Crimes that have stayed with you for years

JohnnyFlash · 11-08-2020 12:09PM

The Paul Quinn murder resonated with me at the time. He was only 21. He was brought to a shed, and beaten to death by at least 10 men welding iron bars and nailed-studded clubs. They were wearing boiler suits, masks, and surgical gloves. A spike was driven through his face to end it all, after they had broken every bone in his body below his neck.

Edgware · 11-08-2020 12:13PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

This thread has made me realise how easy it is to forget crimes and horrendous ones at that.

But maybe that's what our minds do, because to keep them there would be awful also.

So sorry for all the families who lost loved ones in distressing circumstances, and those who cannot locate their loved ones either.

Its easy to remember incidents such as Darkley, Loughlinisland for the terrible atrocities but there were several others that dont get the same publicity. The Reavey and O Dowd family murders by Loyalists. The murder of three members of the Hanna family by the Provisionals when they blew up their car by mistake.
In the early 70s the Officials killed people by mistake as part of feuds with the Provos and later the I.N.L.A.

rob316 · 11-08-2020 12:24PM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

The Paul Quinn murder resonated with me at the time. He was only 21. He was brought to a shed, and beaten to death by at least 10 men welding iron bars and nailed-studded clubs. They were wearing boiler suits, masks, and surgical gloves. A spike was driven through his face to end it all, after they had broken every bone in his body below his neck.

Jesus ya the Paul Quinn murder was horrific. He was still alive for hours after before he died in hospital. It wasn't clean like a bullet to the head it was the most excruciating pain you can imagine. All because he punched some IRA honcho.

Muahahaha · 11-08-2020 12:28PM

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

The killing of that kid in Palmerstown in the early 70s. Was, allegedly, satanic elements to the crime.

Killer got a few years and the murder seemed to have been “swept under the carpet”. Again alleged, influence of religious orders in that.

I was literally about to post about that. It is one of the most bizarre murder cases in Ireland yet the vast, vast majority of people have never heard of it due to an alleged cover up by Opus Dei and the Catholic Church. It garnered almost no media attention at the time which given it is comparable to the James Bulger and Robert Holohan cases is pretty unbelievable. What little coveage the murder did get was described in the newspapers as "a tragic accident" rather than one child murdering another. It was like a massive sweeping under the carpet operation between the Catholic Church and the media.

For those not familiar in 1973 in Palmerstown a 16 year old boy called Lorcan Bale murdered his friend and neighbour 7 year John Horgan and crucified him is in his attic to carry out satanic rituals. In the attic Gardai found an alter, communionn chalices and the 7 year old victim strung up from the rafters. Both the parents of the murderer and victime were devout Catholics with heavy involvement in Opus Dei and the Legion of Mary. Lorcan Bale had also known a priest who gave him a book on Satanic rituals from where he got the idea to carry out the murder.

This is a long read on it but it is gripping reading, it is real WTF stuff

https://www.broadsheet.ie/2016/06/22/the-devil-is-in-the-detail/

There is also a book on the case called The Boy in the Attic by David Malone, would recommend it highly

Mad_maxx · 11-08-2020 12:41PM

Hangdogroad wrote: »

It was widely reported at the time that an attempt had been made to burn the body and O Donohoe admitted to it.

didn't know that?

J Madone · 11-08-2020 12:41PM

rob316 wrote: »

The sentence fit, it was tragic the whole thing. He was full of remorse and carries what he did with him for the rest of his life, nothing would of been gained locking him up any longer. He panicked and tried to get away with it but he handed himself in. I read the statement he made, it was just an accident, he even said "he picked up a knife and thought about slashing his own throat after he realized he killed Robert".

He made a huge mistake the way he tried to cover it up but he just killed his young neighbor. He panicked.

We will never know the full story, I certainly would not believe a word out of this guys mouth. He lied until he was about to be caught. He was not the victim as some people are trying to portray. Robert is the victim and I feel sorry for his family.

