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Shane Ross' new speeding penalties

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    #542
    swarlb
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭swarlb


    mgn wrote: »
    I never seen and evidence of motorist driving up on footpaths killing people or trying to run over cyclist or pedestrians in the dark.

    You are correct... they tend to do it in broad daylight instead !

    https://lovindublin.com/news/dublin-taxi-cyclist-bike-video


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    #543
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    swarlb wrote: »
    You are correct... they tend to do it in broad daylight instead !

    https://lovindublin.com/news/dublin-taxi-cyclist-bike-video

    Taxi drivers are allowed to chase them.The have special licence for it.


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    #544
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    amcalester wrote: »
    If, as you say, the RSA measure deaths where the safe limit was exceeded, and this safe limit is (often) less than the posted limit, then what is the issue with putting measures in place to catch people exceeding the posted limit?

    I'm aware that the safe limit will depend on road conditions and that in some cases the safe limit may be above the posted limit, but there has to be a cut off or upper limit, probably more so for pedestrians/cyclists etc than the motorist them-self.

    I'd agree with you about the RSA being dishonest, they've decided what "safe" looks like and are pushing that as the answer to Road Safety despite any evidence to the contrary.

    Because it won't reduce the No's in statistics.

    All they need to do is enforce whats on the books already.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #545
    Vicxas
    Registered Users Posts: 15,282 ✭✭✭✭Vicxas


    Can anyone tell me if this passed through the cabinet?


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    #546
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    mgn wrote: »
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    You need to go well beyond looking at the figures. You need to look at the causes of deaths. I've never seen any evidence that 'safety gear' for cyclists saves lives, or that pedestrians wearing headphones cause deaths.

    I never seen and evidence of motorist driving up on footpaths killing people or trying to run over cyclist or pedestrians in the dark.
    How hard have you looked?

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-24-dies-after-car-struck-pedestrians-on-pavement-36106495.html

    Looks like we might have a technology solution available soon, if governments have the guts to stand up to the motoring industry

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/13/car-lobby-opposes-eu-safety-bid-that-would-save-1300-lives-a-year


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    #547
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    How hard have you looked?

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-24-dies-after-car-struck-pedestrians-on-pavement-36106495.html

    Looks like we might have a technology solution available soon, if governments have the guts to stand up to the motoring industry

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/13/car-lobby-opposes-eu-safety-bid-that-would-save-1300-lives-a-year

    And damn right they are opposed to it, total and utter nanny state nonsense. Trying to take all the fun out of driving.


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    #548
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Sienna Black Sacrifice wrote: »
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    How hard have you looked?

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-24-dies-after-car-struck-pedestrians-on-pavement-36106495.html

    Looks like we might have a technology solution available soon, if governments have the guts to stand up to the motoring industry

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/13/car-lobby-opposes-eu-safety-bid-that-would-save-1300-lives-a-year

    And damn right they are opposed to it, total and utter nanny state nonsense. Trying to take all the fun out of driving.
    So speeding is the fun bit?


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    #549
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,544 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    Sienna Black Sacrifice wrote: »
    And damn right they are opposed to it, total and utter nanny state nonsense. Trying to take all the fun out of driving.

    If it was to kick in around schools, residential areas, black spots instead of vehicle & environmentally unfriendly ramps I’d be all for it.


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    #550
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    How hard have you looked?

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-24-dies-after-car-struck-pedestrians-on-pavement-36106495.html

    Looks like we might have a technology solution available soon, if governments have the guts to stand up to the motoring industry

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/13/car-lobby-opposes-eu-safety-bid-that-would-save-1300-lives-a-year

    https://www.thejournal.ie/woman-critical-collision-cyclist-3920019-Mar2018/

    What about the cyclist flying around the place with regard for nothing,up on footpaths, breaking lights, no lights on bikes, no safety gear.Why is there no rules for them?.Answer because we got a shower of anti motorist cyclist ministers and councillors who make the rules.


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    #551
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    mgn wrote: »
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    How hard have you looked?

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/man-24-dies-after-car-struck-pedestrians-on-pavement-36106495.html

    Looks like we might have a technology solution available soon, if governments have the guts to stand up to the motoring industry

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/dec/13/car-lobby-opposes-eu-safety-bid-that-would-save-1300-lives-a-year

    https://www.thejournal.ie/woman-critical-collision-cyclist-3920019-Mar2018/

    What about the cyclist flying around the place with regard for nothing,up on footpaths, breaking lights, no lights on bikes, no safety gear.Why is there no rules for them?.Answer because we got a shower of anti motorist cyclist ministers and councillors who make the rules.
    There are plenty of rules for cyclists and cyclists are prosecuted by Gardai as required.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/nearly-600-cyclists-fined-under-new-penalty-regime-1.2631593

    Like most of the rules for motorists, they are ignored most of the time.

    But let's not pretend that cyclists are in the same ballpark as motorists for danger and harm.

    Motorists have killed 4,000 people in Ireland over the last 15 years. Cyclists have killed zero people over the same period. Motorists kill about 1 pedestrian each week on average.


