Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

muob · 20-06-2019 09:23AM

The Royal Court of Social Mafia is in situ...

Mob Justice....

Calls to get their names out there to add further misery to their families, gang up en masse on two CHILDREN/teenagers who have been charged with evil wishes for their rapes, beatings while in detention....that is a SICK reaction to a very serious crime with very tragic consequences for so many people for years to come - families of those charged totally devastated, destroyed, broken, siblings, parents, grandparents all affected & you wish to heap further misery & suffering on them...maybe try open your hearts a little and put yourself in their shoes while being a little less judgemental.

Afaik the purpose of detention and prison, most
Importantly for Juvenile Detention, is/should be to REHABILITATE so the accused re- emerges as an adjusted member of society not beat them to a pulp while they are inside as some of posters on here seem to be wishing for.

This is no way condones or excuses any aspect of this horrific crime or lessens in any way my sincerest sympathies to the parents & family of Ana.

sonic85 · 20-06-2019 09:24AM

Hal3000 wrote: »

The reason people support mob justice is because of our soft touch justice system. How would you feel if this happened to your daughter only to see the perpetrators get a joke of a sentence and then set up with new identities and new lives. If our Justice system was strong and fair then maybe people would stop baying for blood.

I don't have a daughter but I have a little sister and god forbid if something happened to her I wouldn't be able to restrain myself.

Humans are strange creatures really. If a dog attacked me tomorrow and tore a few chunks out of me it would be put down but if a human kicks the sh!te out of me stamps on my head and kills me then they get shoved into a small room for a few years. Their liberty is restricted yes but I'd imagine after a bit of time they would acclimatise to it and then lead a reasonably good existence with good meals,TV, shop to buy supplies, gym, possibility of gaining an education. Where's the justice in that? You could argue that prison is not really a punishment anymore, just a bit of an obstacle to get over. These lads will be out and about before they're 30 FFS!

Meathcat · 20-06-2019 09:25AM

HalloweenJack wrote: »

What difference does it make if their names are out there?

People don't have to worry about them until they're released. Getting their names now will only cause trouble for their families and satisfy people's curiosity, nothing more.

I totally agree with you there. Whatever about the two boys, they are bound to have siblings, cousins, aunts, uncles and grandparents who will all be tarred with the same brush and may become the victims of bullying themselves. I'm sure some people will deny that would happen but mob mentality rules and it would get out 'That's the sister of Boy B' or whatever. I deliberately left parents out of my list because to be honest, I'm not sure the parents really deserve a break here. Ok so they didn't know what the boys were up to but is that not the job of a parent? Surely they should at the very least have been monitoring what their sons were watching/downloading etc. These were 13 year olds and by all accounts, Boy A was at this crack for a while.

My other approach to agreeing with not releasing their identities is that once their faces and names are out there, it will become all about them and who they are. It shouldn't be about them, it should be about Ana Kriegel and preserving her memory. Not about their faces and names. And with the best will in the world, that's what will happen. It sounds to me like they are the kind of boys who would revel in the notoriety and that shouldn't be allowed to happen. On a Facebook comment yesterday, someone mentioned the case of Shan Mohangi but admitted they couldn't remember his victim's name offhand. That's because the case is still all about him, not his victim. I feel this would be an insult to Ana Kriegel and her memory.

rob316 · 20-06-2019 09:26AM

Sociopathic children is a very real thing. You could raise your child with the best intentions but it won't matter they are programmed to be evil.

beggars_bush · 20-06-2019 09:27AM

tayto lover wrote: »

I knew of a bullying case in a small school in the country.
11 girls in 5th class. One girl being victimized and bullied by the other ten.
One of the girls has a birthday party, all invited except the bullied girl.
During the party each girl in turn phones the bullied girl to gloat and tell her how much fun they’re all having. 10 phone calls to this poor girl who has to go and sit in that classroom with these bullies on the following Monday.
School did fcuk all about it either.

Youngsters can be very cruel. We should never forget it.

what could the school do about a party outside of school?

EDIT, also why do 5th class girls need phones?

Boggles · 20-06-2019 09:27AM

rob316 wrote: »

The same sickwell? Are you serious, are you actually reading what your posting.

Take your high horse and ride the **** out of here you clown

My lack of support for mob justice is nothing to with me being on a high horse and all to do with me not being a dribbling fúcktard.

Buy hey you are obviously super E-Hard. Good for you.

Wabbit Ears · 20-06-2019 09:28AM

muob wrote: »

The Royal Court of Social Mafia is in situ...