Mad_maxx · 11-08-2020 12:44PM

rob316 wrote: »

Jesus ya the Paul Quinn murder was horrific. He was still alive for hours after before he died in hospital. It wasn't clean like a bullet to the head it was the most excruciating pain you can imagine. All because he punched some IRA honcho.

he drove trucks of laundered diesel to make ends meet ( viewed as honest work in monaghan and south armagh) so no Saint certainly, got in a row with a local IRA chief or perhaps his son

A murder of barbaric savagery

Muahahaha · 11-08-2020 01:05PM

Padraig Mor wrote: »

A very common misconception (although I am not downplaying the Garda's persistence). A bizarrely little known facet of the case is that Dwyer was specifically identified to the Gardai as the likely killer shortly after O'Hara's body was found - around the time the final reservoir searches were taking place, Gardai were already quietly removing items from Dwyer's bin to obtain DNA samples. Looking at the case in total, it's clear the person who named Dwyer could be one of only two people - his wife or, far more likely, the 'secret witness' who had been having an ongoing S&M affair with Dwyer and knew of O'Hara and Dwyer (and even met her?).

yeah but whatever about Dwyer being a suspect the Garda who found the bag in the reservoir tried and failed to retrieve it on two separate occasions (I think on one of them he was even off duty). He got it on the third attempt and the contents within it cracked the entire case. I think it was just pure persistence of a regular Garda to find out what was in that bag, he wouldnt have known at the time it could be anything to do with Dwyer, its not like he was a detective, just a regualr copper. He could have easily just dismissed it as any bit of rubbish thrown into the reservoir but he didnt.

Who is the 'secret witness'? I remember at the time there was chatter that one of Dwyers S&M contacts was a female solicitor who was working for the DPP. The rumour was that Gardai found a tape of her having sex with Dwyer but the DPP held this evidence back to protect her career.

flasher0030 · 11-08-2020 01:39PM

Muahahaha wrote: »

yeah but whatever about Dwyer being a suspect the Garda who found the bag in the reservoir tried and failed to retrieve it on two separate occasions (I think on one of them he was even off duty). He got it on the third attempt and the contents within it cracked the entire case. I think it was just pure persistence of a regular Garda to find out what was in that bag, he wouldnt have known at the time it could be anything to do with Dwyer, its not like he was a detective, just a regualr copper. He could have easily just dismissed it as any bit of rubbish thrown into the reservoir but he didnt.

Who is the 'secret witness'? I remember at the time there was chatter that one of Dwyers S&M contacts was a female solicitor who was working for the DPP. The rumour was that Gardai found a tape of her having sex with Dwyer but the DPP held this evidence back to protect her career.

How did he know the bag was so relevant?

Muahahaha · 11-08-2020 01:48PM

flasher0030 wrote: »

How did he know the bag was so relevant?

Unless Im wrong I dont think he did at the time. I mean there was something like 12 months between Elaine o'Hara going missing and the bag being found. As a regular Garda in a different policing district Im sure he would have been aware of her disappearance but he wasnt a detective actively investigating it. When he tried to retrieve the bag I dont think he ever knew at the time it could all be connected, there had been no evidence of Dwyer being in that remote location in Wicklow.

It was just some kind of randomness between the water levels being low so the bag could be seen and the Garda being persisitant in getting it out of there. From Dwyers perspective he must be kicking himself in prison for not having got rid of the bag better than he did.

TCDStudent1 · 11-08-2020 01:56PM

Muahahaha wrote: »

yeah but whatever about Dwyer being a suspect the Garda who found the bag in the reservoir tried and failed to retrieve it on two separate occasions (I think on one of them he was even off duty). He got it on the third attempt and the contents within it cracked the entire case. I think it was just pure persistence of a regular Garda to find out what was in that bag, he wouldnt have known at the time it could be anything to do with Dwyer, its not like he was a detective, just a regualr copper. He could have easily just dismissed it as any bit of rubbish thrown into the reservoir but he didnt.

Who is the 'secret witness'? I remember at the time there was chatter that one of Dwyers S&M contacts was a female solicitor who was working for the DPP. The rumour was that Gardai found a tape of her having sex with Dwyer but the DPP held this evidence back to protect her career.

