Post primary return to schools roadmap

snor · 14-08-2020 9:05am

How is recruitment going in your school? We’ve had a lot of retirements and sick leaves so lots of posts to be filled.

rainbowtrout · 14-08-2020 9:08am

snor wrote: »

How is recruitment going in your school? We’ve had a lot of retirements and sick leaves so lots of posts to be filled.

We needed 14 new teachers this year. I believe we are still short 4 or 5

snor · 14-08-2020 9:13am

rainbowtrout wrote: »

We needed 14 new teachers this year. I believe we are still short 4 or 5

I’d say it’s the same in our school - and the shortage in all the usual subjects. Be interesting to see If there is capacity there to fill all positions.

Postgrad10 · 14-08-2020 9:25am

Anyone else frightened of the leaving cert results. They made a right mess of it in England. I’m guessing we’ll be no different.

wirelessdude01 · 14-08-2020 9:26am

snor wrote: »

I’d say it’s the same in our school - and the shortage in all the usual subjects. Be interesting to see If there is capacity there to fill all positions.

But but but, Norma, teaching council registry, 2000, implied they were just waiting to be employed ðŸ˜‚

Treppen · 14-08-2020 11:45am

Postgrad10 wrote: »

Anyone else frightened of the leaving cert results. They made a right mess of it in England. I’m guessing we’ll be no different.

Of course there are going to be downgrades.
If the department were smart they'd do nothing to the grades and leave the CAO lottery system sort out the oversubscribed courses.

Thank the Dr Ciara Kelly and Joe Duffy for the predicted grades anyway . "We need to give the students certainty" they said.

So what now?
Get results.
Appeal?
Repeat in 2 months?
Cram revision in 2 months?
No support from teachers as you are no longer a pupil in that school.
Will the paper be modified?
Get results from that.
Appeal?
Await CAO along with the 2021 LC?
Is it fair to be competing with the 2021 LC group?
Maybe try to sit the 2021 June LC?

Well that sure made things certain Dr. ,

As a 2020 6th year you would want to have some mental resolve to be up to that craic.

Which is why I reckon a lot of 2020 LC will accept whatever they get and go to college . But of course all those students don't make for good headline hysteria. Cue more petitions and Joe Duffy and Dr Ciara preaching to the teachers blaming the unions.

wirelessdude01 · 14-08-2020 11:56am

Treppen wrote: »

Dr Ciara preaching to the teachers blaming the unions.

One good thing about her move to the breakfast show is that she won't be able to dictate like she did previously.

pandoraj09 · 14-08-2020 12:26pm

My voice amplifier arrived. Its the one recommended by Mirrorwall in an earlier post. Great gadget altogether. I'm not at all techy but just practising using it while wearing a facemask I got used to it very quickly.

Treppen · 14-08-2020 1:13pm

Our department of ed. plans show 3 classes in the PE hall. Ah well at least the department are true to form, pack them in and stack em high. Same as it ever was.

Treppen · 14-08-2020 1:24pm

Has any teaching staff on here been consulted , especially practical subjects? I get the feeling it's see,speel and hear no evil.

The longer the silence the more I'm reluctant to plan anything and the more I'm sure that it'll just be long days of supervision, crowd control and study. With us expected to do the digital teaching when we get home.

combat14 · 14-08-2020 2:07pm

going to be some fun trying to teach practical subjects next year when not allowed within 2m of students

r93kaey5p2izun · 14-08-2020 2:20pm

What I have heard from a friend is that her school will be keeping 1st and TY in base classes in the same room for everything. 2nd will only mix for their 3 options. 3rd, 5th, 6th will mix as normal. But each year group will be given its own area of the building and there will be no access to labs or practical rooms for at least September. All but one or two rooms are too small for social distancing so it will be masks all day more or less. 6th Year area will be the sports hall which is a separate building. No lockers for anyone. No trips , events or activities allowed. Teachers are to have everything stored in the school hall. No mention of how the FE college which uses the same building and teachers will be operating.