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    #552
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    There are plenty of rules for cyclists and cyclists are prosecuted by Gardai as required.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/nearly-600-cyclists-fined-under-new-penalty-regime-1.2631593

    Like most of the rules for motorists, they are ignored most of the time.

    But let's not pretend that cyclists are in the same ballpark as motorists for danger and harm.

    Motorists have killed 4,000 people in Ireland over the last 15 years. Cyclists have killed zero people over the same period. Motorists kill about 1 pedestrian each week on average.

    Is it always the motorist fault when the pedestrian gets killed.


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    #553
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,544 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    mgn wrote: »
    https://www.thejournal.ie/woman-critical-collision-cyclist-3920019-Mar2018/

    What about the cyclist flying around the place with regard for nothing,up on footpaths, breaking lights, no lights on bikes, no safety gear.Why is there no rules for them?.Answer because we got a shower of anti motorist cyclist ministers and councillors who make the rules.

    I think the bigger concern are the cars that cause more accidents, do more damage, kill and maim more people and are less skilful in managing their vehicles.

    I don’t know who told you there were no rules for cyclists. You clearly need to brush up on the rules of the road if you thing certain road users don’t have applicable rules.


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    #554
    bazz26
    Registered Users Posts: 51,157 ✭✭✭✭bazz26


    Oh I see the usual motorist hater from the MAMIL forum has wondered in again with the usual top trump links to reaffirm his self hatred towards motorists. That chip on your shoulder is really getting bigger, best get a surgeon to take a look at it as soon as possible before it completely consumes you.


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    #555
    koheim
    Registered Users Posts: 156 ✭✭koheim


    Vicxas wrote: »
    Can anyone tell me if this passed through the cabinet?

    Should pass no problem, same as the drink driving bill. Only a few obscure senators complaining, and of course Mattie McGrath.


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    #556
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    I think the bigger concern are the cars that cause more accidents, do more damage, kill and maim more people and are less skilful in managing their vehicles.

    I don’t know who told you there were no rules for cyclists. You clearly need to brush up on the rules of the road if you thing certain road users don’t have applicable rules.

    What planet are you living on.Drive around any town and within 5 minutes you will see someone idot up on the footpath or going through a red light.Or maybe you only see what you want to see.The cyclists have rules but the ignore them.The would rather complain about the motorist.


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    #557
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,544 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    mgn wrote: »
    What planet are you living on.Drive around any town and within 5 minutes you will see someone idot up on the footpath or going through a red light.Or maybe you only see what you want to see.The cyclists have rules but the ignore them.The would rather complain about the motorist.

    I see just as many cars breaking lights MGN. I’m a motorists, but I cycle commute too, which means I’m usually at the top of the line in traffic at lights. This, along with my standing height and unimpeded (by pillars) view of traffic means I see a lot more than you do in your car and believe me, cars are way more dangerous and careless.

    Aside from that, the stats speak for themselves.

    Pedestrians and cyclists are almost 50% of traffic in Dublin.

    Yet cyclists are the cause of less than 10% of accidents and emergency braking with the LUAS.

    And cars cause 50% of accidents and emergency braking with the LUAS.


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    #558
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    I see just as many cars breaking lights MGN. I’m a motorists, but I cycle commute too, which means I’m usually at the top of the line in traffic at lights. This, along with my standing height and unimpeded (by pillars) view of traffic means I see a lot more than you do in your car and believe me, cars are way more dangerous and careless.

    Aside from that, the stats speak for themselves.

    Pedestrians and cyclists are almost 50% of traffic in Dublin.

    Yet cyclists are the cause of less than 10% of accidents and emergency braking with the LUAS.

    And cars cause 50% of accidents and emergency braking with the LUAS.

    Funny when i'm sitting at traffic lights i usually see the cyclist come along look around if there is nothing coming carries on regardless of what colour the light is,


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    #559
    The Specialist
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭The Specialist


    mgn wrote: »
    Funny when i'm sitting at traffic lights i usually see the cyclist come along look around if there is nothing coming carries on regardless of what colour the light is,

    Same experience every day. Just last Friday I had a cyclist decide he would continue straight through a red junction (I had green light for a right turn with traffic stopped further up) and narrowly avoided getting himself pasted on to the road. It's nothing new though, you just have to understand that a cyclists intelligence or sense of self preservation isn't very high at all and plan around that.


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    #560
    Kevin Finnerty
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,254 ✭✭✭Kevin Finnerty


    koheim wrote: »
    Should pass no problem, same as the drink driving bill. Only a few obscure senators complaining, and of course Mattie McGrath.

    Shane Ross will hopefully become obscure come next election.


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    #561
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    mgn wrote: »
    John_Rambo wrote: »
    I see just as many cars breaking lights MGN. I’m a motorists, but I cycle commute too, which means I’m usually at the top of the line in traffic at lights. This, along with my standing height and unimpeded (by pillars) view of traffic means I see a lot more than you do in your car and believe me, cars are way more dangerous and careless.

    Aside from that, the stats speak for themselves.

