BBC goes FTA: 10th July

DMC

Breaking news on Media Guardian.... more to follow...

11am: The BBC is ending its £85m agreement with Sky and launching its own free-to-air digital satellite service. More follows...

DMC

Whoa! In the clear!!!

Full press Release

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/stories/2003/03_march/12/digital_sat.shtml

BBC goes in the clear on digital satellite

The BBC today (Wednesday 12 March 2003) announced that from 30 May it will, for the first time, broadcast its eight TV channels unencrypted on digital satellite.

This decision means that digital satellite viewers in the UK will, in the future, be able to receive the BBC channels without a Sky viewing card, through any make of digital satellite receiver. Current and future Sky subscribers will still be able to receive all the BBC's services.

It also means that the BBC will save an estimated £85 million over the next five years because it will no longer be using BSkyB's Conditional Access system.

Of the savings, £40 million will be used to improve access to all the BBC's regional services on digital satellite (DSAT). The BBC national services in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland, plus, for the first time, all 15 regional variations of BBC ONE in England will all be available on DSAT and listed together on Sky's Electronic Programme Guide (EPG).

BBC Director-General Greg Dyke said: "This is an important decision for the BBC which will save us a considerable amount of money. It will also bring new benefits to viewers right across the country, will broaden the appeal of digital satellite and enable as many people as possible to get the BBC's digital channels.

"For the first time ever, all the BBC's regional and national services will be available to viewers right across the UK. This means that a Scot living in London can get BBC ONE Scotland, or a native of Yorkshire, living in Cornwall could watch regional programmes from their home region."

Today's decision has been triggered by two events. Firstly, the BBC's five year contract with BSkyB for conditional access ends in May, so alternative options can be considered.

Secondly, by moving all the BBC's services to the Astra 2D satellite, whose signals are tightly focused, the BBC can limit broadcasting principally to the UK. This removes the need to encrypt for rights purposes.

However, to ensure that satellite viewers continue to receive the right regional version when they watch BBC ONE or BBC TWO, the BBC will need a one-off change from Sky, for which it has offered to pay a fair price, including a profit margin.

This involves a simple adaptation to the EPG software which allows the viewer to select the regional service they want so they always get 'their' BBC ONE or BBC TWO.

However, if this is not achieved, the BBC will still go ahead with broadcasting its services unencrypted on DSAT.

Notes to Editors

• There are currently 6.6 million Sky subscribers who will continue to receive all the BBC channels. Anyone else with a Sky box, including the estimated 1 million homes that have 'churned' out of subscription or opted for a non subscription 'solus' card, will also continue to receive the BBC's services.

• Ever since the BBC started broadcasting on satellite, they have paid Sky a fee for 'conditional access'. This has meant that the BBC's signal is scrambled (encrypted) to ensure that it is only received in the UK and that audiences get the right regional service for where they live.

• The BBC pays the uplink costs to the satellite and for the cost of Astra satellite capacity. It paid Sky for conditional access and a charge for listing on the EPG.

• There are currently nearly 80 TV channels broadcasting in the clear on satellite in Europe, plus 61 radio stations, including CNN, EuroNews and Turner Classic Movies.

• CNN currently pay Sky just under £30,000 for their EPG listing. The BBC expects to pay a comparable price as it moves to an unencrypted transmission and ceases to require conditional access.

• The national and regional services available on the EPG will include the 15 English regional versions of BBC ONE, plus the English-wide version of BBC TWO, plus the national versions of BBC ONE and BBC TWO in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

• The BBC will continue to support the other British public service broadcasters to get a satellite 'must carry' clause as an amendment to the Communications Bill, which is now heading for the House of Lords. The BBC will also continue to argue for clarification in the Bill that 'due prominence', under the ITC's EPG code, means making the right regional service available via slots 101 and 102.

Leesider

Very Interesting indeed.

Does this mean we can watch Scottish football (unencrypted) anywhere in the UK?

If the BBC is in the clear, will all digiboxes be able to access all their channels, including ROI boxes? Or will it be like 5live - blocked?

Lots of topics for discussion!

DMC

Its moving to 2D, which I heard a long long time ago. Now that the contract with Sky is up in May, ALL Services will go unencrypted. It makes reference in the press release that all BBC ONE regions will be there.

And, as we are in the path of 2D, all services should be available with an FTA reciever here. I would say that there might be some block on RoI sub cards, a la ITV.

