I resent spending money on cars, why isn't there an EV for me

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528599#Comment_120528599

What!!!

Most diesel cars will not do 55-65mpg daily. I have proof of that sitting in the garden now. 520d sitting at 26mpg. It will do 50 on a motorway run though.

49c a kwh too. Who in their right mind is paying that?

cgorzy

Night rate will not suit everyone, more than the car needs to be considered in that decision unless already using a night rate anyway. Low car usage and required existing high daytime electric usage can mean staying with a 24hr rate works out best. Unless there is a way to even out charging for everyone to a combined lower rate, highly unlikely, then there will be people paying the same to drive 5K as someone else to drive 15K.

LasersGoPewPew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527959#Comment_120527959

How on earth are you paying 7.9c per kwh? The cheapest night rate on the market at the moment is about 21.5c per kWh.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528849#Comment_120528849

Energia had an EV plan up until a month or 2 ago. It was well posted on here advising any EV owner to grab it while still available.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528849#Comment_120528849

That's what a very large group of EV owners in the country are paying right now. Possibly even the majority. But even if you just compare a mid size 50MPG diesel at €1.60 to a mid size EV doing 17kWh at the currently best rate available of 11c for EV slot night rate and take into account 10% charging losses, the EV is still 75-80% cheaper than diesel per km

No matter what way anyone is trying to twist this, EVs are cheaper to fuel. Even if you had a 100MPG diesel, the EV would cost only half to fuel

Obviously this applies to an EV owner who charges mostly at home or free at work (as the overwhelming majority of EV owners do). If you charge your EV at fast chargers only, there isn't much in it either way. Depending on the charger and the rates, they might even be more expensive than diesel

3d4life

Anyone prefer for this drivel thread to be moved to After Hours ?

eagerv

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528849#Comment_120528849

I got in at 8.2c incl VAT last Sept. Also locked in for a year.

Was well advertised here and elsewhere, there was only one way electricity prices were going..

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528730#Comment_120528730

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528635#Comment_120528635

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528639#Comment_120528639

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528726#Comment_120528726

https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/revealed-how-irish-households-are-being-charged-the-highest-prices-in-europe-for-electricity/a643287541.html

The survey found residential electricity prices, including taxes, varied from 9.2c per kilowatt hour in Hungary to 49.9c in Ireland. The EU average was 28.3c.​

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528953#Comment_120528953

Those reports are always flawed. They seem to take the standard rate of the main incumbent utility company (formerly state monopoly) without any deductions. The people that pay 49c on a 24/7 rate and never shop around deserve no sympathy.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528962#Comment_120528962

Agreed. I pulled the figure quite lazilly in fairness. I think my own rate is 41c/unit although when it comes to my car I charge it at 0c

eagerv

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528962#Comment_120528962

I actually know people paying that rate, they wouldn't dream of shopping around.

The same as the people who pay huge prices per month for their rarely used mobiles, never thinking of going on a payg €15/month or whatever.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528923#Comment_120528923

I got it without having an EV. 🙂

Pekarirska

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527557#Comment_120527557

Your Cuban premise needs to be corrected.

Cubans drive old cars because they're not allowed to import cars privately. Too many engines ended up propelling rafts in direction of Miami, so Fidel banned all private ICE imports.

Cubans simply can't buy any car with an average $10 weekly wage and the car ownership stands at 2%. That's not a matter of choice, it's a complete absence of it.

Almost a quarter of a million Cubans (out of let's say 10 million) emigrated to the US in 2022 alone to put the country's economic misery into perspective.

ICEs are facing death and it's fast: there are more electric motorcycles in Cuba than ICEs today. And they are all Chinese.

Only Russia, Iran, UAE, Iraq, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait can produce oil below $20 with profit, the rest of the world can't. But the price must be much higher to balance petrostate's budgets, and that's the important bit.

DownByTheGarden

I am on 9c a kwh between 2 and 5am. To get that though I have to pay about 40c per kwh for any other time and even higher for dinner time electricity. But I have solar panels and a battery so not so bad for me as i can avoid using electricity at the peak times.

But to say that everyone can have 9c per kwh without a penalty for the other hours going forward is just nonsense.

Our EV is great for most of our driving, but we have a diesel for when the EV doesnt suit.

We find a combination of EV and diesel and solar gives the best setup for both cost, time spent driving, and convenience.

When we were without the diesel for a few weeks last summer when some idiot all but wrote it off we found that we spend more time waiting on chargers to be free, more time in motorway service stations and more time going out of our way to charge the car when on long journeys and on our holidays, when we couldnt just take the diesel, and that was before the charger prices went into orbit. If you put a price on your time then you see how inconvenient it can be.

