Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

Moonymoon00 · 20-06-2019 10:12AM

mcgovern wrote: »

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

AudreyHepburn · 20-06-2019 10:12AM

mcgovern wrote: »

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

And therein lies the problem with mob justice. Innocent people get hurt because of a desire for revenge and because people let their emotions take over.

Lucuma · 20-06-2019 10:14AM

mrjoneill wrote: »

Boy B father state his son lost 2 mobile phones he gave him to portray a bumbling fool & stated he was very immature for his age as well as craved friendship also to portray his darling son as a pawn of the Big Bad Boy A.

Also - and excuse me if this was already brought up I haven't read the whole thread - did you notice Boy B's father made sure to say that he noticed the blue construction tape missing from his garage 'a few weeks prior to the murder'. Implying that B and had taken it and given it to A well in advance. We only have Boy B's father's word to take for that...

sbsquarepants · 20-06-2019 10:22AM

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

Surely any gobshíte has the faculties to realise if you can see him walking around the town / going to school / playing ball or whatever - then that's not him!

Fan of Netflix · 20-06-2019 10:25AM

https://twitter.com/Orlaodo/status/1141646518337900544

Boy B family in hiding according to his solicitor.

gozunda · 20-06-2019 10:25AM

Aisling_Dublin wrote: »

Psychopathy is an illness, psychopaths are born unable to feel mercy, empathy and sympathy.

Dont wish to split hairs but I believe psychopathy is considered a 'personality disorder' and not a mental illness for legal purposes ie in itself it wouldn't rule that a person was unable to stand trial or would have to be committed to a psychiatric hospital instead of jail afaik

Good article here about how psychopaths live amongst us

https://www.independent.ie/life/family/family-features/how-to-tell-if-you-share-your-life-with-a-psychopath-30241202.html

Lucuma · 20-06-2019 10:25AM

CityRoad wrote: »

I have been following this thread for a few days and although I have not read every post, I want to make a couple of points as I know some of the details of the background. I will not put the case at risk, I do not know the names or have any information on the boys or the family and I take my cue from the local community who have done a sterling job in waiting for the case to be tried and not risking it in anyway. I am torn about the confidentiality aspect, because I believe it follows the rehabilitation model of justice and I am not sure that some can be rehabilitated.

I mention the information as some think there may be non national element to it (there wasn't, they were good Irish boys!), that there is mental illness, that there is coercion by one on the other or any nonsense that the jury got this wrong. They did not.

1. Boy A & B were bullies at the local school, I know this as they bullied a child of a friend of mine constantly before the murder, so it could have been someone I know and love in the grave, instead of poor Ana. These boys worked as a bullying team, one is not more innocent than the other.

2. There are no learning issues, the school did not consider them to be problems in anyway whatsoever. There is no mental illness, there are no special ed needs, this is who they are.

3. Anyone that was their target was isolated by the others, including the child I know. It is not pleasant but it seems it was the only viable solution for the other kids.

My worry now is my friend's child and the long term effects, like survivors guilt.

In regards to the principal and counsellor at the local school they should be sacked, there is alot of negligence there, I would love to see some litigation or an inquiry on that.

If they are both mentally ill it's a folie a deux, if not it is joint enterprise, you cannot deliver someone to their death and claim innocence.

The Gardai did an amazing job in talking to the kids and handling the case.

The only mystery is the unknown DNA on Ana's body, but don't worry he'll strike again.

Hard to read this post. That explains why Ana's mother was immediately alarmed when she heard who Ana had left with. She said she 'knew of' the boy

20-06-2019 10:27AM

Lucuma wrote: »

He obviously blamed the park ranger for not keeping an eye on what was happening in the park and allowing his precious darling to get attacked.

The park ranger rang the guards on his phone and handed it to Boy A's father who spoke to them.

Did this happen on the same evening Ana went missing (Mon 14th) or the following day (Tue 15th) when her disappearance was made public?

I’ve tried looking but getting conflicting info.