Very bad news for people in Europe, though.

DMC

Media Guardian's take on it now...

http://media.guardian.co.uk/broadcast/story/0,7493,912657,00.html

icdg

I'd presume that the BBC will still need an EPG deal with Sky, but it should be so much cheaper without having to licence the NDS Videocrypt system.

So from May 30th, there is the strong possiblity that you will be able to recieve all the BBC services via "Other Channels".

Does this mean the end of the FTV card scheme, I wonder? Certainly the point of the scheme is very limited if its just for ITV1, Channel 4, and Channel Five.

Whats' the current going price of a DSat reciever and satellite dish without Sky contract? I will sevirely consider getting one if this is going to be the case!

DMC

Its really big news, ICDG, for us here in Ireland.

It is possible that all services are there in Other Channels, but I'd say that Sky will do a number on Irish sub boxes. I'd like now to get my hands on a non-Sky digibox.

The FTV scheme is dead, you will no longer need a card.

MediaGuardian. "The BBC today effectively launched a competitive service to BSkyB" Utter rubbish.

icdg

Well, if the FTV card scheme is dead, then surely all one will need to do, if a block is put on Irish digiboxes, is to pull out the viewing card. I believe the EPG returns to the UK-style EPG then?

Johnmb

Why would they bother to put a block on the ROI cards? Surely it is in their interests to have as many channels available as possible for their viewers (even if the channels don't pay Sky, it will encourage people to subscribe to Sky if they get all these channels as a handy side effect). Does anybody know when the ITV channels, Ch4 and Ch5 five contracts expire, and would it be likely that they will follow the BBC's lead when their contracts do expire?

JDxtra

That is incorrect. If you remove your Irish viewing card from a digibox the EPG remains the same and does not become a UK EPG.

I have not tried this, but I believe you have to remove the card, and do a software update with no card in the box for it to return to a UK EPG.

JDxtra

I thought the BBC ran the "FTA card" scheme. If no card will be required from May, then surely people will also want ITV, C4 & C5 to go down the same road as BBC and go unencrypted on 2D.

DMC

ITV were never in the FTV club, afaik, Sky did all the work for them, and NTL did the uplinking. It will be a major cost saving on the BBC's part if the FTV business ends.

Ch4 and five, well, they are on Dsat as long as the BBC, so they might change. But remember that Ch4 has FilmFour and E4, which are subscription based channels.

Why would they bother to put a block on the ROI cards?

Why wouldnt they? Look what happened to ITV when it appeared on Irish boxes.

DMC

Just remembered this bit....

Originally posted by Johnmb
Surely it is in their interests to have as many channels available as possible for their viewers (even if the channels don't pay Sky, it will encourage people to subscribe to Sky if they get all these channels as a handy side effect).

It doesn't work like that. Currently, the BBC receive a rights fee from cable and satellite operators in order to carry BBC ONE and TWO on TV down here. If the BBC went FTA on Irish Sky subs, the cable companies will be up in arms, big time. Some block will be put in place. Its worth money to the BBC being on subscription TV here, this wont end.

Unless you have an FTA receiver.

Also, its going FTA. You wont need an Sky digibox to receive them. A non-Sky digibox will work, i.e. You wont have to pay Sky a cent to get all the BBC services.

Johnmb

But was ITV not attached to the FTV cards? IOW, it made sense when the cards were around, but it surely wouldn't make sense if the cards are done away with. I may be wrong in my thinking, but it just seems that it would require effort to block the channels, whereas to do nothing would not only be easier, it may encourage more people to get Sky Digiboxes as they are the easiest boxes to get your hands on. If the ITV and Ch4 channels are also made FTA, then the likes of NTL and Chorus would be in a lot of trouble in Ireland, to the benefit of Sky, without them having to do a thing.

JDxtra

Yes, this is defo good news. No matter what happens with Irish digiboxes - at least people will be able to get BBC for free with an FTA reciever.

timpat

re. Sky blocking the BBC's

Wasn't it ITV Network Centre that were behind the ITV's (including UTV) being blocked in ROI? If so, unless BBC request Sky to block out ROI, shouldn't we expect to be able to add the BBC's like any other FTA channel? As has been said, its in SKy's interest to be able to provide as many channels as possible.

This is certainly big news.

The key question is - for those of us with no UK FTV card and with ROI Sky subs and Sky digiboxes, will WE be able to get the full BBC suite post 30 May??? And how would be see them if we do - via OTHER Channels or as the BBC Press Release implies, actually on the EPG?