Mob Justice....

Calls to get their names out there to add further misery to their families, gang up en masse on two CHILDREN/teenagers who have been charged with evil wishes for their rapes, beatings while in detention....that is a SICK reaction to a very serious crime with very tragic consequences for so many people for years to come - families of those charged totally devastated, destroyed, broken, siblings, parents, grandparents all affected & you wish to heap further misery & suffering on them...maybe try open your hearts a little and put yourself in their shoes while being a little less judgemental.

Afaik the purpose of detention and prison, most
Importantly for Juvenile Detention, is/should be to REHABILITATE so the accused re- emerges as an adjusted member of society not beat them to a pulp while they are inside as some of posters on here seem to be wishing for.

This is no way condones or excuses any aspect of this horrific crime or lessens in any way my sincerest sympathies to the parents & family of Ana.

Nah, seriously, fcuk those guys.

20-06-2019 09:30AM

Aisling_Dublin wrote: »

Psychopathy is an illness, psychopaths are born unable to feel mercy, empathy and sympathy.

Is it an illness though? Do all psychopaths go on to commit crimes or do some just lead average lives? Just because you feel no mercy, empathy or sympathy just makes you, you.

Ursus Horribilis · 20-06-2019 09:36AM

beggars_bush wrote: »

what could the school do about a party outside of school?

EDIT, also why do 5th class girls need phones?

The school couldn't do anything about the bullying here but where were the parents while they were ringing this girl up?

The parents will tell you that they need phones to keep in contract with their kids. I think it's a bit young but that genie is well out of the bottle.

mcgovern · 20-06-2019 09:37AM

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Example: go back about 15 years, PS2 game called 'Manhunt', read down through the page, murder in england was at the beginning linked with an obsession of this game, later not, but that could have been simply because it was to difficult to prove and could end in litigation from the makers.

If you actually read through the page yourself, you'd see that it was later not linked to the murder, because the murderer didn't even have a copy of the game.

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Now that was 15 years ago, there was a sequel to the game, i imagine there are similar or worse games out there today, and possibly in VR environment.

You 'imagine' there are worse, so of course the world must be awash with them. And the two boys obviously spent all day playing them, even though we don't actually know if they play video games at all.

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Our brains process and store these images into memory, you may not recall it to the forefront of your mind every day, but everything we experience and consume mentally shapes who we are, and how we interpret the world.

The key word there, is 'everything'. Yet you seem set on blaming one particular medium, with no evidence to back it up. It's also not how memory works, but we won't get into that.

the butcher · 20-06-2019 09:39AM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Someone noticed something about this earlier. Wasn’t Boy A wearing tracksuit bottoms? If so, would his trouser be “down” rather than “open”?

Methinks Boy B May have been telling porkies to the professional psychologist too if Boy As attire was tracksuit bottoms.

Also Boy B said he had seen the mask a couple of days beforehand in Boy A's house. And he said Boy A was wearing it for the "whole incident" in the room and never took it off.

Greyfox · 20-06-2019 09:46AM

Boggles wrote: »

So you think someone who doesn't encourage or engage in mob justice has no empathy with victims of crime?

No it isn't. That's just moronic nonsense.

We cant live in a society that doesnt have justice. I think in Ireland people who cant understand why some people encourage mob justice are people lacking empathy for victims. Not understanding the anger is cases like this is not normal. To call it moronic indicates to me that you care more about criminals. We wouldnt have this problem is we had decent judges

Lucuma · 20-06-2019 09:46AM

Standman wrote: »

Nope, it's called the right to remain silent. He dug the hole for himself and hopped into it.

Or another way of looking it is that he confessed.

That doesn't mean he shouldn't have been charged with murder. But it means there might be some hope of rehabilitation for him

TheAsYLuMkeY · 20-06-2019 09:47AM

mcgovern wrote: »

If you actually read through the page yourself, you'd see that it was later not linked to the murder, because the murderer didn't even have a copy of the game.

I did read it, the story didn't appear from nowhere and would not be unusual for facts to be distorted when big organisations stand to lose a fortune, i have also played it, seriously f**ked up game.

mcgovern wrote: »

You 'imagine' there are worse, so of course the world must be awash with them. And the two boys obviously spent all day playing them, even though we don't actually know if they play video games at all.

