The eviction ban

Larbre34

There are many necessary solutions to the shortage of housing across the market. Some are easier to deliver than others.

But the one thing that must be done, that has never been properly done, is to set a clear and unambiguous overarching housing and planning policy for years to come that gives certainty to providers, whether its State agencies, approved housing bodies, developers, investors, aspiring owner occupiers, renters, bungalow blissers or mom and pop landlords.

It should be a strategic policy that protects against economics shocks and gives everyone putting money into creating homes that the returns will be modest, but certain, that there will be fairness in tenancy and in ownership and that taxation will be on the basis of the business that housing provision is and not on the basis of income tax. On the other hand, the standards required of landlords should be extremely high and very rigidly enforced.

There is a win-win to be achieved in Housing, but it requires massive big brass balls to slay some old sacred cows and change course from the mess we are now in.

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120326633#Comment_120326633

In fairness to the government, they were faced with potentially thousands of families on the street through no fault of their own. Some sort of short term measure was needed while they put the longer term solution in place.

The problem, of course, is they did not do the latter.

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120326744#Comment_120326744

If the Government actually did this and provided as house at a reasonable rent to everyone that needed one, private landlords would also complain that their businesses were being undercut by the State.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120326072#Comment_120326072

He also said there are currently 37 under construction. That's horrendous

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327166#Comment_120327166

Nor did they ever intend to do the latter. Hence my cynicism.

tinsofpeas

A quick look at the prime time segment there. Desperate.

If you're about to be put out onto the streets, it just doesn't make any sense to comply. It would be mortifying and humiliating, but the alternative is being mortified and humiliated sleeping on the streets. Its a very difficult decision, but it's an easy choice.

Not to mention that once you're put out, you'll have zero agency in political discourse.

In this utterly crazy situation, years in the careful making, everything is on the table now. I wouldn't be surprised nor would condemn if mass occupation of empty homes and buildings occurred.

A convergence of those affected, landlords, homeless, and tenants, those sleeping in cars, on couches, everyone, needs to come down on this government and opposition like a bomb.

It can be done next month when it's difficult, or in two months when it's worse, or next year when it's worse again. This isn't going to change on its own and the eviction ban is a flash in the pan of trouble to come.

Youd have 3rd hand embarassment from a thousand miles away. Look at how wealthy we are, say some, and then you see the shambling state of the place. A country wrecked for a few quick bob. Some trade.

irishproduce

Watching prime time tonight was shocking.

One tenant complaining she, her kids and their kids facing homelessness. Not a peep about why are all the kids being had as this seems to only make their situations more precarious. Not a mention of personal responsibility.

Then on to the grilling from the presenter to the minister, "but where are you telling her she should go now on April 1st, tell her where she is supposed to sleep".

I agree it's difficult and wouldn't fancy being in her situation but this is pure cradle to grave stuff if the government running your life for you. To make matters worse then, the government keep importing more people who are entirely dependent on the state. And I'm not talking about Ukrainians, you'd give them a pass with what they're facing.

tinsofpeas

I wouldn't be so quick to condemn an obviously cherry picked example as the woman with children and grandchildren. Saying she should have personal responsibility for the existence of the children is akin to saying they should do the economically sensible thing and just die.

Not to mention there are plenty of people who'd be far more economically pleasing to the eye that are in just as much hot water. Of the top of my head I can think of several families in such dire straits, but carefully hidden in plain sight.

There is a swelling current of invisible people badly affected by this housing crisis that won't be caught in reports or statistics.

As for the migration thing, it's like hearing someone ndlessly complain about lack of desserts and treats in a famine. There's more than enough serious trouble for people in Ireland as it is, notions of accommodating more people is up there with perpetual energy. Brainless. Barely worth the oxygen to say shut up.

What is the cracking point for people? Do you need it to be your own son on the street before you do something? Will a cousin cut it? A neighbour? An old friend?

This continues until its stopped, it'll never end on its own.

thinkabouit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120326261#Comment_120326261

he wants my taxes to compete to buy a house that I’m trying to buy by working & getting a mortgage & then councils will probably put people in it that are on welfare or refugees & will never generate 1 cent in for this country.

