How will schools be able to go back in September?

byhookorbycrook · 28-07-2020 08:40PM

How will buses manage with staggered drop offs ? Of parents with children in 3 different classes ?

Alrigghtythen · 28-07-2020 08:41PM

KerryConnor wrote: »

I Agree you'll be in contact with toddlers bodily fluids over the course of the day which you usually aren't in a school.
However a secondary school teacher for example, might be in close contact (I think 40 mins in a packed classroom with an airborn virus can be discribed this way) with 200 adult sized humans in the course of 1 day.
I'm in primary and i think the risks are smaller, i'll be in contact with 30 smaller humans (smaller lungs or for whatever reason less infectious)

Take 22 contact hours a week with 35? Pupils a class. That's 770 pupils a week they are in contact with. Less for most teachers involved in exam years and smaller classes.

https://www.tui.ie/second-level-hours-meetings/second-level-teaching-hours.2128.html

Teachers who are not involved in the delivery of Junior Cycle may be required to teach up to a maximum of 22 hours per week. The maximum weekly teaching hours for those involved in the delivery of Junior Cycle is 21 hours and 20 minutes.

A teacher in an Assistant Principal I post has maximum class contact hours of 18 hours per week if not involved in delivery of Junior Cycle and 17 hours 20 minutes if involved. Maximum teaching hours for principals and deputy principals are set out in a schedule in CL 58/98.

KerryConnor · 28-07-2020 08:41PM

But I;d love to see a visual of how children's social circles change in and out of school. Currently my own children are reguarlly seeing a maximum of 10 chlidren between them. That'll increase to 130ish - 2 secondary and 1 primary child. I think naturally 'pods' or whatever you want to call them develop outside school.

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

In that case everyday life where kids are all playing together, doing sports, having playdates, birthday parties etc is also making a joke of pods.

Don't focus on it too much, life is going on pretty much as normal outside of school pods, it's just that the dept had to be seen to be doing something as a nod to social distancing in school.

Bobtheman · 28-07-2020 08:41PM

Alrigghtythen wrote: »

The preschool child care have more contact hours and are a lot more up close and personal with bodily fluids than either secondary or primary school teachers.

I get that it may be scary for teachers. Yes it will be different and you will need to adapt. Haven't we all?

They should look to other industries to show them how it's done. The trail blazers who kept the country going while keeping covid out.

The school doors cant be kept shut forever

Are you in a classroom or work place with 200/300 hundred people passing through? No screen as it's not practical in schools. So I take with a pinch of salt that we all adjusted. We all have but some more than others. I'd sympathise with a shop worker more than someone at home on zoom.
Schools are unique places. I have authority over kids but they ain't my employees. Completely unique legal framework.

Alrigghtythen · 28-07-2020 08:42PM

Bobtheman wrote: »

Are you in a classroom or work place with 200/300 hundred people passing through? No screen as it's not practical in schools. So I take with a pinch of salt that we all adjusted. We all have but some more than others. I'd sympathise with a shop worker more than someone at home on zoom.

No, nearer 900

Bobtheman · 28-07-2020 08:45PM

Alrigghtythen wrote: »

No, nearer 900

For you? Doing what?

Bruthal · 28-07-2020 08:55PM

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

Your right, covid-19 is just the flu and hasn't killed anyone or brought the world to its knees for no reason at all

How many deaths from a particular cause does it take to bring the world to its knees?

deiseindublin · 28-07-2020 09:14PM

That's some room to fit 900 people. Fair play.

Crazy cramming kids into a classroom like this when Parnell Park tomorrow night will only have 120 in the stands and circa another 80 on the pitch, with a capacity of 14k or so, without the pitch.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 28-07-2020 09:22PM

Trailblazer has certainly raised my expectations.

I'm hoping for space exploration centre, cancer research facility as the workplace but 900 people in a room has me stumped.

Alrigghtythen · 28-07-2020 09:23PM

Lol, Rule 1 of exams,

Always read the question

28-07-2020 09:25PM

Alrigghtythen wrote: »

That was pre covid. What's your plan for doing safety checks and demonstrating post covid?