Wont be going looking, i know there are, also logic and odds would tell you they did play games if they were on the internet so freely and given the ubiquitous availability of video games and the playing of them by youth today.

mcgovern wrote: »

The key word there, is 'everything'. Yet you seem set on blaming one particular medium, with no evidence to back it up. It's also not how memory works, but we won't get into that.

Not blaming any one medium, if you read back over my posts.

ohnonotgmail · 20-06-2019 09:49AM

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

I did read it, the story didn't appear from nowhere and would not be unusual for facts to be distorted when big organisations stand to lose a fortune, i have also played it, seriously f**ked up game.

Wont be going looking, i know there are, also logic and odds would tell you they did play games if they were on the internet so freely and given the ubiquitous availability of video games and the playing of them by youth today.

Not blaming any one medium, if you read back over my posts.

do you know what is also not unusual? journalists making up stories.

Lucuma · 20-06-2019 09:50AM

the butcher wrote: »

What annoys me still is the parents of Boy A. The thought process goes to show the lengths some will go to protect their own, regardless of the reality presented to them.

Your son comes home, bloodstained..you would immediately ask what happened and check for the cuts/wounds/source of the bleeding. No signs of bleeding....you hear he's attacked by 2 adult men with "inner city accents". Somehow your 13 year old son managed to overpower them both and kick one in the head standing up. A kick so hard the man bled enough to stain BOTH boots. You decide to clean his clothes and wash them overnight?!

Instead of initially ringing the Gardai, you go back down to the park to check about with your son. And at some stage bump into Gardai and tell them to check somewhere else?! Not tell them there and then your son was attacked?!

You're leaving out the bit about the park ranger, did you read his evidence? He said he was in the park ranger's cabin when he heard a loud knocking on the door. An irate man was outside saying his son had been attacked in the park. The park ranger went over and had a look at the son sitting in the car and tried to talk to him.

That shows the mentality of Boy A's parents/father. Straight away looking for someone to blame because his precious little boy got hopped

Moonymoon00 · 20-06-2019 09:50AM

What worries me is that I have seen different pictures that claim to be the identity of boy a and b . But they are not the same boys in all pictures . Is it possible that people are under the impression that they know their identities but it's actually pictures of innocent boys ?

Lillyfae · 20-06-2019 09:52AM

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

The good far out weighs the bad. There's teenage tech millionaires that created apps etc.

That's a ridiculous statement. Do you honestly think that there are more teenage tech millionaires than teenage tyrants attacking their peers through various tech platforms??

Children's access to technology as it stands doesn't sit well with me. How parents are monitoring and policing their children's use of technology varies wildly from child to child. I often talk to colleagues with preteen/ teen children and they have nothing good to say about the kids having smart phones, but also don't seem to have any inclination to remove them, arguing "they all have them, we can't deprive our child".

There needs to be an absolute enforcement of the age barrier to all social media, and a complete ban on smart phones for children under this age. In order to teach them to use it, perhaps there could be a platform introduced in schools- not a pupil or staff member, no access- most schools have an intranet nowadays so I can't imagine that this would be massively difficult. No-one seems to be doing this on a local, national or global level anywhere even though every single day we hear new cases of horror related to social media/ technology use by children.

Boggles · 20-06-2019 09:54AM

Greyfox wrote: »

We cant live in a society that doesnt have justice.

We don't.

Greyfox wrote: »

I think in Ireland people who cant understand why some people encourage mob justice are people lacking empathy for victims.

Mob justice will just create more victims and punish the innocent.

Greyfox wrote: »

Not understanding the anger is cases like this is not normal. To call it moronic indicates to me that you care more about criminals.

Anger is normal. Handing the justice system over to violent murderous mobs is moronic and not normal.

Greyfox wrote: »

We wouldnt have this problem is we had decent judges

From what I have read the judge in this case has been stellar.

TheAsYLuMkeY · 20-06-2019 09:55AM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

do you know what is also not unusual? journalists making up stories.

Have you played this game?

Play the game for an hour, than come back to me and tell me that the content and the way the game draws you in to kill more violently is not f**ked up and would be damaging for a young impressionable mind.

Let me be clear here,

These two toe rags i hope spend their LIFE imprisoned to the day they die.

I wish no ill will to their families at all.

I hope no one else ever has to go through anything like this ever again.

I see violent online content available to children as one strand of what is wrong generally with the way the world is today and should be halted.

Greyfox · 20-06-2019 09:55AM

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Example: go back about 15 years, PS2 game called 'Manhunt', read down through the page, murder in england was at the beginning linked with an obsession of this game, later not, but that could have been simply because it was to difficult to prove and could end in litigation from the makers.