Bananaleaf · 14-08-2020 2:20pm

Spoke with my principal today. The conversation was a bit weird. While we are speaking of 'bubbles', he has been working so hard trying to implement the roadmap in school that I don't think he has listened to a single news report or radio talk show in weeks. I was taken aback by how little he seemed to understand of the public reaction to the roadmap and some of the questions he was asking me about what people "on the outside" were thinking/saying was a little bit shocking.

wirelessdude01 · 14-08-2020 2:26pm

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Spoke with my principal today. The conversation was a bit weird. While we are speaking of 'bubbles', he has been working so hard trying to implement the roadmap in school that I don't think he has listened to a single news report or radio talk show in weeks. I was taken aback by how little he seemed to understand of the public reaction to the roadmap and some of the questions he was asking me about what people "on the outside" were thinking/saying was a little bit shocking.

Sounds like he was/is in his own 'bubble'.

Alex86Eire · 14-08-2020 2:52pm

Treppen wrote: »

Has any teaching staff on here been consulted , especially practical subjects? I get the feeling it's see,speel and hear no evil.

The longer the silence the more I'm reluctant to plan anything and the more I'm sure that it'll just be long days of supervision, crowd control and study. With us expected to do the digital teaching when we get home.

No practical work in my school. Teacher demos only for science anyway.

Bananaleaf · 14-08-2020 2:58pm

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Sounds like he was/is in his own 'bubble'.

Very much so. Not good

am_zarathustra · 14-08-2020 4:01pm

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

It’s impossible to physically correct everyone’s maths individually, you will burn out. It takes far longer to correct online than in the copy. What I did was record the full solutions for the homework in video. The first part of the each virtual class was to use the video to correct any questions that went wrong. They had to upload their work so I could see they wrote out the solution/fixed their work. Then I recorded the demonstration for whatever we were doing that day. They could watch/rewatch it. And then set them questions to do. Rarely I used someone else’s YouTube video for demonstrations but I found it never quite worked as well-they are used to me and my way of speaking/teaching. If they still couldn’t figure out a problem then they messaged me

It worked fairly well. Obviously not as good as a classroom by any stretch but it was ok. However it was incredibly time consuming to prep/record particularly without a proper whiteboard. I ended up preparing the document with screen shots of the problems then writing on that. But creating that document took time. So did the recording etc. There’s no way I could do it for three maths class groups on top of teaching a full timetable

Very similar to my own approach, I suspended my phone above a white board or page, they could see the board and here my voice. For standard correcting this works really well but for HL maths I'd need to be giving them proper grades so they know where they are, it's so time consuming...I'm more thinking about Christmas exams...mocks etc. We do Autumn exams for the exam classes so it's not that far away, although Lord knows if they will even be still in school

djemba djemba · 14-08-2020 4:29pm

snor wrote: »

How is recruitment going in your school? We’ve had a lot of retirements and sick leaves so lots of posts to be filled.

We have at least 5 new teachers and a few set for retirement in October.

It is going to be so hard for new teachers in schools to assimilate this year ahead. It can be hard enough to get to know people under normal circumstances but this year ahead. I suppose teachers already in the school will need to make a bigger effort.

mirrorwall14 · 14-08-2020 4:55pm

djemba djemba wrote: »

We have at least 5 new teachers and a few set for retirement in October.

It is going to be so hard for new teachers in schools to assimilate this year ahead. It can be hard enough to get to know people under normal circumstances but this year ahead. I suppose teachers already in the school will need to make a bigger effort.

To be honest the shy student still in me is intimidated enough at the staggered break times meaning I’m at the mercy of socialising only who is free at my slots. I can’t imagine trying to start in a school like ours this year. We had a staff meeting today. There are going to be four different versions of the timetable for different year groups with three different break and lunch times

ethical · 14-08-2020 5:27pm

The poor old teacher...the gift that keeps on giving and giving and giving!