Mess

Bass Reeves

The government could not renew the EB as the courts would over turn it within months if not weeks unless there was exemption for owners to get the house back for themselves or for family members. 94% of units are owned by non institutional LL. A LL with 1-2 properties would have managed to get a property back by claiming it was needed for a family member. Within a short time of respossession the For Sale sign might be up on it. A vacancy tax will not work with owners of 1-2 properties that are vacant. They will just put a family members PPS number against it and that will prevent any liability. Even at that many vacant units are belong to people living with relatives, going through probate, belong to people in nursing homes etc. No vacancy tax will effect. Even if an effect VT was introduced it would take 3-5 yeras to see any serious changes.

The governmet now needs to change tack and legislate to encourage owners of vacant properties to start renting them again. As well they need to look at the RTB and regulation and make changes to certain aspects that will encourage LL to stage in the rental market. 43K units have left the sector since 2016.

Donald Trump

It would be more likely that the politicians are getting lobbied by property owners to end it. People going on about AG are just those with perpetual paranoid victim mentalities.

Don't forget that a huge chunk of the TDs appear to have multiple properties. Which they are entitled to have of course.

tinsofpeas

It has to be recognised that arguing over the finicky points of regulation and theoretical policies 5 years from now is a position of comfort.

For those currently on the sharp end of this housing crisis, there is no such comfort.

The comfortable vs the uncomfortable is a ratio that is rapidly swinging one direction.

Something is going to give. As if that couldn't have been predicted.

I think it would be a genuinely beneficial thing, all round, if this eviction lifting causes uncomfortable scenes across the country. Show people being lifted out of a home, show children being put out too, show standoffs between gardai and squatters, show places being boarded up from the inside. Make a big fat holy show of it. Show, and don't tell, the state of housing in the country for all those afraid to look up from their shoes day in and out.

Jinglejangle69

Love how posters here keep saying the streets, the streets.

Lets get one thing straight.

Not one family has spent a night on the streets in Ireland.

End of. Stop falling for the lies.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120326907#Comment_120326907

Also a landlord in RTE yesterday who had a tenant who didn’t pay rent for 3 years, went to the PRTB and they didn’t want to know.

We are now a communist country in all but name.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327896#Comment_120327896

Landlords have plenty of sway. As illustrated by the billions the State send their way every year. As well as the massive, and undeserved, gift to them whereby they are actually allowed to break a tenancy (a legally binding contract) because they say they need something, or their family needs it. Nowhere else would that be allowed. Imagine you going into work tomorrow and your boss telling you that he is letting you go with immediate effect because he needs your job for his kid. Would that be allowed? Of course not. Imagine signing a contract with a company to deliver something for them, and half way through you are summoned in and told they are cancelling the contract because the manager's relative just lost their job and they can do it instead.

It was a temporary moratorium. It might be brought it again. There is an opportunity now for anyone who was moaning about it to actually sell up and leave it. Most won't. They'll be back on here whinging again next year if another one is implemented.

tinsofpeas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327925#Comment_120327925

Not one family?

Yeah, that's very believable. Next you'll be telling us there isn't a housing crisis but an accommodation inconvenience.

A car is a good as a home, right. A child growing up in a hotel is perfectly acceptable. A setee, why not, the basis of a sustainable and fruitful future. And, yes, people living on the streets.

You might be one of the ones that needs to be shown and not told. So yeah, make as a big a show of it as possible, there's people to convince.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327942#Comment_120327942

What is the full story there?

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327949#Comment_120327949

Riiiiiiiight so you have just proved my point that not one family has ended up on “the streets” in Ireland.

Thanks..

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327977#Comment_120327977

Yeah, there are a list of reasons.

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2004/act/27/section/34/enacted/en/html#sec34

But they cannot evict for one reason and then not do it. If they don't do what they intended to do, they have to offer it back to the evicted tenant. Or else they leave themselves open to a claim.

tinsofpeas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327967#Comment_120327967

You must be awfully invested in this housing crisis. Jinglejangle in the pocket, those shiny pennies look after the pounds, am I right?