SirChenjin · 20-06-2019 10:29AM

ManOfMystery wrote: »

Just got round to reading it last night. A long, harrowing and upsetting read - not just because of the murder and brutality, but because of the bullying and seemingly lonely life she had before that.

I don't have a lot of time for some journalists in this day and age where a lot of 'journalism' is comprised of copy and pastes from social media and other sites, but in this case, I found this to be a very respectful, heavily researched article which covered the unique circumstances of this difficult case in a way that really hit home how sad the whole situation was.

I would encourage anyone to read this because it may just open your eyes a bit to those vulnerable children and teens around us who we assume are just getting on with things, but are actually suffering silently.

I agree, I read it when it was first linked on this thread and it is worth reading.

I also mentioned upthread that there was a lovely, if heartbreaking piece on RTE news on Tuesday about Ana, showing her in lovely family photos and mentioning that two days were celebrated every year by her family, her birthday and the day that she was adopted.

I think it is important to remember her as a person in her own right. May she rest in peace, poor innocent child.

Lucuma · 20-06-2019 10:29AM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Did this happen on the same evening Ana went missing (Mon 14th) or the following day (Tue 15th) when her disappearance was made public?

I’ve tried looking but getting conflicting info.

The same evening. The park ranger said that Boy A's hair was a mess and he looked scuffed up and had blood on his tshirt etc. It was the same evening.
Before his Mammy had a chance to bleach the blood stains off his clothes that night!

Sunflower 27 · 20-06-2019 10:30AM

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

Absolutely spot on. I'd imagine some kids are behind the sending of pics, thinking it's funny and unaware of consequences.

It isn't just angry adults baying for blood.

....... · 20-06-2019 10:31AM

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

No. No. No.

People have a responsibility not to share images of of someone who they dont know and claim its someone. #fakenews

Every fool out there sharing images about this is actually damaging the case for sentencing. They can still appeal.

20-06-2019 10:32AM

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

Why would innocent boys have any fears of being wrongly named?? The 2 convicted boys are in custody. If a boy with a similiar name is walking around free then obviously it cant be him.

Lefty Bicek · 20-06-2019 10:35AM

inthehat wrote: »

Why would innocent boys have any fears of being wrongly named?? The 2 convicted boys are in custody. If a boy with a similiar name is walking around free then obviously it cant be him.

Will the mob be as rational as you are being... ?

super_furry · 20-06-2019 10:36AM

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

Will the mob be as rational as you are being... ?

It's not even rationality, it's a very basic human thought process.

'Is he in jail'? No? Then it's not him.

chopperbyrne · 20-06-2019 10:40AM

inthehat wrote: »

Why would innocent boys have any fears of being wrongly named?? The 2 convicted boys are in custody. If a boy with a similiar name is walking around free then obviously it cant be him.

But gob****es will find an address for the wrong John Smith, and smash their windows, or set fire to their cars.

20-06-2019 10:40AM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

You know what?

In a few weeks this will all be forgotten, and all the supports will be be for the accused/perpetrators and all the chatter will be about them rather than the bereaved.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

The victims are forgotten immediately after their victim impact statements.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

TBH I personally will give this a week from now, and then it will all move on.

We will all forget it soon enough

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

All forgotten in time anyway, we all move on.

Well we won't forget if you stick around anyway!

Gael23 · 20-06-2019 10:40AM

Fan of Netflix wrote: »

https://twitter.com/Orlaodo/status/1141646518337900544

Boy B family in hiding according to his solicitor.

Is this a ploy for the judge to feel sorry for them in sentencing?

tayto lover · 20-06-2019 10:40AM

beggars_bush wrote: »

what could the school do about a party outside of school?

EDIT, also why do 5th class girls need phones?

The school could have dealt with the bullying going on IN the school.
The children do not need phones. Mine never had one until 15 Years old but that’s an issue for their own parents.

20-06-2019 10:41AM

It important to remember the person at the center of.