No break since 12th March,working from c8.00 am,home schooling also,finishing at 12.00 midnight,filling in stupid forms for a non trusting ETB,meetings in June and regular meetings now in August online and requests everyday to help out with supervision and staying with base class until next teacher arrives (only if you have a free next yourself....very cost neutral!),mention of FCUKIN CP hours,(we have ours done virtually,no pun intended!),where does it all end ? Some Principals acting like the total bufoons that they are,not willing to stand up and react,take the money and run so to speak,(I have every respect for the poor voluntary secondary school Principal as its a lonely job),the other shower (etb)have nothing effin else to do other than annoy their teachers at every opportunity to make themselves look good at their Zoom meeting and do not mention the non appearance of certain Golden Circle staff at the present online staff meetings for the Plebs!
The Unions are quiet and possibly rightly so ,the parents are stirring it up as is (Taoiseach) Leo and Norma ,poor Norma ,what can you say,thrown in to a river of Piranhas and dosent even recognise what they are or where she is but sure the pension is good.
For Gods sake will someone stand up and tell the Media what actually happens in school and what will happen in school in the nexy few weeks,a teacher preferably,because as it is we are going nowhere without listening to the frontline workers.Maybe Leo is right ,maybe we are heading for Herd Immunity .....if this is the case perhaps everyone will be back in their offices,and the DÁIL will be back in the DÁIL the week after the schools open and we will all live happily every after.

pandoraj09 · 14-08-2020 6:50pm

Query regarding this LWR position,the one that you get 2 hours a week off for. I've zero interest in it. We got an email from management earlier saying if nobody expressed an interest in the job that it would be allocated to one of the AP1s. I'm the most senior teacher in my school and an AP1 so I'd say it won't be long before they come knocking on my door. I won't be agreeing to do it, but it would be unfortunate to have to argue my case before the school year has even begun. Can people share whats happening in their school with this position ie if nobody applies for it? Thanks in advance

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 14-08-2020 7:31pm

pandoraj09 wrote: »

Query regarding this LWR position,the one that you get 2 hours a week off for. I've zero interest in it. We got an email from management earlier saying if nobody expressed an interest in the job that it would be allocated to one of the AP1s. I'm the most senior teacher in my school and an AP1 so I'd say it won't be long before they come knocking on my door. I won't be agreeing to do it, but it would be unfortunate to have to argue my case before the school year has even begun. Can people share whats happening in their school with this position ie if nobody applies for it? Thanks in advance

We had no applicant but one person was talked into it.

They can't make you do it so stand your ground

SligoBrewer · 14-08-2020 8:05pm

It's important that a strong person does it in every school.

am_zarathustra · 14-08-2020 8:41pm

pandoraj09 wrote: »

Query regarding this LWR position,the one that you get 2 hours a week off for. I've zero interest in it. We got an email from management earlier saying if nobody expressed an interest in the job that it would be allocated to one of the AP1s. I'm the most senior teacher in my school and an AP1 so I'd say it won't be long before they come knocking on my door. I won't be agreeing to do it, but it would be unfortunate to have to argue my case before the school year has even begun. Can people share whats happening in their school with this position ie if nobody applies for it? Thanks in advance

Jesus, I hope this isn't true

rainbowtrout · 14-08-2020 9:37pm

pandoraj09 wrote: »

Query regarding this LWR position,the one that you get 2 hours a week off for. I've zero interest in it. We got an email from management earlier saying if nobody expressed an interest in the job that it would be allocated to one of the AP1s. I'm the most senior teacher in my school and an AP1 so I'd say it won't be long before they come knocking on my door. I won't be agreeing to do it, but it would be unfortunate to have to argue my case before the school year has even begun. Can people share whats happening in their school with this position ie if nobody applies for it? Thanks in advance

Principal sent out a half assed email with half the details missing about two weeks ago. A week later he sent out the proper template one that was in the guidelines. About four hours later he said that a particular member of staff was appointed on a 'first to reply' basis. So if there was genuine interest no one got a chance. It also prevents a teacher vote on the matter. You can draw your own conclusions from that.

The covid aide was not offered to staff at all. Two of our LCs are in doing it. :rolleyes:

You can't be made do it. It's not an AP1 job.

LW2018 · 14-08-2020 9:40pm

pandoraj09 wrote: »

Query regarding this LWR position,the one that you get 2 hours a week off for. I've zero interest in it. We got an email from management earlier saying if nobody expressed an interest in the job that it would be allocated to one of the AP1s. I'm the most senior teacher in my school and an AP1 so I'd say it won't be long before they come knocking on my door. I won't be agreeing to do it, but it would be unfortunate to have to argue my case before the school year has even begun. Can people share whats happening in their school with this position ie if nobody applies for it? Thanks in advance

Under the new circular for leadership and management positions, doesn't there have to be a review of posts to re-evaluate the needs of the school and with whole staff input. If that already happened at the end of the school year then you shouldn't be directly asked just because you have an AP1 position. I'd say hold firm on it.