Wait for someone to tell them it seems rather than use their education and training to figure out a better way

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 28-07-2020 09:27PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Wait for someone to tell them it seems rather than use their education and training to figure out a better way

Shur aren't they a pity

28-07-2020 09:28PM

KerryConnor wrote: »

But I;d love to see a visual of how children's social circles change in and out of school. Currently my own children are reguarlly seeing a maximum of 10 chlidren between them. That'll increase to 130ish - 2 secondary and 1 primary child. I think naturally 'pods' or whatever you want to call them develop outside school.

Always remember, 90% of infections are 15 minutes at 2 meters. Minimising those type of interactions is what is required

Smacruairi · 28-07-2020 10:23PM

Primetime was a bit light.

Thought the kids actually spoke the most sense. ASTI rep was trying to play nice, parents rep came across as dogmatic, and Aodhan spoke well. Collins trotted out but they didn't have time to dig into the numbers too much.

Think the program summed up everything so far - everyone wanting to do their best, some old grudges still there, but some sense of dawning reality that social distancing isn't really possible and 90% of people don't really care.

Will be interesting to see how ppl react when teachers do the job, go in and teach and then there is no remote teaching at all as there is no time then to do it.

28-07-2020 10:26PM

It's pretty simple really. Formal education is paused until Sept 2021. Everybody starts back then in the year they would have in Sept 2020. They're all a year older but all in the same boat. As for the kids who would have been due to start for the first time in 2020, well they have to take one for the team. They can be Generation Covid. No formal education for them, unfortunately, but they'll be given the dole from this year on until they're legally able to be employed as chimney sweeps or whatever.

Joking obviously, but it's about as well thought out as the current plan.

sideswipe · 28-07-2020 10:28PM

Smacruairi wrote: »

Primetime was a bit light.

Thought the kids actually spoke the most sense.

Not very enlightening really, the only thing I learned is that no matter where kids are from these days they have the same accent......damn YouTube.

Smacruairi · 28-07-2020 10:32PM

sideswipe wrote: »

Not very enlightening really, the only thing I learned is that no matter where kids are from these days they have the same accent......damn YouTube.

They never seem to have the boyo from Leitrim on for comment. For shame.

But to be fair to them, they pointed out the obvious nonsense that is social distancing in a school which everyone else pretended was grand. Particularly the principal who was measuring out a classroom, said a few don't fit, and then saod, ah sure we will make it work. End scene.

the corpo · 28-07-2020 10:35PM

Social distancing probably won't matter, it will be ventilation that will do the damage.

I hadn't realised the Department was falling behind on the scientific advice, but this has me even more worried. They're actively discounting airborne transmission, when the evidence is clearly pointing to it. Can't see the NPHET position on it yet, will they be as behind on they as they were with masks?

The entire Primary Schools reopening plan hangs on one sentence (p26): "Remember that the virus is spread by droplets and is not airborne so physical
separation is enough to reduce the risk of spread to others even if they are in the same
room"

https://twitter.com/DeeGilhawley/status/1287858674057326592?s=20

Grandeeod · 28-07-2020 10:48PM

Deleted User wrote: »

It's pretty simple really. Formal education is paused until Sept 2021. Everybody starts back then in the year they would have in Sept 2020. They're all a year older but all in the same boat. As for the kids who would have been due to start for the first time in 2020, well they have to take one for the team. They can be Generation Covid. No formal education for them, unfortunately, but they'll be given the dole from this year on until they're legally able to be employed as chimney sweeps or whatever.

Joking obviously, but it's about as well thought out as the current plan.

That might have worked. Seriously.:D

I'm of the opinion that for Secondary schools, a one week in and one week homework, while making changes in Schools was a far better way to go. A 50% reduction week on week. Review it monthly and go from there. What we have got is a country where the parliament is in a convention centre at a cost of 25K a day so social distancing can be done and lots of TDs wearing masks. Large parts of the civil service are working from home at least half a week. I have to wear a mask on a socially distanced train. I have to wear a mask in a shop. If I go to a restaurant or bar for food, I can stay for 105 minutes. But I'm expected to allow my child into a school with no mask or any meaningful social distancing for hours. That's not a plan. It's a social experiment based on economics. If we do end up paying the price, I hope it's not a big one.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 28-07-2020 10:53PM

The students who spoke on Prime Time were the only ones to address actual issues people will face on returning to school. Fair play to them.

