June so i will wait until July
    to take it for new reg plate.


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