The EV is great, when you have all the infrastructure around it. Like if you never have to charge publicly, or if you can offset the expensive hours home electricity that you need to use for anything else, in order to get the cheap rate for the EV during certain hours.

eusap

Buying an EV is a bit like saying i will buy a Pub so i can have cheap pints, yes you will get Cheap Pints (cost per km) but you had to buy a pub (Capital cost of car, solar panels, chargers) to get your cheap pint. But at least you can get to sit at the bar and tell everybody you have a cheap pint.

Until the capital costs come done it absolutely makes no sense to buy an EV, especially for a family.

I am not anti EV, i have often came close to pushing the Order now button on a Tesla but my Return on Investment brain says No

DownByTheGarden

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530686#Comment_120530686

LOL. Thats an excellent comparison :)

You can sit at the bar then telling everyone else who bought a bar and isnt living the dream that its just that they didnt buy the bar that suited their needs and how you never have any issues with yours and that your electricity is cheaper and that you only drink the pints between 2 and 5am and you have never had to go on hold when ordering new kegs.

Excellent :)

MojoMaker

Even if an EV was more expensive to run, right up to significantly more expensive to run, I would still choose to own and drive one over an ICE now. Having made the move there is no looking back.

When did EV buying become a commodity exercise where you end up comparing energy ratings of household appliances?

eusap

and just in case anybody is wondering I did do the maths, i assumed all at home charging and didn't include capital cost of solar etc... and even assumed a low cost of electricity. Until the capital cost of EV cars drops it makes no sense. Its at years 6 that the pendulum swings the other way

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530686#Comment_120530686

But you’re not the person being targeted to buy an EV. It’s only if you are buying a new car either way. Then consider the fuel source. Petrol, diesel or electric. Whatever suits you.

Nobody, absolutely nobody will tell you to drop everything to go buy a new EV just to save running costs. ROI on any car purchased will be lost as the value is constantly devaluing so you’ll never get the ROI. Can’t think of it like that. You’d never buy a car at all.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530844#Comment_120530844

Your maths is slightly flawed as the model 3 is €40,388 to purchase. So there’s €3k straight away in favour of the EV.

MojoMaker

Also 4.2L / 100km is that poor Golf's minimum consumption when all the stars align and pootling around like grandma.

The last F10 520D I had made similar claims - up to 65mpg!! In normal day to day use on the *mundane aspects of urban and suburban driving*, more like 8-9L / 100kms (which is all I would expect and was happy enough with).

The EV will do its average 17kwh/100kms all day in that same environment, and the Model 3 probably more like 13kwhs/100kms to be honest.

eusap

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530869#Comment_120530869

took it from tesla website this morning €42,990

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530908#Comment_120530908

Yes but you misread the on the road price. It’s €40,388.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530844#Comment_120530844

I'd think of a Model 3 as comparable to VW Passat rather than a Golf

eusap

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530892#Comment_120530892

on the model 3 i divided the range by battery capacity to come to 8.54

MojoMaker

Which is just as nonsense a figure as the 4.2L/100km on the Golf!!

Also, as Liamog mentioned, of all the products in the VW stable you're hardly comparing a Golf to a Model 3!

Lastly, if we're determined to stick with the Golf comparison, the closest directly-comparable example is the Golf Style 2.0 DSG which is €40,880 before any on-the-road charges from your local friendly VW dealer

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530915#Comment_120530915

Fix your pricing first then adjust the model 3 range to 400km. That’s a realistic range for the model 3 RWD. Not the 509 WLPT as the 509 can’t be achieved in real world driving. The 400 can easily. Same for the diesel. You won’t get 1000km from the tank. My 520d does 26mpg in real life city driving long term average. Obviously doubles for motorway runs but long term average is below 30.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530915#Comment_120530915

Ignore that.

first off, fix your model 3 price to match what it actually costs. Then use 400km as the model 3 realistic real world every day range.

The gold won’t do that mpg long term either. My 520d does 26mpg long term. Yes it doubles on motorway runs but long term is 26 mpg.

The M3 will do 400km all day every day easily.

Gumbo

Also the golf is €38k

makes the M3 a non brainer if that’s what your in the market for

eusap

Even with the real world changes, there is little in it. The reason i picked a golf is that's what LeasePlan have put in the same category for company car drivers. And also Mr Musk has said a model 3 should become an everyday peoples car