The adults generally waffled and contributed very little to what was a show lacking any real insight or clarification on issues arising from this weeks 'guidelines'

Peter Flynt · 28-07-2020 10:55PM

Smacruairi wrote: »

Primetime was a bit light.

Thought the kids actually spoke the most sense. ASTI rep was trying to play nice, parents rep came across as dogmatic, and Aodhan spoke well. Collins trotted out but they didn't have time to dig into the numbers too much.

Think the program summed up everything so far - everyone wanting to do their best, some old grudges still there, but some sense of dawning reality that social distancing isn't really possible and 90% of people don't really care.

Will be interesting to see how ppl react when teachers do the job, go in and teach and then there is no remote teaching at all as there is no time then to do it.

The problem with all this is that everyone is hamstrung and stuck be the demand to open schools at all costs.

No one is asking questions that need to be asked and, for the very few that i have seen, they are glossed over by the media.

17/18 year olds on PT know that social distancing is not going to happen in post primary schools yet there seems to be this alternative universe with the DES where everything is going to be possible.

s1ippy · 28-07-2020 11:03PM

Since yesterday morning, I now know five teachers who have quit. Three special needs needs, one primary and one secondary.

caveat emptor · 28-07-2020 11:03PM

the corpo wrote: »

Social distancing probably won't matter, it will be ventilation that will do the damage.

I hadn't realised the Department was falling behind on the scientific advice, but this has me even more worried. They're actively discounting airborne transmission, when the evidence is clearly pointing to it. Can't see the NPHET position on it yet, will they be as behind on they as they were with masks?

https://twitter.com/DeeGilhawley/status/1287858674057326592?s=20

Schools shopping up to be a disaster.
Can do attitude is laudable but invisible micro droplets that cause infection is a thing now.

https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1280903785703976961?s=20

combat14 · 28-07-2020 11:08PM

Smacruairi wrote: »

Primetime was a bit light.

Thought the kids actually spoke the most sense. ASTI rep was trying to play nice, parents rep came across as dogmatic, and Aodhan spoke well. Collins trotted out but they didn't have time to dig into the numbers too much.

Think the program summed up everything so far - everyone wanting to do their best, some old grudges still there, but some sense of dawning reality that social distancing isn't really possible and 90% of people don't really care.

Will be interesting to see how ppl react when teachers do the job, go in and teach and then there is no remote teaching at all as there is no time then to do it.

exactly teachers are not going to teach in the classroom and remote teach another group too

ChelseaRentBoy · 28-07-2020 11:08PM

s1ippy wrote: »

Since yesterday morning, I now know five teachers who have quit. Three special needs needs, one primary and one secondary.

It's utterly laughable expecting teachers to cram into small rooms with 30 kids. This government are an absolute disaster.

khalessi · 28-07-2020 11:08PM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Schools shopping up to be a disaster.
Can do attitude is laudable but invisible micro droplets that cause infection is a thing now.

https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1280903785703976961?s=20

Mask and a visor for the teacher is the only way. If parents want their children wearing masks they can send them in otherwise no masks for children. We had a few children asking to wear masks in March and they did as they felt better.

Grandeeod · 28-07-2020 11:16PM

When are teachers and parents going to utter the word, STOP?

wirelessdude01 · 28-07-2020 11:19PM

Grandeeod wrote: »

When are teachers and parents going to utter the word, STOP?

Teachers won't anyway as it won't be heard and if it heard then it will be twisted.

Parents will be listened to but majority don't have the time or inclination to read what is actually being proposed.

combat14 · 28-07-2020 11:27PM

Grandeeod wrote: »

When are teachers and parents going to utter the word, STOP?

teachers unions will probably call a halt but it probably wont be till the last minute at this stage ...

28-07-2020 11:33PM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Schools shopping up to be a disaster.
Can do attitude is laudable but invisible micro droplets that cause infection is a thing now.

https://twitter.com/DrEricDing/status/1280903785703976961?s=20

Vast majority of infections are through droplets. Some do happen through air transmission, however if we prevent as many of the droplet transmissions as possible, we stay ahead of the virus. It has to be accepted, transmissions will occur, people will get sick, people will die. Some schools will also close due to clusters.

Life needs to go on though, minimising risk but accepting some will remain

How will schools be able to go back in September?

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