Secondly, would we not need to get a UK FTV card to get ITV, C4 and C5?

What are people's views on these points?

JDxtra

There will be no such thing as an FTV card after May - as the BBC ran this scheme!

So, people in the UK with no Sky card (of any type) and a 2nd hand Sky box will be able to get the BBC channels - but the question is will they be able to get ITV, C4 & C5??

At the moment it is looking like they will not be able to get them channels, but they will eventually kick up a fuss and something will have to be sorted out.

Tom

I wonder if this means SKy will reduce the price of the sub considering it increased to pay for BBC1 and 2 ....Somehow I doubt it :rolleyes:

DMC

I dont think there will be any change on the BBC channels front on our Sky subs, TBH.

BBC ONE and TWO will still be there, the BBC will still recieve payment from Sky for them, but either the other services will be in the clear in "other channels" or blocked.

DMC

Originally posted by timpat
And how would be see them if we do - via OTHER Channels or as the BBC Press Release implies, actually on the EPG?

The Irish EPG is a different beast.... Other channels or blocked is the only options.

JDxtra

I don't see how Sky could easily block us from adding BBC3 etc via "Other Channels". After all, they will have no encryption!

Unless of course Sky removed the ability to add channels entirely!

icdg

In any case all you would still need is a non-subsidised digibox? Tony has them for EUR 400 for a Sky one (which I would want if at all possible, since it would contain the Sky Active engine needed to access BBCi). He also has a cheap FTA reciever for EUR 220, but the dish and installation will set one back to nearly EUR 600 for the package...

ITV were (and are) paying Sky to use the Conditional Access System, and were within their rights to have the settings changed to exclude ROI cards. But if the BBC are no longer making any payment to cover the CAS then they will no longer be able to exclude ROI. They will have to licence the CAS in order to exclude ROI, and surely that will defeat the point of this move.

There is one further thing which follows from this move - where does this leave BBC WORLDWIDE's contract with Sky for the ROI? Will that be voided also? If so, could it mean the disappearence of BBC from the ROI EPG? Certainly I would think that phone calls are being made right now between Sky and Worldwide to see if this contract will continue.

Questions to be answered...

JDxtra

An updated article on this topic has just appeared on the BBC News site. In reference to Sports rights, it says...

"If no deal can be made Scottish and Welsh viewers would still be able to watch the matches affected on analogue channels."

Indicating that they may well block programmes that they do not have the rights to broadcast all over the UK.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/tv_and_radio/2843069.stm

timpat

Although it is early days, I would speculate that Sky won't block the channels - they are hardly likely to be in the mood to cooperate with the BBC after this move today!

I'm wondering though are there frequencies/settings the BBC could use on Astra 2d that we here in ROI with standard Sky digiboxes may not be able to receive? I know that I don't seem to be able to add most of the 'extra channels' talked about on this forum with my PAce Sky digibox.

Also the question remains, if Sky's "BBC card" scheme is effectively dead from 30 May, how will people in the UK with DS get the likes of ITV, C4 and C5 (and by extension, those of us in ROI who haven't yet got an FTV card!!!)

watty

just read about this here http://forums.mediauk.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=307409#post307409

It may not happen (negociation ploy etc).

* Since last SW update the digibox remembers card after power off and does not revert to UK EPG anymore. (e.g. BBC Radio used to be on EPG if you powered on with no card, now it isn't.)

* BBC1, 2, 3, 4, Cbeebies, CBBC and News24 will ONLY be via "OTHER CHANNELS" not EPG in Ireland as Irish EPG costs extra.

* BBC1, 2, 3, 4, Cbeebies, CBBC and News24 will now work on PC direct to Disk MPEG2 recording as do other FTA.

* Still no RTE on my PC Satellite Hard Disk recording!

* Unless ITV, C4 and Five follow suit, you still need a FTV card for them. BBC never operated the FTV scheme. Sky does, previously the Post Office did!

* If you have a UK FTV card, UK cancelled sub card, UK Sub or convince the Digibox it has NO card, then you will get the FTA BBC EPG.

I will research how easy it is to convince a ROI carded box that it has no card. Anyone got the old basic EPG with no pay channels listed to come up since last SW update on box with ROI card?
It would be nice to fit a switch

icdg

Originally posted by DMC
The Irish EPG is a different beast.... Other channels or blocked is the only options.