Sorry, I meant housing inconvenience. For others. Not yourself, that goes without saying.

Jinglejangle.

walterking

I've an investment property. Thankfully it's in an area that would have reasonable tourism.

I have it on Airbnb from April to September and after expenses and tax the net is about 20% below what I'd get renting on a long term basis, but whilst the "eviction ban" mantra abounds I will not even contemplate renting it long term.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327993#Comment_120327993

I bet that sounded funnier in your head.

Im just here stating facts.

Bass Reeves

Any extension of the ban would have had to have an exclusion where the house was required by the owner themselves or a family member. LL looking to exit would use this clause so an extension would be ineffective.

The majority of LL do not break contracts. The reality is it's a one sided contract that is put in place by government. The only contract you can enforce is a six month contract and you evict after six months. This is used in holiday home locations at present.

After six months and one day all contracts are of unlimited duration. But that is on the LL side only. Tenants do not want to commit to long term contracts like elsewhere in Europe. So you have a one sided contract where the only way a LL could get back possession was in the case of sale or of family need.

Government chickened out in the last budget and since by not putting in place some encouragement for LL to stay in the sector. Unfortunately I do not think Any LL wishing to leave the sector will wait for the next. The government need to make changes to keep LL's in the sector.

tinsofpeas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120328029#Comment_120328029

There's nothing humorous about a crisis.

As for taking facts on the impact of guns from an arms dealer on how nobody gets shot with guns, I'll put that on the long finger, ta.

Just like profiting off any entirely broken, malfunctioning system that directly impacts people's lives to the extreme negatives, it wouldn't be me. Wouldn't exactly be a point of pride, if you get my meaning?

But that all goes back to bail outs and lack of choices in investment in this country and what have you. That'll be something that needs looking into after this atrocious situation falls on its arse.

Like it was always going to do from day one.

Or maybe next year it'll all be better! Every conceivable factor points the opposite direction, but you never know.

sky6

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120326944#Comment_120326944

You're perfectly right. What the Goverment are doing is illogical and Illegal. They are trying to dictate what Owners can do with their own Property.

Is there going to be one set or rules for Family Homes and another set of rules for people who just happened to maybe inherit the family home and decided to rent it rather than leave it empty in these difficult times.

I also believe that Owners or Landlords are being forced to sell before they have their own property stolen from them by the Goverment.

How are the Gov going to equate this anomaly to the ordinary public who has word hard to provide a home for their family.

There proposals are just madness and Daft. Any party that supports this I will definitely vote against, nd I'm sure I won't be alone.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120328078#Comment_120328078

You are misreading it. It is the way it is outlined on that page. The table is part of (a) rather than (b). There were two scenarios, one at the end of the term, and the other based on the allowed grounds. The former has actually been removed.

This is the revised act. The pertinent bit is the same as the original link

https://revisedacts.lawreform.ie/eli/2004/act/27/section/34/revised/en/html

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120327967#Comment_120327967

One

https://www.independent.ie/regionals/dublin/family-of-five-forced-to-live-in-tent-in-dublin-as-housing-crisis-deepens-41955879.html

Two

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/homeless-family-store-street-gardastation-20553500

Three

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/shocking-image-of-father-and-son-sleeping-rough-in-street-not-unusual-says-charity-37283826.html

20 seconds it took and there’s many more. That enough for you?

I was always proud to be Irish, I believed us to be progressive, friendly and caring. I was wrong. A Country full of Me Feiners!

Bass Reeves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120328108#Comment_120328108

The first one is by choice. Living in the accommodation ( hotel provided) was effecting his business interests.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120328108#Comment_120328108

“However after spending three nights at the facility, which they said consisted of a single room with a small bathroom, two sets of bunk beds and a single bed, the family said they were better off living in a tent in their old neighbourhood.”

Didn’t even take me 20 seconds chief.

FFS😄😄

Scam, Scam, Scam.