Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

Moonymoon00

What worries me is that I have seen different pictures that claim to be the identity of boy a and b . But they are not the same boys in all pictures . Is it possible that people are under the impression that they know their identities but it's actually pictures of innocent boys ?

Lillyfae

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

The good far out weighs the bad. There's teenage tech millionaires that created apps etc.

That's a ridiculous statement. Do you honestly think that there are more teenage tech millionaires than teenage tyrants attacking their peers through various tech platforms??

Children's access to technology as it stands doesn't sit well with me. How parents are monitoring and policing their children's use of technology varies wildly from child to child. I often talk to colleagues with preteen/ teen children and they have nothing good to say about the kids having smart phones, but also don't seem to have any inclination to remove them, arguing "they all have them, we can't deprive our child".

There needs to be an absolute enforcement of the age barrier to all social media, and a complete ban on smart phones for children under this age. In order to teach them to use it, perhaps there could be a platform introduced in schools- not a pupil or staff member, no access- most schools have an intranet nowadays so I can't imagine that this would be massively difficult. No-one seems to be doing this on a local, national or global level anywhere even though every single day we hear new cases of horror related to social media/ technology use by children.

Boggles

Greyfox wrote: »

We cant live in a society that doesnt have justice.

We don't.

Greyfox wrote: »

I think in Ireland people who cant understand why some people encourage mob justice are people lacking empathy for victims.

Mob justice will just create more victims and punish the innocent.

Greyfox wrote: »

Not understanding the anger is cases like this is not normal. To call it moronic indicates to me that you care more about criminals.

Anger is normal. Handing the justice system over to violent murderous mobs is moronic and not normal.

Greyfox wrote: »

We wouldnt have this problem is we had decent judges

From what I have read the judge in this case has been stellar.

TheAsYLuMkeY

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

do you know what is also not unusual? journalists making up stories.

Have you played this game?

Play the game for an hour, than come back to me and tell me that the content and the way the game draws you in to kill more violently is not f**ked up and would be damaging for a young impressionable mind.

Let me be clear here,

These two toe rags i hope spend their LIFE imprisoned to the day they die.

I wish no ill will to their families at all.

I hope no one else ever has to go through anything like this ever again.

I see violent online content available to children as one strand of what is wrong generally with the way the world is today and should be halted.

Greyfox

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Example: go back about 15 years, PS2 game called 'Manhunt', read down through the page, murder in england was at the beginning linked with an obsession of this game, later not, but that could have been simply because it was to difficult to prove and could end in litigation from the makers.

The reality is you can find a video online within a minute that would be 1,000 times worse then the worst thing you'd see in a computer game. Blaming computer games is stupid as there all very tame compared to some of the stuff thats easy to access online

Lucuma

Lucuma wrote: »

You're leaving out the bit about the park ranger, did you read his evidence? He said he was in the park ranger's cabin when he heard a loud knocking on the door. An irate man was outside saying his son had been attacked in the park. The park ranger went over and had a look at the son sitting in the car and tried to talk to him.

That shows the mentality of Boy A's parents/father. Straight away looking for someone to blame because his precious little boy got hopped

Why would you go to the park ranger and not the guards?

TheAsYLuMkeY

Greyfox wrote: »

The reality is you can find a video online within a minute that would be 1,000 times worse then the worst thing you'd see in a computer game. Blaming computer games is stupid as there all very tame compared to some of the stuff thats easy to access online

Holy crap, i have never said it was solely down to that, its one factor in a bigger picture i offered as an example.

Boggles

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Why would you go to the park ranger and not the guards?

He said he rang the guards and couldn't get through, the park ranger then tried and got through and handed the phone to the father.

In reality.

A young fella getting a small bit of hiding wouldn't be far up on the list priorities of the guards that day or any day really.

J11

As a man in his 20s, it breaks my heart every time I see a photo of that lovely girl. The depravity of the crime hits hard and it's depressing knowing what she had to go through knowing full well her life was ripped away so callously. I'm not religious but I hope she's at peace now somewhere better than the world we live in.

Lucuma

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Why would you go to the park ranger and not the guards?

He obviously blamed the park ranger for not keeping an eye on what was happening in the park and allowing his precious darling to get attacked.

The park ranger rang the guards on his phone and handed it to Boy A's father who spoke to them.

ohnonotgmail

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Have you played this game?