Or option three, BBC WORLDWIDE negotiates seperately a deal to put the core services on our EPG. If the services will be available anyway, this becomes a lot easier...

Originally posted by jdempsey
So, people in the UK with no Sky card (of any type) and a 2nd hand Sky box will be able to get the BBC channels - but the question is will they be able to get ITV, C4 & C5??

If the FTV card scheme ends, presumably people will no longer be able to get ITV1, C4, or Five. However it's possible that while no more FTV cards may be issued, the existing cards might be supported on a legacy basis.

By the way, BT run (or ran) the scheme on behalf of the BBC etc.

Originally posted by timpat
re. Sky blocking the BBC's

Wasn't it ITV Network Centre that were behind the ITV's (including UTV) being blocked in ROI? If so, unless BBC request Sky to block out ROI, shouldn't we expect to be able to add the BBC's like any other FTA channel?

Indeed this was the case. See the statement issued at the time.

http://www.iolfree.ie/~icdg/news_130202b.htm

But ITV were never really FTA IIRC, they were FTV to anyone with a viewing card. Sky changed this to anyone with a UK-Sky or FTV card, blocking ROI cards. At all times ITV were using (and paying for the CAS) in order to postcode ITV1.

The thing is, from the BBC's statement they will not be using the CAS at all. BBC ONE will not be postcoded. Instead the BBC are to ask Sky nicely (and offer them some cash) to update their software to include a "Select Region" option in Settings. If Sky say no, then BBC ONE LDN and BBC TWO (Network) will be on #101 and #102 for everyone (in the UK), with the others all listed in the next available EPG positions. Another difference with this new arrangement is that the BBCi Region Select arrangement on BBC ONE (Network) will be gone, instead all BBC ONE regions will be available on the EPG for everyone (again, in the UK).

DMC

Originally posted by icdg

ITV were (and are) paying Sky to use the Conditional Access System, and were within their rights to have the settings changed to exclude ROI cards. But if the BBC are no longer making any payment to cover the CAS then they will no longer be able to exclude ROI. They will have to licence the CAS in order to exclude ROI, and surely that will defeat the point of this move.

Good point.

There is one further thing which follows from this move - where does this leave BBC WORLDWIDE's contract with Sky for the ROI? Will that be voided also? If so, could it mean the disappearence of BBC from the ROI EPG? Certainly I would think that phone calls are being made right now between Sky and Worldwide to see if this contract will continue.

This is the biggie. If it goes free, and the BBC let it go as it will in May, it buggers up the cable co's. But as they are receiving money from Sky on behalf of the subs... it is in the best interests of both parties to sort something out.

Icehouse

It seems like great news - I was worried that I may have been out of the Asra 2D footprint, but no, I scrape into it and can stick to my 60cm dish. I reckon though that the BBC will not be available to Sky subscription holders in Ireland though unless they have an FTA box - I say this simply as the BBC's target audience is the UK, the rights they buy are UK only, they get paid by RTE and other broadcasters for the rights to show BBC programmes outside the UK, get paid by cable companies for the rights to rebroadcast etc. etc.

>>MediaGuardian. "The BBC today effectively launched a competitive service to BSkyB" Utter rubbish.

I disagree - effectively the BBC has today thrown down the gauntlet to Sky - Up until now there has been nothing of quality FTA on Astra at 28° because of Sky's monopoly. BBC have broken that in one foul swoop and may prompt others to follow suit - BBC could even create a partnership with other channels to market a type of Satellite Freeview - the only Sky involvement would be for the EPG. I suppose Sky could theoretically get really nasty now and block BBC FTA from Digiboxes (as the ITV FTA was only available on non-Digiboxes a while back)

Interesting times indeed. Greg Dyke is still a to**er and the quality of BBC channels is still going down, but fair play to him for putting the cat amongst the Murdoch pigeons!!

DMC

The bee I had in my bonnet was with the word "competitive" in that sentence. Its not competition, merely raspberry blowing and the two fingered salute to Sky, saying we want to provide the same service (or better) but we dont want to pay you no more.

watty

The FTA ITV2 wasn't too easy on a FTA box either. It won't be "hidden" that way. If it's FTA on a Digibox in UK, it will work here on a Digibox, at worst via "other channels".

The ITV2 FTA wasn't "real" FTA, I had to manually create a station entry and PIDs, normal FTA is found in an Autoscan.