Has there been much interest in this role in many schools? Just the two who applied in our place so both got it

LW2018 · 14-08-2020 9:42pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Principal sent out a half assed email with half the details missing about two weeks ago. A week later he sent out the proper template one that was in the guidelines. About four hours later he said that a particular member of staff was appointed on a 'first to reply' basis. So if there was genuine interest no one got a chance. It also prevents a teacher vote on the matter. You can draw your own conclusions from that.

The covid aide was not offered to staff at all. Two of our LCs are in doing it. :rolleyes:

You can't be made do it. It's not an AP1 job.

Principals were told by the JMB to allow time for people to express interest - days not hours!! Big issue there from management

DubLad69 · 14-08-2020 10:15pm

pandoraj09 wrote: »

Query regarding this LWR position,the one that you get 2 hours a week off for. I've zero interest in it. We got an email from management earlier saying if nobody expressed an interest in the job that it would be allocated to one of the AP1s. I'm the most senior teacher in my school and an AP1 so I'd say it won't be long before they come knocking on my door. I won't be agreeing to do it, but it would be unfortunate to have to argue my case before the school year has even begun. Can people share whats happening in their school with this position ie if nobody applies for it? Thanks in advance

The position is a worker Rep, as a person who has an AP position you are now in middle management. I would not think that its appropriate for those in middle management to be taking the LWR position.

am_zarathustra · 14-08-2020 10:31pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Principal sent out a half assed email with half the details missing about two weeks ago. A week later he sent out the proper template one that was in the guidelines. About four hours later he said that a particular member of staff was appointed on a 'first to reply' basis. So if there was genuine interest no one got a chance. It also prevents a teacher vote on the matter. You can draw your own conclusions from that.

The covid aide was not offered to staff at all. Two of our LCs are in doing it. :rolleyes:

You can't be made do it. It's not an AP1 job.

What? LC like leaving certs? That's insane

Between that and the LWR I'd have the union in, sounds like the principal is a cowboy

rainbowtrout · 14-08-2020 10:37pm

LW2018 wrote: »

Principals were told by the JMB to allow time for people to express interest - days not hours!! Big issue there from management

Oh I know. This is tip of the iceberg stuff.

rainbowtrout · 14-08-2020 10:38pm

am_zarathustra wrote: »

What? LC like leaving certs? That's insane

Between that and the LWR I'd have the union in, sounds like the principal is a cowboy

You're too kind. I can think of several other words I'd use.

Yes LC like leaving cert.

mirrorwall14 · 15-08-2020 9:11am

That’s insane....

On a different note. I photocopy a fill in workbook for music at the start of term to power through composing basics. I’m going to copy it now and leave it aside ready. But how do the hand them out? Wash my hands then put them on tables before they arrive?

I presume we can’t keep batches of students ziplock folders in the room anymore? I am getting to keep the music room (albeit with a lot less storage). I’m just thinking like if I just put a box for them to drop them into on the way out the door then set them aside. But again I’d need to put them on the tables for them coming in. Or hand them out as they come in? Maybe it’s just creating un-necessary problems for myself

Also I wonder is there any issue sellotaping laminated pages to the desks from a cleaning perspective? No word on lockers and instruments are an issue so I’m wondering if I can print, laminate and stick down a laminated keyboard to the desks themselves. It would be easier than handing them out. I’m going hell for leather into music theory and composing since instruments and performance are all up in the air

pandoraj09 · 15-08-2020 9:46am

LW2018 wrote: »

Under the new circular for leadership and management positions, doesn't there have to be a review of posts to re-evaluate the needs of the school and with whole staff input. If that already happened at the end of the school year then you shouldn't be directly asked just because you have an AP1 position. I'd say hold firm on it.