I didn't think that evidence was held back. I think it was not reported on in the media to protect her career as judge deemed it would have a detrimental effect on it. So her identity was protected.

There were other witnesses on that trial who used whatever website was discussed. Their identities were fully revealed in the media. Not sure if that was fair on them either.

Muahahaha · 11-08-2020 02:17PM

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

I didn't think that evidence was held back. I think it was not reported on in the media to protect her career as judge deemed it would have a detrimental effect on it. So her identity was protected.

There were other witnesses on that trial who used whatever website was discussed. Their identities were fully revealed in the media. Not sure if that was fair on them either.

yeah there was 3 men who had slept with Elaine o'Hara who had their private lives outed in the public court. iirc one was married so would guess that ended when his wife found out. I dont remember the exact details of what evidence the men gave other than to confirm she was active on a BDSM website, nothing they said was really crucial to the prosecution.

But I always found it unfair that the female solicitor who worked for the DPP and slept with Dwyer had her identity protected. The DPP had no problems outing the three men and turning their lives upside down but she got a level of protection that the men were not afforded. Not sure how the judge squares that circle but those men had careers and families too. Whats good for the goose should be good for the gander but it seems her position as a state solicitor allowed her an anonymity that the men were not afforded. That stinks to me.

Sultan of Bling · 11-08-2020 02:20PM

I wonder what people's opinions are on the Rachel O'Reilly case which has been mentioned a few times in the thread. A horrific crime.

The conviction of Joe O'Reilly has never sat right with me though.

IIRC it was the mobile phone evidence that ultimately got him convicted but there were no eye witnesses, no murder weapon found, no forensic evidence or any clear cctv evidence he was in the area at the time.

The only image they had was a blurry image of a car which "could have been his", according to police. The police also advised he had a shower in the house after he murdered her and drove back to his job in the Broadstone straight after yet his car was not picked up on any CCTV between his house and his workplace.

There was also endless articles in the papers before the trial about his affair. Other front page stories that appeared were a story about him getting new windows on the house and a front page story showing a photo of him with "a female companion", which turned out to be his sister.

I always wondered was it ever possible for him to get a fair trial by jury. Then there was the whole book of evidence being left in the jury room.

Am I right in thinking a juror was also dismissed for speaking to a reporter during the trial for saying that everyone knows he's guilty. (I cannot find anything on the Web about this so open to correction)

I'm not saying he is innocent or anything like that. I'm just wondering should he have been convicted at that time.

J Madone · 11-08-2020 02:29PM

flasher0030 wrote: »

How did he know the bag was so relevant?

A guy out for a walk spotted the bag and rang the gardai

cazzer22 · 11-08-2020 02:46PM

Definitely has to be Amy Lynn Bradley. She is a girl who went missing on a cruise ship, where she had been staying with her brother and her parents. The way it was handled and the subsequent sightings are just things that never leave you.

Hangdogroad · 11-08-2020 02:46PM

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

I wonder what people's opinions are on the Rachel O'Reilly case which has been mentioned a few times in the thread. A horrific crime.

The conviction of Joe O'Reilly has never sat right with me though.

IIRC it was the mobile phone evidence that ultimately got him convicted but there were no eye witnesses, no murder weapon found, no forensic evidence or any clear cctv evidence he was in the area at the time.

The only image they had was a blurry image of a car which "could have been his", according to police. The police also advised he had a shower in the house after he murdered her and drove back to his job in the Broadstone straight after yet his car was not picked up on any CCTV between his house and his workplace.

There was also endless articles in the papers before the trial about his affair. Other front page stories that appeared were a story about him getting new windows on the house and a front page story showing a photo of him with "a female companion", which turned out to be his sister.

I always wondered was it ever possible for him to get a fair trial by jury. Then there was the whole book of evidence being left in the jury room.

Am I right in thinking a juror was also dismissed for speaking to a reporter during the trial for saying that everyone knows he's guilty. (I cannot find anything on the Web about this so open to correction)

I'm not saying he is innocent or anything like that. I'm just wondering should he have been convicted at that time.