    Pedestrians and cyclists are almost 50% of traffic in Dublin.

    Yet cyclists are the cause of less than 10% of accidents and emergency braking with the LUAS.

    And cars cause 50% of accidents and emergency braking with the LUAS.

    Funny when i'm sitting at traffic lights i usually see the cyclist come along look around if there is nothing coming carries on regardless of what colour the light is,
    If you really want to go down the "who breaks the law most" road, have a look at the RSA Speed Survey first please, and see how 60% - 80% of motorists break speed limits. Then have a look at the Aviva mobile phone abuse survey and see how Ireland is 2nd worst in Europe.

    Then have a look at the road death figures.


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    #562
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    The Specialist wrote: »
    mgn wrote: »
    Funny when i'm sitting at traffic lights i usually see the cyclist come along look around if there is nothing coming carries on regardless of what colour the light is,

    Same experience every day. Just last Friday I had a cyclist decide he would continue straight through a red junction (I had green light for a right turn with traffic stopped further up) and narrowly avoided getting himself pasted on to the road. It's nothing new though, you just have to understand that a cyclists intelligence or sense of self preservation isn't very high at all and plan around that.
    Isn't it amazing how, for all these stories that we hear of cyclists nearly getting killed breaking red lights, cyclists don't actually get killed breaking red lights.

    How could that possibly be?


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    #563
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,544 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    mgn wrote: »
    Funny when i'm sitting at traffic lights i usually see the cyclist come along look around if there is nothing coming carries on regardless of what colour the light is,

    I see cyclists looking around and if there's nothing coming carrying on regardless.

    I see motorists blindly blasting through red lights at much much higher speeds without checking if there's anything coming every day.

    And don’t forget, cyclists tend to have much better reflexes and faster reactions that car drivers


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    #564
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    mgn wrote: »
    What about the cyclist flying around the place with regard for nothing,up on footpaths, breaking lights, no lights on bikes, no safety gear.Why is there no rules for them?
    Are you trying to take all the fun out of cycling?


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    #565
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    If you really want to go down the "who breaks the law most" road, have a look at the RSA Speed Survey first please, and see how 60% - 80% of motorists break speed limits. Then have a look at the Aviva mobile phone abuse survey and see how Ireland is 2nd worst in Europe.

    Then have a look at the road death figures.

    Have you no motorist to report today to your clamper mates.Seen that you have them on speed dial.


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    #566
    mgn
    Registered Users Posts: 1,904 ✭✭✭mgn


    John_Rambo wrote: »
    I see cyclists looking around and if there's nothing coming carrying on regardless.

    I see motorists blindly blasting through red lights at much much higher speeds without checking if there's anything coming every day.

    And don’t forget, cyclists tend to have much better reflexes and faster reactions that car drivers

    What brainless idiot told you that.


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    #567
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    mgn wrote: »
    What brainless idiot told you that.

    Cyclists are better drivers too.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2018/10/09/cyclists-are-better-drivers-than-motorists-finds-study/#6b2fa196f6c8


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    #568
    The Specialist
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,539 ✭✭✭The Specialist


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Isn't it amazing how, for all these stories that we hear of cyclists nearly getting killed breaking red lights, cyclists don't actually get killed breaking red lights.

    How could that possibly be?

    What an idiotic ****ing question. The cyclist I was referring to meeting last week only escaped serious injury or death because of MY actions and awareness as a motorist to avoid him - certainly not because of whatever dust was whistling around in his brain dead skull. A little darker road, maybe darker clothes and he could have had a family facing christmas minus a loved one, purely because he felt a red light didn't apply to him.


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    #569
    John_Rambo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,544 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    mgn wrote: »
    What brainless idiot told you that.

    The same stats that prove cyclists make better drivers! Much faster reaction times and far superior awareness than non-cycling drivers. A lot of professional racing drivers cycle for you good reason.


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    #570
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    The Specialist wrote: »
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Isn't it amazing how, for all these stories that we hear of cyclists nearly getting killed breaking red lights, cyclists don't actually get killed breaking red lights.

    How could that possibly be?

    What an idiotic ****ing question. The cyclist I was referring to meeting last week only escaped serious injury or death because of MY actions and awareness as a motorist to avoid him - certainly not because of whatever dust was whistling around in his brain dead skull. A little darker road, maybe darker clothes and he could have had a family facing christmas minus a loved one, purely because he felt a red light didn't apply to him.
    And yet, I can't recall a single case of a cyclist being killed after running a red light in Ireland in living memory - can you?

    Is it just possible that people might be exaggerating the danger, or the nearness of the near misses or the frequency?


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    #571
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,540 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    mgn wrote: »
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    If you really want to go down the "who breaks the law most" road, have a look at the RSA Speed Survey first please, and see how 60% - 80% of motorists break speed limits. Then have a look at the Aviva mobile phone abuse survey and see how Ireland is 2nd worst in Europe.

    Then have a look at the road death figures.

    Have you no motorist to report today to your clamper mates.Seen that you have them on speed dial.
    Did that already on the way in, thanks - hopefully will get a few more on the way home.


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