Has there been much interest in this role in many schools? Just the two who applied in our place so both got it

Apparently the review of posts is now held off until January. And BOMs coming to the end of their term will also be held off until then too.

scrubs33 · 15-08-2020 10:01am

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Oh I know. This is tip of the iceberg stuff.

I think I mentioned this before but we got an email to say who’s doing the LWR role a few weeks ago. A small minority going rogue in relation to appointments?

Treppen · 15-08-2020 10:15am

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

That’s insane....

On a different note. I photocopy a fill in workbook for music at the start of term to power through composing basics. I’m going to copy it now and leave it aside ready. But how do the hand them out? Wash my hands then put them on tables before they arrive?

Wrap in cling film now then hand it out with disposable gloves while you open it. Are you allowed go near students though? Maybe throw it at them.

pandoraj09 · 15-08-2020 10:27am

Treppen wrote: »

Wrap in cling film now then hand it out with disposable gloves while you open it. Are you allowed go near students though? Maybe throw it at them.

Laughing out loud at this!!!!

Leftwaffe · 15-08-2020 10:32am

Legitimate question, how are teachers going to handle corrections this year?

Particularly English teachers, seems they have a lot of correcting copies to do. They can't be collected up and the teacher can't take them home or elsewhere.to mark them.

Ill be doing mine online but I'm just curious.

rainbowtrout · 15-08-2020 10:33am

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

That’s insane....

On a different note. I photocopy a fill in workbook for music at the start of term to power through composing basics. I’m going to copy it now and leave it aside ready. But how do the hand them out? Wash my hands then put them on tables before they arrive?

I presume we can’t keep batches of students ziplock folders in the room anymore? I am getting to keep the music room (albeit with a lot less storage). I’m just thinking like if I just put a box for them to drop them into on the way out the door then set them aside. But again I’d need to put them on the tables for them coming in. Or hand them out as they come in? Maybe it’s just creating un-necessary problems for myself

Also I wonder is there any issue sellotaping laminated pages to the desks from a cleaning perspective? No word on lockers and instruments are an issue so I’m wondering if I can print, laminate and stick down a laminated keyboard to the desks themselves. It would be easier than handing them out. I’m going hell for leather into music theory and composing since instruments and performance are all up in the air

Put all the workbooks in a box and leave the box out on the first day. Tell them to take one on the way in.

Same with the ziplock folders. They take them and hand them back in as necessary.

Alex86Eire · 15-08-2020 10:37am

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Legitimate question, how are teachers going to handle corrections this year?

Particularly English teachers, seems they have a lot of correcting copies to do. They can't be collected up and the teacher can't take them home or elsewhere.to mark them.

Ill be doing mine online but I'm just curious.

They'll have to be done online I'd say. We can't collect anything from students so online seems to be the only option.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 15-08-2020 12:27pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Legitimate question, how are teachers going to handle corrections this year?

Particularly English teachers, seems they have a lot of correcting copies to do. They can't be collected up and the teacher can't take them home or elsewhere.to mark them.

Ill be doing mine online but I'm just curious.

Take a picture of the work and email it

am_zarathustra · 15-08-2020 12:36pm

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Legitimate question, how are teachers going to handle corrections this year?

Particularly English teachers, seems they have a lot of correcting copies to do. They can't be collected up and the teacher can't take them home or elsewhere.to mark them.

Ill be doing mine online but I'm just curious.

I have been thinking about this and I think the way I'm going to do it is, they have two copies and on a Friday they out one in a box in my room, by Monday they are safe for me to touch and I can correct them then. I might change the days depending on timetabling. My classes are well trained so hopefully they can do a bit of self correction too

We are also hopefully getting a couple of UV sterilising cabinets so that's an option too, maybe a mixture of both!

pandoraj09 · 15-08-2020 12:54pm

I teach two languages, neither of them English, and it's not possible, well for me anyway, to mark online. I need to put in accents, change verb endings, cross out stuff, change the order of sentences etc. If we had more training on online teaching and learning perhaps I'd be more competent in this area. I have a habit of circling "big" mistakes loads of times to make the correction stand out, and also putting in positive comments beside things they've written that I like. Maybe all of this is possible online??? I need training. We got 15 minutes on how to use Google drive on the afternoon of March 12th from one of the more "tecky" teachers.

am_zarathustra · 15-08-2020 1:03pm

There are a good few programmes that allow you to write with a stylus on a picture of work. My handwriting is appalling so a neat little box I can type in suits me but I can see why it wouldn't suit you! Have you looked at the small uv sterilizers? They are pretty good and not too expensive, libraries are beginning to use them but they have expensive industrial ones. There a little ones for around 50eu, might be worth the investment. Or mention buying a big one to the principal?