Play the game for an hour, than come back to me and tell me that the content and the way the game draws you in to kill more violently is not f**ked up and would be damaging for a young impressionable mind.

Let me be clear here,

These two toe rags i hope spend their LIFE imprisoned to the day they die.

I wish no ill will to their families at all.

I hope no one else ever has to go through anything like this ever again.

I see violent online content available to children as one strand of what is wrong generally with the way the world is today and should be halted.

there is nothing to support the claim that the killer in that case ever played the game. Some journalist made the link from thin air. that is the point i am making.

ManOfMystery

Lackadaisical wrote: »

Beyond words.

I read Conor Gallagher's article in Irish Times on the case and to be quite honest I feel like I've been punched in the stomach. I'm not usually traumatised by newspaper articles, but this one is an exception. How the hell could anyone do something like that to anyone?

My thoughts are with Ana, her parents and the Kriegel family. May she rest in peace and never be forgotten.

Just got round to reading it last night. A long, harrowing and upsetting read - not just because of the murder and brutality, but because of the bullying and seemingly lonely life she had before that.

I don't have a lot of time for some journalists in this day and age where a lot of 'journalism' is comprised of copy and pastes from social media and other sites, but in this case, I found this to be a very respectful, heavily researched article which covered the unique circumstances of this difficult case in a way that really hit home how sad the whole situation was.

I would encourage anyone to read this because it may just open your eyes a bit to those vulnerable children and teens around us who we assume are just getting on with things, but are actually suffering silently.

mcgovern

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

What worries me is that I have seen different pictures that claim to be the identity of boy a and b . But they are not the same boys in all pictures . Is it possible that people are under the impression that they know their identities but it's actually pictures of innocent boys ?

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

sbsquarepants

Lucuma wrote: »

Or another way of looking it is that he confessed.

That doesn't mean he shouldn't have been charged with murder. But it means there might be some hope of rehabilitation for him

He didn't confess, he tripped himself up. There's a huge difference - he's a sick little bastard.

Moonymoon00

mcgovern wrote: »

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

AudreyHepburn

mcgovern wrote: »

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

And therein lies the problem with mob justice. Innocent people get hurt because of a desire for revenge and because people let their emotions take over.

Lucuma

mrjoneill wrote: »

Boy B father state his son lost 2 mobile phones he gave him to portray a bumbling fool & stated he was very immature for his age as well as craved friendship also to portray his darling son as a pawn of the Big Bad Boy A.

Also - and excuse me if this was already brought up I haven't read the whole thread - did you notice Boy B's father made sure to say that he noticed the blue construction tape missing from his garage 'a few weeks prior to the murder'. Implying that B and had taken it and given it to A well in advance. We only have Boy B's father's word to take for that...

sbsquarepants

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

Surely any gobshíte has the faculties to realise if you can see him walking around the town / going to school / playing ball or whatever - then that's not him!

Fan of Netflix

https://twitter.com/Orlaodo/status/1141646518337900544

Boy B family in hiding according to his solicitor.

gozunda

Aisling_Dublin wrote: »

Psychopathy is an illness, psychopaths are born unable to feel mercy, empathy and sympathy.

Dont wish to split hairs but I believe psychopathy is considered a 'personality disorder' and not a mental illness for legal purposes ie in itself it wouldn't rule that a person was unable to stand trial or would have to be committed to a psychiatric hospital instead of jail afaik

Good article here about how psychopaths live amongst us

https://www.independent.ie/life/family/family-features/how-to-tell-if-you-share-your-life-with-a-psychopath-30241202.html

Lucuma

CityRoad wrote: »

I have been following this thread for a few days and although I have not read every post, I want to make a couple of points as I know some of the details of the background. I will not put the case at risk, I do not know the names or have any information on the boys or the family and I take my cue from the local community who have done a sterling job in waiting for the case to be tried and not risking it in anyway. I am torn about the confidentiality aspect, because I believe it follows the rehabilitation model of justice and I am not sure that some can be rehabilitated.

I mention the information as some think there may be non national element to it (there wasn't, they were good Irish boys!), that there is mental illness, that there is coercion by one on the other or any nonsense that the jury got this wrong. They did not.