Since you don't need to decrypt anything, a "homemade" smart card that "convinces" the Digibox it hasn't got an ROI card would not be illegal. Then swapping cards would swap between ROI EPG and UK EPG.

Anyone see any legal issue with that as the "card" won't and can't decode any Sky encrypted channels?

I'm sceptical that it will happen, but look forward to be able to use my PC hard disk & Sat card for ALL BBC time shifting etc, not just TCM, BBC World, DW TV, German and Itallian etc.

Now if RTE would only .....

I can't imagine Chorus or NTL Ireland getting excited though!

Stiabhna

We're getting there slowly but surely. Now, why can't RTE follow suit?

Stephen

Source: Skydigital.mediabulletin.co.uk


12/03/03 ITV to follow BBC move?
Following this morning's major news about BBC's decision to launch its own free to air satellite service on Astra 2D, ITV has hinted it may follow suit when its contract with BSkyB comes up for renewal in August 2004. Joint managing director Clive Jones said ITV had long believed the prices charged for carriage were too high, and that ITV would "review all options" before renewing its contract with Sky. "We understand entirely why the BBC has felt it necessary to take this course of action and wish them every success," said Mr Jones. "ITV currently needs Sky's conditional access facilities in order to deliver the best regional service to viewers," he added. Channel 4 also welcomed the move but was more circumspect in its criticism of Sky. The C4 chief executive, Mark Thompson, said the broadcaster had a "satisfactory broadcast arrangement in place with BSkyB for some years ahead" but that the BBC's move could help bring down costs in the long term. Because it operates two pay-TV channels, Film Four and E4, Channel 4 could not broadcast on a free-to-air satellite network and needs the conditional access infrastructure supplied by Sky.

watty

Originally posted by Stiabhna
"ITV currently needs Sky's conditional access facilities in order to deliver the best regional service to viewers," he added. .

Baloney! All ITV regions are available via "other channels" with FTV card, cancelled UK sub card or UK Sub. It is only an EPG payment to keep it that way if they don't use encryption, exactly as BBC proposes to allow 1 of 15 BBC1s to be 101.
The way epg works is separate.

For what BBC wants, though, sky would have to add a "region menu" in the Services | Setup as there might not be a card to tell box which region it is.

Then an Scotsman in London can change his settings and have BBC Soctland as 101.

If Sky won't do this, then "Main" BBC 1 (London?) will be 101 and the other BBC1s will be currently unused EPG numbers.

Similar applies to 102, 960, 961 and 962. If BBC gets menu added, your own BBC2 will be 102 (as at present), otherwise The 102, 960, 961, 962 will be current England Layout.

(Those of you who have only ever seen an ROI epg havn't a clue waht I'm warbling about though?)

icdg

ITV is tied into a contract with Sky, but in any case, will probably want to "wait and see" how this BBC move pans out.

If the BBC suceeds in pursauding Sky to change its software (not exactly easy!), then ITV could hop on the back of this move.

The thing is, the software selector would probably have to have options to select both ITV and BBC region.

Its easy for us - BBC NI = UTV.

But for Scotland, you have BBC Scotland, but a choice of STV, Grampian, or Border. You'd need independent selectors for BBC and ITV. But if one can be done, then the other could also.

Now here's something. Can different versions of the software be applied to ROI and UK? Will we get this selector also? The answer should be "no", but wait and see...

carrolls

Great news, but how will Sky react in the short term?
Reduce Subacription rates,;)
Block Sky News.:mad:
Will ITV & Channel 4 follow suit and go FTA?
Do we need to reposition our satellite dishes to receive Astra 2D?

Icehouse

>>For what BBC wants, though, sky would have to add a "region menu" in the Services | Setup as there might not be a card to tell box which region it is.