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 15-08-2020 1:18pm

I would just get a few students at random to email work, to make sure they did it, but I'd provide solution in class and they cud mark their own. Might not work for everyone

mtoutlemonde · 15-08-2020 1:34pm

pandoraj09 wrote: »

I teach two languages, neither of them English, and it's not possible, well for me anyway, to mark online. I need to put in accents, change verb endings, cross out stuff, change the order of sentences etc. If we had more training on online teaching and learning perhaps I'd be more competent in this area. I have a habit of circling "big" mistakes loads of times to make the correction stand out, and also putting in positive comments beside things they've written that I like. Maybe all of this is possible online??? I need training. We got 15 minutes on how to use Google drive on the afternoon of March 12th from one of the more "tecky" teachers.

As a language and tecky teacher, I loved using Google classroom but it did have it's misgivings. When a student submitted an assignment, when you opened it, you could correct the errors on screen and they appeared as green on the screen. Now I only did this for my junior classes as I would expect my seniors to have their accents in the correct place - they took a picture of that and I would correct it with notes in a response email e.g. line 1, agreement needed etc. I wanted them to write because Google classroom is linked to Google translate and it would correct the mistakes. One problem I had and I never found a solution to it was a student could decline your comment - it was a bit strange. I only noticed when one of my darlings went through every assignment, declined my correction and resubmitted the assignment. Google classroom also restricts access to assignments after a period of time.

The way I used Google classroom: I assigned a comprehension reading or listening, created a doc with a table for student answers. I made sure a file was set up for each student (Google classroom) allows you to do it. I wrote out the answers on a page and compared mine to the students. It was really quick. If we are back to blended learning this year, I will also be using Google forms for end of chapter tests, it is self correcting and you can put times on each question so they won't have time to check the book.

Also when you use Google classroom, a folder appears in your Google drive, called classroom. In it, your classes will have a specific folder and inside that your students will have an individual folder with all of their work.

It was daunting to begin with but it was great.

mirrorwall14 · 15-08-2020 2:09pm

If you are using google classroom with a tablet you can write freehand corrections on the screen onto photos of their work they submit. This is how I corrected music composition and maths tests. It’s slower than paper still but it’s better than typing. It auto creates a new copy of the image with your corrections on it and you can ‘Return’ the assignment to the student so they know it came in

Unfortunately you can’t do it this way on a laptop/desktop

mtoutlemonde · 15-08-2020 2:35pm

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

If you are using google classroom with a tablet you can write freehand corrections on the screen onto photos of their work they submit. This is how I corrected music composition and maths tests. It’s slower than paper still but it’s better than typing. It auto creates a new copy of the image with your corrections on it and you can ‘Return’ the assignment to the student so they know it came in

Unfortunately you can’t do it this way on a laptop/desktop

I presume with a stylus? Is there an all rounder? One that would work on all tablets?

combat14 · 15-08-2020 2:42pm

Interesting to see that we are still learning so much about this new virus - wonder what we will learn after schools and office workers and Dail return to work later this month...

Scientists say the coronavirus is at least as deadly as the 1918 flu pandemic

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2020/08/13/scientists-say-the-coronavirus-is-at-least-as-deadly-as-the-1918-flu-pandemic.html

mirrorwall14 · 15-08-2020 3:11pm

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

I presume with a stylus? Is there an all rounder? One that would work on all tablets?

You can do it with a finger. I used an Apple Pencil with my iPad Pro but I was the exception rather than the rule

mtoutlemonde · 15-08-2020 3:25pm

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

You can do it with a finger. I used an Apple Pencil with my iPad Pro but I was the exception rather than the rule

Your corrections looked 'too real' - using my finger would definitely not look the same

Another thing to look into!

Post primary return to schools roadmap

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