A workmate testified that he had initially given him a false alibi. Also he had a strong motive plus his odd behaviour and demeanour after the murder.that's just from my memory sure there was more.

Muahahaha · 11-08-2020 03:18PM

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

I wonder what people's opinions are on the Rachel O'Reilly case which has been mentioned a few times in the thread. A horrific crime.

The conviction of Joe O'Reilly has never sat right with me though.

IIRC it was the mobile phone evidence that ultimately got him convicted but there were no eye witnesses, no murder weapon found, no forensic evidence or any clear cctv evidence he was in the area at the time.

yeah his conviction didnt sit well for me either. Mainly because of the mobile phone mast evidence, it was said in court by the defence that the Gardai had obtained this unofficially from O2 at the time. Im pretty sure o'Reilly appealed it too but the judge wasnt allowing it despite it looking like it was evidence obtained either illegally or unofficially. It seemed like a matter of all involved saying ah sure he definitely did it so we will allow this. I think in other jurisdictions a mistrial would have been called.

For whats its worth I believe he is guilty as hell too but think the actual conviction is dubious.

Sweet.Science · 11-08-2020 03:32PM

Sultan of Bling wrote: »

I wonder what people's opinions are on the Rachel O'Reilly case which has been mentioned a few times in the thread. A horrific crime.

The conviction of Joe O'Reilly has never sat right with me though.

IIRC it was the mobile phone evidence that ultimately got him convicted but there were no eye witnesses, no murder weapon found, no forensic evidence or any clear cctv evidence he was in the area at the time.

The only image they had was a blurry image of a car which "could have been his", according to police. The police also advised he had a shower in the house after he murdered her and drove back to his job in the Broadstone straight after yet his car was not picked up on any CCTV between his house and his workplace.

There was also endless articles in the papers before the trial about his affair. Other front page stories that appeared were a story about him getting new windows on the house and a front page story showing a photo of him with "a female companion", which turned out to be his sister.

I always wondered was it ever possible for him to get a fair trial by jury. Then there was the whole book of evidence being left in the jury room.

Am I right in thinking a juror was also dismissed for speaking to a reporter during the trial for saying that everyone knows he's guilty. (I cannot find anything on the Web about this so open to correction)

I'm not saying he is innocent or anything like that. I'm just wondering should he have been convicted at that time.

Hello Mr O'Reilly

freshpopcorn · 11-08-2020 03:42PM

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Don't remember that one at all. Perhaps because of 9 11 as suggested by another poster. This link gives details on what happened the student:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/child-killers-lover-brutalised-in-jail-says-her-father-26007701.html

It happened in about the last week in August. So, it would have been out of the news by 9/11.
It was spoken a lot around me because of where the father worked. Everybody said at the time he had lots of help from people he knew.

TCDStudent1 · 11-08-2020 03:49PM

freshpopcorn wrote: »

It happened in about the last week in August. So, it would have been out of the news by 9/11.
It was spoken a lot around me because of where the father worked. Everybody said at the time he had lots of help from people he knew.

Yeah, read a few articles about it earlier. Sounds like he had a bit of help alright. Some guy with a beard called Alan used to pay the rent and the owners didn't know anything about him.

From what I gather, the guards actually managed to locate him, went to the house, left and were coming back again. That's when he committed the crime. If the guards had actually entered the house when they first arrived, the girl would probably have been saved. Have I got that right?

Muahahaha · 11-08-2020 03:56PM

freshpopcorn wrote: »

It happened in about the last week in August. So, it would have been out of the news by 9/11.
It was spoken a lot around me because of where the father worked. Everybody said at the time he had lots of help from people he knew.

Right up until 9/11 happened the main global story at the time was the one up in Belfast where unionists were shouting abuse at Catholic children who were walking through 'their' area on their way to school. It had been going on for weeks and in early September that year international TV camera crews flew in to Belfast to cover the story. I remember CNN covered it and broadcast the hatred of Catholics by Unionists back to America. Everyone was shocked that you had grown women shouting hateful sectarian abuse at children and it had become a global story that all the big news agencies were covering.