Now she had issues and early teens can be a horrible time, but if she had just got over the hump of that, by the age of 16/ 17 she might have got over it she was well on the way to becoming the tall attractive sporty woman she was going to become.

She wasn't academic but she was a great swimmer she might have been a swimming instructor or worked in a gym or might have been a dance teacher.

She might have married and become a mother and brought much love grandchildren to her parents.

Now all that is gone.

Boggles · 20-06-2019 10:42AM

super_furry wrote: »

It's not even rationality, it's a very basic human thought process.

'Is he in jail'? No? Then it's not him.

He is a child. He has just been wrongly outed by the revenge mob on the internet as a child murderer, in a case where people ranting and raving about bringing in the death penalty for children.

Do you not think that innocent child may feel even a small bit anxious.

Or is it a case of fúck him and how he may feel the internet need their collective revenge orgasm?

Greyfox · 20-06-2019 10:42AM

Boggles wrote: »

Mob justice will just create more victims and punish the innocent.

Only if they get the wrong person

Boggles wrote: »

Anger is normal. Handing the justice system over to violent murderous mobs is moronic and not normal.

It's not moronic, if your sibling/daughter is let down by the justice system its not moronic, its simply you have been forced into doing something desperate due to our poor justice system

Boggles wrote: »

From what I have read the judge in this case has been stellar.

Yes there's good ones, but there a minority

Boggles · 20-06-2019 10:45AM

Greyfox wrote: »

Only if they get the wrong person

They have all ready, didn't take long. See post below.

mcgovern wrote: »

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

MrFresh · 20-06-2019 10:45AM

Greyfox wrote: »

Only if they get the wrong person

Yeah, that's the point. That's why we have a justice system, to reduce the possibility of getting the wrong person.

bnt · 20-06-2019 10:45AM

Thinking Ireland might want to copy the UK's porn age verification system? UK porn age-verification system faces indefinite delay.

Lefty Bicek · 20-06-2019 10:46AM

super_furry wrote: »

It's not even rationality, it's a very basic human thought process.

'Is he in jail'? No? Then it's not him.

Yet pictures of the wrong boy have been put online, we are told.

The mob is a very basic human thought process too. And the mob frequently gets it wrong.

I recognise that I am coming from a position of ever-increasing cynicism about human nature.

shesty · 20-06-2019 10:46AM

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

It's against the law to ID them.An offence under the Children's Act.It has fines/jail time attached to it.And on top of that the judge made an order for it.It wasn't just done at the whim of a court out of the goodness of their heart.

I wonder do people realise that?

joe40 · 20-06-2019 10:47AM

Boggles wrote: »

He is a child. He has just been wrongly outed by the revenge mob on the internet as a child murderer, in a case where people ranting and raving about bringing in the death penalty for children.

Do you not think that innocent child may feel even a small bit anxious.

Or is it a case of fúck him and how he may feel the internet need their collective revenge orgasm?

I heard of a story in England when one of the gutter press there, news of the world I think, were on about naming paedophiles. A Paediatrician was attacked...

Suckler · 20-06-2019 10:48AM

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

Yet pictures of the wrong boy have been put online.

The mob is a very basic human thought process too. And the mob frequently gets it wrong.

I recognise that I am coming from a position of ever-increasing cynicism about human nature.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2000/aug/30/childprotection.society

Mob rule in force. Common sense not being too common is the problem.

Force Carrier · 20-06-2019 10:49AM

tayto lover wrote: »

The children do not need phones. Mine never had one until 15 Years old but that’s an issue for their own parents.

They looked at statistics with "middle school" kids in america after wide spread use of smart phones became ubiquitous in 2008 and noticed a significant increase in self harm rates in boys and girls - and particularly in girls. Social network apps put a lot of pressure on kids and there is a lot of online bullying. Not that these issues haven't always been there but the technology exacerbates them. And there is no upside to the phones anyway. They aren't needed and bring no benefit.

I think in a few years schools everywhere will ban phones and jam phone signals.
Whatever laws need to change will be changed.

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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