The reality is you can find a video online within a minute that would be 1,000 times worse then the worst thing you'd see in a computer game. Blaming computer games is stupid as there all very tame compared to some of the stuff thats easy to access online

20-06-2019 09:56AM

Lucuma wrote: »

You're leaving out the bit about the park ranger, did you read his evidence? He said he was in the park ranger's cabin when he heard a loud knocking on the door. An irate man was outside saying his son had been attacked in the park. The park ranger went over and had a look at the son sitting in the car and tried to talk to him.

That shows the mentality of Boy A's parents/father. Straight away looking for someone to blame because his precious little boy got hopped

Why would you go to the park ranger and not the guards?

TheAsYLuMkeY · 20-06-2019 09:58AM

Greyfox wrote: »

The reality is you can find a video online within a minute that would be 1,000 times worse then the worst thing you'd see in a computer game. Blaming computer games is stupid as there all very tame compared to some of the stuff thats easy to access online

Holy crap, i have never said it was solely down to that, its one factor in a bigger picture i offered as an example.

Boggles · 20-06-2019 10:00AM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Why would you go to the park ranger and not the guards?

He said he rang the guards and couldn't get through, the park ranger then tried and got through and handed the phone to the father.

In reality.

A young fella getting a small bit of hiding wouldn't be far up on the list priorities of the guards that day or any day really.

J11 · 20-06-2019 10:00AM

As a man in his 20s, it breaks my heart every time I see a photo of that lovely girl. The depravity of the crime hits hard and it's depressing knowing what she had to go through knowing full well her life was ripped away so callously. I'm not religious but I hope she's at peace now somewhere better than the world we live in.

Lucuma · 20-06-2019 10:00AM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Why would you go to the park ranger and not the guards?

He obviously blamed the park ranger for not keeping an eye on what was happening in the park and allowing his precious darling to get attacked.

The park ranger rang the guards on his phone and handed it to Boy A's father who spoke to them.

ohnonotgmail · 20-06-2019 10:01AM

TheAsYLuMkeY wrote: »

Have you played this game?

Play the game for an hour, than come back to me and tell me that the content and the way the game draws you in to kill more violently is not f**ked up and would be damaging for a young impressionable mind.

Let me be clear here,

These two toe rags i hope spend their LIFE imprisoned to the day they die.

I wish no ill will to their families at all.

I hope no one else ever has to go through anything like this ever again.

I see violent online content available to children as one strand of what is wrong generally with the way the world is today and should be halted.

there is nothing to support the claim that the killer in that case ever played the game. Some journalist made the link from thin air. that is the point i am making.

ManOfMystery · 20-06-2019 10:02AM

Lackadaisical wrote: »

Beyond words.

I read Conor Gallagher's article in Irish Times on the case and to be quite honest I feel like I've been punched in the stomach. I'm not usually traumatised by newspaper articles, but this one is an exception. How the hell could anyone do something like that to anyone?

My thoughts are with Ana, her parents and the Kriegel family. May she rest in peace and never be forgotten.

Just got round to reading it last night. A long, harrowing and upsetting read - not just because of the murder and brutality, but because of the bullying and seemingly lonely life she had before that.

I don't have a lot of time for some journalists in this day and age where a lot of 'journalism' is comprised of copy and pastes from social media and other sites, but in this case, I found this to be a very respectful, heavily researched article which covered the unique circumstances of this difficult case in a way that really hit home how sad the whole situation was.

I would encourage anyone to read this because it may just open your eyes a bit to those vulnerable children and teens around us who we assume are just getting on with things, but are actually suffering silently.

mcgovern · 20-06-2019 10:03AM

Moonymoon00 wrote: »

What worries me is that I have seen different pictures that claim to be the identity of boy a and b . But they are not the same boys in all pictures . Is it possible that people are under the impression that they know their identities but it's actually pictures of innocent boys ?

There is a boy in a town close by around the same age as Boy A, with the same name.
If you google Boy As name, even including Leixlip in the search, you'll find pictures of this innocent lad and none of Boy A. I've seen people reference some of these pictures relating to Boy A, so wouldn't be at all surprised if they are being circulated.

sbsquarepants · 20-06-2019 10:10AM

Lucuma wrote: »

Or another way of looking it is that he confessed.

That doesn't mean he shouldn't have been charged with murder. But it means there might be some hope of rehabilitation for him

He didn't confess, he tripped himself up. There's a huge difference - he's a sick little bastard.

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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