Maybe the BBC are just asking Sky to implement software technology they know Sky already have? We'll have to wait and see but I'm happier today than I was yesterday. Bet a lot of "FTV-iewers" are breathing a sigh of relief as well, if the Beeb does go FTA

Icehouse

>>Do we need to reposition our satellite dishes to receive Astra 2D?

not unless you have problems receiving 2D at the moment, or you've been pointing at Hotbird lately ;op

Darby OGill

I'm not too well up on the various agreements between Sky/BBC/chorus/NTL, so these questions might be daft-

1. If BBC goes free-to-air on Astra 2D and is readily available in Ireland as a result, Sky and the others will lose those customers who are only subscribing in order to get BBC (and even more if ITV/channel 4 follow suit). While the numbers might not be huge, there is a loss of income to the various providers, and presumably the BBC. Why would the BBC make their services available free to Ireland, given that we pay no licence fee to them, when they currently get an income for this very service?
2. Can Sky block or otherwise attempt to interfere with the signal which is being processed through a Sky digibox? (I'm suggesting that Sky would be so pissed off with this development that they could say to customers or ex-customers- Sod off and buy a different free-to-air receiver if you want BBC-no way will we help you!)

watty

Some of the Sky Channels you get ARE on 2D, so reception is not an issue.

Extra cost of Rights / Loss of earnings for ROI (< 1M viewers?) is peanuts compared to about 15M stg per year saving on Encryption.

Ultimately We don't pay Licence Fee for RTE, nor UKers for BBC, though RTE and BBC funded from licence. Ulimately Licence Fee is a tax on having TV reception. (Though a letter I saw suggested that in UK if you can prove you receive only foriegn, not even C4 or "Five", they could waive licence fee!)

2. I think UK Gov would take very dim view of Sky blocking BBC. If it FTA in UK with no card, a Digibox anywhere in signal area can be made to work. Neither BBC nor UK gov would care if it it blocked on ROI EPG (it would be very unlikely it could be fTA in UK and not work via "other Channels" here.

Don't forget, unlike NTL or Chorus, or Ill fated On Digital Subscribers, EVERY ROI and UK Sky Digibox is "Owner / Occupied".

The only two conditions on ownership is that if you cancel sub in first year you are liable for repayment of any initial subsidy. Still your box. The other condition is that Sky own the EPG and Operating system software on your box....
But you don't own your PC OS eithier! You have a "licence" to use it! Nor do you own the SW in the 3 or 4 microcontrollers in your VCR or DVD player. So I wouldn't overly worry about Sky's ownership of the OS and EPG SW.

If someone wants to distribute BBC outside of UK they need to pay. If the want to redistribute BBC inside UK they need permission.

BBC NI Divis can be recieved in much of East, Midlands and Boarder. Even in Limerick on Keepers hill. It doesn't affect Chorus or NTL.

C5 could be received in whole of Ireland FTA on Analog Satellite till last Sky Channel closed.

If people can receive BBC by "other means" it does not affect Chorus / NTL, other than their competitiveness and what they might be prepared to pay BBC.

For years Cable & MMDS companies have been BBC parasites rather than offering a "real" quality multichannel service. Sky's entry to Multichannel market in Ireland has, I beleive helped. A sensible Digital MMDS package now exists (would it ever hace gone Digital otherwise?) and has dropped from nearly 39 Euro to 27 Euro for a sensible 38 channel Lineup, only due to Sky competition.

Basically in the past people got cable or MMDs for BBC, and because they couldn't put up their own "mast" for BBC.

Tony

Originally posted by icdg
In any case all you would still need is a non-subsidised digibox? Tony has them for EUR 400 for a Sky one (which I would want if at all possible, since it would contain the Sky Active engine needed to access BBCi). He also has a cheap FTA reciever for EUR 220, but the dish and installation will set one back to nearly EUR 600 for the package...

Actually its a little cheaper @ €459 fitted with 80cm dish or €179 for receiver only. Thanks for the plug I hope you dont mind me correcting that.

Tony

timpat

Judging from the debate I have seen here and elsewhere today it seems that all of the BBC suite will be available to us in ROI from 30 May on DS via Add Channels as Astra 2d covers Ireland. Sky can't block them because that would mean using a form of encryption which BBC are no longer signing up to.

It would seem like a good idea for Sky in Ireland to exploit this development by negotiating a fresh deal with BBC Worldwide for an EPG placing for all the BBC channels here on the basis that we will be able to see them anyway by listing them under Other Channels. It would certainly provide Sky with an edge over NTL and Chorus.

Today's developments don't however resolve the 'age old' "UTV and C4 sometime before the end of time" issue as it seems from articles I have seen that Channel 4 will be sticking with the Sky encription system due to E4 and Film Four. Also ITV are locked into a deal until August 2004 and I suppose after what happened today Sky will try to negotiate some form of deal with ITV next year to keep them on board. (Has anyone heard a peep of a reaction from the C5 camp?)

Does that seem like a fair assessment?

watty

Subscriptions are anything from 15 Euro to 50 Euro p.m.