1. Boy A & B were bullies at the local school, I know this as they bullied a child of a friend of mine constantly before the murder, so it could have been someone I know and love in the grave, instead of poor Ana. These boys worked as a bullying team, one is not more innocent than the other.

2. There are no learning issues, the school did not consider them to be problems in anyway whatsoever. There is no mental illness, there are no special ed needs, this is who they are.

3. Anyone that was their target was isolated by the others, including the child I know. It is not pleasant but it seems it was the only viable solution for the other kids.

My worry now is my friend's child and the long term effects, like survivors guilt.

In regards to the principal and counsellor at the local school they should be sacked, there is alot of negligence there, I would love to see some litigation or an inquiry on that.

If they are both mentally ill it's a folie a deux, if not it is joint enterprise, you cannot deliver someone to their death and claim innocence.

The Gardai did an amazing job in talking to the kids and handling the case.

The only mystery is the unknown DNA on Ana's body, but don't worry he'll strike again.

Hard to read this post. That explains why Ana's mother was immediately alarmed when she heard who Ana had left with. She said she 'knew of' the boy

Lucuma

Lucuma wrote: »

He obviously blamed the park ranger for not keeping an eye on what was happening in the park and allowing his precious darling to get attacked.

The park ranger rang the guards on his phone and handed it to Boy A's father who spoke to them.

Did this happen on the same evening Ana went missing (Mon 14th) or the following day (Tue 15th) when her disappearance was made public?

I’ve tried looking but getting conflicting info.

SirChenjin

ManOfMystery wrote: »

Just got round to reading it last night. A long, harrowing and upsetting read - not just because of the murder and brutality, but because of the bullying and seemingly lonely life she had before that.

I don't have a lot of time for some journalists in this day and age where a lot of 'journalism' is comprised of copy and pastes from social media and other sites, but in this case, I found this to be a very respectful, heavily researched article which covered the unique circumstances of this difficult case in a way that really hit home how sad the whole situation was.

I would encourage anyone to read this because it may just open your eyes a bit to those vulnerable children and teens around us who we assume are just getting on with things, but are actually suffering silently.

I agree, I read it when it was first linked on this thread and it is worth reading.

I also mentioned upthread that there was a lovely, if heartbreaking piece on RTE news on Tuesday about Ana, showing her in lovely family photos and mentioning that two days were celebrated every year by her family, her birthday and the day that she was adopted.

I think it is important to remember her as a person in her own right. May she rest in peace, poor innocent child.

Lucuma

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Did this happen on the same evening Ana went missing (Mon 14th) or the following day (Tue 15th) when her disappearance was made public?

I’ve tried looking but getting conflicting info.

The same evening. The park ranger said that Boy A's hair was a mess and he looked scuffed up and had blood on his tshirt etc. It was the same evening.
Before his Mammy had a chance to bleach the blood stains off his clothes that night!

Sunflower 27

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

Absolutely spot on. I'd imagine some kids are behind the sending of pics, thinking it's funny and unaware of consequences.

It isn't just angry adults baying for blood.

.......

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

No. No. No.

People have a responsibility not to share images of of someone who they dont know and claim its someone. #fakenews

Every fool out there sharing images about this is actually damaging the case for sentencing. They can still appeal.

Moonymoon00

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

Thanks . That is very worrying . For innocent boys to be protected about being accused for this , I feel the state has a duty to identify boy a and b officially now . Times have changed , social media cannot be patrolled .

Also, I'm sure there are young people who think it's funny to circulate their friends pictures/names as the identity of the boys , thinking it's funny or could using it to bully others .

Why would innocent boys have any fears of being wrongly named?? The 2 convicted boys are in custody. If a boy with a similiar name is walking around free then obviously it cant be him.

Lefty Bicek

inthehat wrote: »

Why would innocent boys have any fears of being wrongly named?? The 2 convicted boys are in custody. If a boy with a similiar name is walking around free then obviously it cant be him.

Will the mob be as rational as you are being... ?

super_furry

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

Will the mob be as rational as you are being... ?

It's not even rationality, it's a very basic human thought process.

'Is he in jail'? No? Then it's not him.

chopperbyrne

inthehat wrote: »

Why would innocent boys have any fears of being wrongly named?? The 2 convicted boys are in custody. If a boy with a similiar name is walking around free then obviously it cant be him.

But gob****es will find an address for the wrong John Smith, and smash their windows, or set fire to their cars.