Then the two planes went into the twin towers and the media all decamped out of Belfast to cover that story instead. News from Belfast literally vanished over night as the world was gripped about what happened in New York.

take everything · 11-08-2020 04:09PM

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

The killing of that kid in Palmerstown in the early 70s. Was, allegedly, satanic elements to the crime.

Killer got a few years and the murder seemed to have been “swept under the carpet”. Again alleged, influence of religious orders in that.

That guy lives in London IIRC and is an prominent member of his church.

I bet he is

Bizarre.

Gregor Samsa · 11-08-2020 04:13PM

Muahahaha wrote: »

For whats its worth I believe he is guilty as hell too but think the actual conviction is dubious.

He lost appeals in 2009 and again in 2012. In 2016, the Supreme Court refused permission for another appeal. Unless one thinks that the appeals process right up to the Supreme Court is in a conspriacy to keep him locked up, then the conviction is legally sound.

take everything · 11-08-2020 04:26PM

Actually Lorcan Bale, the 16 year old from Palmerstown who killed his 7 year old neighbour by knocking him unconscious, tying him up, putting him in a bag before dragging him to his attic and crucifying him in a satanic ritual in the seventies seems to have an account on let's ride, a cycling website.

Lives in London and is a prominent member of his church as I say.

Scumbag.

HildaOgdenx · 11-08-2020 04:33PM

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Can anybody here remember when two Gardai were killed when there car was rammed by a Stolen Mazda sports car driven at high speed on the N11 Sillorgan Dual-Carriageway back in about 2002.
It stuck with me because it happened very near where my sister lived when she was going to UCD and the fact that two Gardai died.

Yes, I remember that.

Garda Anthony Tighe, and Garda Michael Padden.

HildaOgdenx · 11-08-2020 04:36PM

Hangdogroad wrote: »

A workmate testified that he had initially given him a false alibi. Also he had a strong motive plus his odd behaviour and demeanour after the murder.that's just from my memory sure there was more.

Also (if I remember correctly) the fact that he denied returning to the house that morning, when the phone mast evidence showed that he did.

HildaOgdenx · 11-08-2020 04:53PM

Siobhan Hynes, a young teenager who was murdered on a beach in Connemara, in 1998.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/murder-most-foul-and-the-finger-of-suspicion-26165274.html

I remember reading an interview her dad gave, many years later. He said that he still lies awake at night wondering was she calling out to him, for help, when she was attacked. Heartbreaking.

The murderer was successfully convicted. He has made several appeals, afaik. Nor sure if he is out now.

iamstop · 11-08-2020 05:38PM

I doubt many on here have heard about this case but I read about it 3 years ago and it's still one of the most chilling I can think of. He just seemed so nonchalant about the whole thing. Having parties and killing prostitutes and feeding them to pigs.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Pickton

He was even caught up with the law in 97 and was suspected of things in 98 and 99 but slipped through the cracks still remained free to keep killing until 2002!

There was one detail of the case that I feel like I remember reading but can't find it in the wiki. A local woman has witnessed a woman tied up and in distress on the farm but Pickton saw her and bought her off with drugs. Shocking stuff considering he went on to commit so many more murders after that point.

Edit: Found it in new story:
https://www.thestar.com/news/2007/06/26/star_witness_describes_horrific_pickton_scene.html

marklazarcovic · 11-08-2020 05:45PM

david parker ray, the toybox killer, one of the vilest humans to walk the planet id imagine.

aided by his daughter.

https://youtu.be/nwwhd7VzFLI

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Parker_Ray

https://allthatsinteresting.com/david-parker-ray-toy-box-killer

freshpopcorn · 11-08-2020 05:56PM

They are some very interesting cases in the UK.
One that I heard about in the UK was a 38 year old lady called Julie Pacey who was strangled in her home in 1994.
On the Friday before she was killed she told her children she heard a knock on the door and said come in thinking it was the girl she looked after. However a man wearing overalls entered the house and left.
However the mystery also surrounded a blue BMW 5 Series car that she was seen driving and it was parked on her drive whilst her own car was a blue Audi 80.

Crimes that have stayed with you for years

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