At 26 Euro what you save in a year pays for a digibox...

Don't forget for the Interactive / Active stuff you need a Digibox.

Personally I use a Satellite Receiver for WATCHing TV or LISTENING radio, Internet miles better for interactive.

I'm happy with Teletext. Unfortuanately BBC has dumped it on Satellite, but CNN's telextext news is Good and Though RTE is encrypted on my PC receiver the Teletext still works (PC caches ALL the pages and lets you mouse click on page numbers, and copy/paste to windows apps.)

timpat

...also just a thought - We can currently add BBC Parliament to our Channel line-up - is that because this is a Free to Air channel and if so, then applying the same logic - all BBC Channels will have the same status as Parliament in which case it stands to reason that we should be able to add them to the line-up of Other Channels in the same way???

rlogue

I'd say at best Irish viewers will be able to manually add the BBC channels to their digiboxes, but would it not be possible to block RoI viewers from the other BBC channels?

In any case, I would have thought that a manual reboot of the box with the card taken out would allow Irish viewers to watch the whole lot of the beeb.

Happy Days!

Lennoxschips

Re ITV, C4, C5... Question: Would any FTV card/expired UK Sky card would do for these? i.e. I remember last year that the FTV card doesn't need to be married to your box for itv/c4/c5, I assume this is still true?

Re 2D satellite: Not necessarily bad news for Europe. I can recieve 2D absolutely perfect in Holland with a 50 cm dish that is slightly misaligned (It was windy and I'm too lazy to fix it). I've heard that with a large dish you can get 2D as far south as Northern Italy. (2D is bad news for bar/cafe owners in southern Spain though, obviously)

muffinhead

I got an FTV card, which I activated last week. However, since then I have been trying out manual channel tuning on Sky (with my Irish sub-card) and I have been able to pick up Channel 4, Five & ITV (all regions are available incl. UTV)! Has anyone else tried this or does everyone use an FTV card to get these channels??

Originally posted by muffinhead
I got an FTV card, which I activated last week. However, since then I have been trying out manual channel tuning on Sky (with my Irish sub-card) and I have been able to pick up Channel 4, Five & ITV (all regions are available incl. UTV)! Has anyone else tried this or does everyone use an FTV card to get these channels??

If it is your Irish card that is giving you the UK channels, then it is one of those flukey cards
99.9% of Irish sub cards will give the blue screen with the "08" message channel unavailable
mm

TVDX

Message to Watty!,
i was reading one of your earlier posts that sky was operating the ftv scheme and that it would keep going for the remaining channels.

But what i want to know is will they now not bother replacing the cards that they have issued or will they still go ahead and replace them?.

Will they still be issuing new cards?.

Originally posted by icdg
In any case all you would still need is a non-subsidised digibox? Tony has them for EUR 400 for a Sky one (which I would want if at all possible, since it would contain the Sky Active engine needed to access BBCi).

Or you could take a daytrip on the train to Newry ( aprox €22 ) and buy a sky plus for €330
And then pay Tony for the install
mm

Originally posted by TVDX
Message to Watty!,
i was reading one of your earlier posts that sky was operating the ftv scheme and that it would keep going for the remaining channels.

But what i want to know is will they now not bother replacing the cards that they have issued or will they still go ahead and replace them?.

Will they still be issuing new cards?.

Watty said earlier that this could still al be just a negotiaion ploy by the BBC...but maybe not We won't know till later on but it augers well anyhow.

In answer to your question, Sky will have to continue to issue the new cards for FTV viewers as their contract with the BBC still stands and are doing so at the moment.
mm

muffinhead

I get the blue screen when I try to tune in BBC1 Scotland but my BBC1 NI still hasn't been activated on my Irish sub-card so i'll see if that comes on when BBC1 NI is activated!

Am I just lucky to get CH4, 5, BBC3, BBC4, ITV1, ITV2, BBC News 24, Cbeebies & CBBC channel without an FTV card !

watty

Originally posted by rlogue
I'd say at best Irish viewers will be able to manually add the BBC channels to their digiboxes, but would it not be possible to block RoI viewers from the other BBC channels?

In any case, I would have thought that a manual reboot of the box with the card taken out would allow Irish viewers to watch the whole lot of the beeb.

Happy Days!

Result of research into this posted. Taking out card or a New Install in Service menu does not work. Solution is a little bit more bizzare!